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I Won't Greet The Pope Till He Returns Jewish Treasure
Virtual Jerusalem ^ | 5/13/2014

Posted on 05/13/2014 8:06:33 PM PDT by Former Fetus

Pope Francis is due to arrive in Israel on May 25, but Councilman Aryeh King has made clear that he will not be among the Jerusalem officials welcoming the Catholic leader.

Jerusalem Mayor Nir Barkat is expected to greet the Pope on Mount Scopus during the visit, and Barkat's office has sent messages to members of the city council inviting them to join in welcoming the Pope.

King, chairman of the "United Jerusalem" faction, responded by mail to Barkat's office and the other council members, declaring that he will not join them.

"I won't come, unless (the Pope) will bring in his suitcase the treasures of the Jewish people that were stolen by his predecessors, treasures that today are located in the Vatican's basement," remarked King.

Several treasures from the destroyed Holy Temple in Jerusalem are believed to have been brought to Rome; indeed the Arch of Titus in Rome, erected shortly after the death of Emperor Titus in 81 CE, clearly depicts Roman soldiers bringing to Rome the golden candelabrum and other Temple artifacts.

The treasures reportedly remained on public display between 75 CE and the early 5th century in the Temple of Peace in Rome's Forum. Jews have requested access to the Vatican's storehouses to ascertain whether the treasures are still there.

The councilman added "without the return of our people's possessions, I see in (the Pope's) visit an unprecedented insolence."

Protecting Jewish possessions and sites.

King has likewise been actively opposing the rumored negotiations that would have Israel sell King David's Tomb to the Vatican. Foreign Minister Avigdor Liberman denied the deal on Tuesday, after hundreds of Jews protested at the site the day before.

Last month, an Israeli diplomatic source told Arutz Sheva that the Israeli government has no intention of transferring control over the site to the Church; those claims were reiterated Sunday, by the office of the Sephardi Chief Rabbi, Rabbi Yitzhak Yosef.

However, Rabbi Yaakov Sevilia, an activist for King David's Tomb, told Arutz Sheva that there is a deal in the works - which would see David's Tomb given to Christians, and the Temple Mount to Muslims. He cited journalist Gulio Meotti, who contributes regularly to Arutz Sheva, as the source for this knowledge.


TOPICS: Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: pope; templevessels
The best present the Pope could give the Israeli people would be to announce the soon naming of a committee composed of both Catholic and Jewish people, who would go into the Vatican vaults and answer once and for all whether the Temple vessels are stored there or not.

As for King David's Tomb, it should be enough to say that he was a Hebrew King, not Roman!

1 posted on 05/13/2014 8:06:33 PM PDT by Former Fetus
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To: Former Fetus

While they’re in there they can look through all the porn that the Vatican is supposedly collecting ... and Jesus’s wedding ring ... and His son’s cradle ... and ...


2 posted on 05/13/2014 8:09:58 PM PDT by who_would_fardels_bear
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To: Former Fetus

Hold a grudge long?


3 posted on 05/13/2014 8:10:39 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously-you won't live through it anyway-Enjoy Yourself ala Louis Prima)
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To: Former Fetus

Councilman?

Ooooh! What a snub!


4 posted on 05/13/2014 8:14:22 PM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: Former Fetus

Everyone should go to their pastor and priest and ask if their denomination is holding world treasures, looted from people.


5 posted on 05/13/2014 8:15:33 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Former Fetus

Anyone who uses BCE and CE instead of the much older and much more widely spread BC and AD, which is clearly meant to attack Christians, does not deserve butkis from Christian.

Even so if it can be determined that certain things were with the temple in the time of Solomon or in Jerusalem in the time of David, then I would say return it.


6 posted on 05/13/2014 8:20:42 PM PDT by yarddog (Romans 8: verses 38 and 39. "For I am persuaded".)
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To: ansel12
Everyone should go to their pastor and priest and ask if their denomination is holding world treasures, looted from people.

And there is no need to stop there. Folks might as well ask their Presidents or Kings too. Because every faction can find grievances against every other faction, if you just look hard enough.

7 posted on 05/13/2014 8:24:23 PM PDT by Leaning Right (Why am I holding this lantern? I am looking for the next Reagan.)
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To: Leaning Right

I usually think of religion as a little different from countries.


8 posted on 05/13/2014 8:27:01 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Former Fetus

LOL. Moron.


9 posted on 05/13/2014 8:27:02 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Evil is powerless if the good are unafraid" ~ Ronald Wilson Reagan)
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To: Leaning Right

How many churches keep loot and stolen treasures?


10 posted on 05/13/2014 8:28:47 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Jeremiah Jr
"I won't come, unless (the Pope) will bring in his suitcase the treasures of the Jewish people that were stolen by his predecessors, treasures that today are located in the Vatican's basement," remarked King.

Several treasures from the destroyed Holy Temple in Jerusalem are believed to have been brought to Rome; indeed the Arch of Titus in Rome, erected shortly after the death of Emperor Titus in 81 CE, clearly depicts Roman soldiers bringing to Rome the golden candelabrum and other Temple artifacts.

He's going to need a big suitcase.

11 posted on 05/13/2014 8:31:27 PM PDT by Ezekiel (All who mourn the destruction of America merit the celebration of her rebirth.)
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To: Former Fetus

” Jews have requested access to the Vatican’s storehouses to ascertain whether the treasures are still there.”

Proving that at least some Jews are not too bright.


12 posted on 05/13/2014 8:33:20 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: ansel12

“How many churches keep loot and stolen treasures?”

Can’t someone make an argument that all American churches are on “looted” or “stolen” land?


13 posted on 05/13/2014 8:34:28 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: Former Fetus

It hardly seems to me that the looting of these items and their carrying to Rome in the first century A.D. is any reason to suspect that the Holy See has them. After all, the Church had no influence in the first centuries, and when it did become influential there was nothing like the Vatican of today to receive these kinds of items. I really see no reason to believe that such treasures would be entrusted to the local bishop of that city when they would already have had to be housed somewhere for centuries. No, this just sounds like another silly conspiracy theory. How do we know that the Vandals or Visigoths didn’t carry this stuff away during one of their sacks of the city?


14 posted on 05/13/2014 8:35:20 PM PDT by cothrige
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To: ansel12

I agree...the Emperor Titus was definitely NOT the “predecessor” of any Pope!!! Who knows what that pagan did with his stolen treasure, anyway? Probably melted it down to make necklaces for his wife, or some such.... And then there were later the Vandals and Goths, whose specialty was plunder...


15 posted on 05/13/2014 8:36:00 PM PDT by Frank_2001
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To: vladimir998

No, they can’t, but seriously what churches keep stolen treasures and loot?


16 posted on 05/13/2014 8:36:31 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Frank_2001

Huh? The vandals church has stolen treasure?


17 posted on 05/13/2014 8:37:51 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: ansel12; All

Anyone see the move Monument Men? There it shows some churches saving art treasures and returning them to their owners.


18 posted on 05/13/2014 8:38:14 PM PDT by gleeaikin
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To: cothrige

Yeah, and how many times has Rome been sacked? If those items were in Rome, they could have been melted down long, long ago.


19 posted on 05/13/2014 8:46:05 PM PDT by virgil (The evil that men do lives after them)
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To: ansel12

If the Vatican has these things, it’s a good thing. They’ve been safe in a basement for almost 2000 years instead of being melted down by muslims, Lombards, Goths, whatever.


20 posted on 05/13/2014 8:50:31 PM PDT by virgil (The evil that men do lives after them)
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To: Former Fetus
"I won't come, unless (the Pope) will bring in his suitcase the treasures of the Jewish people that were stolen by his predecessors, treasures that today are located in the Vatican's basement," remarked King.

Was this Rodney King who said this? LOL.

21 posted on 05/13/2014 8:52:11 PM PDT by Alberta's Child ("What in the wide, wide world of sports is goin' on here?")
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To: vladimir998
LOL. This guy sounds like his knowledge about these artifacts comes from Raiders of the Lost Ark.
22 posted on 05/13/2014 8:53:44 PM PDT by Alberta's Child ("What in the wide, wide world of sports is goin' on here?")
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To: virgil

I see, the original owners must be pleased as punch to know they have been kept safe since they were taken.


23 posted on 05/13/2014 8:58:29 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Former Fetus

According to Lttw he will be dead,
Mary
A moment will come when I will take my beloved son, the Pope. I will walk with him to Jerusalem. For the second time I will go to Jerusalem to witness the death of a son.

When this happens the eyes of the Jewish people will see for the first time. They will see in the Pope’s death what the Catholic Church has done for them. There will be no mistake about which Church has blessed them, because it will have been done by the head of the Church and by the greatest of sacrifices. Israel will embrace the Catholic Church.

All Catholics will welcome Israel because all will have seen the decision of the Holy Father (the bishop dressed in white) to offer his life for Israel. The union between the Catholic Church and Israel will be a union of hearts brought about by the events that the whole world will have has seen and can never forget.

Comment: By the Pope’s death, Israel’s eyes will be opened to the Catholic Church and how Catholic hearts will be opened to Israel. Both happen from the same event.
http://www.locutions.org/
Do I believe this website-no


24 posted on 05/13/2014 9:11:36 PM PDT by fatima (Free Hugs Today :))
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To: Former Fetus
I Won't Greet The Pope Till He Returns Jewish Treasure

Did he steal it from someone's coffin?

25 posted on 05/13/2014 9:18:47 PM PDT by Veggie Todd (The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. TJ)
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To: ansel12

I think they should indeed be pleased as punch if any of these things could be found.


26 posted on 05/13/2014 9:24:36 PM PDT by virgil (The evil that men do lives after them)
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To: Former Fetus
Relief from Titus' Arch.



27 posted on 05/13/2014 9:32:18 PM PDT by eddie willers
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To: virgil

Well, the original owners probably didn’t survive the Catholic church’s requisition of their property.


28 posted on 05/13/2014 9:33:22 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Vendome

Irish Alzheimer’s is when you forget everything but the grudges.


29 posted on 05/13/2014 10:57:51 PM PDT by Psiman (PS I am not a crackpot)
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To: yarddog

“Anyone who uses BCE and CE instead of the much older and much more widely spread BC and AD, which is clearly meant to attack Christians, does not deserve butkis from Christian.”

Absolutely; I don’t even acknowledge those terms or people who use them.


30 posted on 05/14/2014 3:49:37 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: cothrige

“After all, the Church had no influence in the first centuries, and when it did become influential there was nothing like the Vatican of today to receive these kinds of items.”

The Church was actively persecuted in the first centuries; I believe the first three Popes were martyrs. This is just grandstanding and hate-mongering.


31 posted on 05/14/2014 3:52:02 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: ansel12

The Catholic Church sacked the Temple? I didn’t know that. Actually I doubt these things are still in Rome. They’ve already been looted long ago. Some people just hate Catholics, they just want to blame them for the world’s problems, like some people want to blame America for everything. This Councilman is just mouthing off to attract attention by way of controversy.


32 posted on 05/14/2014 6:49:07 AM PDT by virgil (The evil that men do lives after them)
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To: cothrige; virgil; Frank_2001; ansel12; kearnyirish2

Maybe so, which begs the question of why not open the vaults to inspection and let this conspiracy theory die? Unless, of course, it is not a theory...


33 posted on 05/14/2014 7:08:46 AM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: fatima
Israel will one day turn to Christ, but not to the Pope or the Catholic Church!

for I say to you, you shall see Me no more till you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!’ (Matt. 23:39)

"He" is capitalized, so it does not refer to the Pope but to Jesus.

34 posted on 05/14/2014 7:12:36 AM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: Former Fetus

You sound like the Nazis insisting Jews were sitting on piles of gold. The Nazis opened the homes to inspection...

This conspiracy theory will never die; too many people havebuilt their identity around it.


35 posted on 05/14/2014 7:20:57 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: virgil

“Some people just hate Catholics, they just want to blame them for the world’s problems, like some people want to blame America for everything. This Councilman is just mouthing off to attract attention by way of controversy.”

That’s my take on it as well.


36 posted on 05/14/2014 7:24:26 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Former Fetus
Maybe so, which begs the question of why not open the vaults to inspection and let this conspiracy theory die? Unless, of course, it is not a theory...

Unless, of course, there is no vault.

37 posted on 05/14/2014 7:51:35 AM PDT by COBOL2Java (I'm a Christian, pro-life, pro-gun, Reaganite. The GOP hates me. Why should I vote for them?)
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To: COBOL2Java

How hard would it be to prove that? I’m not saying the Vatican has the Temple’s vessels, it’s been too long and too many things have happened, but I am saying “show to the world that you don’t have them and let’s move on”.


38 posted on 05/14/2014 8:04:49 AM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: Former Fetus
How hard would it be to prove that? I’m not saying the Vatican has the Temple’s vessels, it’s been too long and too many things have happened, but I am saying “show to the world that you don’t have them and let’s move on”.

Oh sure, they'll take him to the storage rooms, show him what they have, and he'll come out and say "They didn't take me to the REAL vault where it's kept!" Thus the false scandal lives on.

39 posted on 05/14/2014 8:30:15 AM PDT by COBOL2Java (I'm a Christian, pro-life, pro-gun, Reaganite. The GOP hates me. Why should I vote for them?)
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To: Former Fetus

The thing is, as far as I understand, these storage areas (”vaults”) are huge. I saw a special on the History channel I think last year where they were given special access to the storage areas. It’s like the catacombs down there, with no apparent precise organizational structure. (It is Italy)

So it’s not just a question of letting a few guys in on a weekend to take a poke around. Or going into some database and doing a keyword search for “menorah”. It would probably take months of searching with teams of people in every corner before such people were satisfied.

Besides again we have the historical fact the looting occurred wayyy before the current “vaults” existed, in the time between the current structure and when they were brought to Rome, you have at least 1,000 years. A lot of stuff can go missing in that time, especially if it had an economic value as well. After all, Rome was sacked how many times since?

With all that, is it really worth it? Because of a small possibility their stuff *might* be there? And what happens if (probably when) they don’t find it? Do accusations of further coverups and/or outright black market sales start flying? Or that the treasure funded the Crusades? Or even the construction of the Vatican itself? When does it end?


40 posted on 05/14/2014 8:38:09 AM PDT by FourtySeven (47)
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To: COBOL2Java

That’s why I suggested a committee of Catholics and Jews.


41 posted on 05/14/2014 8:51:00 AM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: FourtySeven
Who said anything about "a weekend"? Yes, it will take time (and I think I have a feeling for "Italian organization" since I was born and lived for 22 years in Spain). But it's been centuries! All the Pope would have to say in his trip to Israel is that a committee of Catholics and Jews is going to be appointed to search for any possible Temple vessels, menorah... He could remind people of the centuries that have passed, the different invasions... and finish saying that if anything belonging to the Second Temple is found, it will be returned to Israel.

Of course he would be expected to follow up with his promise.

42 posted on 05/14/2014 8:55:22 AM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: jjotto

My thought exactly, so Mr. King won’t grant the pope an audience. Hilarious


43 posted on 05/14/2014 9:01:45 AM PDT by turducken
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To: turducken; jjotto

I have often been laughed at for signing on-line petitions, writing letters to the editor... They always ask me what is “little me” able to accomplish? It’s a long story, I don’t always feel like writing a book, but the summary is that when I stand in front of my Lord, He will not ask me “why didn’t you say something about ...?” I think Councilman King is doing the same thing, standing up for what he believes to be right, regardless of how much he can be expected to accomplish all by himself.


44 posted on 05/14/2014 9:36:00 AM PDT by Former Fetus (Saved by grace through faith)
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To: virgil

I wasn’t thinking of the actual sacking of the temple, but the treasures gained through so many centuries of sacking by the church and it’s military operations and organizations.

Today the denomination’s military force is too small for conquest and looting.


45 posted on 05/14/2014 9:40:27 AM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Former Fetus

Maybe the Vatican is worried about Jerusalem being taken by radical Islam, in which case NONE of the treasures would ever be seen again. They’d be destroyed as were the giant Buddhas in Afghanistan, because they were the work of infidels!


46 posted on 05/14/2014 3:33:24 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
I'm sure the Pope would be glad to meet Councilman King, but I doubt he knows who he is.

The Vatican certainly holds Jewish artifacts it would be nice to have access to, whether the spoils of Jerusalem might be questionable.

The Councilman is correct they were displayed at the Temple of Peace. Common sense, the Temple of Peace was built to house the booty, of course it was there. Built by Vespasian, who was not a Pope. It was a pagan Temple. Don't know if it had a basement, probably not.

Near the end of the 2nd century it burned down. Burning down means the inside, not the marble walls. Some of which still stand. It was Rome's art museum, in a sense. Given the fact the Constantine ruled in the early 4th century, and began construction of the old St. Peters, if the booty survived the fire and was credibly seen in the 5th century, imo the implication would be that it was viewed as a Roman artifact, not Christian.

That's not to say the loot couldn't have ended up at the Vatican, Presuming the Vandals didn't value gold, or missed the loot of Jerusalem while sacking Rome

47 posted on 05/15/2014 5:58:11 AM PDT by SJackson (the Democrats take back control, we don’t make (this) kind of naked power grab, J Biden)
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