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The Misinformed Case for Voter ID
Townhall.com ^ | May 15, 2014 | Steve Chapman

Posted on 05/15/2014 8:17:30 AM PDT by Kaslin

The logic behind laws requiring voters to provide a government-issued photo identification card is simple and seductive: If you need to show an ID to board a plane, open a bank account, get public aid or do any number of other things, it only makes sense to do the same before casting a ballot.

That was what Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker, a Republican, said in 2011 as he signed a law imposing this new mandate. "There really is no barrier for people," he asserted. "Particularly in a society where people need photo identification for just about everything else, including checking out a book from the library ... it's a reasonable requirement."

Many of the advocates can't imagine anyone functioning in 21st-century America without valid proof of identity. So they are skeptical that requiring it could possibly be an obstacle to voting. They also tend to believe that anyone who lacks something so basic deserves no accommodation.

These attitudes reflect a failure to understand the lives of many Americans. In the suit challenging the Wisconsin law, which recently was overturned by a federal court, a parade of people attested that they lacked the required ID and, in many cases, couldn't easily get it.

One of them was Ruthelle Frank, a former member of the village board of Brokaw. She has never had a driver's license or state ID, and her 1927 birth certificate has a misspelling. To get it fixed, she would have to undertake a legal process that could cost $200.

Another was Mariannis Ginorio, a young Milwaukee woman. She had no driver's license, and Wisconsin doesn't accept birth certificates from her native Puerto Rico issued before 2010. Sam Bulmer, a homeless Air Force veteran, could offer only a federal Veterans Identification Card -- which is not on the list of IDs recognized by the state.

Statewide, the court concluded, 300,000 eligible voters don't have the documents needed for voting. In the normal course of life, people like this don't need them.

Fifteen percent of white adults in Wisconsin, and half of blacks and Hispanics, don't drive. Passport holders are a minority of the population. A lot of people don't need a photo ID to board a plane because they don't fly.

In fact, the Transportation Security Administration doesn't bar anyone who shows up without an ID. In that case, the TSA says, "You'll be able to fly as long as you provide us with some information that will help us determine you are who you say you are."

Seniors can verify their eligibility for Social Security without a photo ID. Food stamps? Federal regulations say "any documents which reasonably establish the applicant's identity must be accepted, and no requirement for a specific document, such as a birth certificate, may be imposed." Libraries will generally accept a utility bill or something similar to issue a card.

Opening a bank account? Larry Dupuis, a lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union of Wisconsin Foundation, says he never had to show an ID to open his account, which he did some two decades ago. "It's really a post-9/11 thing," he says, for banks to require one. But many poor people don't have bank accounts.

Those activities, in any event, are not constitutionally guaranteed, which voting is. The government can impose regulations that affect constitutional rights. But it must have a good reason, and the rules can't be an undue burden. States can mandate a 24-hour waiting period for abortions, which the Supreme Court says is a modest restriction justified by "the state's interest in protecting the life of the unborn."

Under federal law, you may buy a gun from a private seller without an ID. Licensed dealers must see photo identification, despite the Second Amendment. That's not hard to justify because if a person forbidden to own firearms acquires one -- say a convicted felon -- the outcome may be fatal.

If a person forbidden to vote manages to cast a ballot by pretending to be someone else, by contrast, the election result will almost never be affected. Besides, the sort of fraud that an ID would prevent is exceedingly rare. The court in Wisconsin found the requirement would block vastly more legal voters than fraudulent ones.

States have long had procedures that discourage fraud by impersonation without blocking legitimate voters from the polls. The stricter new requirements may sound reasonable, but they're not reasonable for everyone -- or reasonable for democracy.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: voterid
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1 posted on 05/15/2014 8:17:30 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin

To make it short democrats hate honest elections.


2 posted on 05/15/2014 8:20:22 AM PDT by Vaduz
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To: Kaslin

—hogwash—Chapman just destroyed whatever credibility he had with me for his sometimes sensible firearms comments-—


3 posted on 05/15/2014 8:20:23 AM PDT by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the media or government says about firearms or explosives--)
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To: Kaslin
The stricter new requirements may sound reasonable, but they're not reasonable for everyone -- or reasonable for democracy.

Horse hockey. Specious argument. Protection of the ballot is ESSSENTIAL to our Republic or we fall into the realm of Banana Republic. Oh, and we ain't no democracy, either. This author is a buffoon.

4 posted on 05/15/2014 8:24:33 AM PDT by rjsimmon (The Tree of Liberty Thirsts)
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To: Kaslin

Stevie must be firmly in the Rand Paul camp.


5 posted on 05/15/2014 8:24:40 AM PDT by SoConPubbie (Mitt and Obama: They're the same poison, just a different potency)
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To: Kaslin

To me there is an easy solution to such cases as mentioned.

Deal with people on a case by case basis, if they have trouble getting a driver’s license or other official ID.

And give them a special voter’s ID, to be used to identify themselves for voting only.

We should still verify that they live in the jurisdiction in which they are wanting to register to vote. But if the problem is not having an ID, let’s get them an ID, rather than saying that since some people have trouble getting an ID, then we can’t require an ID of anybody. Let’s issue an ID for use for voting purposes only, if people really don’t have any other ID.

MSNBC has pushed the story of an old black woman somewhere down south, who didn’t have an ID. She is in her 90s, doesn’t have her marriage certificate, and since her married name doesn’t match her birth certificate, she couldn’t get an ID.

The MSNBC narrative was that this old black woman, who was one of the few blacks in her town who were able to register to vote back in the days of Jim Crow laws, was now being disenfranchised by today’s voter ID laws. They said she navigated the Jim Crow laws and was able to vote then, but is not being allowed to vote now.


6 posted on 05/15/2014 8:25:36 AM PDT by Dilbert San Diego
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To: Kaslin
Poor people don't get the sniffles, apparently.

Former Gov. "Diamond Jim" Doyle - Rat, instituted a photo I. D. requirement in Wisconsin to buy cold meds.

7 posted on 05/15/2014 8:27:16 AM PDT by Mygirlsmom (No Mo (zilla). I'm going to the Opera instead.)
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To: rellimpank

BS
We are tired of Chicago machine politics, we are tired of dead people voting, we are tired of DEMOCRATS voting in multiple jurisdictions, we are tired of illegal aliens voting, we are tired of felons voting, we are tired of Al Franken recounting until he wins,we are tired of fraud. Let us have fair elections.


8 posted on 05/15/2014 8:27:57 AM PDT by thorvaldr
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To: Kaslin

Just don’t go riding your bike the wrong way in Milwaukee, I guess.


9 posted on 05/15/2014 8:28:55 AM PDT by Dr. Sivana ("I'm a Contra" -- President Ronald Reagan)
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To: rellimpank

This is the second straight obfuscating and gobblydegook filled column on voter fraud for this Chicago Tribune columnist. Here’s how he started a piece on Obama and the NSA.

“Every so often, we get proof that Barack Obama, when confronted with a grievous abuse of government power by his administration, will do the right thing.”

No wonder I don’t read Townhall. This is Kathleen Parker stuff.


10 posted on 05/15/2014 8:28:55 AM PDT by Luke21
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To: Kaslin
If you need to show an ID to board a plane, open a bank account, get public aid or do any number of other things, it only makes sense to do the same before casting a ballot.

Unless your intent is to steal elections......................

11 posted on 05/15/2014 8:31:30 AM PDT by Red Badger (Soon there will be another American Civil War. Will make the first one seem like a Tea Party........)
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To: Dilbert San Diego

“since her married name doesn’t match her birth certificate, she couldn’t get an ID.”

I’m thinking her gubmint checks are somehow still making the trip to her mailbox though.


12 posted on 05/15/2014 8:31:46 AM PDT by V_TWIN
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To: rellimpank

What credibility does Townhall still have as a conservative site?


13 posted on 05/15/2014 8:32:14 AM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans!)
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To: Kaslin

Edge cases are not persuasive.


14 posted on 05/15/2014 8:32:24 AM PDT by Menehune56 ("Let them hate so long as they fear" (Oderint Dum Metuant), Lucius Accius (170 BC - 86 BC))
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To: Kaslin
Statewide, the court concluded, 300,000 eligible voters don't have the documents needed for voting. In the normal course of life, people like this don't need them.

Here is the crux of the fallacy: How much would it cost, really, to set up a contract for the one-time task of contacting these 300,000 people and correcting their documentation problems?

15 posted on 05/15/2014 8:32:33 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (Islam offers us three choices: Defeat them utterly, die, or surrender to a life of slavery.)
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To: Kaslin

You really don’t need to refute all the specious and hysterical claims by Democrats on Voter ID. The crux of the matter is they want to CHEAT, and our reason is to stop them from doing it. There’s nothing more simple than that, and we should tell them that every time they bleat about it.


16 posted on 05/15/2014 8:32:39 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: Kaslin

Time to go back to our roots...

It used to be that only landowners could vote because they were the ones paying taxes to fund the government. That was a founding principle of America.

Instead of an identification card to vote you should have to show your 1040 form proving that you are funding the government you are voting for. Multigenerational welfare recipients, Obama phone users, and multimillions paying zero taxes (ex: Arianna Huffington who paid zero the year she ran for CA governor) would not be allowed to vote.


17 posted on 05/15/2014 8:33:24 AM PDT by anonsquared
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To: Kaslin

According to this link:

http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/drivers/apply/idcard.htm

Obtaining a State ID card for the purposes of voting is FREE!

So what is the problem again?


18 posted on 05/15/2014 8:33:55 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius (www.wilsonharpbooks.com - Eclipse, the sequel to Bright Horizons is out! Get it now!)
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To: Dr. Sivana

I hate nothing worse than people on bicycles riding their bikes against the traffic, but walk with the traffic instead against the traffic when their is no pedestrian way


19 posted on 05/15/2014 8:34:43 AM PDT by Kaslin (He needed the ignorant to reelect him, and he got them. Now we all have to pay the consequenses)
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To: anonsquared

Right. The idea that everybody has an equal say is nuts.


20 posted on 05/15/2014 8:36:43 AM PDT by all the best (sat`~!)
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To: Vaduz

Of course they do, because the only way to win for them is through fraud.


21 posted on 05/15/2014 8:37:23 AM PDT by Kaslin (He needed the ignorant to reelect him, and he got them. Now we all have to pay the consequenses)
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To: Kaslin

ID standards for playing little league baseball are more stringent in this country than for voting, which has far more profound consequences.

Nobody THINKS FOR THEMSELVES in this country anymore. As it is with pretty much all leftist positions on issues, they are nonsensical, illogical and have evil intent.


22 posted on 05/15/2014 8:37:40 AM PDT by RatRipper (The political left are utterly evil and corrupt)
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To: Vaduz

There’s a simple way around this, since the cases for those “unable” to get an ID are extremely rare,

they can cast a “provisional” ballot, and if the margin of election victory is smaller than the number of provisional ballots, they must be opened, verified individually, and counted.

Otherwise, they remain sealed up.

This concept is one of those “IQ tests” for leftists, and they usually fail the test.
When this is proposed, they scream that every vote should count. They just don’t get the concept that counting these votes when the margin of the election is greater than the number of these votes just wouldn’t matter.


23 posted on 05/15/2014 8:38:11 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter admits whom he's working for)
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To: Kaslin

C’mon Now,Anybody Can Find A Few Exceptions!!This is BULLSH*T!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


24 posted on 05/15/2014 8:39:46 AM PDT by bandleader
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To: anonsquared

I’ve had a leftist attempt to argue that those on the receiving end of taxpayer largess obviously DO “have a stake” in the outcome of the election.

Yeah, their ability to use the gov’t as an instrument of theft.
This is like saying a thief “has a stake” in what kind of alarm system you put on your house.


25 posted on 05/15/2014 8:39:49 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter admits whom he's working for)
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To: MrB

Next time you are asked for your photo ID tell the person asking, “I’ll provide the ID only when voter ID is also required”. See how far you get then. Be sure to have a CONSERVATIVE news person within camera or hearing distance, you definitely want it on national news.


26 posted on 05/15/2014 8:42:17 AM PDT by DaveA37
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To: Kaslin

Chapman is the token raving leftist on TownHall.com. Mindless drivel, but always entertaining.


27 posted on 05/15/2014 8:43:26 AM PDT by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: DaveA37

Should you have to show an ID when attending a public meeting with a politician?

I think not.


28 posted on 05/15/2014 8:43:34 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter admits whom he's working for)
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To: Kaslin
Fifteen percent of white adults in Wisconsin, and half of blacks and Hispanics, don't drive.

Oh, most of them drive. They just don't have an active license. Different things, you know.

I suppose that these same numbers also don't buy allergy remedies or alcohol in liquor stores or restaurants/bars.
29 posted on 05/15/2014 8:43:52 AM PDT by Dr. Sivana ("I'm a Contra" -- President Ronald Reagan)
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To: Kaslin

Boo-hoo.


30 posted on 05/15/2014 8:45:37 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: Kaslin
One of them was Ruthelle Frank, a former member of the village board of Brokaw. She has never had a driver's license or state ID, and her 1927 birth certificate has a misspelling. To get it fixed, she would have to undertake a legal process that could cost $200.

This woman couldn't find $200 in 87 years?

Let's give her the benefit of doubt and credit her back the years before she was eligible to vote. That makes it 69 years to get her birth certificate fixed.

And she's complaining now?

-PJ

31 posted on 05/15/2014 8:45:43 AM PDT by Political Junkie Too (If you are the Posterity of We the People, then you are a Natural Born Citizen.)
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To: V_TWIN

Since when does a married name, and I assume last name match a birth certificate, unless it’s the same?


32 posted on 05/15/2014 8:49:40 AM PDT by Kaslin (He needed the ignorant to reelect him, and he got them. Now we all have to pay the consequenses)
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To: Vaduz

Only a cheater would object to Voter ID!


33 posted on 05/15/2014 8:51:30 AM PDT by maxwellsmart_agent
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To: Kaslin

Easy solution.

If a person shows up to vote without photo ID, they sign an affidavit attesting to their eligibility to vote and that they recognize the fact that if they are falsely claiming that eligibility, they are committing a felony and subject to a mandatory 5 years imprisonment. Then they hold up the affidavit and their picture is taken. They are then allowed to vote.

The state is then required to confirm the persons identity and eligibility whereupon they either issue an ID or put the person in jail.


34 posted on 05/15/2014 8:52:39 AM PDT by CMAC51
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To: Political Junkie Too

Sooner or later all these people with no ID will need to get sorted out to deal with IRS, SS or some other govt organization. So best to get it done while they are alive.


35 posted on 05/15/2014 8:53:26 AM PDT by Oldexpat
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To: anonsquared

Agreed, but I would go even further. ANY citizen, and I stress citizen, who receives a check as the primary source of income from employment from a federal, state, or local government body or entity, is not allowed to vote, with exceptions for the military, and perhaps a few other groups I can’t think of right now.


36 posted on 05/15/2014 8:53:49 AM PDT by SgtHooper (This is my tag!)
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To: maxwellsmart_agent

Yep


37 posted on 05/15/2014 8:55:17 AM PDT by Vaduz
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To: Kaslin

If 26 million Afganis can venture across rugged terrain and get past terrorists to vote, so can grandma.


38 posted on 05/15/2014 8:55:52 AM PDT by EQAndyBuzz ("Heck of a reset there, Hillary"S)
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To: Kaslin
Under federal law, you may buy a gun from a private seller without an ID. Licensed dealers must see photo identification, despite the Second Amendment. That's not hard to justify because if a person forbidden to own firearms acquires one -- say a convicted felon -- the outcome may be fatal.

If a person forbidden to vote manages to cast a ballot by pretending to be someone else, by contrast, the election result will almost never be affected. Besides, the sort of fraud that an ID would prevent is exceedingly rare. The court in Wisconsin found the requirement would block vastly more legal voters than fraudulent ones.

Ask Jews in 1944 Germany whether the wrong leaders (who are chosen through VOTING) may be fatal.

So the author KNOWS that systematized and organized voter fraud on a scale which determines elections does not occur? What was ACORN about then? Why did the Fed's illegally target and persecute the 'True the Vote' crowd?

39 posted on 05/15/2014 8:56:03 AM PDT by LucianOfSamasota (Tanstaafl - its not just for breakfast anymore...)
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To: SgtHooper

Oops, not quite enough: “and who receives a government check as a form of entitlement, other than Social Security”. The EBT crowd needs to be prohibited as well, but the idea is there.


40 posted on 05/15/2014 8:56:14 AM PDT by SgtHooper (This is my tag!)
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To: Kaslin

States that require voter ID offer them free at the DMV for those that can’t afford one.

The utility bill BS don’t fly either, because you have to have a valid picture ID to have the utilities turned on!

Still can’t get an ID? No problem, everyone has finger prints, no photo ID requires you finger print on the ballot.


41 posted on 05/15/2014 8:57:54 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Unions are an Affirmative Action program for Slackers! .)
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To: SoConPubbie

Yup, likely a Libtardian just like Runt Paul.


42 posted on 05/15/2014 8:59:40 AM PDT by Beagle8U (Unions are an Affirmative Action program for Slackers! .)
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To: MrB

Their idea of every vote should count is to vote often they no longer try to hide their dishonesty they know the public have been bummed down and they can sell anything to them with the help of the MSM.


43 posted on 05/15/2014 9:04:05 AM PDT by Vaduz
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To: Kaslin

They are the masters of fraud.


44 posted on 05/15/2014 9:04:45 AM PDT by Vaduz
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To: rellimpank

Mr Chapman deserves a hearing. He came with an opinion and with reasons to support his opinions. I don’t agree with him, but it’s so much more refreshing than the argument we usually hear.....”RACIST!” And you know that is the sum total of everything we normally get.

I disagree with Chapman.

First, I don’t think getting a picture ID is a burden at all. Despite the few examples he’s given of those who can’t get a Puerto Rican certificate or have to change a name on a birth certificate because of bad spelling, those exceptions should not drive a good rule. Besides, there’s no need to require a birth certificate to prove citizenship. Some reasonable evidence should be all that’s required to get a picture ID....bills, witnesses, relatives, etc. It’s just not hard to do. And the payoff — secure elections — is important.

Second, his point that a few cases of fraud can’t determine an election simply isn’t so. We had one woman in Cincy convicted for voting 6 times last presidential election. With 88 counties, that’s 568 votes if it were to happen in every other county. And Florida was determined by that number of votes in the famous hanging chad election.

All of his arguments about what people DON’T DO are simply a subset of how hard it is to get verify your identity for purposes of a picture ID.

ALL OF THESE are mitigated by the ID being free, by transportation being provided, and by other means of identifying oneself. So far as a homeless man having difficulty, even that man has a name and a story that can be checked.

Picture ID is not a burden of any consequence at all. The courts are wrong.

Finally, I think he’s mistaken about the right to vote. It can be abridged, although the list of constitutional reasons are limited. For example, one must be a US citizen, states can impose registration requirements, certain criminals can be prevented, and there are even residency requirements. Therefore, since there are registration requirement, then it only follows that one be able to demonstrate some bit of truth regarding one’s meeting those requirements.


45 posted on 05/15/2014 9:10:14 AM PDT by xzins ( Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for victory!)
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To: Kaslin
... a parade of people attested that they lacked the required ID and, in many cases, couldn't easily get it.

You may choose to not live as an adult in modern America but that is YOUR choice and should have no impact on our election laws.

46 posted on 05/15/2014 9:11:47 AM PDT by Straight Vermonter (Posting from deep behind the Maple Curtain)
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To: Kaslin
Fifteen percent of white adults in Wisconsin, and half of blacks and Hispanics, don't drive.

I am pretty doubtful of that number. They may not have licenses but I suspect they manage to drive without them.

47 posted on 05/15/2014 9:12:55 AM PDT by Straight Vermonter (Posting from deep behind the Maple Curtain)
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To: Kaslin

given anyone who is poor and doesn’t have ID can get a state ID card for free, there is no burden. it was written in the law so that it wouldn’t be a burden.


48 posted on 05/15/2014 9:15:34 AM PDT by Secret Agent Man (Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: Straight Vermonter

Now how many in your state have valid drivers licenses and how many that don’t do drive anyway?


49 posted on 05/15/2014 9:18:13 AM PDT by Kaslin (He needed the ignorant to reelect him, and he got them. Now we all have to pay the consequenses)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

Re: “Obtaining a Wisconsin state ID card for the purposes of voting is FREE!”

They have the same procedure in South Carolina.


50 posted on 05/15/2014 9:19:00 AM PDT by zeestephen
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