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How two votes could diminish Britain's role in the world forever ^ | May 15, 2014 | Sara Miller Llana

Posted on 05/16/2014 1:05:20 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper

The UK is set for a major shift in its place in the world, as Scots vote on independence this fall and PM David Cameron looks to hold a referendum in 2017 on leaving the EU.

(Excerpt) Read more at ...

TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: britain; forkinit; uk
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1 posted on 05/16/2014 1:05:20 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: Berlin_Freeper
Today, the Cutty Sark now sits on display on the banks of the Thames in Greenwich. Keith Merritt stands admiring the ship,where he chose to bring his six-year-old grandson on his first visit to London to see “all the good bits of where we were.” But the engineer can’t help but lament that Britain in 2014 is not gazing outward, but increasingly inward, thinking smaller instead of big.
Cutty Sark destroyed by fire
Fire has ripped through the Cutty Sark, reducing the iconic 19th century tea clipper to a charred wreck.
2 posted on 05/16/2014 1:13:02 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: Berlin_Freeper

Cutty Sark:

The ship was badly damaged by fire on 21 May 2007 while undergoing conservation. The vessel has since been restored and reopened to the public on 25 April 2012.

3 posted on 05/16/2014 1:28:04 AM PDT by moose07 (the truth will out ,one day.)
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To: Berlin_Freeper
Scotland puts the great into Great Britain, says Cameron: Prime Minister heads north to 'love-bomb' voters amid poll fears

4 posted on 05/16/2014 2:04:20 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper (You can't be passive and moral.)
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To: Berlin_Freeper
It is interesting and somewhat ironic that Great Britain is working at cross purposes within itself. On the one hand Nigel Ferage is leading an exciting and ever growing movement, UKIP, to take Britain out of the European Union which is at minimum a threat to the integrity of the European union. On the other hand, little Scotland is moving toward independence from Great Britain because the European Union and other multinational organizations like NATO offer tiny breakaway movements like Scotland, the Basques, and the Flemish the prospect of surviving in a new world order under the protection of these multinationals.

As Scotland's breakaway movement succeeds, its survival depends on the vitality of the European Union which is under threat from Nigel Ferage. The Scots want home rule which is certainly more democratic in the sense that their votes would count more than they currently do in London. The indictment led by Nigel Ferage against the European Union is that the European Union is essentially undemocratic, overly bureaucratic, and entirely elitist where the votes of an individual residing in any European country is diluted and swamped among 315 million votes and then frustrated by elitist bureaucrats in Brussels.

The Scots might find they will have traded more democracy for less, more security for less, more prosperity for less.

5 posted on 05/16/2014 2:07:13 AM PDT by nathanbedford ("Attack, repeat, attack!" Bull Halsey)
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To: nathanbedford
It's no more odd than the ongoing fight within the US between proponents of Federal power and those who favor States Rights, an argument that has been going on since, well, since the country was founded pretty much. But I agree, it is kind of odd that nationalism and internationalism are major forces in world today, and in the case of Scottish Nationalists being touted at one and the same time!

I agree with you. The Scots Nationalist case is basically for a larger slice of a much smaller pie. I personally think they will be much the worse for the exchange.

6 posted on 05/16/2014 2:58:54 AM PDT by Vanders9
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To: Berlin_Freeper

If Scotland leaves, and the UK also leaves the EU customs union - it will be like all the chains coming off at once.

Scotland has twice as many MPs per person as England: most of them are liberal. Without Scotland, England becomes Conservative.

And without the EU, England becomes free.

7 posted on 05/16/2014 3:19:01 AM PDT by agere_contra (I once saw a movie where only the police and military had guns. It was called 'Schindler's List'.)
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To: agere_contra

“Without Scotland, England becomes Conservative.”

This must worry Cameron no end as he is the biggest CINO politician I have ever seen in English politics!


8 posted on 05/16/2014 3:59:02 AM PDT by melsec (Once a Jolly Swagman camped by a Billabong.)
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To: agere_contra

Yep, free from trade and travel. The consensus on the street here is that England will give Scotland enough autonomy to stay in the UK, and the EU referendum will fail miserably.

9 posted on 05/16/2014 4:23:19 AM PDT by AnAmericanInEngland
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To: nathanbedford

Consider Scotland and then Neoeuropa...... the American Northeast.

There is no question that if the Neoeuropa was purged, America would be a better place

What was does not need to continue to be what is

10 posted on 05/16/2014 4:28:12 AM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... History is a process, not an event)
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To: melsec

We need one of the Bushes making a speech there for Euro NWO integration and Scotland attachments... would fly real well...

11 posted on 05/16/2014 5:12:00 AM PDT by lavaroise (A well regulated gun being necessary to the state, the rights of the militia shall not be infringed)
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To: lavaroise

Bailing from the EU might be the best thing England has done for a long time. Loosing Scotland may not be to their advantage though.

12 posted on 05/16/2014 5:30:59 AM PDT by DaveA37
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To: AnAmericanInEngland

The EU is a sinking ship. Its a just a matter of how many more years it will soldier on before finally failing.

The UK will likely vote to leave the EU especially if Nigel Farage manages to become PM in the next few years.

Countries like Greece, Portugal, and many eastern European nations never had the economies to be able to function in the EU and never should have been allowed in. Now they are nothing but a drag on it.

13 posted on 05/16/2014 9:09:00 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose o f a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: Berlin_Freeper; UKrepublican; BillyBoy; AuH2ORepublican; fieldmarshaldj; Clintonfatigued

England would well be rid of Scotland’s Labour MPs if you ask me.

14 posted on 05/17/2014 11:02:42 PM PDT by Impy (RED=COMMUNIST, NOT REPUBLICAN)
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To: Impy

Scotland is already a basketcase and politically moonbat, like a giant White Detroit with better scenery. The best of the Scots already left for America long ago. A Conservative in England not wanting to cut them loose should have their head examined. It would also force Scotland to grow up (politically speaking).

15 posted on 05/17/2014 11:21:21 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: fieldmarshaldj; BillyBoy

I agree completely.

The Tory leadership is completely against it (morons) but I would imagine the rank and file do not agree with them.

I’ve heard some UK freepers voice opposition though, national pride. I think you gotta put that aside for common sense. Would anyone here object if New England up and decided they wanted out of the union? I would bid fond farewell to their congressional delegations.

I do think it would benefit Scotland also, it’s possible one day they could have a right-of-center government after they’ve as you said “grown up”, and get a local right of center party not affiliated with the Tories, who are heavily disliked in Scotland.

16 posted on 05/18/2014 12:57:58 AM PDT by Impy (RED=COMMUNIST, NOT REPUBLICAN)
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To: Impy

Most of the Northeast, for that matter, the Black Hole of DC (including MD & NoVA), Philadelphia, Detroit, Chicago (Sorry, Impy), and pretty much the entire West Coast above San Diego to Puget Sound would pretty much free the rest of the country.

The Scottish “Right” ought to just start a new party and call it “Liberal” like Australia. Reclaim the name from the Communists who took a positive-sounding word and ideology (of the classic sense) and perverted it into something evil.

17 posted on 05/18/2014 1:19:36 AM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

Last I checked Orange Co is just north of San Diego and one of the most conservative co in the USA.

18 posted on 05/18/2014 1:32:41 AM PDT by TJC (V)
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Excuse me, then above the O.C. northwards, starting at L.A. County. It’s getting late. :-P

Unfortunately, it’s also been trending leftward at an alarming rate like the rest of the state. While Dubya got 60% there in 2004, Zero still got 46% of the vote there in 2012, with Willard getting less than 52%, far below most suburban “Conservative” counties (and McCain barely eked out 50% in ‘08).

Go back to the last year the GOP won the state (1988) and the county voted 68% for GHW Bush to Dukakis’s 31%. Reagan won it with 75%(!) in 1984. That’s when it had its reputation as a premier GOP Conservative county in the nation. A long time ago when the nation was a saner place.

19 posted on 05/18/2014 1:45:13 AM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

I am an English Conservative who, despite frequent periods of despair at the influence of Scottish lefties, still believes in the Union.

I do this because I see Scotland and its people as fellow Britons belonging to a common nation, not as disposable appendages to be cut off and thrown away in the name of present political expediency. I’m sure many Americans who are often exasperated by the attitudes and influences of the Blue States will feel the same.

20 posted on 05/18/2014 2:28:27 PM PDT by sinsofsolarempirefan
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