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In survey, Lackland drill instructors rip leaders, say they fear recruits
San Antonio Express-News, via Stars & Stripes ^ | May 29, 2014 | Sig Christenson

Posted on 05/29/2014 11:18:37 AM PDT by Timber Rattler

A survey of basic-training instructors conducted during the worst sex scandal in Air Force history revealed a sharp distrust of senior commanders at Joint Base San Antonio-Lackland and a widespread fear of recruits.

In occasionally bitter comments, some instructors lashed out at basic-training leaders.

They talked of stressful working conditions and declining standards that had made training too easy, with recruits even saying they expected to have a harder time.

The survey, done last year and obtained this week by the San Antonio Express-News, revealed basic training remains haunted by recruit abuse and misconduct, the same issues that prompted a major makeover at Lackland.

(Excerpt) Read more at stripes.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: airforce; lackland; training; usaf
Such is the state of the U.S. military in the Age of Obama...
1 posted on 05/29/2014 11:18:37 AM PDT by Timber Rattler
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To: Timber Rattler

With the administration’s war on servicemen, all any female would have to do is threaten a sexual harassment complaint and get anything she wants.


2 posted on 05/29/2014 11:24:04 AM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: Timber Rattler
Such is the state of the U.S. military in the Age of Obama...
The story is specifically about the Air Farce at Lackland, not the military in general.
3 posted on 05/29/2014 11:24:39 AM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: Timber Rattler

Great Lakes Basic Training March 1982, age 27, Pensacola AOCS 1984, turned 30, was dubbed the old man.

Both experiences taught me one simple surviaval technique.

Make it to the next meal, then make it to lights out. Next day repeat.

If someone DOR’ed (dropped on request) from AOCS, the Marine drill instructors would have a beer party to celebrate.

What the hell is happening? Obama. Chuck the Duck Hagel. Moochelle, Hitlery, Valerie Hizbollah Jarret, David I’ll suck your Axelrod, Jay Carney, everyone inside the beltway military and civilian.


4 posted on 05/29/2014 11:28:26 AM PDT by the anti-mahdi
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To: Timber Rattler
USMC so far hasn't got the problem of Drill Instructors fearing recruits.

They have a system. It works.

5 posted on 05/29/2014 11:29:48 AM PDT by The KG9 Kid
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To: Timber Rattler
I went through Basic Training at Lackland AFB in 1977, and our course was 6 weeks long and included one half of one day on the Confidence Course. One half day in the entire 6 weeks.

They were more concerned about how you lined up your shoes under your bunk than how fit you were. If you could run a mile and a half in under 15 minutes, you passed.

I understand today's USAF Basic is 8 weeks and includes much more field training.

6 posted on 05/29/2014 11:32:46 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
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To: Timber Rattler
I suspect that the Air Force has the easiest basic training of all the services, and that this PC crap is making it worse.

Also, I say this as a former Air Force officer.

7 posted on 05/29/2014 11:32:52 AM PDT by jumpingcholla34
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To: Timber Rattler
what do you expect from the Air Farce?
8 posted on 05/29/2014 11:39:14 AM PDT by quadrant (1o)
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To: Timber Rattler

Don’t worry, all they’re ever going to have to deal with are hackers and carbon emissions.


9 posted on 05/29/2014 11:40:14 AM PDT by muir_redwoods (When I first read it, " Atlas Shrugged" was fiction)
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To: Timber Rattler; All

Hell, I went through Lackland in 1981, and found it easier than I expected it to be.

Air Force Basic, at least according my experiences, and of those that I know, has always been a Day Camp, compared to the others.


10 posted on 05/29/2014 11:45:10 AM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: Timber Rattler

Air Force boot camp is only 6 weeks long as it is.


11 posted on 05/29/2014 11:47:00 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Haven't you lost enough freedoms? Support an end to the WOD now.)
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To: quadrant
I always enjoyed the Tac Evals at Hahn AB: as one of two officers in my unit that had a TS clearance (the battery commander being the other), I knew that I'd spend all 4 days in the Wing CP.

It cracked me up when I heard the zoomies complaining about having to work 12 hour shifts.

Me? I planned accordingly: 3 additional sets of fatigues, shave kit, etc. I'd catch brief naps during the night. Didn't need too many, I was 24/25 and indestructible.

I didn't mind it at all, I was in a comfortable, temperature-controlled environment.

12 posted on 05/29/2014 11:47:10 AM PDT by Night Hides Not (For every Ted Cruz we send to DC, I can endure 2-3 "unviable" candidates that beat incumbents.)
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To: muir_redwoods; quadrant

I’m sure...

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/3160319/posts

http://astroguyz.com/2009/02/19/the-downing-of-spirit-03-did-the-moon-play-a-role/


13 posted on 05/29/2014 12:00:38 PM PDT by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political parties in the long run gave away our liberty.)
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To: The KG9 Kid

If I were in charge for just one day.... one of the things I would do is to make military boot camp mandatory for all young men and I would have the USMC handle the job for all branches.

Mind you, I did not specify that military service would be mandatory for all, just boot camp. I would hope there would be an appropriate number of “casualties”.


14 posted on 05/29/2014 12:21:54 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
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To: Yo-Yo

I went through in 1976 and had a gung ho TI. He used to take us out on Sunday afternoons for 35 airborne shuffle laps around a drill pad. He used to constantly threaten us with reaching into our chests and pulling out our hearts if we so much as touched him. He chose the dorm chief by asking who could kick everybody else’s a$$. The 5th Dan black belt and former gang member who raised his hand wasn’t disputed.

Back in those days, sometimes “accidents” happened behind the barracks to troops who wouldn’t get with the program. Sometimes “blanket parties” inside the barracks happened too.


15 posted on 05/29/2014 12:24:10 PM PDT by afsnco
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To: Timber Rattler

And the Air Force allegedly gets the higher quality recruits. Can just imagine how scary the lower end of the Army recruits must be.


16 posted on 05/29/2014 12:41:52 PM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: Yo-Yo
I went through Basic Training at Lackland AFB in 1977, and our course was 6 weeks long and included one half of one day on the Confidence Course. One half day in the entire 6 weeks. They were more concerned about how you lined up your shoes under your bunk than how fit you were. If you could run a mile and a half in under 15 minutes, you passed.

I went thru in '68. Pretty much the same.

17 posted on 05/29/2014 12:44:22 PM PDT by TangoLimaSierra (To win the country back, we need to be as mean as the libs say we are.)
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To: oh8eleven

No, the story reflects how this whole country hase become “victim centric” and any allegation has more weight that the follow-on facts.


18 posted on 05/29/2014 1:06:52 PM PDT by pfflier
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To: Timber Rattler

How’s the cartoon/joke go?
Air Force guy: Video game console in hotel room broke, “This Sucks!”
Army Infantryman: Raining, “This sucks!”
Ranger: Raining, “I like the way this sucks!”
Special Forces: Raining, chest deep in water, “This doesn’t suck enough!”


19 posted on 05/29/2014 1:21:37 PM PDT by vpintheak (I will not comply!)
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To: Yo-Yo

I went through in ‘81 and as long as you could roll your socks, space your clothes hangers in the wall locker and line up your shoes under your bunk, you were good to go.

I remember running in formation on the drill pad while our TIs smoked behind the platform where one of their colleagues was leading PT. The TI assigned to that task was usually one of the few who didn’t smoke and was in some semblance of shape.

Make no mistake: many of the TIs who got busted at Lackland deserved what they got. But in typical Air Force fashion, “leadership” threw everyone to the wind when the scandal erupted and I’m sure that a few TIs got burned because on baseless claims, or because they didn’t report misconduct quickly enough.

However, that does not excuse TIs having sex with recruits, which is what many of them were busted for. It’s also another reflection of poor leadership. During my time at basic, there was never more than one or two officers in the squadron, and they were rarely at work before 7:30 and were headed home at 4:30. Same held true for the senior NCOs who were supposed to be supervising the training process.

That left mid-level and junior personnel in charge and many did what they pleased. I’m also sure that some of the trainees who “blew the whistle” were also willing participants, willing to trade sex for an easier time in basic (if that’s possible in the USAF).

As I recall, the Air Force fired the training group commander as the extent of the scandal became known. But the 37th Wing Commander was suddenly reassigned, after less than two years on the job.

That type of double standard doesn’t exactly inspire confidence.


20 posted on 05/29/2014 1:45:34 PM PDT by ExNewsExSpook
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To: Timber Rattler
3708 BMTS in January 1974 a year after I had left college after playing football. I delayed enlisted one year and one week after I had joined to keep my draft lottery number of 30 being used. A week after I delayed enlisted Nixon called off the draft. I stayed in shape and the USAF basic was a piece of cake. I was reared in the USAF and my Father was a former D.I. and had been a member of TAC and SAC. Basic training was home week for six weeks. When I got to my duty station I was allowed to train with Marines at Gulfport NCBC and earned my marksmanship ribbons learning from them because I had to have them to be able to carry and participate in Honor Guard ceremonies. I have a great respect for the Marine NCO's that taught me at the range. Most USAF members then hadn't a clue about combat.

My Father was required to carry an M-1 Carbine and had combat training when he was a member of SAC in the 1950's. He was at Bien Hoa and Takli as a Senior NCO in the 1960's and used his experience well at Bien Hoa several times.

21 posted on 05/29/2014 2:22:03 PM PDT by vetvetdoug
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To: Night Hides Not
I'm not surprised.
22 posted on 05/29/2014 2:59:53 PM PDT by quadrant (1o)
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To: Yo-Yo
I went through Basic Training at Lackland AFB in 1977, and our course was 6 weeks long and included one half of one day on the Confidence Course.

Went thru PI back in the mid 60's. A fellow recruit was corresponding with a buddy who had joined the AF and left for Lackland for basic the same day he (the Marine recruit) left for PI. Our platoon was about half way thru our 13 week recruit training cycle at PI when the AF guy wrote to say he had graduated and was on his way home on boot leave.

23 posted on 05/29/2014 3:17:50 PM PDT by BluH2o
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To: the anti-mahdi
Great Lakes Basic Training March 1982, age 27, Pensacola AOCS 1984, turned 30, was dubbed the old man.

I spent most of the winter of 1976-77 at Great Lakes. First for Basic then a week leave home post Basic, back to GLNTC for Apprentice Training Fireman, then in early Feb 77 to my ship.

Our Company Commander was a MMC with Dolphins. He loved to use the word Dive followed by Mother. That winter was one of the coldest. To go to the Mess Hall many times it was put on as many layers as you could wear and get there as best you could. Many days he couldn't march us out on the grinder but he made up for it in PT in the barracks and Drill Hall. His mind games were a riot also. He put the fear in you and rightfully so.

I've been hazed {Snipe shipboard traditional initiation now against Navy regs,} kissed the Royal Baby then walked the gauntlet in a grease tube from the galley, and worked in bilges coming out so black Mom wouldn't have know me LOL.

24 posted on 05/29/2014 4:37:29 PM PDT by cva66snipe ((Two Choices left for U.S. One Nation Under GOD or One Nation Under Judgment? Which one say ye?))
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To: cva66snipe

Yeah, I am a shellback too. I threw away the uniform I was wearing.

Hahahahaha, it was fun, kind of like getting into a brawl fun, you knew what was coming but laughed anyway.

I had snot freezing on the end of nose in March! Sounds like were there in the dead of winter.

Ricky Crud. Everyone got it. Lungs full of mucus, laryngitis, fever and chills, but you stayed in training just the same.

Yeah, they break you down and put you back together the way they want you to be.

I thank you for your service, there was no draft, you volunteered, and you went through those same WWII hangars that I did.

Paintings were pretty cool on the walls. It was good to be young. Bless you sir.


25 posted on 05/29/2014 6:21:28 PM PDT by the anti-mahdi
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To: Yo-Yo

To paraphrase my TI at Lackland: “You really think anybody gives a f#@! if you fold your underwear in 6” squares? We’re here to see if you can follow orders...period.”


26 posted on 05/29/2014 7:13:06 PM PDT by gundog (Help us, Nairobi-Wan Kenobi...you're our only hope.)
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To: the anti-mahdi

Thanks for your service and bless you too. You know what was so bad that winter I came home to east Tennessee for Christmas after Basic and lakes here were iced up also. The weather after the first of the year up there really got bad. We were told maximum times we could stay outside & shovel snow LOL.


27 posted on 05/29/2014 7:36:42 PM PDT by cva66snipe ((Two Choices left for U.S. One Nation Under GOD or One Nation Under Judgment? Which one say ye?))
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To: gundog

Sgt. Robertson, is that you?


28 posted on 05/30/2014 10:57:27 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
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To: Yo-Yo

I was a few years ahead of you but pretty much the same thing. First two weeks they marched you to death, second two weeks they taught you do death, third two weeks they bored you to death.


29 posted on 05/30/2014 12:29:37 PM PDT by ops33 (Senior Master Sergeant, USAF (Retired))
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