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Ignore NRA fantasy world: Good guy with pepper spray stops bad guy with gun
The Kansas City Star ^ | 06-06-2014 | Yael T. Abouhalkah

Posted on 06/06/2014 5:43:55 PM PDT by PaulCruz2016

The gun lovers who preach that arming American citizens to stop even more violence always ignore the fact that Wayne LaPierre was wrong.

“The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun,” LaPierre, the National Rifle Association’s executive vice president, infamously said after a gunman in 2012 killed 20 schoolchildren and six adults in Newtown, Conn.

Yet looked what happened Thursday.

According to police, a student building monitor named Jon Meis used pepper spray to subdue a shooter who had already killed one student and wounded a couple others at Seattle Pacific University in Washington.

Police said the actions by Meis probably saved more lives, because the gunman had extra shotgun shells he could have used after reloading.

In the larger scheme of things, Meis’ use of pepper spray to halt the killings are at odds with the actual facts of how often a “good guy” with a gun stops a “bad guy” with a gun.

Basically, it doesn’t happen.

It’s a fantasy of the NRA and its most ardent gun-rights supporters.

(Excerpt) Read more at kansascity.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Editorial; US: Washington
KEYWORDS: banglist; barfalert; gun; guns; nra; pepperspray; seattle; shooting; washington
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1 posted on 06/06/2014 5:43:55 PM PDT by PaulCruz2016
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To: PaulCruz2016

The fact is that it still took a weapon to stop a guy with a weapon.

That hasn’t changed.


2 posted on 06/06/2014 5:45:57 PM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults)
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To: PaulCruz2016

You just cannot fix either stupid or evil.


3 posted on 06/06/2014 5:46:36 PM PDT by microgood
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To: PaulCruz2016
Image and video hosting by TinyPic

Paris Ainsworth was shot 4 times and still returned fire hitting 2 of 3 assailants (one of them twice).

Bet she wishes she had used her pepper spray instead. /s
4 posted on 06/06/2014 5:48:05 PM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

If the shooter had a 30 round clip, the guy with the pepper spray would likely be dead before shooter had to reload.

Moronic article.


5 posted on 06/06/2014 5:50:11 PM PDT by bamahead (Few men desire liberty; most men wish only for a just master. -- Sallust)
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To: PaulCruz2016
Okay, Yael, I have an idea. Let's you and me have a duel. You bring your pepper spray and I'll bring my .45.

Fair warning; after I drop you I'm going to take your pepper spray, shove it in your wound and empty it while laughing manically about gun control. ;^O

6 posted on 06/06/2014 5:51:40 PM PDT by TigersEye ("No man left behind" means something different to 0bama.)
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To: PaulCruz2016
The anti-gunners are anti-pepper spray, too.

Just not this time.

7 posted on 06/06/2014 5:52:55 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum ("The more numerous the laws, the more corrupt the government." --Tacitus)
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To: PaulCruz2016

idiot. I’m holding a shot gun and he has a choice of pepper spray, Colt .45 or another shotgun...I’m so frickin sure he’d pick the pepper spray. dumba## just doesn’t describe him enough.


8 posted on 06/06/2014 5:53:31 PM PDT by Dick Vomer (democrats are like flies, whatever they don't eat they sh#t on.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

Why did they bother calling in a bunch of uniformed guys WITH GUNS?


9 posted on 06/06/2014 5:53:43 PM PDT by digger48
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To: PaulCruz2016

Stupid libs.

They’re opposed to people walking around with pepper spray too.


10 posted on 06/06/2014 5:53:49 PM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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manically = maniacally ... ah, heck, you’ll be bleeding out so who cares about semantics!?


11 posted on 06/06/2014 5:54:44 PM PDT by TigersEye ("No man left behind" means something different to 0bama.)
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To: PaulCruz2016
Here’s an insightful Mother Jones article

Mother Jones? Insightful? Har Har. Need I say more on that?

The left and its never ending misdirection on firearms and the 2nd amendment.

It's NOT about hunting, it's not about protecting yourself from criminals. Those rights are innate givens.

The thing the left refuses to acknowledge and debate is the real reason for 2A. Protecting ourselves from TYRANTS.

Guns are effective protection, deterrent and defense RE crime. But that is irrelevant to 2A. 2A is to protect us from the government. The founders made that very clear. The left refuses to discuss that because an open and free discussion would make it painfully obvious that they are defending tyrants with their attack on your gun rights.

12 posted on 06/06/2014 5:56:05 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s ((If you can remember the 60s.....you weren't really there)
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To: PaulCruz2016

Oh come on. Abouhalkah doesn’t really believe that we don’t need good guys with guns. She would never advocate disarming the police based on her purported theory that good guys don’t need guns. No, she just wants to disarm law abiding citizens and leave guns in the hands of criminals and police. As for her motive, I’ll leave that up to you to figure out.


13 posted on 06/06/2014 5:56:21 PM PDT by SSS Two
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To: PaulCruz2016

Yet if police use the same pepper spray to subdue an assailant folks like Yael cry that excessive force was being used. The warped and idiotic thought processes of the left never cease to amaze me.


14 posted on 06/06/2014 5:56:57 PM PDT by dowcaet
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To: PaulCruz2016

In a lot of states you have to have a license to carry pepper spray.


15 posted on 06/06/2014 5:59:20 PM PDT by P-Marlowe (There can be no Victory without a fight and no battle without wounds)
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To: bamahead
Moronic article.

LOL. Any piece that references Mother Jones to support its point is by definition moronic. Regardless of the subject.

16 posted on 06/06/2014 5:59:26 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s ((If you can remember the 60s.....you weren't really there)
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To: dowcaet
Yet if police use the same pepper spray to subdue an assailant folks like Yael cry that excessive force was being used.

I rather doubt that. Abouhalkah didn't pass judgement on Meis' use of pepper spray. She doesn't really care about that. She simply doesn't want law abiding citizens to own guns.

17 posted on 06/06/2014 6:01:00 PM PDT by SSS Two
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

The anti-gunners are anti-pepper spray, too.

Yup. Don’t get caught with either a gun or pepper spray in NYC.


18 posted on 06/06/2014 6:01:55 PM PDT by TalBlack (Evil doesn't have a day job.)
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To: P-Marlowe

It was against school rules for the hero to carry pepper spray. Doing what is right trumps the rules.


19 posted on 06/06/2014 6:02:10 PM PDT by 21twelve (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2185147/posts 2013 is 1933 REBORN)
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To: P-Marlowe

I would suspect that the pepper spray guy was violating the law at the college.


20 posted on 06/06/2014 6:04:23 PM PDT by RetiredTexasVet (If you lined up the best and brightest of this administration, you'd just have a string of dim bulbs)
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To: PaulCruz2016

Only a Democrat would be stupid enough to think it’s a good idea to take a can of spray to a gun fight.


21 posted on 06/06/2014 6:05:07 PM PDT by DJ Taylor (Once again our country is at war,and once again the Democrats have sided with our enemy.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

For the record, the person Abouhalkah is named after killed a man with a weapon other than a gun.


22 posted on 06/06/2014 6:05:58 PM PDT by SSS Two
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To: SSS Two

Imagine that, a Muslim who wants to disarm all Americans...

Whoda thunkit...


23 posted on 06/06/2014 6:11:10 PM PDT by Delta Dawn (Fluent in two languages: English and cursive.)
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To: bamahead

So it’s a good thing he didn’t have a 30 round clip. Glad his lethality was limited by his gear.


24 posted on 06/06/2014 6:11:43 PM PDT by christx30 (Freedom above all.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

Yael doesn’t have an original thought

Just another Affirmative Action Jackson token “journ-O-list”


25 posted on 06/06/2014 6:12:51 PM PDT by A_Former_Democrat (Shame on Sam The Sham . . . Michael ScAM . . .$$$ grab all planned by this "handlers")
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To: PaulCruz2016

You can’t fix delusional and stupid.


26 posted on 06/06/2014 6:15:31 PM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Be a part of the American freedom migration: freestateproject.org)
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To: PaulCruz2016

I apologize for using feminine pronouns when referring to Yael Abouhalkah. Yael is a common female name in Israel, but this particular Yael appears to be male.


27 posted on 06/06/2014 6:16:29 PM PDT by SSS Two
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To: christx30

Of course it’s very fortunate he did not have a larger capacity weapon. It’s the premise in the article that pepper spray could stop ANY shooter in any situation that is absurd.

Make no mistake, the guy who did stop the shooter with pepper spray is a BRAVE HERO.


28 posted on 06/06/2014 6:20:33 PM PDT by bamahead (Few men desire liberty; most men wish only for a just master. -- Sallust)
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To: christx30

If a soldier ever gets into a firefight that lasts longer than five seconds, he’ll curse the day he decided to carry a shotgun into combat.


29 posted on 06/06/2014 6:21:16 PM PDT by DJ Taylor (Once again our country is at war,and once again the Democrats have sided with our enemy.)
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To: SSS Two

“Abouhalkah....just wants to disarm law abiding citizens and leave guns in the hands of [Muslims]. As for her motive, I’ll leave that up to you to figure out.”

With that name, her motive is that she’s...a muzzie?


30 posted on 06/06/2014 6:23:20 PM PDT by elcid1970 ("In the modern world, Muslims are living fossils.")
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To: PaulCruz2016

Pepper spray works great when the shooter has no rounds in his weapon.


31 posted on 06/06/2014 6:23:52 PM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: PaulCruz2016

A good resource for gun owners fighting back is http://www.easybakegunclub.com

Updated every day. Good stories and reviews on that site as well.


32 posted on 06/06/2014 6:24:24 PM PDT by RandallFlagg (Uninstall Fascist Firefox. Get Pale Moon.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

IBTZ


33 posted on 06/06/2014 6:24:35 PM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: SSS Two

So far left he/she is probably “transgender”


34 posted on 06/06/2014 6:26:31 PM PDT by A_Former_Democrat (Shame on Sam The Sham . . . Michael ScAM . . .$$$ grab all planned by this "handlers")
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To: PaulCruz2016
The gun lovers who preach that arming American citizens to stop even more violence always ignore the fact that Wayne LaPierre was wrong.

Sophistry.

American citizens to not have to provide justification for exercising a civil right.

35 posted on 06/06/2014 6:27:48 PM PDT by holymoly
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To: elcid1970

Yael Abouhalkah is a male. No idea about his name, but Yael appears in several languages (such as Yale in English).


36 posted on 06/06/2014 6:28:47 PM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: PaulCruz2016

How much you wanna bet the guy was wishing he had a gun instead of that pepper spray?


37 posted on 06/06/2014 6:28:49 PM PDT by Mastador1 (I'll take a bad dog over a good politician any day!)
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To: PaulCruz2016

Good guys and gals with a .40 Glock is better.


38 posted on 06/06/2014 6:33:51 PM PDT by SkyDancer (If you don't read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read newspapers you are misinformed)
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To: jjotto

He’s still a muzzie, right?


39 posted on 06/06/2014 6:38:37 PM PDT by elcid1970 ("In the modern world, Muslims are living fossils.")
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To: elcid1970

It’s an Arab name, but I don’t know if it’s Arab Christian.


40 posted on 06/06/2014 6:44:05 PM PDT by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: PaulCruz2016

But in GEORGIA, it took a good guy with a gun to stop a bad guy with a gun again.


41 posted on 06/06/2014 6:49:37 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Sometimes you need more than seven rounds, Much more.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

I give the guy with the pepperspray big props, he is a hero, no doubt about it. He’s also very lucky and obviously brave. He and his actions deserve to be rewarded and celebrated.

But with that said, what would have happened if the attacker was one of those who can tolerate irritant sprays, or worse, he was ready for the guy with a backup pistol, knife, or etc.? Thing is, every encounter like this is unique in circumstance, the antis touting the spray as just as effective as firearms, are living in a fantasy world. In this case, the circumstances just happened to be right for the guy to succeed in defeating the attacker.


42 posted on 06/06/2014 7:07:30 PM PDT by SirFishalot
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To: PaulCruz2016

There’s this odd notion that a summary of a position can be dismissed because, as demonstrated by a single sensible exception/anecdote, the brief summary is not of peer-reviewed encyclopedic completeness.

Yes, by far, it takes a good guy with a gun to stop a bad guy with a gun. That’s why cops carry guns. That someone with pepper spray stopped someone with a gun is a sensible exception to the rule without negating the rule, and does not justify disarming cops and fitting them with Dave’s Insanity Sauce in aerosol form.


43 posted on 06/06/2014 7:21:38 PM PDT by ctdonath2 ("If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun" - Obama, setting RoE with his opposition)
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To: PaulCruz2016

Hey Yael, lets test that.

You take the pepper spray, I’ll take the gun.

Let’s see what happens...


44 posted on 06/06/2014 7:31:09 PM PDT by DB
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To: PaulCruz2016

And to think that there are conservatives who think the Libs are intellectual, and actually make a living telling us how debating Libs is the only way forward, Hello George Will. Basically I am saying the author of this article is a moron. Heck his fellow mooslim, Major Hassan killed at least one person who tried to disarm him, what about that Alliboobookah?


45 posted on 06/06/2014 7:42:25 PM PDT by junta ("Peace is a racket", testimony from crime boss Barrack Hussein Obama.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

He was in violation of the order to “hunker down”.

Can’t have civilians going all “superhero” can we?


46 posted on 06/06/2014 7:52:38 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (The new witchhunt: "Do you NOW, . . . or have you EVER , . . supported traditional marriage?")
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To: 21twelve

Yup. Prohibited by the libtards as that college: “13. Possession, use or display on University property of any firearms, weapons, fireworks, live ammunition, incendiary devices, or other items that are potentially hazardous to members of the campus community.”

Pepper spray is definitely potentially hazardous, ergo prohibited.


47 posted on 06/06/2014 7:54:55 PM PDT by piytar (The predator-class is furious that their prey are shooting back.)
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To: PaulCruz2016
There’s just one little problem with this: Not a single one of the 62 mass shootings we studied in our investigation has been stopped this way

Off-hand, I can think of three.

There was most definitely the church shooting in CO Springs.

If I remember right, a school shooting in VA or somewhere near there, and it seems there was a mall shooting in UT or someplace.

48 posted on 06/06/2014 8:03:45 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: DB
?Hey Yael, lets test that.

Gun vs. Pepper Spray at 20 paces. What's the range on pepper spray ?

49 posted on 06/06/2014 8:14:14 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lost my tagline on Flight MH370. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: PaulCruz2016

Yael is a leftist moron, once of the reasons I refuse to read the KC Red Star (and I live in the KC Metro.)

What he’s saying here is, as usual, idiotic. That a one-time fluke proves his fantasy. I’ve got a suggestion, Yael: Get the KCPD to disarm, except for pepper spray. Using your... well, what ever it is that you substitute for thought... the police have no reason for firearms, since in this ONE CASE, a shooter was disarmed by someone with pepper spray, disproving the statement by Wayne LaPiere.

Disproved. Yeah, right.

Hey Yael, I heard that they revived someone who had been underwater for more than 10 minutes with no lingering brain damage... I guess that means we can leave drowning victims under water for at least 9 minutes before needing to save them, right?

Yes, Yael is a moron.

Mark


50 posted on 06/06/2014 9:02:50 PM PDT by MarkL (Do I really look like a guy with a plan?)
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