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'It's hell down there:' Inside the battle for eastern Ukraine
CNN ^ | June 6, 2014 | Tim Lister

Posted on 06/07/2014 10:37:26 AM PDT by 1rudeboy

Slovyansk, Ukraine (CNN) -- In a forest of pines to the east of Slovyansk, Prapor and his seventy men were digging in Thursday. A man in his late-fifties with a magnificent beard and four different weapons, Prapor freely admitted he was not a local. But he was here -- he said -- to resist the "Ukrainian fascists" in Krasny Liman, a nearby town just recaptured by government forces.

He was dismissive of the group that had fled Krasny -- "Cossacks," he sneered. He had already lost seven men, but his fighters were the bravest. They would not run away.

Meeting Prapor was revealing in several ways. Pro-Russian separatists working in eastern Ukraine are better organized, better armed (Prapor's group had a truck-mounted anti-aircraft gun that was clearly working), and more of them appear to come from beyond Ukraine. And they are building a maze of roadblocks and defensive positions across the region.

But a few kilometers beyond, in rolling countryside under a hot sun, a very different group was setting up camp: a substantial force of Ukrainian paratroopers, with armored personnel carriers and artillery. Above, a reconnaissance plane drifted in loops.

Both sides look -- at least militarily -- more competent than they did a few weeks ago. Checkpoints used to be few and far between. Now there is a maze of them -- more separatist than Ukrainian -- dotted across both the Donetsk and Luhansk regions. The insignia of the "Vostok Battalion" -- a group that includes both Russian and local fighters -- is common at the roadblocks that have sprung up on the main roads leading into Donetsk.

A few weeks ago, we watched the bedraggled remnants of the Ukrainian army's 25th Division surrounded and harangued by locals near Kramatorsk. Now there is a sense of purpose....

(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: occupycrimea; occutardation; russia; russianoccupation; ukraine

1 posted on 06/07/2014 10:37:26 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

Borodai is a Russian national. A lot of Ukrainian “separtist” leadership is the fruitcake of mother russia, apparently. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Borodai


2 posted on 06/07/2014 10:44:47 AM PDT by lodi90
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To: 1rudeboy; fieldmarshaldj; AuH2ORepublican; Impy; GOPsterinMA; randita; Sun; LdSentinal; ...

I have a theory about Vlad Putin’s actions, which few otheres have speculated on. Russia has a huge Islamic population in its southern borders and fundamentalism is catching on there. Russia’s population outside those areas has been falling for years. So Putin wants to anex all the ethnic Russian areas in neighboring nations to form a united Russia so that the Islamic areas don’t wind up outnumbering them in the future and to have the forces to stamp out further successionist movements.

As for Ukraine, if the Obama Administration had any intelligence, it would subtly push for a Ukrainian confederation, with a nominal national government but the various provinces holding great autonomy on domestic issues.


3 posted on 06/07/2014 10:47:04 AM PDT by Clintonfatigued (The War on Drugs is Big Government statism)
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To: Clintonfatigued

Obama believes in centralized power


4 posted on 06/07/2014 10:47:56 AM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: Clintonfatigued

“As for Ukraine,if the Obama Administration had any intelligence,it would subtly push for a Ukrainian confederation,with a nominal national government but the various provinces holding great autonomy on domestic issues.”

You mean the way the U.S. is supposed to operate. Isn’t he actively working to undermine that here. I don’t think that’s in his playbook.


5 posted on 06/07/2014 11:00:56 AM PDT by DeWalt (Times are more like they used to be than they are today.)
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To: Clintonfatigued

If that is Putin’s plan then why did he annex the Crimea, the most heavily islamic part of Ukraine? Putin just gave Russian citizenship to hundreds of thousands of Muslim Tatars.

Ukraine hardly has any muslims at all so why would they want to become part of Russia, which has over twenty million muslim citizens? Why would Ukrainians want to give up their own country that is not even one percent muslim to become part of a country that is already over ten perecent muslim?


6 posted on 06/07/2014 11:22:38 AM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Clintonfatigued

Your conclusion is flawed because you have missing data. Chechnya is growing rich and strong because of billions of Russian tax dollars. The dictator of the Muslims is building his own little Islamic state, while getting for Putin 99 percent of the vote in sham elections. He also names stuff after Putin and openly declares that Putin should be President for life. Chechen spetznaz have been fighting on behalf of Moscow in Ukraine, and they did so in Georgia too.


7 posted on 06/07/2014 2:50:01 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: 1rudeboy; little jeremiah; tcrlaf

FYI Some updates on Ukraine:

- Assassination in Nemirov city.......Ukrainian police confirm death of ‘Chief of Poroshenko’s presidential campaign administration’,.... shot down in his car.

- Poroshenko promised to get rid of his assets on becoming President? Instead he’s buying up more factories...and kept his Media Network.

- Yarosh to be offered a Cabinet position, Right Sector to become “the army of Poroshenko.”

- A little humor...Russian paper Describes the Meeting of Obama and Poroshenko as “Meeting of the two chocolate presidents.”

- PM Yatsenyuk says deputy of defense minister is suspected of stealing money provided for the Ukrainian army.

- Former Pres. Candidate Radical ‘Lyshko’ kicks out Russian Journalists from Rada....Stop Censorship” group slams Ukraine MP who tore up press card of Russian journolist - say unacceptable “even for journalists from enemy country”

- Residents of the Odessa region are trying to join the Donetsk and Lugansk announcing the creation of ‘the People’s Republic of Odessa’.

- Poroshenko...”federalization is not an option”...” The only official language in Ukraine will be Ukrainian.”

- Kiev Army using an insane amount of artillery on Semenovka Sloviansk over the last couple days....many buildings bombed and destroyed. One individual wrote it was so heavy your hearing was affected....SLAVYANSK in humanitarian crisis...:
Under heavy bombardments, w/o water or electricity & running out of food .....continued bombing this morning...June 7, 2014 (Sat)....... 2 long videos of fights

http://youtu.be/ZeQAkj4vrqI

http://youtu.be/f7bHi0wFJvM


8 posted on 06/07/2014 2:52:13 PM PDT by caww
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To: caww

If it’s on YouTube, it must be true.


9 posted on 06/07/2014 3:17:09 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

I rather think people have the capability to discern what is or not....and generally there are other sources to back it up as evidence comes in. In this case there’s plenty out there.


10 posted on 06/07/2014 3:38:15 PM PDT by caww
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To: caww

Of course there is. No one ever happens to be around to correct the disinformation, though. Wonder why that is?


11 posted on 06/07/2014 3:41:50 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: caww

posted 08 June 2014 03:31 Hide Post
https://www.facebook.com/burkonews?fref=ts ^ | Today, 7 June | Roman Burko

Partisons Fighting Back........... Killing Terrorists;

TRANSLATION: By tapping private channels #Zello, in which the terrorists and their accomplices exchange operational information, volunteers reported that the road Kharkov-Rostov (in Soviet times, the highway was number 13), an unknown group of people engaged in guerrilla activities against DNR militants. Supporters of terrorists are panicked, because just today with the actions of the mobile group the terrorists lost 5 fighters.

Along with this, it is noted that the guerrilla activities are likely local, because the actions of a group of assailants on checkpoints DNR because they knew the grounds [area] (which is not typical for non locals) and occurred without any casualties among the independent attackers. The tactics of guerrilla groups are also not typical of regular and newly created units of the National Guard, # FP and territorial defence units.

We have seen the facts, when the separatists complained in the channels Zello on the disappearance of its people in occupied areas, this is often blamed on the actions of the special security services, but after analyzing reports from local residents and volunteers in eastern Ukraine, we came to the conclusion that in the has started effective action of independent guerrilla cell leading the fight against terrorists and separatists. Since the continuing increase of repressions and looting of the local population from the other by Kadyrov’s and other pro-Russian militias has led to this new backlash.

This precedent creates a new milestone in the history of confrontation in the Donbas. We ask all residents to report information about the facts of guerrilla warfare against terrorists DNR. This data also will also help form the basis of the chronology of events of the war of liberation against the pro-Russian invaders.

....Time for snake-eaters to be fed to the hogs...
.......In bunches or one at a time....

Hope this doesn’t offend you tender putee nature...


12 posted on 06/07/2014 3:44:02 PM PDT by hubel458
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To: 1rudeboy

Libya- Both sides are bad, Obama sides with the worst side.

Egypt- Both sides are bad, Obama sides with the worst side.

Syria- Both sides are bad, Obama sides with the worst side.

Ukraine- Both sides are bad, Obama sides with the worst side.

You can always count on Obama to show you who is the least loathsome....they are the ones he is against. In Ukraine that is the separatists in the east...


13 posted on 06/07/2014 4:05:34 PM PDT by Bobalu (What cannot be programmed cannot be physics)
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To: Bobalu

That’s an interesting standard you have . . . you choose whom to support locally considering whom you oppose globally, without considering anything else.


14 posted on 06/07/2014 4:08:11 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

Yup, but in this case I am so perfectly correct.


15 posted on 06/07/2014 4:13:29 PM PDT by Bobalu (What cannot be programmed cannot be physics)
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To: Bobalu

Actually . . . .


16 posted on 06/07/2014 4:17:53 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: caww

“Poroshenko...”federalization is not an option”...” The only official language in Ukraine will be Ukrainian.””

Well, that should settle things. NOT...


17 posted on 06/07/2014 4:55:07 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: caww

At Slovyansk, the Rebels have gotten at least one old WW2 relic running, a T-34-85 that was a war monument, and into the fight, apparently.

They also captured a downed Mi-24, and have taken it into town. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUbpz13tUWU I doubt it will ever fly again, but...

In Luhansk, they got 1 or 2 abandoned T-62’s running again.


18 posted on 06/07/2014 5:12:45 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: Bobalu

‘’count on Obama to show you who is the least loathsome’’

SO TRUE— And since he and administration are not helping

Ukraine as much as they are helping putler, means UKR

are good guys. Our prez and putler are same commies in the

commie/fascist pea pod. We still do business with putler.

Still issue visas to russlies.. still won’t let our gas

shippers go to EU to drop putlers prices and cut him

out of the market,to help supply cheaper gas to EU and

UKR. We put on no-sanction sanctions, that don’t bother

russlies.In going gradual, they move money elsewhere..

We still got idiots fighting fracking, which

could bring forth huge amounts gas in UKR-POL-GER- UK.

Which would cut out putler more. He makes speeches

against fracking except in russlie, he behing scenes

supports obama AGW crap, which caused shortages giving

putler more power...

So our THE ONE is helping putler 10 times more than UKS,

Kinda make them good guys.........


19 posted on 06/07/2014 5:33:27 PM PDT by hubel458
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To: Bobalu
You can always count on Obama to show you who is the least loathsome...

Easy conclusion to make when you don't know any Ukrainians. Obama should be on the side of the Chechens and Communists that are working for Putin.

20 posted on 06/07/2014 7:10:35 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: hubel458
Obama is only giving the limited support to Ukraine because American people want it. 55% of the Republicans and 23% of the Democrats say Obama's handling is not tough enough. Only a miniscule amount says it is too tough.

http://www.people-press.org/2014/04/28/bipartisan-support-for-increased-u-s-sanctions-against-russia/


21 posted on 06/08/2014 3:31:19 AM PDT by Krosan
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To: Bobalu

In this case, it is Obama handing Crimea to Russia, and planning to hand the rest of Ukraine to Russia after the midterms.


22 posted on 06/08/2014 6:55:22 PM PDT by Thunder90 (All posts soley represent my own opinion.)
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To: tcrlaf
...”the Rebels have gotten at least one old WW2 relic running”....

I saw a video of them starting that up while it was still on the concrete square monument. I could only think of the great determination these people have.

Unfortunately with the force of shelling the Ukraine Gov. is doing now there is no way they can handle that. But then the idea is to destroy the east infrastruction etc. as we know, so that the IMF and other corporate bottom feeders can get their cut and funnel the “Recovery” funds to the highest bidder....Ukrainians will fair the least when all is said and done..if that.....Ukraine will be a full Debtor state as planned....note that Russia is in the black....


23 posted on 06/09/2014 1:27:39 AM PDT by caww
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To: Clintonfatigued

In the days of the last tsar and kaiser wilhelm (who were cousins), wilhelm sent several commissioned portraits to tsar Nicholas which depicted the two of them as Christian soldiers defending the West from the muslim horde (the turks in particular).

This featured strongly later with the intrigue from the russian foreign minister with the austro-hungarian empire- to pressure the turks into letting russian ships through the Dardanelles, in exchange for Serbia being under the control of austria-hungary. Unfortunately, the a-h empire annexed Serbia, and later a Serbian nationalist assassinated
Franz Ferdinand (heir apparent) and started WWI.

The russian orthodox church features in Putin’s plans and alliances, as they did in former times— as a bastion agains islamofascism. On the other hand, the obamaumaoists are supporting the elements who are not in the russian sway, and this includes descendants of the collaborators with Hitler (einsatsgruppen Ukraine). This makes sense when one clearly sees the world socialists in obamaumao’s regime for what they are— pure socialist/marxists. And Putin— Stalin re-incarnated in the passion of russian nationalism and old alliances. Not to forget the central issue— natural gas to EU and control of it.


24 posted on 06/09/2014 7:04:49 AM PDT by John S Mosby (Sic Semper Tyrannis)
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To: caww
That's an old graph.

It's worse than that -or better depending on your perspective.


25 posted on 06/09/2014 7:42:45 AM PDT by Justa
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To: caww

That must be an old map, the national debt in the United States is 17 trillion and growing.


26 posted on 06/09/2014 7:52:13 AM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: tcrlaf
.” The only official language in Ukraine will be Ukrainian.””

At least it isn't Swedish.

27 posted on 06/09/2014 7:56:15 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: mac_truck
Probably... as the debt raises faster then they can change the maps...HA!.....There was a time when it was easier to grasp the interest...now even that is going off the maps...


28 posted on 06/09/2014 12:24:26 PM PDT by caww
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To: caww

29 posted on 06/09/2014 12:25:53 PM PDT by caww
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