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Russia warns Finland against joining NATO
Norway Today ^ | 8/6/2014 | Norway Today

Posted on 06/08/2014 3:52:24 PM PDT by Dallas59

Do Finland want to start World War III? It's something to think about if Finland wants to join NATO, warns Russian President Vladimir Putin's personal envoy Sergei Markov.

Enlarge Do Finland want to start World War III? It's something to think about if Finland wants to join NATO, warns Russian President Vladimir Putin's personal envoy Sergei Markov. It's not Russian hatred against Finland, but if Finland joins NATO, it shows that the country has a Russia-complex, said Markov, who is a political scientist, to the newspaper Hufvudstadsbladet. - If Finland wants to join NATO, they should think first . Will you join and start World War III? Anti-Semitism started World War II. Russofobien can start a third. Finland is one of the most russofobiske countries in Europe, after Sweden and the Baltic countries, says

(Excerpt) Read more at norwaytoday.info ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: finland; nato; russia
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1 posted on 06/08/2014 3:52:24 PM PDT by Dallas59
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To: Dallas59

folk off Russkies


2 posted on 06/08/2014 3:54:34 PM PDT by yldstrk ( My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Dallas59

Oooooh. Wait till Ubama hears about this. He’s going to get out a fresh crayon and draw a big ol’ red line.


3 posted on 06/08/2014 3:57:57 PM PDT by Texas Eagle (If it wasn't for double-standards, Liberals would have no standards at all -- Texas Eagle)
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To: Dallas59

Sure. Attack Finland like you did in WW2.


4 posted on 06/08/2014 3:58:43 PM PDT by SkyDancer (If you don't read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read newspapers you are misinformed)
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To: Dallas59
Because Putin know that Obama, E.U. and NATO won't do a damn thing to stop him...

Right now, the worse thing Obama can do is send Kerry over there in the hope that his idiocy is contagious,


5 posted on 06/08/2014 4:00:17 PM PDT by darkwing104 (Forgive but don't forget)
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To: Dallas59

Threats like that are guaranteed to backfire.


6 posted on 06/08/2014 4:00:56 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: Dallas59
Finland responds:


7 posted on 06/08/2014 4:01:21 PM PDT by null and void (Fascists never think they're fascists. They just think everybody should obey them.)
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To: Dallas59

Watch it there Russia ,Finland will kick your butts again


8 posted on 06/08/2014 4:01:23 PM PDT by molson209 (Blank)
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To: Dallas59

“it shows that the country has a Russia-complex, said Markov”

Can’t imagine why that might be. Someone needs to mention a certain Finnish snipers name to Markov.


9 posted on 06/08/2014 4:02:51 PM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Dallas59

Even Sweden is thinking of joining NATO, to survive.


10 posted on 06/08/2014 4:04:33 PM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Dallas59
Sorry, Finland. It was nice knowin' ya.

Maybe when we get a President with balls like, say, Sarah Palin, we might be able to rescue you.

Until then, onnea.

11 posted on 06/08/2014 4:12:44 PM PDT by Texas Eagle (If it wasn't for double-standards, Liberals would have no standards at all -- Texas Eagle)
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To: Texas Eagle
Oooooh. Wait till Ubama hears about this. He’s going to get out a fresh crayon and draw a big ol’ red line.

Yeah but Bathhouse Barry will draw it in front of the Fins warning them against joining NATO, because if there is a side that will aid Americas enemies and hurt her allies that is the side he will always pick!

12 posted on 06/08/2014 4:19:50 PM PDT by Mastador1 (I'll take a bad dog over a good politician any day!)
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To: Dallas59

Assuming “Russofobien” means “fear of Russia”, then yes, Finland would have to be mentally retarded not to have a strong fear of Russia.


13 posted on 06/08/2014 4:22:21 PM PDT by samtheman
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To: Lurker

I’ll mention him: “Simo Hayha”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4


14 posted on 06/08/2014 4:38:20 PM PDT by dynachrome (Vertrou in God en die Mauser)
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To: SkyDancer

15 posted on 06/08/2014 4:38:59 PM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: Dallas59

“Finland is one of the most russofobiske countries in Europe, after Sweden and the Baltic countries...”

Gee, I wonder why that would be? Could it be because of decades and decades of Russian occupation, Russification, and then a Russian led communist infiltration and attempted overthrow of Finland’s fledgling government right after WWI and then Stalin’s land grab and the Winter War in 1939-1940?

Gee, I wonder.


16 posted on 06/08/2014 4:45:31 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: smokingfrog

Don’t mess with the Finns. They had a sniper that bagged like 300 or so Soviets.


17 posted on 06/08/2014 4:55:11 PM PDT by SkyDancer (If you don't read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read newspapers you are misinformed)
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To: Dallas59

Screw you Pootie.


18 posted on 06/08/2014 5:00:39 PM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Obama lied; our healthcare died.)
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To: smokingfrog; SkyDancer

Of course the Red/Red sympathizing NYT reporter has to describe the destruction of Soviet aggressor forces as a “terrifying sight”.


19 posted on 06/08/2014 5:03:51 PM PDT by fso301
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To: Dallas59

Hey Russia, Finland ain’t your little bitch, anymore.


20 posted on 06/08/2014 5:11:04 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Dallas59

See this Putin lovers on FR.


21 posted on 06/08/2014 5:22:39 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Do The Math)
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To: vladimir998

Yeah...cuz everyone over there is still living as if it were 1950.

Have you met Bob from Finland?


22 posted on 06/08/2014 5:38:17 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: mac_truck

“Yeah...cuz everyone over there is still living as if it were 1950.”

No, they’re just living with the reality of how things are now:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/01/us-ukraine-crisis-nordics-idUSBREA301AD20140401

http://www.worldcrunch.com/world-affairs/sweden-and-finland-face-their-russian-fears/crimea-nato-scandinavian-countries-finland-sweden/c1s15485/#.U5UGbGdOVjo


23 posted on 06/08/2014 5:58:27 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: Dallas59

...here is some good reading for all to help explain this...
many may be aware....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics


24 posted on 06/08/2014 6:45:44 PM PDT by himno hero (hadnuff)
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To: molson209; null and void; SkyDancer; smokingfrog; dfwgator
you know, while Finland did kick the USSR's butt in the Winter War, it:
  1. Still lost
  2. Knew that it was only keeping a desperate hold-off until some help, somehow could arrive
  3. Was helped by the horrible (in fact non-existent) Soviet logistical planning
  4. Could not be easily repeated against Putin's new army

the Russians have been winning against the Finnic peoples for nearly a millenia -- remember that what is now the lands around the city of Moscow were once Finnic territory and that there are many finnic groups in Russia -- udmurts, Karelins eta. -- I would also argue that Moscowites are partly Finnic, partly Mongolic by blood mixed with their Slavic blood

Finland should be afraid, but it should be more afraid NOT to join NATO.

It ought to join an Eastern bloc stretching from Finland to Romania that forms a wall of steel against Russia

25 posted on 06/08/2014 7:36:44 PM PDT by Cronos (Obama’s dislike of Assad is not based on Assad’s brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: Cronos

Not too sure. A NATO run by 0bama??


26 posted on 06/08/2014 7:46:11 PM PDT by SkyDancer (If you don't read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read newspapers you are misinformed)
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To: Cronos

true


27 posted on 06/08/2014 7:55:45 PM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: SkyDancer

“a sniper that bagged like 300 or so Soviets.”

See #14


28 posted on 06/08/2014 8:05:21 PM PDT by dynachrome (Vertrou in God en die Mauser)
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To: vladimir998
they’re just living with the reality of how things are now:

I suggest you do the same thing pal. It isn't 1950 anymore no matter how much you WISH it were.

29 posted on 06/08/2014 8:15:55 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: mac_truck

“I suggest you do the same thing pal. It isn’t 1950 anymore no matter how much you WISH it were.”

I never said it was 1950. The simple fact is that a number of Finns are worried about what the Russians might do - especially after seeing what unfolded in Ukraine just a few weeks ago. It doesn’t mean they think the Russians will invade Finland. It does mean they see NATO membership as a bulwark against Russia.

“For Finland there’s also reason to be concerned. At the tail-end of March, Andrej Illarionov, a former adviser to Vladimir Putin, told a Swedish newspaper that the Russian president had designs on Finland, which had been a part of the Russian Empire for more than 100 years. “Putin has said several times that the Bolsheviks and Communists made big mistakes,” Illarionov said, in a translation from the Independent. “He could well say that the Bolsheviks in 1917 committed treason against Russian national interests by granting Finland’s independence.” One Finnish Web site reported that Helsinki was nervous due to news that Russian troops had been conducting military exercises on the Finnish border, though there are now some credible signs that report could be a Russian disinformation campaign.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/04/09/no-russia-isnt-about-to-invade-finland-and-sweden/

So, unless you have something useful to add to this discussion, I suggest you shut up.


30 posted on 06/08/2014 8:32:50 PM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998
I never said it was 1950.

Whining about WW2 era Soviet actions add nothing useful to the discussion princess, nor does the hand-wringing about Russia's 'designs' on Finland as relayed to the world by some Swedish tabloid or Finnish website.

31 posted on 06/08/2014 9:15:35 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: Dallas59
Where Do The Finns Come From?
32 posted on 06/09/2014 1:46:57 AM PDT by blam
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To: blam

Impressive back reference to 2007.


33 posted on 06/09/2014 2:11:29 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: SkyDancer

Not so much. The Poles and Baltics are teaming up — Finland should join them and Romania —> ok, they are weak, even together, but together they are a lot stronger than individually


34 posted on 06/09/2014 3:39:05 AM PDT by Cronos (Obama’s dislike of Assad is not based on Assad’s brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: Dallas59
"Finland is one of the most russofobiske countries in Europe, after Sweden and the Baltic countries, says"



35 posted on 06/09/2014 4:00:21 AM PDT by Grzegorz 246
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To: mac_truck

“Whining about WW2 era Soviet actions add nothing useful to the discussion princess,”

Oh, historical context about the last war between Russians and Finns doesn’t matter in an article about Russia and Finland and NATO? You moron.

“nor does the hand-wringing about Russia’s ‘designs’ on Finland as relayed to the world by some Swedish tabloid or Finnish website.”

Right because what the Swedes and Finns write or publish clearly has nothing to do with what the Swedes and Finns might think based on their own history or anything, right? Moron.

Now you’re just embarrassing yourself, moron. Since you have nothing useful to add to this discussion, as you just demonstrated, I suggest you shut up.


36 posted on 06/09/2014 4:40:43 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: All

It’s time to put an end to Putin’s bullying and charade.

NATO should aggressively pursue Finland as a full member.

When the Russians are busy moaning diplomatically.

We should send the 82nd Airborne to Ukraine and offer them immediate full membership.

Appeasement leads to war.


37 posted on 06/09/2014 4:49:02 AM PDT by rbmillerjr (Russians to the Left of me, Useful Idiots to the Right...)
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To: SkyDancer

It was 505 confirmed kills, see #14.


38 posted on 06/09/2014 4:53:42 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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To: vladimir998
Oh, historical context about the last war between Russians and Finns doesn’t matter in an article about Russia and Finland and NATO?

Lol...if you're really going to provide historical context princess, you might do well to remember which side the United States fought on in WW2. Geographically speaking, American tax-payer subsidized NATO looks more like 1940s Nazi Germany every day. Something conservatives here should be very concerned about.

You also might consider that Russia provides Finland with a large stable export market as well as billions in direct investment, which sustained Finland's recovery over the past decade. As Europe's economy has unraveled the share of trade Finland does with Russia continued to grow, and an economic slow down in Russia would have an big impact on Finnish economy as well.

This expanding economic relationship provides the motivation for EU socialists, their western ideological counterparts, and a few useful idiots on the right to dig up decades old animosities and try to push them as contemporary problems.

Same old tired playbook Biden/Kerry/Obama are running in Ukraine.

39 posted on 06/09/2014 6:14:53 AM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: Gene Eric
"Impressive back reference to 2007.

Thanks. Here's one of those Saami women:

Renee Zellwegger

40 posted on 06/09/2014 7:11:21 AM PDT by blam
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To: mac_truck

“Lol...if you’re really going to provide historical context princess, you might do well to remember which side the United States fought on in WW2.”

I do remember, moron. But seeing how Finland and the U.S. have common interests that matters little. Finland and Russia are still at odds and will continue to be.

“Geographically speaking, American tax-payer subsidized NATO looks more like 1940s Nazi Germany every day.”

I can see where a moron like yourself might think that. But whether that is true or not has no bearing on whether or not the Finns have a legitimate right to seek allies against any possible Russian threat.

“Something conservatives here should be very concerned about.”

You should worry more about making sense, moron.

“You also might consider that Russia provides Finland with a large stable export market as well as billions in direct investment, which sustained Finland’s recovery over the past decade.”

Oh, so you’re admitting that Russia has a huge financial interest in Finland and therefore might be interested in having far more control over Finland?

“As Europe’s economy has unraveled the share of trade Finland does with Russia continued to grow, and an economic slow down in Russia would have an big impact on Finnish economy as well.”

So? How exactly does that have any bearing on the Finns worries about possible Russian encroachment?

“This expanding economic relationship provides the motivation for EU socialists, their western ideological counterparts, and a few useful idiots on the right to dig up decades old animosities and try to push them as contemporary problems.”

Moron, you really are a moron. Decades old animosities? Animosities? How about an OUTRIGHT INVASION and ETHNIC CLEANSING? Isn’t that what really happened in Karelia? How about decades of bullying the Finns on the part of the Russians? Is that just “decades old animosities”? Moron, you really are a moron.

“Same old tired playbook Biden/Kerry/Obama are running in Ukraine.”

Don’t expect the Finns to be as stupid as you are, moron. You can ignore history, moron, but it influences today no matter what you claim.


41 posted on 06/09/2014 7:51:59 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: blam

She’s barely Kven at most. She’s half Swiss German.


42 posted on 06/09/2014 7:56:14 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998

Russia & Finland have been building a mutually productive trade relationship for the past twenty five years.

Sorry if that hurts your butt princess.


43 posted on 06/09/2014 8:06:17 AM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: vladimir998

“Geographically speaking, American tax-payer subsidized NATO looks more like 1940s Nazi Germany every day.”

Thanks for pointing out the idiocy of statements like this.

10 years ago it would have been unthinkable to see this idiocy spouted on FR. These neo-anarchist isolationists are not conservative and are not libertarian either.


44 posted on 06/09/2014 8:57:17 AM PDT by rbmillerjr (Russians to the Left of me, Useful Idiots to the Right...)
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To: mac_truck

“Russia & Finland have been building a mutually productive trade relationship for the past twenty five years.”

That doesn’t change anything I said, moron. Russia had a “mutually productive trade relationship” with Crimea. How’s Crimea’s freedom from Russian domination looking these days? Oh, wait…

“Sorry if that hurts your butt princess.”

My butt is just fine. I do find it strange that you take an interest in it, however. More important is that you are apparently incapable of making an actual argument or even listing any pertinent facts. No, you’re more interested in my butt. Clearly, between the two of us, you’re the princess, moron.


45 posted on 06/09/2014 11:33:52 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: rbmillerjr

“Thanks for pointing out the idiocy of statements like this.”

No problem. There are plenty of stupid people out there these days. I’m just surprised how many are posing as conservatives at FR.

“10 years ago it would have been unthinkable to see this idiocy spouted on FR. These neo-anarchist isolationists are not conservative and are not libertarian either.”

You’re absolutely right.


46 posted on 06/09/2014 11:38:13 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: PapaBear3625

Best Russian in WW2 Stalingrad with around 300 ....


47 posted on 06/09/2014 11:54:28 AM PDT by SkyDancer (If you don't read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read newspapers you are misinformed)
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To: rbmillerjr
Lol...I did a quick search and found an old thread with a 1000+ posts on it discussing Pat Buchanan's book Death of the West from early 2002.

Dozens of posters, lots of useful discussion on a variety of subjects, including the future of Europe, "isolationism", immigration etc., etc. Lots of people arguing all different sides of the issues including a good number from the class of 98.

So in fact you are wrong to suggest it was "unthinkable" ten years ago to see such discussion on this forum.

As for the comment that you took exception to, one only has to look at a map of NATO expansion to see how much it resembles Nazi Germany circa 1942.


48 posted on 06/09/2014 6:03:44 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: mac_truck

Your comparing NATO to Nazi Germany 1942 is moronic.

It is moronic because Nazi German expansion, being of the illegal variety of annexation and military conquest cannot be equivocated to the voluntary association of nations in NATO to help deter Soviet aggression.

It is worse than moronic. It is pathetically absurd.


49 posted on 06/09/2014 8:39:11 PM PDT by rbmillerjr (Russians to the Left of me, Useful Idiots to the Right...)
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To: rbmillerjr
Nazi German expansion, being of the illegal variety of annexation and military conquest cannot be equivocated to the voluntary association of nations in NATO to help deter Soviet aggression.

From the Russian perspective the differences between the two expansions are meaningless. They both have the same net effect of bringing an European adversary closer to its border. To argue that Russia is being 'aggressive' for trying to maintain a buffer between itself and Europe, while ignoring a sustained NATO/EU expansion that in scope resembles Nazi Germany's push to the east is both naive and disingenuous.

Leaked cable traffic from 2008 confirm that at least some folks in the last administration understood this, and accurately predicted the Russian response in Crimea.

50 posted on 06/10/2014 6:10:48 AM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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