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US: Russia Sends Tanks to Rebels in Ukraine
VOA News / Voice of America ^ | June 13, 2014 2:13 AM | VOA News / Voice of America

Posted on 06/14/2014 7:11:18 AM PDT by WhiskeyX

The U.S. State Department has confirmed that Russia has sent tanks and other heavy weapons to separatists in Ukraine.

State Department spokeswoman Marie Harf said Friday that a convoy of three T-64 tanks, several rocket launchers, and other military vehicles crossed the border near the Ukrainian town of Snizhne in the last three days. She called the move "unacceptable."

(Excerpt) Read more at voanews.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: nato; russia; ukraine; us

1 posted on 06/14/2014 7:11:18 AM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: WhiskeyX

It’s starting to look like the Communist and Islamofascist Spring is kicking in full bore. Thanks Hillary! You and Hanoi Boi Kerry have done a wonderful job!


2 posted on 06/14/2014 7:27:53 AM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Obama's smidgens are coming home to roost.)
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To: WhiskeyX

Maybe they are sending WMDs also. Wag The Dog baby.


3 posted on 06/14/2014 7:30:18 AM PDT by McGruff (I can only show you the door. You're the one that has to walk through it.)
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To: WhiskeyX
"She called the move "unacceptable."

What's that suppose to mean exactly?

4 posted on 06/14/2014 7:30:18 AM PDT by PoloSec ( Believe the Gospel: how that Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again)
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To: WhiskeyX

“She called the move “unacceptable.”

Uh oh. The next move of the state department will be to send an email to putin written in ALL CAPS.


5 posted on 06/14/2014 7:30:54 AM PDT by lowbridge
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To: FlingWingFlyer
Communists and islamonazis worldwide realize there will never be another one of their own in the WH again.

The next 30 months will be horrific, and our enemies will be in a position to do existential harm to Americans on U.S. soil.

6 posted on 06/14/2014 7:33:14 AM PDT by Rome2000
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To: Rome2000

I agree. I don’t see much of a future for this country with the Cloward-Piven strategy kicking in along the border with the Invasion of the “Refugee Toddlers” either.


7 posted on 06/14/2014 7:37:09 AM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Obama's smidgens are coming home to roost.)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

8 posted on 06/14/2014 7:41:26 AM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: McGruff

Did RT just tweet it?


9 posted on 06/14/2014 7:41:56 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: WhiskeyX

That’s just a down payment on the power Putin will be moving into the area. Obama’s weakness has just begun to bear fruit.


10 posted on 06/14/2014 7:43:17 AM PDT by FourPeas ("Maladjusted and wigging out is no way to go through life, son." -hg)
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To: WhiskeyX
Development of the T-64 main battle tank commenced in 1954. First production tanks were delivered to the Soviet Army in 1963. Officially it was adopted only in 1967. It was publicly revealed in 1970. Over 6 000 of these MBTs off all versions were built. During it's introduction the T-64 was a very advanced tank, but had a number of significant drawbacks. It was never exported outside the Soviet Union.

Currently it is in service with Ukraine (~1 500) and Uzbekistan (100). Russia had a couple of thousands T-64 tanks in storage, however some sources report, that by 2013 all of them have been scrapped.

http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t64.htm

11 posted on 06/14/2014 8:51:44 AM PDT by McGruff (ISIS Terror Leader Was Released By Obama from Camp Bucca in 2009)
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To: McGruff

Next time they’ll say Russia has invaded to Cali from Mexico in brand-new Russian Abrams tanks.


12 posted on 06/14/2014 9:28:39 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix

The last time Mexico militarily invaded the US with the intent to occupy was when, 1846? The last time Russia did it to Ukraine was 2014. So you should probably understand why there is some question.


13 posted on 06/14/2014 9:34:01 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

My question comes out of a reported tank types in alleged convoy which aren’t operated by any Russian unit for about 19 years, but still built in Ukraine and ised by Ukrainian forces. Yet, they say these are Russian tanks.


14 posted on 06/14/2014 9:50:40 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix

And my point is that we know Russia is trying to destabilize E. Ukraine.


15 posted on 06/14/2014 9:53:05 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

Maybe, but movement of Ukrainian forces, pretending to be a Russian convoy is not the best example of Russian involvement.


16 posted on 06/14/2014 10:03:16 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix
Especially when they were so sneaky to cross from the Russian side, in tanks that Russia still possesses (although obsolete).
17 posted on 06/14/2014 10:09:56 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: wetphoenix
And I thought you were one of the irrational ones. If Russia sends tanks into Ukraine it won't be three. Sounds to me like someone is trying to lie us into war. Worked for Kosovo.
18 posted on 06/14/2014 10:15:15 AM PDT by McGruff (ISIS Terror Leader Was Released By Obama from Camp Bucca in 2009)
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To: 1rudeboy

I believe it was all scrapped and melted long time ago. Even if they weren’t, how would they drive these things phased two decades ago and sitting unused for many years?


19 posted on 06/14/2014 10:18:49 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: WhiskeyX

Back in the mid ‘80’s I had a computer game called Balance of Power. What is happening now reminds me of that game, as everything seems to be happening all at once at break neck speed.


20 posted on 06/14/2014 10:21:08 AM PDT by catfish1957 (Face it!!!! The government in DC is full of treasonous bastards)
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To: catfish1957
I think it's more like Nukem


21 posted on 06/14/2014 10:22:39 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: McGruff

LOL. What made me look irrational to you?


22 posted on 06/14/2014 10:29:58 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: catfish1957

And they are rioting in Brazil over a stupid soccer game. Must be a full moon or something.


23 posted on 06/14/2014 10:30:56 AM PDT by McGruff (ISIS Terror Leader Was Released By Obama from Camp Bucca in 2009)
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To: wetphoenix

You and I do not know that they were scrapped and melted. The NYT reported that T-64’s are still held in storage in that area (by Russia). Sure, the story may be false . . . but maybe just as false as the Russian claim that they don’t have any anymore.


24 posted on 06/14/2014 10:36:01 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: McGruff
If Russia sends tanks into Ukraine it won't be three.

Not "Russia sends," but did "Russia allow to send?" Who knew that the Russian border in that region is as porous as our Mexican border? Seriously.

25 posted on 06/14/2014 10:38:58 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: McGruff

The T-62 has been withdrawn from active service and generally scrapped, yet the Russian Ground Forces still have some of them around to use despite their official status.

The T-64 and T-80 tanks were being withdrawn from active service following the 2008 reorganizations of the Russian Ground Forces. Reports of the T-64 being scrapped, however, are false. The T-64 and T-80 used many important components manufactured in the Ukrainian SSR, and following the events of 1991 Russia no longer maintained a sustainable logisitical capability for obtaining the required maintenance parts from the Ukraine. So, the T-64 and T-80 tanks with the Ukrianian components were withdrawn from active service with the Russian Ground Forces. Despite false reports of the Russian T-64 tanks being scrapped by 2013, they were actually put into storage in many cases and others have been and still are being scrapped, meaning taken apart for scrap metal salvage.

There are plenty of the “scrapped” T-64 tanks available to arm and equip the Russian Spetsnaz forces operating covertly, or not so covertly, in the Ukraine.

Commercial stallite photographs have observed the Russians moving the tanks to Rostov and putting them aboard trucks for transport to the Ukrainian border. So, all of this false propaganda you are disseminating to cast doubt about the Russian Government using these tanks to invade the Ukraine is an utterly futile lie.


26 posted on 06/14/2014 10:47:06 AM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: 1rudeboy

“The last time Mexico militarily invaded the US with the intent to occupy was when, 1846?”

No, it was in June 1916.


27 posted on 06/14/2014 10:52:14 AM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: 1rudeboy

T-64 is three times as expensive as T-72 and five times higher maintenance platform. There is no domestic source of parts in Russia and Ukrainian company building it and exclusively providing parts is a competitor of Russian tank companies on a world markets. Russian military has no contracts with it and if they had they could have been choked by Russian MIC. A fleet was barely operational by 1995 and none is drivable, let alone battle-ready by this time for sure (even if some weren’t scrapped).
They have plenty of other tanks to move if they really wanted to go into Ukraine.


28 posted on 06/14/2014 10:55:31 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: 1rudeboy
I am so confused. The pro-Kiev crowd wants Russia to pull back from its border with Ukraine. The pro-Kiev crowd wants Russia to stop revitalized WW2 tanks from crossing that border.

Huh?

29 posted on 06/14/2014 10:59:53 AM PDT by grania
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To: grania

Are you that easily confused? Best to stick to domestic affairs, then.


30 posted on 06/14/2014 11:06:57 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: wetphoenix

“I believe it was all scrapped and melted long time ago. Even if they weren’t, how would they drive these things phased two decades ago and sitting unused for many years?”

T-64 tanks were withdrawn from active service about 2008. Many T-64 tanks were scrapped before 2008 and after 2008, but thousands were put into storage with many of them being new old stock that had never been used. Those stored T-64 tanks are far better condition to use than the World War Two era T-34 tank the insurgents actually used recently in the Ukraine.


31 posted on 06/14/2014 11:11:24 AM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: WhiskeyX

Ok, if you are so sure. Anyway, it makes no sense to operate it, given T-72 and T-90 available.


32 posted on 06/14/2014 11:16:48 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: WhiskeyX
Please try and stay focused. Russian troops allegedly did not occupy Crimea until Putin himself admitted he sent them. What's keeping him from lying about it now?

Again, I am inclined to believe that these are not Russian tanks, in the sense that they are not regular units of the Russian army. But would Russia allow tanks to cross its border into Ukraine? Absolutely.

33 posted on 06/14/2014 11:17:17 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

“Please try and stay focused.”

You mentioned the last attempted Mexican military invasion of the United States asking if it was in 1846. For the record, the Mexican government pursued its failing Plan San Diego repeatedly in the period 1914-1916. Plan San Diego included genocidal plans to kill every captured White U.S. male in a number of U.S. States. This is a bit of history every american ought to know and heed, in addition to the current events with Russia and its genocidal leadership.


34 posted on 06/14/2014 11:28:37 AM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: 1rudeboy

Crimea and mainland Ukraine aren’t the same.
‘Green men’ in Crimea were clearly a Russian marines legally placed there as part of Naval bases’ personnel. They had uniforms, vehicles of Russian marines, even license plates indicating who they are.
E. Ukrainian insurgency is 90% local. The majority of them are older men, which is not the case for Russian military who are average 19 years old. Not to mention most of these people you see on TV are speaking ‘surjic’, a type of Spanglish of the area which is a weird mix of Russian and Ukrainian.


35 posted on 06/14/2014 11:32:09 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix

Yeah, right. Is that what RT tweeted?


36 posted on 06/14/2014 11:33:03 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

You can observe it from numerous sources, RT is not the best of them because they are biased for obvious reason.


37 posted on 06/14/2014 11:35:17 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix
Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. Multiple sources observed that the troops in Crimea were not wearing insignia. Putin later admitted he sent them.

Now, you will have us believe that they were clearly-identified Russian Marines? LOLOL

38 posted on 06/14/2014 11:37:44 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

Remove insignia from US Marine who still has a USMC uniform, combat gear along with an M-4, sitting on top of Bradley IFV - you would clearly identify this person as a US Marine.


39 posted on 06/14/2014 11:45:35 AM PDT by wetphoenix
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To: wetphoenix
Then you are not familiar with U.S. Special Forces. Understandable . . . but I thought Russia has its equivalent? If not, Russia is in sadder shape than I thought.

Yeah, I know you are just spinning.

40 posted on 06/14/2014 11:47:44 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Three tanks do not an invasion make. Now 300—that would.


41 posted on 06/14/2014 12:02:59 PM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: 1rudeboy

If—and I do mean IF—Putin does send tanks—it will not be three—it will be more like 300—and they will not be old ones—they will be T-90s manned by their best troops and supported by the Red Air Force. Until that happens do not believe the Ukrainian Propaganda (and Putins Propaganda too). Before they march—a Cyber attack will knock out Kiev. That will be the first stage of the attack. Whe Ukraine goes dark—the Russians are on the move for real—at that point it will be too late.


42 posted on 06/14/2014 12:10:41 PM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: Forward the Light Brigade

I don’t understand why other people cannot understand. It is not all or nothing. Putin can allow three tanks to cross his frontier . . . and he’s ahead in the game. Doesn’t matter where they came from, or who is driving them.


43 posted on 06/14/2014 12:13:54 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Forward the Light Brigade

“Three tanks do not an invasion make. Now 300—that would.”

Three tanks, three hundred tanks, or zero tanks, it is stil an illegal Russian invasion of the Ukraine. Furthermore, the use of troops without distinctive and truthful national insignia lawfully commissioned by a sovereign state is a war crime punishable as a capital crime.


44 posted on 06/14/2014 6:26:31 PM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: Forward the Light Brigade

Soviet-Russian military forces have been used covertly and out of uniform in violation of the laws of war since before 1920. They were used in China in the 1930s-1940s, the Korean War 1950-1953, Egypt 1967-1970s, Vietnam Wars, Libya, Iraq, and many more skimishes throughout the world. Their use as fake insurgents is fully consistent with their past 94 years or greater practices. Your denials are nothing more than blatant and propagandistic lies and blustering.


45 posted on 06/14/2014 6:34:20 PM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: wetphoenix

“Remove insignia from US Marine who still has a USMC uniform, combat gear along with an M-4, sitting on top of Bradley IFV - you would clearly identify this person as a US Marine.”

Tell that fairy tale to the U.S. Army veterans from the Second World War who fought the German infiltrators who wore U.S. Army uniforms and used captured U.S. equipment and armored fighting vehicles.


46 posted on 06/14/2014 6:38:20 PM PDT by WhiskeyX
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To: WhiskeyX

~“Remove insignia from US Marine who still has a USMC uniform, combat gear along with an M-4, sitting on top of Bradley IFV - you would clearly identify this person as a US Marine.”

Tell that fairy tale to the U.S. Army veterans from the Second World War who fought the German infiltrators who wore U.S. Army uniforms and used captured U.S. equipment and armored fighting vehicles.~

Are you insisting it was Ukrainian forces using Russian equipment with Russian license plates, wearing Russian uniform, only missing Russian flags and badges? Or maybe they were Turkish?
WWII was long time ago.


47 posted on 06/14/2014 6:58:02 PM PDT by wetphoenix
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