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Japan bans child porn, but excludes manga, anime
Associated Press ^ | Jun 18, 2014 5:54 AM EDT | Elaine Kurtenbach

Posted on 06/18/2014 3:31:10 AM PDT by Olog-hai

Japan’s parliament has passed a law which bans possession of child pornography, but excludes sexually explicit depictions of children in comics, animation and computer graphics. […]

The law provides for prison terms of up to one year and fines of up to 1 million yen ($9,800) for having pornographic photographs or videos of children. It allows a grace period of one year for people owning such materials to dispose of them. […]

Child advocates and other critics of the new legislation say it is a long-overdue improvement, but are unhappy with the exclusion of depictions of sexual fantasies involving children in “manga” comic books, anime and video games. Pictures of children as young as toddlers posed in sexually suggestive ways are easily found online in Japan. …

(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Japan; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: anime; childporn; childsexabuse; manga

1 posted on 06/18/2014 3:31:11 AM PDT by Olog-hai
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To: Olog-hai

Manga and anime should be banned just on principle, regardless of any connection to porn. I could expound on just how truly awful those cartoon forms are, but then I remember that this is the culture that recently produced ghastly robot “babies” to try to entice people to have more children.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/06/23/japan.baby.robot.population/


2 posted on 06/18/2014 3:40:07 AM PDT by exDemMom (Current visual of the hole the US continues to dig itself into: http://www.usdebtclock.org/)
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To: Olog-hai

Wow....aren’t they about 100 years late?


3 posted on 06/18/2014 3:46:59 AM PDT by napscoordinator (Governor Scott Walker 2016 for the future of the country!)
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To: exDemMom

“but then I remember that this is the culture that recently produced ghastly robot “babies” to try to entice people to have more children.”

Truly a culture in a death spiral, similar to that in the United States (we just use different “bread & circuses”). After resisting for decades, Japan is now forced to let in foreigners because their population is aging & dying...


4 posted on 06/18/2014 3:50:24 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Olog-hai

Anima introduced a child of mine to transexualism and homosexuality.


5 posted on 06/18/2014 3:52:23 AM PDT by Chickensoup (Leftist totalitarian fascism is on the move.)
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To: kearnyirish2

We still have a very small gaijin population here compared to Europe, the USA, and Canada. Most foreigners here are professionals with good jobs. We are not like Toronto and Los Angeles. Japan has done well with their strict immigration policy. I love it here because its still homogenous, and most foreigners are accepted as respectable people.


6 posted on 06/18/2014 4:03:18 AM PDT by lefty-lie-spy (Stay metal. For the Horde \m/("_")\m/ - via iPhone from Tokyo.)
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To: Olog-hai

It should be noted that US law in this area is vague and inconsistent.

Federal law prohibits “cartoon” or virtual pornography involving fictional child characters only if it “lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value.”

How, even in theory, virtual or cartoon child porn could have any such value is a puzzlement.

State laws on the issue are wildly inconsistent.


7 posted on 06/18/2014 4:03:34 AM PDT by Sherman Logan (Perception wins all the battles. Reality wins all the wars.)
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To: lefty-lie-spy

I was under the impression from friends who have visited Japan that they import Filipinos for their lower working class; I wouldn’t know myself. The number of gaijin there today is probably 1000% of the number there ten years ago; the native population is held up as the epitome of an aging, dying population (moreso than Western European countries that are looking at the same fate). I’m not pointing fingers; the European settlers of the United States are going the same way.


8 posted on 06/18/2014 4:10:09 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Chickensoup
Anima introduced a child of mine to transexualism and homosexuality.

The biggest problem with manga and anime is the labeling and/or rating. There are named categories that could tip off a parent to unwanted content, but relatively few westerners know what to look for (unfortunately, the kids often *do* know what those category titles mean). A lot of the stuff that is *not* rated TV-MA has too much adult content.

That said, there is a lot of anime that is not only totally clean, but exquisitely crafted. It's a shame that this true art is in the shadow of the nasty, poorly illustrated, fetish-laden stuff.

9 posted on 06/18/2014 4:59:51 AM PDT by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: exDemMom
That is as intellectually sound a principal as banning novels because of "Fifty Shades of Gray" and Anne Rice's filthy Sleeping Beauty" series.

Manga is simply a form for presenting stories. It can present any type of story someone might write. From Romantic tragedies to sports stories, or historical narratives to supernatural horror stories. It is all there.

The porn is there too, just as it is with novels or magazines. And, with the decadence of American society, there is likely porn consumption in all media. That does not make any of the media inherently bad. It is the prurient material which is the problem.

10 posted on 06/18/2014 5:14:15 AM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: Charles Martel

My granddaughter has grown up watching studio ghibli. Studio Ghibli is wonderful. Start with My Neighbor Totoro. Spirited Away is his masterpiece but is a little scary. I also love Howl’s Moving Castle. My granddaughter’s favorite is The Cat Returns. This is the studio that did Ponyo and Arreitti.


11 posted on 06/18/2014 5:15:34 AM PDT by Mercat
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To: MrEdd

Yes... my question is why not gospel manga?


12 posted on 06/18/2014 5:47:44 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
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To: HiTech RedNeck

There actually is some Christian stuff produced by the Japanese Catholic minority.


13 posted on 06/18/2014 5:53:12 AM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: Olog-hai

This is something I’ve been concerned about for a number of years. Actually, ever sinc CGI was clearly depicting human acts so realistically that any futurist could see that the day was soon coming that you could not tell the difference between real actors and CGI.

The foundational argument against posessing these images of children is that a real child is in the images or videos and is being exploited. No matter what the arguments the supporters of this industry may try, that argument trumps it all. But what of drawings and, of CGI that looks absolutely real? No child was exploited.

What then?


14 posted on 06/18/2014 5:59:05 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: cuban leaf

I too have wondered about this. In a few discussions, most people that I have talked to seem to think that such CGI images should be banned because they will encourage thoughts of child molestation, and then some might act on these thoughts. In other words, the reasoning against such images consists of thoughtcrime and what-ifs.

I personally have no desire to view anything depicting children sexually, and I am quite sure that you don’t either. Don’t be surprised if some on this thread accuse either or both of us of pedophilia, regardless.


15 posted on 06/18/2014 6:26:58 AM PDT by HartleyMBaldwin
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To: Chickensoup

Not to pick a fight or point fingers, but you allowed it. My kids don’t see/watch anything that I do not watch/research first. They especially don’t watch 99% of the cartoons/animation crap that is out there.


16 posted on 06/18/2014 6:48:39 AM PDT by Resolute Conservative
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To: HartleyMBaldwin

In a few discussions, most people that I have talked to seem to think that such CGI images should be banned because they will encourage thoughts of child molestation, and then some might act on these thoughts. In other words, the reasoning against such images consists of thoughtcrime and what-ifs.


And the thing is, that argument always legally falls flat when dealing with the adult equivalent. The only reason the child variety can be controlled (in the environment controlled by our first amendment as currently interpretted) is that children are being DIRECTLY exploited in the “real” images. With CGI, no such argument can be made.

And like you, the whole concept is repugnant to me. It is a very dangerous form of mental illness.


17 posted on 06/18/2014 6:50:20 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: exDemMom
Manga and anime should be banned just on principle,

I don't know about that. Ghost in the Shell is excellent. So is Cowboy Bebop for that matter. Cowboy Bebop has one of the best soundtracks of any cartoon I can think of. The Seatbelts rock.

Yeah, some of it sucks. (my daughters liked Inayasha) Like most artistic forms though, some is good, some is bad, some is excellent.

18 posted on 06/18/2014 7:59:39 AM PDT by zeugma (It is time for us to start playing cowboys and muslims for real now.)
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To: Mercat

While it has a similar ‘look and feel’ to Studio Ghibli, never make the mistake of thinking that the movie Grave of the Fireflies (IMDb rating 8.5, 446 reviews) was done by them. It is one of the most painful tragedies ever made, and even a lot of adults are traumatized by watching it.

But it is one of the best animated movies ever made.


19 posted on 06/18/2014 11:00:32 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("Don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative." -Obama, 09-24-11)
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To: kearnyirish2

What change did the Japanese do to their immigration laws?


20 posted on 06/18/2014 11:10:58 AM PDT by ansel12 ((Ted Cruz and Mike Lee-both of whom sit on the Senate Judiciary Comm as Ginsberg's importance fades)
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To: Olog-hai

There is a basic legal problem with trying to outlaw cartoon child porn.

This is best described by the “stick figure test”. Draw two simple standing stick figures.

Caption them as two adults having a conversation about politics. Quite legal. Caption them as two young children having sex, even if they are not touching, and it is child pornography. The porn is in the text, not the pictures.

Cartoon characters can have adult features, child features, anthropomorphic animal features, even mechanical features, that are vague enough to be subjective, and can even be modified by descriptions. Likewise, they can change or morph, age or become young, say one thing and do another.

The US tried banning child pornographic cartoons, but it has ended up with federal judges *subjectively* deciding cases based on their own opinions, not the law. This means that some judges will define child porn as most anything, and some rejecting real child porn as nothing.


21 posted on 06/18/2014 11:15:11 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("Don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative." -Obama, 09-24-11)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Stick figures and explicit drawings are two different things.


22 posted on 06/18/2014 11:20:19 AM PDT by Olog-hai
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To: exDemMom

What principle is that?


23 posted on 06/18/2014 11:20:47 AM PDT by Olog-hai
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To: Olog-hai

> Stick figures and explicit drawings are two different things.

Legally, not so much. There are so many different ways, styles, of making cartoon people, and caricatures of people, that you end up with a mess. What if the proportions of the human are inhuman, impossible?


24 posted on 06/18/2014 11:39:32 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("Don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative." -Obama, 09-24-11)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Legally how? More “penumbras and emanations”?

Physical sexual characteristics are unambiguous.


25 posted on 06/18/2014 11:40:48 AM PDT by Olog-hai
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Princess Mononoke is scary enough for me. Very graphic.


26 posted on 06/18/2014 11:45:37 AM PDT by Mercat
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To: Olog-hai

> Physical sexual characteristics are unambiguous.

There are even problems in determining whether human porn involves adults or children. Recently, the South American porn actress “Little Lupe” had to fly to NYC with a LOT of paperwork to prove that she was an adult, though petite, for fear that her extensive work would be banned in the US, costing her a fortune.

Some have even suggested that women, no matter their age, should not be allowed to work in pornography unless their breasts are over a certain size. Which shows how ridiculous the argument can get.

Another problem with child porn is that of “provocative poses” being illegal, even if dressed. But often this is entirely dependent on the fetishes of the audience. For example, normal people would not be excited by a video of a girl making a cake. But some deviants would be. So is what she did pornographic? Especially if marketed to deviants?

In Japanese animation, there is a frequently used motif called “Chibi”. Chibi is a Japanese slang word meaning “short person” or “small child”. But in this case, adult characters who have an emotional outburst, hate or love, for example, are morphed into Chibi versions of themselves, along with exaggerated emotional behavior.

Chibi are not children, but represent adult characters either behaving or reacting like children. And yes, Chibi have sex, yet represent adults having sex.


27 posted on 06/18/2014 1:39:16 PM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("Don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative." -Obama, 09-24-11)
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To: ansel12

“What change did the Japanese do to their immigration laws?”

I don’t know; it was a much more insular society 20 years ago. They probably had to loosen the restrictions just for workers.


28 posted on 06/18/2014 2:32:39 PM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Charles Martel

That said, there is a lot of anime that is not only totally clean, but exquisitely crafted. It’s a shame that this true art is in the shadow of the nasty, poorly illustrated, fetish-laden stuff.

_____________

That is what I was exposed to not knowing of the other. Her father let her have the other stuff at his house.


29 posted on 06/18/2014 4:32:07 PM PDT by Chickensoup (Leftist totalitarian fascism is on the move.)
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To: Resolute Conservative

Not to pick a fight or point fingers, but you allowed it. My kids don’t see/watch anything that I do not watch/research first. They especially don’t watch 99% of the cartoons/animation crap that is out there.

____________-

I did not allow my kids anything of this nature. After their father left the kids were permitted to do everything they wanted at his house so they would stay there and lessen his child support burden. My house was derisively termed Little House on the Prairie because of limitations..


30 posted on 06/18/2014 4:36:35 PM PDT by Chickensoup (Leftist totalitarian fascism is on the move.)
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To: MrEdd

It may be quite true that manga is simply a form for presenting stories, as you said. However, in order to experience the stories, you actually have to *watch* it. And the artwork is so mind-stunningly bad, the cartoons so amateurishly animated, that watching it is utterly impossible.

Given a choice between watching manga or a My Little Pony marathon, I think I’d get rid of the TV...


31 posted on 06/18/2014 4:58:16 PM PDT by exDemMom (Current visual of the hole the US continues to dig itself into: http://www.usdebtclock.org/)
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To: zeugma

I’d rather gouge out my eyes than have to watch anime. Calling it an “art form” is much the same as calling rap or hip-hop “music”—it stretches the definitions of those words to the breaking point.

Rocky and Bullwinkle cartoons weren’t exactly high art, but they were not grotesque mockeries of art, either.


32 posted on 06/18/2014 5:08:37 PM PDT by exDemMom (Current visual of the hole the US continues to dig itself into: http://www.usdebtclock.org/)
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To: Olog-hai

On the principle that nothing so grotesque and lacking of anything resembling artistic merit should be allowed to pollute the airways or take up valuable bandwidth that could be better used disseminating quality programming like reality shows and Honey Boo-Boo.


33 posted on 06/18/2014 5:13:03 PM PDT by exDemMom (Current visual of the hole the US continues to dig itself into: http://www.usdebtclock.org/)
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To: exDemMom
I’d rather gouge out my eyes than have to watch anime. Calling it an “art form” is much the same as calling rap or hip-hop “music”—it stretches the definitions of those words to the breaking point.

We'd have to disagree on this. Both of the examples I gave are better than 90% of what WB ever produced.

34 posted on 06/18/2014 8:52:38 PM PDT by zeugma (It is time for us to start playing cowboys and muslims for real now.)
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To: exDemMom

Well . . . the style that became “anime(shon)” was ultimately derived from the Betty Boop cartoons; any Japanese animator will always point to that. So that’s who to blame there.


35 posted on 06/19/2014 6:28:22 AM PDT by Olog-hai
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To: Chickensoup

Sorry to hear that.


36 posted on 06/19/2014 6:34:02 AM PDT by Resolute Conservative
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