Skip to comments.Gay marriage: Top US Presbyterian Council Approves Same-Sex Weddings
Posted on 06/19/2014 6:49:42 PM PDT by Steelfish
Gay marriage: Top US Presbyterian Council Approves Same-Sex Weddings Substantial majority on national assembly votes to recognise unions of 'two people' and let ministers hold ceremonies
19 June 2014
The top legislative body of the Presbyterian church in the US has voted by a large margin to recognize same-sex marriage as Christian in the church constitution, adding language that marriage can be the union of "two people," not just "a man and a woman".
The amendment approved by the Presbyterian General Assembly requires approval from a majority of the 172 regional presbyteries, which will vote on the change over the next year. But in a separate policy change that takes effect at the end of this week's meeting delegates voted to allow ministers to preside at gay weddings in states where the unions are legal and local congregational leaders approve. Nineteen states and the District of Columbia recognize same-sex marriage.
(Excerpt) Read more at theguardian.com ...
Why only two? Why only people? Not very inclusive or affirming, are they?
They done lost the Savior way back. All else is details.
“My Three Gay-Married Sons!”
You cannot legislate the Word of God.
It is what it is and is forever settled.
Sadly, that is the truth. They replaced with the Truth with man’s the whims of a corrupt culture.
And the Presbys are big into the divest, boycott from Israel campaigns all the while their numbers are shrinking and pushing their anti-God agenda.
Presbyterian Church (USA) disinvestment from Israel controversy
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With Declining Ranks, Does a Presbyterian Boycott of Israel Even Matter?
That’s just the fizzle on the cake.
My grandmother went to a Presbyterian church from the 1960s through the 80s (just that I know of) and she would turn over in her grave over this.
My guess is a ploy to get younger members,
Might as well fold up that so called “church”.
Polygaphobes!! Hateful bigots! What right do they have to tell THREE people they're not allowed to LOVE each other?! How would they like it if the polygamy community didn't allow THEIR marriages between two people!
Thank you for encouraging me to look up the difference between heretic and apostate (and schismatic, along with them).
Heresy is a sin because of its nature it is destructive of the virtue of Christian faith. Its malice is to be measured therefore by the excellence of the good gift of which it deprives the soul. Now faith is the most precious possession of man, the root of his supernatural life, the pledge of his eternal salvation. Privation of faith is therefore the greatest evil, and deliberate rejection of faith is the greatest sin. St. Thomas (II-II, Q. x, a. 3) arrives at the same conclusion thus: “All sin is an aversion from God. A sin, therefore, is the greater the more it separates man from God. But infidelity does this more than any other sin, for the infidel (unbeliever) is without the true knowledge of God: his false knowledge does not bring him help, for what he opines is not God: manifestly, then, the sin of unbelief ( infidelitas) is the greatest sin in the whole range of perversity.”
The Church never can and never will give satisfactionand the homosexualist knows it, for he knows the words against him are ineradicableto the declared and impenitent homosexual, the person who, through an act of the vermiculate will, has identified his person with a sin, whether he demands acceptance of his sin through "love," or vindication through identification of his perceived enemies as bigots. Whether he presents himself as an object of love or indignation, what he demands in either case is acceptance not of the person, but of the sin-bound and sin-defined person. He demands the declaration of spiritual authority that there is nothing objectively disordered about this binding of man to sin, and assurance that this monstrous amalgam can indeed enter the kingdom of heaven. This can never happen among Christians until they abandon Christianity, which is at war with every sin, and whose indelible constitution places all perversions of the perfect man at the muzzle of its canons.
Doesn’t prophesy say that in the last days many shall fall away from the faith?
Or maybe the Presby’s never had faith to lose in the first place, I don’t know.
(to recognize same-sex marriage as Christian in the church constitution)
God will not be mocked.......
Going to require a radically revised Romans Chapter 1. Modern MetroPresby version.
There are plenty of good Presbyterian denominations. Presbyterian Church of America, the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, and the Cumberland Presbytherian Church. They are all growing; the PC-USA is shrinking.
Problem is that the press lauds them because they are a failed church, and they are also the oldest with the prettiest buildings.
What's the point of getting younger members if the church is no longer a Christian church? I have been convinced for quite a few years that the Presbyterian church has become apostate. I am not Presbyterian, but if I was I would be out the door and off the membership roll before God judges these apostates who insist on calling themselves Christians just as if they actually believed in the Lord Jesus Christ and respected His holy institution of marriage between man and woman.
if they don't believe what God has to say about homosexual debauchery in His Word (hint, hint,--- he aint in favor of it) then they should simply stop calling their social club a Church and go whole hog into human-animal hook-ups of all kinds. And why stop with same-sex so-called "marriage"? Why not man-dog marriage, or pig-woman hook-up, or any other combination of livestock and humans? Or for a little variety, maybe fish-man or lobster-woman?
I started to say that God must be laughing at their nonsense, but on 2nd thought I think it's much more likely that He's crying. Why? Because His sinless Son died in their place to save them from hell, and they're making a mockery of one of His most sacred institutions, i.e., marriage for life between one man and one woman.
One way to empty the churches is to fill the leadership with homosexuals. It’s a plan.
“An example of what happens when heretic brands of Christianity get to interpret Scripture accord to their own lights.”
It is actually an example of what happens when heretics ascend to church leadership.... a plague that has infected all denominations, including the Catholic Church.
Statistics show over 50% of clergy are addicted to porn.
can’t you sue them to stop using the term Presbyterian?
to be fair, it is the PCUSA — the largest Presbyterian denomination, but one of at least 30 in the USA. There are smaller denominations that abhor gay marriage.
When you see the abomination of desolation standing in the Holy place....
“For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now”
Is the abomination gay marriage, that makes desolate due to it’s very nature, and the church is the Holy place? I’d have to read more scripture regarding this but if it fits, we are warned the tribulation is close at hand.
No worries. The Gates of Hell shall not prevail against the ONE, TRUE, HOLY, CATHOLIC, AND APOSTOLIC faith. We have seen the rot of Protestantism now starting to fray and decay and wither away with just about every single Protestant denomination now formally interpreting Scripture as “sanctifying” gay marriage. Without belief in the Eucharist, the rest is all desiderata. With Belief, there is life everlasting: Hence:
“I am the living bread which came down from heaven.”
I don’t make stuff up.
And I certainly would not lie to you two.
Some catholic posters here post inflammatory articles about a liberal non catholic sect to bash non Catholic sects in general
I happen to find PCUSA apostate as well but know they are hardly indicative of say my sect ..rural Southern Baptists
Until FR I never knew they’re were Catholics who held non Catholics in such low regard
I sure knew none in the South where we got along and public schools always had fish on Fridays
A learning curve.
Like the Redskins?
Inflammatory? On the Religion Forum? Surely you jest.
The fact that "some" (actually any) post intemperately is a shame and a scandal and, imo, is not God pleasing. Then we have to wrestle with what is and is not temperate.
In one way, it's like that Supreme Court Justice said, "I know it when I see it." And, it definitely has do do with whose ox is being gored. We fallible and sinful humans lack pure motives. Some of us struggle with that and do try to consider both the content and effect of our words. Some of us recoil at the very thought that we could EVER be wrong.
The Missus posts more in this forum than do I. I read a great deal of what she posts because I admire both what she says and how she says it. When I commented "You're so busted" (on a previous thread) I believe it was in reaction to some challenging, possibly off base comment you had made that I anticipated her to dissect and refute with her usual skill and precision.
That's all that was. I ask forgiveness for any offense I caused.
Back to the tenor of discussion on the RF - I have thought it might be worthwhile to have a thread to discuss how to discuss. Maybe begin with a refresher course in the conventions of courtesy in real life and how those might be translated into the cyber world. That alone could improve interactions a lot.
Then we might remind ourselves of the basics of logic and how to make and support a position. We might all resolve to take greater care to find the right word, especially when a hot word that pops in our mind, in the heat, seems so perfect.
Of course such a thread would require the reading comprehension that we used to get in high school. There are so many comments here that demonstrate an appalling lack of it.
Liberals have learned to play that game, as they have all the other rhetorical games.
They just tell the young people that the conservative Christians are the hypocrites citing Jesus talking about forgiveness(gays) , giving (voting for those who tax ) to the poor and how the rich conservatives cant get into heaven because they oppose government programs to help the poor.
It's so rare.
The article beautifully states what the choice is .... the sin or the faith. Unfortunately, way too many are choosing the ‘sin’.
Let's try, all of us, to abstain from maligning others with broad, derogatory generalizations; and when they appear on the forum, let's try to correct our *own* co-religionists. Otherwise it turns into one of those bar-room brawls which end up with bruising, body-wide inflammation and bloody pixils.
Let's not do that to the Body of Christ.
About the tagline: maybe I should read this meditatively from time to time.
I’m with you.
My simple belief is that anyone truly accepts Christ as their savior....as the son of God sent here to live as us and die for our sins in our human physical form and endure all that pain to absolve us if we believe
To basically truly make all things new...
And try to at least acknowledge lifes roadmap given us
Has a decent shot at everlasting life at his side
And yes...there is the same vitriol directed at Catholics here from some non Catholics...no question
Southerners persecute Catholics?
There are sects....hardcore charismatics might think old southern baptist me is apostate by their strict fundamentalism but they hardly persecute
You must be a Yankee.
I’m almost 60.
Grew up in a town of 200,000 with around 8 catholic schools and 10 catholic churches in metro area
Parochial schools played in our sports leagues and so forth
Fish on Fridays in all public schools to cover catholic kids
I hear you Yankees harp on this...likely because early 1900s Klan which was up north as much or more than down here was suspicious of Catholics....like Hugo Black
That was sure not relevant in my lifetime.
New England wasps disliked earlier Catholics....is that still an issue
In the coastal south Catholics are pretty prevalent.... even the majority frequently
They are viewed no different down here than anyone and better than say Kingdom Hall or UCC
What you suggest is a canard to be honest.
Where you ever Catholic in the south? No? Then my anecdotes beat your anecdotes.
Until FR I never knew theyre were Catholics who held non Catholics in such low regard
...my, but you have very selective vision when it comes to that sort of thing...
...entire threads are launched with the express purpose of defaming Catholics on this forum, but somehow you fail to notice that...
...personally, I am opposed to the whole practice of carving up other denominations, but when my religion is attacked for no reason other than to attack, I will respond...
I have also pointed out what you claim as well but that is hardly a defense...the other side does it
however I’m not sure the anti Catholics here are condemned to Hell by their very definition...although your clergy are defamed by some no question
there are Catholics here wo claim anyone outside their faith is Hell bound...I sure never thought that about catholics and actually admired last two Popes ideologically more than not
several posters on this forum post almost nothing else but the slander of non catholics
thread after thread
please tell me you are not one of those yankees that view protestants as one big same thing...that is like viewing as latinos as Mexercans
its funny...I never viewed myself as protestant until here...I viewed myself as Christian in general and Baptist by church
Catholics and Baptists have divergent views on that matter...
like I said though...despite this self serving scare tactic that the south is awash in Catholic strange fruit..I never experienced any of the divisiveness I see here between Catholics and non Catholics
and we had plenty Catholics...in coastal areas Catholics often dominate by numbers
it seems like all this fear of non Catholics and chauvinism of Catholics towards non Catholics comes from up north where yall are the majority and have this fear of the hinterland as Catholic hating
that is simply untrue
last week I spent it with an American Catholic and his Polish Catholic wife on 30-A on the beach in Florida panhandle...his granddad helped found the first diocese in Collier county FL 80 years ago
part of my extended family and half my wifes are Catholic ...this sort of talk had never ever come up
if you feel persecuted here then be glad you’re not Mormon
>> sanctifying gay marriage.
The contention is too often gratuitous, but on occasion reasonable concerns are raised.
My extended family is part Catholic and my wife’s family is half Catholic...(her mother’s)
I grew up in a neighborhood in West Jackson MS where there were more Catholics..Italians and Syrian/Leb.. than any other single group...in the 60s...they attended St Marys (since ghetto eaten) and we interacted in sports and other events.like dances and all played same Little League
aside from just regular neighborhood fun together...
My private high school girlfriend was Catholic and I attended mass with her...never heard her folks...dad a doctor...talk some here do
We had a lakehouse in Tensas parish Louisiana...attended mass there since my paternal extended side which was Catholic did
I lived in latin America and the Caribbean and West Africa for nearly 20 years where Catholic church was again my only option
I think I as a non Catholic southerner with Catholic family am just as qualified or maybe more so than you to comment on how Catholics are treated in Dixie.
If you have evidence of persecution of Catholics by Southern Baptists since WWII then please bring it out
Otherwise you’re acting like a liberal clamoring for me too! victimhood
you’re bringing back memories that parrallel that of Jews for me
in the South I never thought Jews were different other than loud moms and church on friday nite
but when I lived in Manhattan I got a new perspective
Catholics like you are giving me a new perspective about Catholics here on FR
it’s not very nice to be honest....and I try to be polite and never demonize Catholicism and I have spoken frequently of aspects of the traditions of Catholicism and the political history I admire but I do think the behavior of some Catholics here is poor form...unprovoked at times
but yes...in this parity age we must qualify all we say....there are catholic bashers here
but I do see the bashing of non Catholics unprovoked too
if it’s proselytizing...it’s not working
in any event ...none of this will ever be settled on this earth and there are far bigger fish to fry
I’m mystified by the claim of Catholics being persecuted in the South.
Husband’s cousin married a few years ago...not long after they began having kids, they converted to Catholicism. No one in this evangelical family thought anything of it. When we all get together, religion isn’t an issue that’s discussed, unless it’s the general Godless direction of the country.
My best friend in high school was Catholic, and I loved spending time at her house with that big family (11 kids) running in and out. This would have been late seventies to early eighties, definitely a less PC time, but again, religion was never an issue.
I was born here in Virginia and raised here, and no one thinks twice about Catholics.
On the other hand, I was posting to a FR Catholic the other day who informed me that a non-Catholic who accepts Jesus, is baptized, and lives his or her life for the Lord is practicing a false religion.
I have a good friend who is Italian Catholic and a longtime Freeper. She would have a problem with that statement.
More like, if I show up at a Baptist church, I'm almost fellowshipped to death!
And you’ll be fed potato salad and fried chicken until you pop.
Oh, those devilish Baptists! BBQ chicken, AND fried chicken, AND potato salad! Followed up by a huge hunka chunka chocolate cake!
Now that's what I call persecution!
Can I have a helping of that persecution, please? Or maybe two?
Oh, insidious is what they are, those beaming Baptist ladies --- leading innocent Catholics like me to to ruin!
I just want to stare at that picture for a while. Anybody would embrace ruin for a slice of that.
"It's their fault, Lord. Their fault. Not my fault..."