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Israel wants to go after Hamas, but doesn’t want all-out war with Gaza
The Times of Israel ^ | Tuesday, July 1, 2014 | Avi Issacharoff

Posted on 07/01/2014 2:40:47 AM PDT by Star Traveler

The key Hamas leadership is in the Strip but an escalation there, in response to the killing of the three teens, would bring dozens of missiles down on Tel Aviv

The options facing Israel, the Palestinian Authority and Hamas on the day after the discovery of the bodies of the three kidnapped Israeli teenagers range from bad to worse.

In the course of the late night cabinet meeting in Jerusalem on Monday, all kinds of ideas for the appropriate Israeli response were aired. The demolition of houses, the deportation of prisoners, an assault on Gaza, and more besides. But the security establishment knows demolishing homes or exiling prisoners will not reduce the motivation of the terrorists, certainly not those from Islamist organizations.

Hamas has learned how to compensate the families of terrorists whose homes are demolished; they’ve been given more than enough money to rebuild those homes. As for the deportation of prisoners, that has become a double-edged sword: Palestinian prisoners released from Israeli jails and exiled have, from their new homes and offices in Gaza, Arab states and Turkey, overseen intensive efforts to establish terrorist infrastructure in the West Bank.

However, despite the pressure of public opinion in Israel for a response to the killings, Jerusalem is concerned about targeting the Hamas leadership in Gaza because of the fear of escalation. The price of a dramatic upsurge in action against Hamas, or of efforts to bring down the Hamas leadership, will be dozens of missiles on Israel’s central Dan region and even further north. At this stage, it does not look as though Israel is interested in waging all-out war with Gaza.

(Excerpt) Read more at timesofisrael.com ...


TOPICS: Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: hamas; israel; starisrael; stih
This is an on-going battle with Hamas. Notice one thing though ... you never see the PA lobbing rockets into Israel and you never see Israel retaliating against the PA because that organization did some terrorist act. The PA is quite a bit different from Hamas.
1 posted on 07/01/2014 2:40:47 AM PDT by Star Traveler
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To: Star Traveler

But the PA is the REAL power behind Hamas.


2 posted on 07/01/2014 2:44:22 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Star Traveler

“The PA is quite a bit different from Hamas.”

If they are so different, why did they merge? Usually organizations merge that have similar goals and approaches to achieving those goals.


3 posted on 07/01/2014 2:50:15 AM PDT by Portcall24 (aer)
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To: Biggirl

No, Hamas was initially supported by Israel in order to offset the power of the P.A. (back then it was Fatah). Hamas and the PA have been enemies. Hamas has murdered PA officials in Gaza. Also Iran has been a long-time sponsor of Hamas, but NOT the PA.


4 posted on 07/01/2014 2:53:27 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Portcall24

The problem that the PA has in trying to “declare” a Palestinian State is that they don’t even control all of the Palestinian areas. So, the PA has attempted to “paper over” their differences, and give the appearance of - at last - being “in control” of all the Palestinian Territories by way of this unity pact.

However, they tried this unity pact before and it “blew up” ... :-) ...


5 posted on 07/01/2014 2:57:22 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

Sure about that?


6 posted on 07/01/2014 3:01:14 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Biggirl

Here’s some background on how Israel,was involved in the creation of Hamas, starting with an approved “precursor organization” to Hamas. Hamas would not be there now of Israel had acted differently. ALSO, the election of Hamas for the government of Gaza caught both Israel and the USA by complete surprise. It was “all over” before they could do a thing about it!

Here’s that article, from the Wall Street Journal ...

How Israel Helped to Spawn Hamas

Surveying the wreckage of a neighbor’s bungalow hit by a Palestinian rocket, retired Israeli official Avner Cohen traces the missile’s trajectory back to an “enormous, stupid mistake” made 30 years ago.

“Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation,” says Mr. Cohen, a Tunisian-born Jew who worked in Gaza for more than two decades. Responsible for religious affairs in the region until 1994, Mr. Cohen watched the Islamist movement take shape, muscle aside secular Palestinian rivals and then morph into what is today Hamas, a militant group that is sworn to Israel’s destruction.

Instead of trying to curb Gaza’s Islamists from the outset, says Mr. Cohen, Israel for years tolerated and, in some cases, encouraged them as a counterweight to the secular nationalists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and its dominant faction, Yasser Arafat’s Fatah. Israel cooperated with a crippled, half-blind cleric named Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, even as he was laying the foundations for what would become Hamas. Sheikh Yassin continues to inspire militants today; during the recent war in Gaza, Hamas fighters confronted Israeli troops with “Yassins,” primitive rocket-propelled grenades named in honor of the cleric.

Israel’s experience echoes that of the U.S., which, during the Cold War, looked to Islamists as a useful ally against communism. Anti-Soviet forces backed by America after Moscow’s 1979 invasion of Afghanistan later mutated into al Qaeda.

At stake is the future of what used to be the British Mandate of Palestine, the biblical lands now comprising Israel and the Palestinian territories of the West Bank and Gaza. Since 1948, when the state of Israel was established, Israelis and Palestinians have each asserted claims over the same territory.

The Palestinian cause was for decades led by the PLO, which Israel regarded as a terrorist outfit and sought to crush until the 1990s, when the PLO dropped its vow to destroy the Jewish state. The PLO’s Palestinian rival, Hamas, led by Islamist militants, refused to recognize Israel and vowed to continue “resistance.” Hamas now controls Gaza, a crowded, impoverished sliver of land on the Mediterranean from which Israel pulled out troops and settlers in 2005.

When Israel first encountered Islamists in Gaza in the 1970s and ‘80s, they seemed focused on studying the Quran, not on confrontation with Israel. The Israeli government officially recognized a precursor to Hamas called Mujama Al-Islamiya, registering the group as a charity. It allowed Mujama members to set up an Islamic university and build mosques, clubs and schools. Crucially, Israel often stood aside when the Islamists and their secular left-wing Palestinian rivals battled, sometimes violently, for influence in both Gaza and the West Bank.

See more at ...
http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB123275572295011847


7 posted on 07/01/2014 3:01:27 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Biggirl

Another one ...

How Israel Helped Create Hamas
In the 1970s, Israel Saw Hamas’ Founders as Allies
http://middleeast.about.com/od/israelandpalestine/a/me090126.htm

It isn’t the kind of history Israelis like to talk about, or admit, but it’s also undeniable: Hamas is at least partly an intentional creation of Israel that dates back to the 1970s.

Back then the secular Palestine Liberation Organization was waging a terror campaign against Israel, which it vowed to destroy. There was no contact between Israel and the PLO, at least not officially. But Israel looked for Palestinians who didn’t align themselves with the PLO. It found them, in Gaza, in an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood—deeply pious Palestinians who were opposed to the PLO’s secular outlook, and who had adopted the Brotherhood’s motto: “Islam is the solution. The Koran is our constitution.”

Waltzing with Hamas

The Palestinian group that would begin calling itself Hamas in 1987 was founded by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, a half-blind cleric partially paralyzed by a childhood sports accident. In the 1970s, Yassin’s interest was to turn Palestinians toward the Koran and to find their way through it, rather than through the PLO. Israel saw an opportunity to battle the PLO from within its own Palestinian ranks by openly supporting Yassin and his followers.

Israel’s assumption that Yassin could be a viable alternative to Yasser Arafat was the same sort of miscalculation the United States committed in Iran in the 1970s, when the CIA cultivated radical Islamist groups there should the regime of the Shah of Iran falter or fall. In 1979, the regime did fall. The CIA had misread the forces of political Islam in Iran. It had also misread its reach: Political Islam wasn’t a fad. It was the future.

Read the rest at the link ...


8 posted on 07/01/2014 3:02:08 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

Thank-you for your response.


9 posted on 07/01/2014 3:02:39 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Biggirl

ABSOLUTELY SURE, as I’ve followed it all along ... :-) ...


10 posted on 07/01/2014 3:03:28 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

PA cheers them on. Same difference.


11 posted on 07/01/2014 3:29:00 AM PDT by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: Star Traveler

http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3174488/posts

First volley has already taken place.


12 posted on 07/01/2014 3:36:14 AM PDT by ImNotLying (The Right To Bear Arms: Making good people helpless won't make bad people harmless!)
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To: gunsequalfreedom

Absolutely not the same, as Israel doesn’t launch attacks against the P.A. ... as it does all the time against Hamas. Rockets don’t come in on Israeli cities, as they do from Hamas. Soldiers are not kidnapped by the P.A. as they are by Hamas! And Prime Minister Benjamin Natanyahu doesn’t lobby Congress to give money to Hamas, as he does for Congress to give money to the P.A.


13 posted on 07/01/2014 3:36:43 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: ImNotLying

You’re mixing up two separate items ... as I already pointed out on that thread ...

— — —

This is NOT related to the three teens found dead. This is related to the rocket attacks by Hamas. Israel and Hamas repeatedly go through this “merry-go-round” ... Hamas launches rockets, Israel retaliates and strikes Hamas positions. This is an “on-going” thing.

Look for something else related to the teens!

Quote from the article ...
“The military said aircraft attacked 34 sites, mostly belonging to Hamas, though its statement did not link the strikes to the abductions.

Instead, it cited 18 Palestinian rocket launched against Israel from Gaza in the past two days which Israeli officials have said Hamas carried out.”


14 posted on 07/01/2014 3:38:46 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

The Palestinian terrorists never get blamed for kidnapping, murder, bombings, rocket and mortar attacks, or the rest of the violence. If Israel responds, they are escalating. It’s time for Israel to ignore the antisemitic media.


15 posted on 07/01/2014 3:53:40 AM PDT by Pollster1 ("Shall not be infringed" is unambiguous.)
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To: Pollster1

Israel does respond and it doesn’t take care of its security measures according to what comes out on the news ... :-) ...


16 posted on 07/01/2014 3:56:45 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

Were you around 1993-2003?

The PLO and Israel traded blows on a daily basis...


17 posted on 07/01/2014 4:12:25 AM PDT by Netz
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To: Star Traveler

If Gaza is destroyed, there can be no retaliation.

Half measures don’t do the job.


18 posted on 07/01/2014 4:17:21 AM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... Obama is public enemy #1)
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To: gunsequalfreedom
The main problem is that the PLO never made the intellectual or practical leap to the Palestinian Authority, (PA), conceptually, they're still the descendants of Arafart FATAH terror organization.
19 posted on 07/01/2014 4:27:49 AM PDT by Netz
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To: Netz
I wasn't in Israel but I was definitely around, to know what was going on. Israel has just started talking with the PLO, the Oslo Accords were subsequently signed, Yasser Arafat was front and center ...

But now Arafat is dead and gone, the PA is a lot milder than with Arafat and Hamas has now taken control of Gaza. It's a different age ... :-) ...

20 posted on 07/01/2014 4:45:38 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: bert

Israel doesn’t do WAR CRIMES - even though Israel’s enemies have accused it of doing that very thing to the Palestinians. That happens to be nothing but PROPAGANDA by Israel’s enemies!

This is something to get cleared up here ... In Israel’s own laws they are committed to protecting all religious rights and religious sites - Muslims, Christians or Jews equally. Israel is the ONLY COUNTRY in the Middle East so committed to doing so.

Also, as part of the original “Palestine Mandate” from the League of Nations, the religious rights of all religious groups were designated to be protected. When Israel declared independence in 1948” and the war started, Israel urged all the Arabs to NOT FLEE because they were not going to harm them. Israel said they wanted them as citizens in the new country.

Right now, the civil and voting rights of all Arabs in Israel (they are full fledged citizens) are FULLY PROTECTED as much as any Jewish citizen. The Arabs have their own legislators in the Knesset. Also, there is an Arab who is on Israel’s Supreme Court. The Arab population of Israel is 20%.

Israel is ABSOLUTELY COMMITTED to preserving the religious rights and shrines of all citizens in Israel!

THIS IS THE TRUE ISRAEL ... not some “comic book character” that some people “want Israel to be” when they are posting online!


21 posted on 07/01/2014 4:47:22 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

Israel wants to go after Hamas, but doesn’t want all-out war with Gaza

And there is the problem. Hamas is the Gaza. The Gaza is Hamas. Just as America refuse to name isla our enemy and instead uses terms like extremist, terrorist, this faction or that faction, Israel is making a mistake. Hamas does not exists without the cooperation and support of the people. Al-Queda does not exist without the cooperation and support of the people and the muslim States. If you fear naming your enemy you have already lost..........


22 posted on 07/01/2014 4:47:29 AM PDT by SECURE AMERICA (I am an American Not a Republican or a Democrat.)
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To: Star Traveler

The Israeli’s should tell the arabs of Gaza to leave. They are going to invade, sanitize, and annex Gaza in to Israel proper. There will be no mercy or quarter given to anyone who supports Hamas, Hizballah, PLO, or any other pan-arabic terrorist organization. Those groups will henceforth be illegal, and dealt with as one would deal with a cockroach.


23 posted on 07/01/2014 4:49:36 AM PDT by Ouderkirk (To the left, everything must evidence that this or that strand of leftist theory is true)
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To: SECURE AMERICA

Hamas is in Gaza and they control it, but Israel doesn’t do WAR CRIMES and distinguishes between Hamas and Palestinian civilians in Gaza. Israel goes out of their way to avoid collateral damage with civilians.

Also, see Post #21 ...


24 posted on 07/01/2014 4:50:38 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Ouderkirk

Israel doesn’t do WAR CRIMES.

See post #21 ...


25 posted on 07/01/2014 4:52:07 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

PA/Hamas is butchering Israel’s citizens in the streets and some don’t want to retaliate because it may make them mad?


26 posted on 07/01/2014 4:55:05 AM PDT by circlecity
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To: Star Traveler

NOT wanting an all out war with Hamas is why these type killings keep happening. If its war the Hamas want, give them one they will NEVER forget, certainly Israel has the capablility.


27 posted on 07/01/2014 4:56:32 AM PDT by DaveA37
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To: circlecity

The PA is not doing it ... but Hamas sure is ...


28 posted on 07/01/2014 4:59:43 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: DaveA37

They gave Hamas one before ... But I don’t figure that this is the “next time” that they’re going to do it from the way I read it.


29 posted on 07/01/2014 5:01:58 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

Sporatic fighting has done nothing but drag this thing out over the decades. Enough is enough. Bibi should put a stop to it once and for all.


30 posted on 07/01/2014 6:06:40 AM PDT by bgill
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To: bgill

There’s not going to be a “once and for all”. You can forget that.

The USA can’t even begin to do a “once and for all” in Afghanistan — which is the LONGEST WAR in US history!

The USA couldn’t do a “once and for all” in Iraq either.

SO ... don’t be expecting Israel to do a “once mad for all” ... :-) ...


31 posted on 07/01/2014 6:11:56 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

That was “once and for all” ...

[... it’s that stupid speller ... :-) ...]


32 posted on 07/01/2014 6:18:49 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler
One point often overlooked or intentionally ignored is the level and scope of incitement within the PA, or as many call them, the “moderates”. HAMAS is very open about their goals - kill all Jews now and ASAP.
The PA has an incredible level of incitement against Jews as well, especially within the school system so whether your wearing a suit and tie (FATAH) or a explosive belt (HAMAS), the goal is the same, kill, kill, kill, albeit, FATAH will try to do it in stages, slowly. The PA is moderate proportionally speaking because they got their arses kicked in Operation Defensive Shield (2002) after 2 years of Intifada.
33 posted on 07/01/2014 6:59:16 AM PDT by Netz
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To: Star Traveler

Don’t you supposed that if Israel was not worried about “world opinion”, they would go full board and CLEAN OUT Gaza BIGTIME?

Was just wondering myself.


34 posted on 07/01/2014 8:05:50 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Netz

Sad, but true.


35 posted on 07/01/2014 8:08:04 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: DaveA37

You got that right. The problem is that Israel worries too much what the world thinks.


36 posted on 07/01/2014 8:09:22 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Star Traveler

Good information. Thanks


37 posted on 07/01/2014 4:56:49 PM PDT by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: Biggirl
Yes, sad but in the Middle East, the TRUTH means absolutely nothing. Israelis spend an inordinate amount of time trying to explain their case and the facts but these are more or less ignored by the international community. A good example is what is going on with Iran.
In the late 1970’s and early 80’s, the Israelis warned the West about Saddam Hussein's nuclear program - they did nothing so, in 1981, the Israelis were FORCED to take out their nuclear facility at Osirak, Iraq.
The world was asleep in 1938-39 and it is so today, as well.
38 posted on 07/01/2014 9:24:26 PM PDT by Netz
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To: Biggirl

Don’t you supposed that if Israel was not worried about “world opinion”, they would go full board and CLEAN OUT Gaza BIGTIME?

The world NEVER lets the Jews of Israel eliminate the problem, only let it simmer, decade after decade. This is what diplomats commonly call, “Conflict Management”.


39 posted on 07/01/2014 9:26:27 PM PDT by Netz
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To: Netz

Yesterday I had downloaded from iTunes the 1983 alburn of singing legend Bob Dylan called “Infidels” which has its most famous recording about Israel called “Neighborhood Bully”. As with the rest of his music, the words tell the story.


40 posted on 07/02/2014 12:58:51 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Netz

Sadly, the world as you said is ASLEEP again in regards to ISIS and other the other alphabet soup terrorist organizations as well, just like the late 30’s.


41 posted on 07/02/2014 1:05:15 AM PDT by Biggirl (“Go, do not be afraid, and serve”-Pope Francis)
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To: Biggirl

Israel must be strong (not as a bully but as the ONLY bastion of freedom & Democracy in that region).
For all it’s sins, Israel is a decent and pluralistic society while ALL of her neighbors are cannibal-Barbarians.


42 posted on 07/02/2014 3:27:42 AM PDT by Netz
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To: circlecity
PA/Hamas is butchering Israel’s citizens in the streets and some don’t want to retaliate because it may make them mad?

...no, it might hurt their poor little diddum’s feelings, after all, it is RAMADAN, a time for festivities, a time for fasting, a time for blowing the crap out of each and every Muslim by other Muslims because, what we need is brotherly love, right ;)

43 posted on 07/02/2014 3:31:22 AM PDT by Netz
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