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To: Kaslin
Ran across a fascinating comment in a biography of B. Franklin. It's from a 1783 letter of his to Robert Morris.

All the property that is necessary to a Man, for the Conservation of the Individual and the Propagation of the Species, is his natural Right, which none can justly deprive him of: But all Property superfluous to such purposes is the Property of the Publick, who, by their Laws, have created it, and who may therefore by other laws dispose of it, whenever the Welfare of the Publick shall demand such Disposition. He that does not like civil Society on these Terms, let him retire and live among Savages. He can have no right to the benefits of Society, who will not pay his Club towards the Support of it.

IOW, it appears that Ben thought you really didn't make that.

3 posted on 07/12/2014 5:00:16 PM PDT by Sherman Logan (Perception wins all the battles. Reality wins all the wars.)
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To: Sherman Logan
All the property that is necessary to a Man, for the Conservation of the Individual and the Propagation of the Species, is his natural Right, which none can justly deprive him of: But all Property superfluous to such purposes is the Property of the Publick, who, by their Laws, have created it, and who may therefore by other laws dispose of it, whenever the Welfare of the Publick shall demand such Disposition. He that does not like civil Society on these Terms, let him retire and live among Savages. He can have no right to the benefits of Society, who will not pay his Club towards the Support of it.

Who cares what BF said in a letter. Socialist redistribution did not make it into the Constitution. And despite what the Supremes may say, the takings clause bars redistribution of wealth.

4 posted on 07/12/2014 5:24:34 PM PDT by LALALAW (one of the asses who's sick of our "ruling" classes)
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To: Sherman Logan

Franklin was most likely thinking of Real Estate. Property taxes are already quite punitive to people who own lots of land (but don’t put it to productive use). Since he lived in a era before the Industrial Revolution kicked into full swing, he probably did not envisage the kind of wealth that individually owned (and directed) capital could create. I’m not sure how he could call the savings and investment of individuals “...property...superfluous to such purposes.” In fact, I seriously doubt he would think such. His only concern would probably be the purchase of influence that great wealth can bring, but that’s why we’re supposed to have a Constitution enforced by principled men. Namely to prevent cronyism from happening.


6 posted on 07/12/2014 5:37:04 PM PDT by Bishop_Malachi (Liberal Socialism - A philosophy which advocates spreading a low standard of living equally.)
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To: Sherman Logan

That’s what he said and many people say things. Pollsters and marketers know that what people say isn’t as important as what they do.

What did he do?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_Company_of_Philadelphia


10 posted on 07/12/2014 6:55:52 PM PDT by 1010RD (First, Do No Harm)
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To: Sherman Logan; Kaslin; LALALAW; Bishop_Malachi; 1010RD; Kennard

A couple of comments regarding Ben’s quote, to put things in context...

He asserts that “society” should get to decide what to do with the “superfluous” property, including, I imagine, what constitutes “superfluous”... But who is “society”?

Well, according to Wikipedia...

“When founded, most U.S. states allowed only Caucasian males—who either owned property (i.e., at least 50 acres of land), or, had taxable incomes—to vote.”

In other words, property owners were the ones that defined property rights and what is superfluous. Well given that, I would not have a whole lot of disagreements with ol’ Ben.

So I will gladly accept the idea that society gets to decide what should be redistributed, PROVIDED, the left also accepts that only property owners get to vote and make those rules.

I can guarantee you that under that system, the amount of redistribution would be way, way less than we have today.


19 posted on 07/13/2014 6:27:03 PM PDT by aquila48
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