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Guardsman kills 2 people, self in northern Utah
WTHR.COM ^ | 14 JULY 2014 | ANNIE KNOX - AP

Posted on 07/14/2014 8:44:33 PM PDT by Extremely Extreme Extremist

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) - An Army National Guardsman left a suicide note in his northern Utah home before killing a college student and one other person early Monday, then fatally shooting himself at another home, authorities said.

Jared Tolman, 23, wrote that he was sorry, and that what he was about to do was selfish, said Logan Police Lt. Rod Peterson.

He is reported to have sent a series of unanswered text messages to Mackenzie Madden before he kicked down the door of her apartment two blocks from Utah State University shortly after midnight.

He then fired an assault rifle multiple times at Madden and a 25-year-old man, both people he knew, police said.

(Excerpt) Read more at wthr.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
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1 posted on 07/14/2014 8:44:33 PM PDT by Extremely Extreme Extremist
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist
People's emotions are nothing to fool with, treat with anything less than respect or underestimate.

YOUNG people, especially young women, treat men's emotions as cavalierly as THEY say men treat women.

Works both ways, doesn't it dearie???

2 posted on 07/14/2014 8:47:43 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

Any pictures of the “assault rifle” yet?

Interesting they say he turned “the gun” on himself, and then say all three shootings were the same weapon. Is it hard to shoot yourself with an assault rifle?


3 posted on 07/14/2014 8:48:03 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

No chick is worth that.

And for ladies, no dude is worth that either.


4 posted on 07/14/2014 8:49:57 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1Jn4:15;5:4-5,11-13;Mt27:50-54;Mk15:33-34;Jn3:17-18,6:69,11:25,14:6,20:31;Ro10:8-11;1Tm2:5-6;Ti3:4-7)
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To: cloudmountain

You’re right, she totally deserved to be killed.


5 posted on 07/14/2014 8:51:24 PM PDT by xjcsa (Ridiculing the ridiculous since the day I was born.)
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To: cloudmountain
you stupid arse....blaming the dead people again....

this murder AGAIN by a me, me, me arrogant creep who can only think of one thing and that is that he is going to show what a big man he is....

killing two young people and you condone it....pathetic..

in the old days of Free Republic, we didn't have these blame the victims first mentality.....FR is hardly recognizable anymore....its just disgusting...

6 posted on 07/14/2014 8:52:00 PM PDT by cherry
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To: cloudmountain

People’s emotions are nothing to fool with, treat with anything less than respect or underestimate.
YOUNG people, especially young women, treat men’s emotions as cavalierly as THEY say men treat women.

Works both ways, doesn’t it dearie???
..............................................

Who needs reporting when the world has you to fill in the narrative?
You are a deeply disturbed individual.


7 posted on 07/14/2014 8:53:57 PM PDT by bramps (Go West America!)
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To: xjcsa

You fixed an absurd remark. Thanks.


8 posted on 07/14/2014 8:54:25 PM PDT by RitaOK ( VIVA CHRISTO REY / Public education is the farm team for more Marxists coming.)
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To: cloudmountain

FRiend, that kind of thinking supports the gangbanger’s excuse, “He dissed me, so I shot him.”


9 posted on 07/14/2014 8:57:09 PM PDT by tumblindice (America's founding fathers: all armed conservatives)
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To: cloudmountain

Some people don’t want to be harassed endlessly. If you don’t like someone, you don’t like him. You shouldn’t have to die for not liking him/her. That’s such a horrid thing to say. This dude was obviously obsessed and couldn’t handle not getting what he wanted. That’s the problem with today’s culture.


10 posted on 07/14/2014 8:57:46 PM PDT by Politicalkiddo (The more helpless the victim, the more hideous the assault.)
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To: cloudmountain

Wow that’s a lot of assumptions your are making in favor of a murderer. Where in that article does it say she was stringing him along?

Maybe the guy was a psycho stalker or violent ex boyfriend that she was avoiding. He did murder two people after all.


11 posted on 07/14/2014 8:58:06 PM PDT by CaptainK (...please make it stop. Shake a can of pennies at it.)
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To: cloudmountain

His emotions were no more played with than that of your run of the mill thug who shoot people in the streets of Chicago or New Orleans.


12 posted on 07/14/2014 9:00:31 PM PDT by Oliviaforever
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To: cherry
FR is hardly recognizable anymore....its just disgusting..

So why do you stick around? Or do you get your jollies vilifying those who disagree with you? You must enjoy BLASTING those who dare to say something that doesn't fit your style of thinking.

Don't bother to answer. I don't care what you think.

13 posted on 07/14/2014 9:02:52 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: CaptainK; cloudmountain
So Cloud, what did you say when he looked like this?


14 posted on 07/14/2014 9:03:00 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: tumblindice
FRiend, that kind of thinking supports the gangbanger’s excuse, “He dissed me, so I shot him.”

It wasn't meant to, FRiend.

My, how angry people get with such a small, simple statement from ONE FReeper making ONE comment on ONE subject.

Thin skins on a site which usually requires THICK skins. Oh well.

15 posted on 07/14/2014 9:06:28 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: Alas Babylon!

If only Nicole had been nicer.


16 posted on 07/14/2014 9:06:51 PM PDT by CaptainK (...please make it stop. Shake a can of pennies at it.)
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To: cloudmountain
Police said the relationship between Tolman and Madden was unclear. No motive was released, and investigators gave no further details about the text messages he sent her.

Apparently you have more information about this than the article does. Please enlighten us all about what happened.

17 posted on 07/14/2014 9:08:39 PM PDT by TigersEye ("No man left behind" means something different to 0bama.)
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To: Alas Babylon!
YOU should know.

YOU are the one who is holding on to the photo of that piece of manure.

YOU are the one it means so much to.

Perfect call sign of yours...Babylon.
Babble on and on.

18 posted on 07/14/2014 9:09:04 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: cloudmountain
cloudmountain, you're obviously having a very bad day. Your other posts here at FR have usually been quite interesting and insightful. You've generally been most considerate to others with different opinions. Please don't spoil your (until now) good track record.

Regards,

19 posted on 07/14/2014 9:15:27 PM PDT by alexander_busek (Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.)
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To: Admin Moderator

Possible zot here for just outrageous behavior and comments


20 posted on 07/14/2014 9:20:49 PM PDT by reed13k (For evil to triumph it is only necessary for good men to do nothings)
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

The article says the guy was part of a support battalion, and that his job was handling laundry. You don’t generally get that kind of MOS unless you fail out of something more demanding, and most MOS schools give plenty of second/third/more tries to get past the graduation requirement, so this guy couldn’t have been a very bright bulb.

And I also really want to see what they’re considering an “assault rifle”.


21 posted on 07/14/2014 9:31:45 PM PDT by Little Pig
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To: cloudmountain

Knock it off!


22 posted on 07/14/2014 9:34:05 PM PDT by Admin Moderator
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To: cloudmountain

That was idiotic. He was the type that will murder over being dumped, and somehow, its her fault. That’s someone’s daughter. Sounds like he was a horse’s ass.

That comment was worthy of Westboro Baptist, not FR.


23 posted on 07/14/2014 9:36:24 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: TigersEye

The dead couple had recently met and were friends. The shooter was a jealous rager. He shot himself at another friend of her’s apartment. That friend was at his folks’ house at the time.


24 posted on 07/14/2014 9:45:16 PM PDT by glock rocks (If you like your health plan, you're a racist !)
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To: glock rocks

I got that much from the article. I was wondering what insight the other poster had to explain his remarks. But thanks anyway.


25 posted on 07/14/2014 9:47:40 PM PDT by TigersEye ("No man left behind" means something different to 0bama.)
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To: TigersEye

Just the insight delivered by the mod it seems.

Sorry, I didn’t notice it an exerpt. I read the story locally on Fox.


26 posted on 07/14/2014 9:52:25 PM PDT by glock rocks (If you like your health plan, you're a racist !)
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To: glock rocks

Did the Fox story have anything that this one didn’t?


27 posted on 07/14/2014 9:54:32 PM PDT by TigersEye ("No man left behind" means something different to 0bama.)
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To: TigersEye

No, same info.


28 posted on 07/14/2014 10:08:26 PM PDT by glock rocks (If you like your health plan, you're a racist !)
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To: cloudmountain
Women don't usually set out to kill the violent and mentally disturbed men, if they have managed to escape from them.

So no, it doesn't work both ways.

29 posted on 07/14/2014 10:30:36 PM PDT by sarasmom (Extortion 17. A large number of Navy SEALs died on that mission. Ask why.)
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To: CharlesWayneCT

No. Quite easy to kill yourself with a rifle. The diminutive Japanese of the WW II Era became quite adept at doing it with an Arisaka almost as long as they were tall by sticking the muzzle under their chin and pulling the trigger with their big toe.


30 posted on 07/15/2014 12:15:08 AM PDT by Eagles6 (Valley Forge Redux. If not now, when? If not here, where?)
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To: Eagles6
a·dept adjective əˈdept/ 1. very skilled or proficient at something. "he is adept at cutting through red tape" synonyms: expert, proficient, accomplished, skillful, talented, masterly, masterful, consummate, virtuoso; More antonyms: inept noun noun: adept; plural noun: adepts ˈadept,əˈdept/ 1. a person who is skilled or proficient at something. "they are adepts at kung fu and karate" synonyms: expert, past master, master, genius, maestro, doyen, virtuoso; More antonyms: amateur Origin mid 17th century: from Latin adeptus ‘achieved,’ past participle of adipisci ‘obtain, attain.’ Translate adept to Use over time for: adept

An act performed precisely once is hardly worthy of adept. Nobody has a resume touting "professional suicide bomber". It's an oxymoron. Schrödinger's cat might have a shot at it.

31 posted on 07/15/2014 1:12:22 AM PDT by Myrddin
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To: cloudmountain

Really? REALLY?? She didn’t answer him, so it was ok for him to kill her? Sick, dude.

I am going to read the whole article and comment further. Prepare to be excoriated.


32 posted on 07/15/2014 3:34:39 AM PDT by blu
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To: cloudmountain

Oh hush. You made an utterly foolish remark, now pay for it.

In cases like these, I read the article to see if there is a connection between in country service and the service member. from the article, this is what I found: “He joined the National Guard in 2009, guard spokesman Steven Fairbourn said. He was assigned to a support battalion for the 19th Special Forces Unit, where his chief duty was handling laundry.”

I can’t tell if he served stateside, or not. Usually in these cases, PTSD is involved. It will be interesting to see if there was a PPO (yep, I know, just a piece of paper that people shoot thru all the time) in place.

And it is never ok to blame the victim. Never.


33 posted on 07/15/2014 3:40:50 AM PDT by blu
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

Note the emphasis on the ‘assault rifle’


34 posted on 07/15/2014 3:46:55 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration (Pr 14:34 Righteousness exalteth a nation:but sin is a reproach to any people)
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To: cloudmountain

I thought you had a good point. You never said she deserved it. You made an inciteful statement on hoe cavalier people are with each others emotions. Was that at play here? Maybe not. But it is still a useful thing to note about today’s society. It is not justifying a murder to say people should be smarter and more careful about how they toss around the affections, giving and revoking at a whim.


35 posted on 07/15/2014 7:05:20 AM PDT by TalonDJ
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To: blu
And it is never ok to blame the victim. Never.

Nonsense. Many if not most victims should serve as a warming in one way or another. They might not have RESPONSABILITY for the act, but that does not mean we should not learn what not to do.
36 posted on 07/15/2014 7:07:16 AM PDT by TalonDJ
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To: cloudmountain

What I’ve learned over the years is that us men are far more emotional and sensitive then the other gender.


37 posted on 07/15/2014 7:37:18 AM PDT by SgtHooper (This is not my tag!)
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To: TalonDJ

So, in other words, it’s ok to shoot someone if they don’t answer your text?

Or, conversely, every text must be responded to, with the punishment for NOT answering the text is death, and that’s ok? BS meter going off big time.

As for victims serving as a warning....sitting on your couch should not be allowed, as someone may shoot thru the window or kick into your house? Grocery shopping? Going to school? If we take your thought to extremes, the only safe way to not be a victim is to be dead.

Sorry, victims bear no blame or responsibility for crimes committed against them. True victims.


38 posted on 07/15/2014 8:33:46 AM PDT by blu
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To: Myrddin
Don't you have something better to do?

Michelangelo only painted 1 Sistine Chapel.

39 posted on 07/15/2014 8:48:35 AM PDT by Eagles6 (Valley Forge Redux. If not now, when? If not here, where?)
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To: SgtHooper
What I’ve learned over the years is that us men are far more emotional and sensitive then the other gender.

Since we inherit our temperament from both/either parent, I would imagine that the split of emotion and sensitivity would be fairly even.

However, I HAVE heard often and often: "If mama is happy, everyone is happy. If mama isn't happy, then no one else is either." I don't know if that's true or not, especially in these days of husbandless and fatherless families.

40 posted on 07/15/2014 11:38:48 AM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: DesertRhino
That comment was worthy of Westboro Baptist, not FR.

The Westboro Baptist Church is an American unaffiliated Baptist church known for its extreme ideologies, especially those against gay people. Wikipedia
Address: 3701 SW 12th St, Topeka, KS 66604
: Fred Phelps

From the Internet: The Topeka, Kansas-based Westboro Baptist Church (WBC) is a small virulently homophobic, anti-Semitic hate group that regularly stages protests around the country, often several times a week. The group pickets institutions and individuals they think support homosexuality or otherwise subvert what they believe is God’s law.
Incorporated in 1967 as a not-for-profit organization, WBC considers itself an “Old School (or Primitive)” Baptist Church. WBC’s leader is Fred Phelps and several of his children and dozens of his grandchildren appear to constitute the majority of the group’s members. WBC has no official affiliation with mainstream Baptist organizations.

=============================

I've never heard of these people. You would THINK that there would be some news of them, somewhere, sometime.

I would THINK that the Baptists would preach against them, as they give a bad name to Baptists.

And this is in KANSAS?

Thanks for their NAME; I learned something.

41 posted on 07/15/2014 11:51:05 AM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: cloudmountain

Well, obviously he was crazy. She was right to avoid him.


42 posted on 07/15/2014 11:53:37 AM PDT by AppyPappy
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To: AppyPappy
Well, obviously he was crazy. She was right to avoid him.

I always dated guys that were friends of friends, "known quantities. My sister introduced me to my husband. Lol. I KNEW that he was thoroughly vetted by my sister.
Daughters are USUALLY protected by dad, as I we were. But when WOMEN date, they have to be uber careful.

RULE 1: Meeting men in bars is a no-no. Of course, it might be the same in the reverse, too.

43 posted on 07/15/2014 12:04:44 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: blu

No. You fail at reading comprehension.


44 posted on 07/15/2014 12:34:02 PM PDT by TalonDJ
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To: TalonDJ
I thought you had a good point. You never said she deserved it. You made an inciteful statement on hoe cavalier people are with each others emotions. Was that at play here? Maybe not. But it is still a useful thing to note about today’s society. It is not justifying a murder to say people should be smarter and more careful about how they toss around the affections, giving and revoking at a whim.

Thank you.

I was making a note at how CAVALIER people are sometimes with others' emotions. It's not really fair sometimes.

"Giving and revoking at a whim."
GREAT summation.

45 posted on 07/15/2014 6:23:04 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: blu

Giving and revoking at whim...is never right, no matter who does it. I just got that message from a FReeper. It describes people who play with others’ emotions. THAT is never right.


46 posted on 07/15/2014 6:27:11 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: cherry
you stupid arse....blaming the dead people again.... this murder AGAIN by a me, me, me arrogant creep who can only think of one thing and that is that he is going to show what a big man he is.... killing two young people and you condone it....pathetic.. in the old days of Free Republic, we didn't have these blame the victims first mentality.....FR is hardly recognizable anymore....its just disgusting.

And YOU stoop to name calling. Shame on you.

My point: it's never right to play with others' emotions. You know that's true.

47 posted on 07/15/2014 6:30:01 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: alexander_busek

See post 35.


48 posted on 07/15/2014 6:30:28 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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To: cloudmountain

You and Ted Bundy would have been good friends.


49 posted on 07/15/2014 6:37:43 PM PDT by rabidralph
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To: rabidralph
See post #35 and try to be less rabid abusive.
Shame on you.
50 posted on 07/15/2014 6:42:27 PM PDT by cloudmountain
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