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Putin Says Ukraine 'Bears Responsibility' for Malaysia Flight Jet Crash
NBC ^ | July 17, 2014 | unattributed

Posted on 07/17/2014 8:22:55 PM PDT by 1rudeboy

Russian President Vladimir Putin Thursday blamed the Ukrainian government for the crash of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17, saying the state bears some responsibility for fighting that may have led to the jet’s apparent downing by a surface-to-air missile.

“I would like to point out in this regard, that this tragedy would not have occurred if there was peace in that land, at least, if hostilities had not resumed in the South-East of Ukraine,” Putin said. “And without question, the state over whose territory this took place, bears responsibility for this awful tragedy.”

(Excerpt) Read more at nbcnews.com ...


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: mh17; ukraine
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Whoo boy. I guess it's fortunate that this did not occur over Crimea, right Vladi?
1 posted on 07/17/2014 8:22:55 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy
Putin: “I would like to point out in this regard, that this tragedy would not have occurred if there was peace in that land, at least, if hostilities had not resumed in the South-East of Ukraine,”

Soetoro: "I would like to point out in this regard, that his humanitarian crisis would not have occurred if there was compromise in this land and Republicans had not blocked Immigration Reform."

2 posted on 07/17/2014 8:26:05 PM PDT by Texas Eagle (If it wasn't for double-standards, Liberals would have no standards at all -- Texas Eagle)
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To: 1rudeboy

Do you think the Russian guy who posted the video and admission of taking down a plane is still alive?


3 posted on 07/17/2014 8:26:49 PM PDT by KOZ.
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To: 1rudeboy
“And without question, the state over whose territory this took place, bears responsibility for this awful tragedy.”

And that explains why the black boxes from Malaysian Flight MH7 were hustled off to Moscow, correct?

4 posted on 07/17/2014 8:26:51 PM PDT by The KG9 Kid
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To: KOZ.
Do you think the Russian guy who posted the video and admission of taking down a plane is still alive?

He's probably inside the black box by now.

5 posted on 07/17/2014 8:27:47 PM PDT by Texas Eagle (If it wasn't for double-standards, Liberals would have no standards at all -- Texas Eagle)
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To: 1rudeboy

I remember the Ukrainian military actually shot down a Russian commercial airliner by accident during a missile system test. I think it was in 2003.


6 posted on 07/17/2014 8:28:20 PM PDT by SeeSharp
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To: 1rudeboy

Obama has been on the ropes against Putin, completely outclassed. But now Putin has committed an outrageous act, and a severe tacktical blunder, and handed Obama and Ukraine a gift. But Obama will fumble it completely.


7 posted on 07/17/2014 8:29:21 PM PDT by Vince Ferrer
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To: Texas Eagle

Selig: ““I would like to point out in this regard, that this tragedy would not have occurred if there was peace in the AL at least, if hostilities had not resumed during the All-Star game.”


8 posted on 07/17/2014 8:29:25 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: KOZ.
"Do you think the Russian guy who posted the video and admission of taking down a plane is still alive?"

The bill for the bullet has already been sent to the family would be my guess.

9 posted on 07/17/2014 8:29:40 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: 1rudeboy

Guess NBC is not taking opinion posts, eh? /s


10 posted on 07/17/2014 8:30:50 PM PDT by RushIsMyTeddyBear (Great vid by ShorelineMike! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOZjJk6nbD4&feature=plcp)
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To: SeeSharp

2001...it was a Russian flight from Tel Aviv to Novosibirsk.


11 posted on 07/17/2014 8:35:08 PM PDT by mac_truck ( Aide toi et dieu t aidera)
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To: 1rudeboy

“that this tragedy would not have occurred if there was peace in that land”

Hey Putin - there would have peace in the land if you hadn’t invaded it.
It ALL goes back to you, Putin.


12 posted on 07/17/2014 8:39:05 PM PDT by nuconvert ( Khomeini promised change too // Hail, Chairman O)
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To: SeeSharp
I remembered a Serbia Airlines plane being shot down but had forgotten it was done by Ukraine.

Interesting in how different the reactions are when the target on the other foot.

13 posted on 07/17/2014 8:43:07 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin

I guess it’s all a wash, then. No one mind . . . you heard it on FR.


14 posted on 07/17/2014 8:45:06 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

Vlad wussed out. So much for his manly man image. He just morphed into an Obamaboy.


15 posted on 07/17/2014 8:45:43 PM PDT by pallis
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To: 1rudeboy

Expect Putinista’s to show up (though they’ve been quiet lately) blaming Right Sector for this everything - even though Right Sector got a whopping 2% in the latest elections.


16 posted on 07/17/2014 8:45:55 PM PDT by Longbow1969
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To: 1rudeboy

Deer Vlad;

Who controls the crash site now?


17 posted on 07/17/2014 8:48:49 PM PDT by Hillarys Gate Cult (Liberals make unrealistic demands on reality and reality doesn't oblige them.)
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To: Longbow1969

As far as I’ve seen, the initial spin was that an Ukrainian air force jet did the shooting (that failed), then the spin was an attempted assassination of Vladi himself (that failed miserably), and the latest spin appears to be “hey, it wasn’t us.”


18 posted on 07/17/2014 8:53:11 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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Oh, and I forgot: McCain’s Fault™.


19 posted on 07/17/2014 8:58:05 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: mac_truck
Oh well, mostly Jews, truth be told probably a Hasidic suicide bomber.

Beard thick with C4, detonator tooth, the usual.

Nothing at all like peace loving Muzzies during Rammy Damn.

/sarc - for the perception impaired

20 posted on 07/17/2014 9:01:54 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: 1rudeboy

And of course we all believe Vlad the KGB man first, last, and always. After all the Putinistas like to claim he is such a good solid Christian.

Once a commie always a commie. Vlad and his boys are just doing what comes naturally


21 posted on 07/17/2014 9:02:48 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: Nifster

C’mon now, Vladi loves Christians. Just as long as they are Russian Orthodox and register with the state.


22 posted on 07/17/2014 9:07:18 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: nuconvert

“that this tragedy would not have occurred if there was peace in that land”

Hey Putin - there would have peace in the land if you hadn’t invaded it.
It ALL goes back to you, Putin.

EXACTLY what I was about to post myself. It’s true.


23 posted on 07/17/2014 9:09:58 PM PDT by rockinqsranch ((Dems, Libs, Socialists, call 'em what you will. They ALL have fairies livin' in their trees.))
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To: Rashputin

I am sure the Soros/Obama folks who link to NBC stories on anything Ukraine will overlook this


24 posted on 07/17/2014 9:10:11 PM PDT by DisorderOnBorder (They are Illegal Aliens...not immigrants)
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To: 1rudeboy

the only way Putin can redeem himself and Russian involvement in the Ukraine is to quickly apprehend everybody that had anything to do with the targeting and shoot down of this aircraft and publicly execute them . With profound apologies to the families of the victims .
No trials , no excuses ; just put them all in front of a wall and machine gun them . Stream it live ....


25 posted on 07/17/2014 9:14:49 PM PDT by LeoWindhorse
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To: 1rudeboy

aye there’s the rub


26 posted on 07/17/2014 9:15:57 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: SeeSharp

https://news.yahoo.com/buk-missile-suspected-malaysia-plane-disaster-204808962.html


27 posted on 07/17/2014 9:17:32 PM PDT by Sacajaweau
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To: Texas Eagle
Putin: “I would like to point out in this regard, that this tragedy would not have occurred if there was peace in that land, at least, if hostilities had not resumed in the South-East of Ukraine,”

Soetoro: "I would like to point out in this regard, that his humanitarian crisis would not have occurred if there was compromise in this land and Republicans had not blocked Immigration Reform."

Holder: "I would like to point out in this regard, the racial animosities would not exist had whites simply allowed disparaged minorities access to their ill-gotten wealth"

28 posted on 07/17/2014 9:17:49 PM PDT by Last Dakotan
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To: LeoWindhorse

Putin couldn’t redeem himself, doing what you suggest- every day for one hundred years. Good suggestion, though.


29 posted on 07/17/2014 9:18:31 PM PDT by RedHeeler
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To: DisorderOnBorder
I am sure the Soros/Obama folks who link to NBC stories on anything Ukraine will overlook this

Just go ahead and cry in your borscht, comrade. Your boys screwed up, big time. Even Ron Paul cannot save you now.

30 posted on 07/17/2014 9:25:57 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy

And where did the “rebels” get this sophisticated and powerful SAM system, Vladdy-me-lad? Yeesh! The dumb bastards didn’t even know how to query a Airline transponder because if they did, they would have never launched.


31 posted on 07/17/2014 9:29:19 PM PDT by Ronin (Dumb, dependent and Democrat is no way to go through life - Rep. L. Gohmert, Tex)
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To: Rashputin
I remembered a Serbia Airlines plane being shot down but had forgotten it was done by Ukraine. Interesting in how different the reactions are when the target on the other foot.

Serbia Airlines? You mean Siberia Airlines.

Anyway about the Siberia Airline shoot down, read your own link. It's not what you think.

The US CIA said the Ukrainians shot the plane down. Putin said the Ukrainians did not shoot down the plane. The Ukrainians finally admitted to it. One could speculate why Putin wanted to cover up for the Ukrainians, but the bottom line is that Putin was covering up for a plane shoot down then and he's doing the same thing now.

32 posted on 07/17/2014 9:34:24 PM PDT by FreeReign
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To: 1rudeboy

In the same way that the House bears
responsibility for the border crisis.


33 posted on 07/17/2014 9:37:36 PM PDT by WKTimpco
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To: The KG9 Kid
And that explains why the black boxes from Malaysian Flight MH7 were hustled off to Moscow, correct?

Normal flight across Holland, Germany, Poland, and 700 miles of Ukraine. Then boom!

This is MH17, not MH370. What would the black boxes add to what is already known?

34 posted on 07/17/2014 9:40:43 PM PDT by cynwoody
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To: KOZ.
Do you think the Russian guy who posted the video and admission of taking down a plane is still alive?

Igor's reportedly a GRU hotshot. Even hotshots f-up now and again.

They needed to scramble a fighter to go up and eyeball it before destroying it. They don't have fighters, but they do have missiles.

35 posted on 07/17/2014 9:43:54 PM PDT by cynwoody
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To: cynwoody
The question is "Why were the black boxes hustled off to Moscow if this crash occurred in the Ukraine?".

The Russians believed that it was important to scoop them up and flee with them. Not a peep about what happened or who did it.

Bet we'll never see those again.

36 posted on 07/17/2014 9:50:22 PM PDT by The KG9 Kid
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To: The KG9 Kid
The Russians believed that it was important to scoop them up and flee with them. Not a peep about what happened or who did it.

Standard operating procedure, I'm sure. The Ukrainian separatists are in league with their big brother to the north, whose language they speak and with whom they intermarry.

Bet we'll never see those again.

That's likely of importance only to counsel for suing relatives. E.g., maybe the CVR would reveal the captain overriding the copilot on airline policy on the issue of diverting around the Donbas region.

37 posted on 07/17/2014 10:00:13 PM PDT by cynwoody
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To: 1rudeboy

Russia has nothing to gain by downing a passenger jet.

Russia would only look bad by downing a passenger jet.

The financial elites that run America, UK and Europe, however, do want to gin up support for overt US military action in Ukraine.

America, as new world order’s largest military machine, has the capability to turn the tide and bolster up NWO’s puppet government in Kiev so they can officially sign Ukraine into the EU.

So the real beneficiary of a passenger jet being blown out of the sky over Ukraine is the US/UK/Europe governments and their “backers”.

Russia, of course, is also run by new world order, as it has always had “international” elite investors and traders, it just politely keeps this fact quiet so the American sheeple don’t get wind of the fact that the same globalist monopolists are actually running the show in both Russia AND the US.

It’s obvious that the passenger jet blowup, with the coordinated internet push for American to “do something”, is really just about that.

The American sheeple are slowly starting to catch on, however, so we’re left with so much hype that does not “fly” much any more.

American sheeple have practically zero trust remaining of the US intelligence community.

US intel on the one hand claims that it has fantastical capabilities and that it is absolutely necessary to prevent attacks, then they come across as clueless when attacks happen anyway, after trillions spent, and their only answer at that point is a call for war. We could have the same result by spending zero on intelligence.

Meanwhile, US intel provides the technical machinery to the US government to enable a police state that focuses ALL its real efforts on developing methods of tracking Americans interested in Christianity and guns.

We’ve heard this stupid tune too many times to continue to believe it.


38 posted on 07/17/2014 10:01:31 PM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: DisorderOnBorder
"I am sure the Soros/Obama folks who link to NBC stories on anything Ukraine will overlook this"
Or like the Kiev propaganda crew pretend that even bringing it up is somehow claiming it's a wash and this incident isn't a case of tragic stupidity on the part of the shooters who should be held responsible.

They're blind without their official agenda glasses and with them on everything is seen in a way that merges with the Barry agenda. Such folks always instantly know all about whatever their masters are pushing.

They never admit that there's very limited accurate, independently verified, information, the fact that propaganda flows thick and fast from all the parties, or the reality that the US is way beyond being able to claim to have cleaner hands than Russia does and therefore an equally suspect source of information. Their agenda is everything for them.

People who deal with reality admit there are possibilities and probabilities then make a call on a case by case basis. The agenda driven crowd without fail speak in certainties when certainty doesn't exist.

Let the heathen rage, it's all they know how to do, poor souls.

39 posted on 07/17/2014 10:03:03 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: The KG9 Kid

By the time Vlad is finished with the black boxes they will show Right Sector shot the plane down with a nazis secret weapon from downtown Kiev.


40 posted on 07/17/2014 10:03:25 PM PDT by free_life (If you ask Jesus to forgive you and to save you, He will.)
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To: PieterCasparzen

Good grief. Chances are it was an accident. It wasn’t the Rothschilds.


41 posted on 07/17/2014 10:04:24 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Rashputin

Remind me, who brought up the Serbia [sic] airliner, and its relevance to this thread?


42 posted on 07/17/2014 10:05:43 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: free_life

A couple of the posters on this thread are almost there.


43 posted on 07/17/2014 10:06:29 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: PieterCasparzen

then they come across as clueless when attacks happen anyway, after trillions spent, and their only answer at that point is a call for war.


In TX we used to avoid all those silver coins spent by simply telling the judge ‘he needed killin’. It was a legitimate defense for all our history, maybe even still today in a few areas.


44 posted on 07/17/2014 10:11:51 PM PDT by txhurl (2014: Stunned Voters do Stunning Things!)
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To: free_life; cynwoody
Oh indeed. And certainly anything that might be an audio recording of "Eek! A mis--" (*BZZZZTT*)"

Standard operation procedure for the Russian potato heads, as Cynwoody pointed out.

45 posted on 07/17/2014 10:14:48 PM PDT by The KG9 Kid
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To: FreeReign
I stand corrected, no problem, I just can't type well due to a recent injury I'm recovering from

Sucks, too, making typos and taking forever to say something, blah. You should see the ones when I can't get my fingers on the home row. Like "oq mdc, 23yoql;lw??"

But so what if it's Dogpatch Airlines or any other? Shangra La, whatever?

IMHO the point isn't which airline in that case or this. The point is there's a history of lax controls and mistakes in the Ukraine military when it comes to SAMs. A separatist who knew how to use the missiles learned how in that lax system. People shoot down planes by mistake and the shooters try to hide the facts. So Putin is the evil dude in the mix in both cases? The Ukraine is not responsible even when they control the trigger, right? Not then, not now if it had been Kiev Army units doing the shooting? That's what comes across from some people if that's what they are trying to say or not.

I'm sure that if Kiev Army units had done it, had video of a Kiev NG guys tracking, launching, following the path of the missile, and cheering over the shoot-down, someone would assure me it was all a Russian clandestine operation within the ranks of the Kiev NG and Russia is really responsible.

The most likely shooters are the separatists, no doubt about it. Russia has nothing to gain by downing an airliner but Kiev has plenty to gain by pretending Russia had some say in the plane being shot down. Like I've said before, it doesn't matter what happens a lot of people are happy say "Russia did it" the same way people say, "It's Bush's fault" about everything to this day.

Fine with me if they think that way but it doesn't make a bit of sense.

Russia probably wasn't covering when at first they said Ukraine didn't do it back in 2001. It's probably a case of their taking the word of unreliable people in Ukraine and finding out they were lying only after having egg on their face. So, people in charge in Ukraine who came up through the same corrupt system that probably lied to Putin then are now more reliable sources?

It seems to me Putin isn't covering for anyone. He's avoiding anything but the "larger picture" by saying that had there been no coup there would have been no shoot down and were there no fighting no one would be using SAMs.

That's no different than the US claim that cutting off aid to Egypt because the Egyptian military went after the MB hammer and tong is standing up for democracy. Well, maybe so in the broadest theoretical sense, but in reality it's aiding the MB the only way we can by trying to weaken their Egyptian opposition. Putin is at best avoiding damning the separatists, not "covering" for them now and I doubt he was deliberately doing so in 2001. Is that aiding them? Not a whole Hell of a lot as of yet.

IMHO, Putin xhould have condemned the shooters right off the bat whether he identified them as one group or another. But right off the bat Kiev blamed Russia when Putin knew it wasn't his units why wouldn't he hang back and listen to those who wanted to believe Kiev may have done it if they were anxious to blame him rather than the most probable shooters? Maybe there was a reason to doubt it was separatists, maybe not, but blaming Russia first was bound feed the theory that Kiev forces may have done it however unlikely that may be.

Avoiding the issue by moving to a broader view is the nature of idiotic international game playing that passes for diplomacy these days. It's always about abstracting away anything between you and your goal no matter who "you" is. Kiev routinely blaming Russia for what Ukrainians are doing is a way of deliberately trying to get Russia more involved, not a way to avoid it.

Regards, thanks for the correction.

46 posted on 07/17/2014 11:10:31 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: 1rudeboy
I did because it shows that the Ukraine military has a history of lax SAM controls. If a separatist knows how to use the system he trained in the same lax system the current Kiev NG trained in. Therefore it's relevant when laxity leads to shooting down an airliner over Ukraine.

But, that's pretty damn obvious now isn't it?

47 posted on 07/17/2014 11:13:23 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: 1rudeboy
Actually, I brought up the details and while SeeSharp actually broached the subject and jogged my memory. But, I'm sure you read each and every comment from the start of the thread to the end, right?
48 posted on 07/17/2014 11:25:24 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: The KG9 Kid

The never saw it coming, dear. They were at cruising altitude, keeping an eye on a weather system to their SW and letting autopilot handle the intricacies of flying. Then they suffered catastrophic engine failure and cabin decompression (the fuselage being ripped apart by warhead impact or close-aboard detonation). Then they died.


49 posted on 07/17/2014 11:50:56 PM PDT by brothers4thID (Be professional, be courteous, and have a plan to kill everyone in the room.)
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To: PieterCasparzen

You’re a shameless Putin apologists. Did you support him when he was with the KGB and did you then support the Gulag? Why do you post on an American Conservative website if you favor an autocrat?


50 posted on 07/18/2014 12:03:18 AM PDT by elhombrelibre (Against Obama. Against Putin. Pro-freedom. Pro-US Constitution.)
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