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Modern-Day Russian "Dupes"
AIM ^ | April 4 2014 | Cliff Kincaid

Posted on 07/19/2014 9:03:23 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans

Pat Buchanan’s column, “Is God Now on Russia’s Side?,” is difficult to read and almost laugh-out-loud funny, as Buchanan was once a staunch anti-communist who served President Reagan as his communications director during the Cold War. Buchanan’s opposition to the Evil Empire, as Reagan correctly called it, has given way to an unseemly embrace of former Soviet KGB colonel Vladimir Putin, the virtual dictator of Russia who served the “Evil Empire” for decades.

(Excerpt) Read more at aim.org ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: dupes; putin; russia
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1 posted on 07/19/2014 9:03:23 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

How does Buchanan defend this? Is the article an inaccurate hit-piece or does Buchanan really have these views? If so, are we witnessing mental deterioration?


2 posted on 07/19/2014 9:06:31 AM PDT by SamAdams76
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To: SamAdams76

It’s real, here’s Buchanan’s article:

http://www.wnd.com/2014/04/is-god-now-on-russias-side/


3 posted on 07/19/2014 9:15:05 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

That’s what I find so disconcerting about the “Putin is the Savior of Christianity”-angle. If you scratch underneath the surface, he’s only interesting in saving the Russian Orthodox Church as a political tool. Other Christian faiths? He couldn’t care less about them.


4 posted on 07/19/2014 9:16:03 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: SamAdams76

This is a tough one. The author I believe is correct in his overall impression of Buchanan, however he goes off into looney cazoony land through much of the article. My impression of Buchanan is that he does get pulled in by authoritarians who use religion as part of their schtick, Franco, Putin, etc. But the author hurts his case by bringing in all the nutcase stuff, thus the author comes off as a lunatic.


5 posted on 07/19/2014 9:17:00 AM PDT by gusty
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans
I'm bummed out. Pat Buchanan seemed so much smarter when I was younger. Now he appears to be drooling and it's time for the men in white suits to put him in a wheelchair and take him to a quiet place.

It sucks getting older. I wish I could go back to 1980, knowing what I know now.

6 posted on 07/19/2014 9:18:19 AM PDT by SamAdams76
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To: gusty

Yes, I saw the last half of the article. Crazy stuff. That’s why I asked if what was said about Buchanan was true.


7 posted on 07/19/2014 9:19:11 AM PDT by SamAdams76
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To: gusty
But the author hurts his case by bringing in all the nutcase stuff, thus the author comes off as a lunatic.

Are you referring to the Alexander Dugin occult bits? He is not inventing this information from a conspiracy site..

8 posted on 07/19/2014 9:19:57 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Only Hussein Obama could make Putin look tolerable.


9 posted on 07/19/2014 9:20:10 AM PDT by boycott
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Yeh, all that wizards and warlocks stuff I tend not to believe. I could be wrong, but that’s just me.


10 posted on 07/19/2014 9:24:51 AM PDT by gusty
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To: gusty
You are misunderstanding the author. He is not talking about real wizards and warlocks. He is talking about the occultism of Russia's "National Bolsheviks," who are open with their extreme views.

You might find this article more credible, posted here:

Dugin’s Evil Theology - His Eurasianism is a satanic cult

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3170930/posts

11 posted on 07/19/2014 9:28:14 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

I’m with you guys. President Obama told me to hate Putin, so I hate Putin.

...not sure why, though.


12 posted on 07/19/2014 9:33:13 AM PDT by BobL
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To: BobL
I’m with you guys. President Obama told me to hate Putin, so I hate Putin.

...not sure why, though.

I doubt you know much of anything, to be honest.

13 posted on 07/19/2014 9:34:25 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

“I doubt you know much of anything, to be honest.”

Well if you can give me a reason to hate Putin, other than Obama says so, I might just start hating him.


14 posted on 07/19/2014 9:37:31 AM PDT by BobL
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Did a little looking and around, and you should not worry too much about this dude. He recently attacked Putin as being too soft, and got fired from his job. I will give the author some slack on this, he wrote the article a few months ago. However, I tend to use Occam’s Razor on these matters, look to the obvious instead of dark forces working from the shadows.


15 posted on 07/19/2014 9:37:47 AM PDT by gusty
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To: BobL
I’m with you guys. President Obama told me to hate Putin, so I hate Putin.

I see what you did there. Anyone who disagrees with you agrees with Obama. Pure genius.

16 posted on 07/19/2014 9:46:12 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: BobL

You have a brain and two eyes in your head don’t you?


17 posted on 07/19/2014 9:46:37 AM PDT by sam_whiskey (Peace through Strength)
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To: gusty
Did a little looking and around, and you should not worry too much about this dude. He recently attacked Putin as being too soft, and got fired from his job.

The one mistake in the article is to focus too much on Dugin, when, actually, he is an ideologist and a leader, yes, but only part of a larger movement. He was replaced by Vladimir Zhirinovsky, who wants to deport the Jews and encourages his aids to rape "anti-Russian" journalists.

Other guys like Sergei Kurginyan and his "Essence of Time" weirdo movement are still around too.

Dugin was let go because he was getting too much attention from the media, and had become the subject of books, hence undermining the Russian war effort in Ukraine. If Putin did not want Dugin around, he would have him arrested too like he ordinarily would.

18 posted on 07/19/2014 9:49:14 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: 1rudeboy

“I see what you did there. Anyone who disagrees with you agrees with Obama. Pure genius.”

I’m still pressed to find a reason to hate Putin...all that I hear here is that I’m stupid for not hating him. Maybe there are good reasons...somewhere.


19 posted on 07/19/2014 9:49:46 AM PDT by BobL
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To: sam_whiskey

“You have a brain and two eyes in your head don’t you?”

I’m still looking for examples. I’m open-minded.


20 posted on 07/19/2014 9:50:43 AM PDT by BobL
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To: BobL

Why should you “press” yourself. That would be too hard. And you know Barry hates Putie, that should be enough.


21 posted on 07/19/2014 9:51:34 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: BobL
Well if you can give me a reason to hate Putin, other than Obama says so, I might just start hating him.

Well, he is a mass murderer who routinely has his political opponents or opposition journalists beaten and even killed. He is slowly creating an overt dictatorship over Russia. He is persecuting non-Russian Orthodox forms of Christianity in Russia (because the ROC is under the Kremlin's control, and the others are not). He is a supporter of communist countries and movements across the world. He is a supporter of Neo-Nazi organizations like Hungary's Jobbick and others, giving them both overt and covert assistance. He is helping Iran get nukes. And so on and so forth.

22 posted on 07/19/2014 9:52:30 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

If we ever out law Queer marriage in this country and quit exterminating babies , quit making tax payers pay for contraceptives for some one else then maybe we can question Pat Buchanan’s motive.


23 posted on 07/19/2014 9:55:17 AM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Don’t be a hater!


24 posted on 07/19/2014 9:57:08 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: ravenwolf

Russia has the highest abortion rate in Europe, and there is rampant homosexual rape in their military, not to mention alcoholism and drug abuse among the people.

That’s why Putin’s “Christian” sentiments are just rhetoric aimed at conservatives and other traditionalists across Europe. Russia is building a coalition of far left and right wing parties across the world, and this rhetoric is part of it.


25 posted on 07/19/2014 9:57:52 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: ravenwolf

Some folks aren’t concerned about our own country burning to the ground around us. They’re more interested in fighting a Russia on Russia war at the behest of the EU.


26 posted on 07/19/2014 9:59:14 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin.)
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To: cripplecreek
Some folks aren’t concerned about our own country burning to the ground around us. They’re more interested in fighting a Russia on Russia war at the behest of the EU.

During Reagan's time we had domestic problems too, but that didn't stop us from dealing with the evil empire.

This mentality is part of the Libertarian taint on the conservative movement. Isolationism is just a different path to suicide.

27 posted on 07/19/2014 10:01:35 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Obama is slowly creating an overt dictatorship over America. He is persecuting all forms of Christianity in America. He is a supporter of communist countries and movements across the world. He is a supporter of facist Muslim organizations like Gaza’s Hamas and others, giving them both overt and covert assistance. He is helping Iran get nukes. And so on and so forth.


28 posted on 07/19/2014 10:04:37 AM PDT by keat
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To: gusty
However, I tend to use Occam’s Razor on these matters, look to the obvious instead of dark forces working from the shadows.

Another comment here I forgot to make. The dark forces thing was a discussion from some other writer (actually, it is a literature paper tracing occultism in Russian popular culture), if you click the link. The U.S. has occultism in our popular culture pretty heavy too, to be fair, but the overall point was that Russia is hardly a Christian paradise; and, two, their occultism is even creepier and scarier than ours, insomuch that it is a view held by people in positions of influence, of which Dugin was only one.

I think it would be a stretch to go from this to a "satanic conspiracy." But the comparison between Russia and these mystical nationalists with their interest in "volkish" religions, and Nazi Germany and Hitler's interest in the same, is worth considering when thinking about the route Russia is going in as a country.

Bottom line: Do not believe the stupidity about Russia becoming a Christian empire.

29 posted on 07/19/2014 10:05:50 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: keat
Obama is slowly creating an overt dictatorship over America. He is persecuting all forms of Christianity in America. He is a supporter of communist countries and movements across the world. He is a supporter of facist Muslim organizations like Gaza’s Hamas and others, giving them both overt and covert assistance. He is helping Iran get nukes. And so on and so forth.

Here's another problem I have with you guys: Why is it that we are forced into this false dilemma between one scumbag and another?

30 posted on 07/19/2014 10:07:07 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

I wasn’t talking to you coward.


31 posted on 07/19/2014 10:07:50 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans; BobL

So, BobL, now I’m curious-

Which of the issues he outlined here do you take issue with? Or does it take more than the above to warrant your scorn?


32 posted on 07/19/2014 10:08:32 AM PDT by sam_whiskey (Peace through Strength)
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To: keat

So basically he’s kind of cut from the same cloth as Putin. Why do I have to like either one?


33 posted on 07/19/2014 10:10:33 AM PDT by sam_whiskey (Peace through Strength)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

“Well, he is a mass murderer who routinely has his political opponents or opposition journalists beaten and even killed.”
Obama sicks our spy agencies on journalists, no difference as far as the effect of losing impartial journalism goes. (obviously worse to kill enemies, though)

“He is slowly creating an overt dictatorship over Russia.”
What do you think the IRS scandal is about?

“He is persecuting non-Russian Orthodox forms of Christianity in Russia.”
Not good, but I haven’t seen any stories to that effect, but I have seen a story that said Jews have it better there than since the czars (still not great, but better than before).

“He is a supporter of communist countries and movements across the world.”
So is our president and our Democrat Party, particularly in the 1980s, but still to this day.

“He is a supporter of Neo-Nazi organizations like Hungary’s Jobbick and others, giving them both overt and covert assistance.”
I don’t know enough there...I would like to know both sides of that.

“He is helping Iran get nukes. And so on and so forth.”
Not too hot on the nukes, but he actually was working with us to slow things down...until we blamed him for the plane crash.


34 posted on 07/19/2014 10:11:00 AM PDT by BobL
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

“Buchanan argues that Putin is a Christian and Russia is now a Christian nation. “

No, he doesn’t. I’m not a Buchanan fan, but reading his original piece, it’s clear that he’s saying that Putin is USING Christianity and portraying himself & Russia as strong believers in Christianity.

btw - this ia all 3 1/2 months old.


35 posted on 07/19/2014 10:12:07 AM PDT by nuconvert ( Khomeini promised change too // Hail, Chairman O)
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To: cripplecreek

Some folks aren’t concerned about our own country burning to the ground around us. They’re more interested in fighting a Russia on Russia war at the behest of the EU.


Right.


36 posted on 07/19/2014 10:16:36 AM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: BobL
I’m still looking for examples. I’m open-minded.

Well Putin has just given you about 300 more examples of why your admiration for him is misplaced. A lot of those 300 examples were children or infants. Every one of them was innocent.

See, it's just plain wrong to shoot down commercial airliners. It's evil. And, because that's wrong and evil, it's wrong and evil to place rockets capable of downing commercial airliners in the hands of incompetents who might foreseeably use them to down commercial airliners. What Putin has done here is totally incompetent. And, nothing that he is saying now suggests that he has any regrets about what he's done or that he has any clue as to how to competently handle the ugly scar that his incompetence in Ukraine has produced.

Putin is a thug and a jerk. He's totally screwed up the Russian economy with his incompetent policies in Russia and now he's spreading his incompetence to neighboring countries and, as might be predicted, he's now screwing up their countries, too.

But, for now, forget about Putin's serial incompetence and just concentrate for the next day or two on the 300 new examples that he has provided for your consideration. There is nothing admirable about the man.

37 posted on 07/19/2014 10:19:46 AM PDT by Tau Food (Never give a sword to a man who can't dance.)
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To: BobL

The old moral equivalence argument rears its’ ugly again, only this time from people supposedly on our side. Disheartening, to say the least...


38 posted on 07/19/2014 10:21:16 AM PDT by sam_whiskey (Peace through Strength)
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To: Tau Food

I hate to say it, but we’ve given some PRETTY DECENT hardware to terrorists in Syria (against Putin’s advice)...once they get that moved into position, we might not like the results either.


39 posted on 07/19/2014 10:22:33 AM PDT by BobL
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To: sam_whiskey

ugly head


40 posted on 07/19/2014 10:22:58 AM PDT by sam_whiskey (Peace through Strength)
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To: sam_whiskey

“The old moral equivalence argument rears its’ ugly again, only this time from people supposedly on our side. Disheartening, to say the least...”

I hear you. Pretty sad.


41 posted on 07/19/2014 10:23:07 AM PDT by BobL
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Russia is building a coalition of far left and right wing parties across the world, and this rhetoric is part of it.


If it is all true and not just propaganda it has already caught on in this country, our fight is not with Russia it is with the corruption in our own Government.


42 posted on 07/19/2014 10:24:25 AM PDT by ravenwolf
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Putin and the Russian Orthodox Church are as Christian as the anti-Christ, Pat needs better meds.

There is mounting evidence that the Russian govt is involved in organized human sex trafficking. As for some of other claims in article, too strange to comment on, but wouldn’t put anything past Putin and his fellow oligarths.


43 posted on 07/19/2014 10:28:28 AM PDT by free_life (If you ask Jesus to forgive you and to save you, He will.)
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To: BobL
I hate to say it, but we’ve given some PRETTY DECENT hardware to terrorists in Syria (against Putin’s advice)...once they get that moved into position, we might not like the results either.

I see. Your defense of Putin is that someday it may be shown that other people have made similar mistakes.

I think you need to examine for yourself why you have the hots for a proven incompetent like Putin. He's given you lots to think about.

44 posted on 07/19/2014 10:29:07 AM PDT by Tau Food (Never give a sword to a man who can't dance.)
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To: Tau Food

“Your defense of Putin is that someday it may be shown that other people have made similar mistakes.”

Yep...we are giving arms to people that at least as bad. Fortunately for us airliners are not typically flying in missile range of those weapons.

We have NOTHING to be proud of.


45 posted on 07/19/2014 10:30:54 AM PDT by BobL
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

Prior and up to the 2000 election, I supported Pat Buchanan. His view that the border was going to be the undoing of the United States resonated with me. I had been coming to the same conclusion since the early 1990s. I thought we must either come to grips with the issues of illegal immigration and what I termed destructive immigration, or we were going to lose our nation.

Here we are today. Who can argue with Buchanan’s and my views on immigration now? Illegals, Islamic peoples, the flooding of towns across America with tens of thousands of people from unique and polar opposite cultures...

Sadly, after 2000 it has been my observation that Buchanan has suffered from a sort of unwinding. He has made a number of unfortunate extrapolations that I disagree(d) with.

This commentary is somewhat of a good example of what I am talking about.

Let’s look at these several comments, or quotes.

- - - - -

This writer was startled to read in the January-February newsletter from the social conservative World Council of Families in Rockford, Ill., that, of the “10 best trends” in the world in 2013, No. 1 was “Russia Emerges as Pro-Family Leader.”

In 2013, the Kremlin imposed a ban on homosexual propaganda, a ban on abortion advertising, a ban on abortions after 12 weeks and a ban on sacrilegious insults to religious believers.

- - - - -

Tell me which of us would disagree with these moves. None the less, in life we come to realize that people are multi-faceted. They can do things that are seemingly good one moment, and at the same time do things that are terrible the next.

I don’t read Putin as the great guy some folks do. I don’t read his actions in Crimea or the Ukraine to be pro family. They are pro-Putin in my estimation. The guy seems dedicated to elevated nationalism. My read of this is that he needed accolades reserved for those who exemplify a deep seated love of Mother Russia, and Russians in general.

Due to Putin’s actions, there has been a destabilization in the region. A border conflict is simmering. It wasn’t before. Russian sympathizers are militarized inside the Ukraine. Now even airliners flying over in excess of 30,000 feet are subject to shoot-down.

There was a time when I could respect Putin even if he did have a sordid past. Those days are long gone now. I don’t respect world leaders who don’t respect other nation’s borders. I don’t even respect our own leaders who don’t respect our own borders. Why would I respect Putin?

Buchanan winds up asking whose side God is on now? I think He is on all of humanity’s side. Those who know Him and seek to live Christian lives, are living in accordance with his wishes. I have no doubt there are many in Russia who fall into this category. Good for them.

I’m not buying the idea that Putin is doing God’s will, so the question Buchanan wants us to ponder, is one that can have only one conclusion in my estimation. Putin sealed his fate on the answer earlier this year. That’s a shame really. None the less, it is reality.

Buchanan’s question answers itself, and I’m not convinced Buchanan sees it.


46 posted on 07/19/2014 10:37:17 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (Think how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are stupider than that.)
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To: BobL

So basically Putin is a good leader because Obama is a bad leader, huh? Brilliant!

Putin sponsors our enemies including jihadists but you can overlook that in your love affair with him.

Do some research on the evangelical church in Russia under Putin and his cohorts in the Russian Orthodox Church, it is damming!

And stop making excuses for this puke Putin, you sound like that idiot on MSNBC.


47 posted on 07/19/2014 10:42:14 AM PDT by free_life (If you ask Jesus to forgive you and to save you, He will.)
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To: BobL
We have NOTHING to be proud of.

There are hundreds of millions of Americans who disagree with you.

But, you may be on to something in terms of your understanding your warm feelings for an incompetent jerk like Putin. Other than the fact that Putin is opposing the USA, I don't hear you providing any reasons for those warm feelings. There always seem to be a few folks who at the first sign of trouble rush to embrace and defend our opponents.

48 posted on 07/19/2014 10:43:07 AM PDT by Tau Food (Never give a sword to a man who can't dance.)
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To: ravenwolf

Our fight is with both. Why let one of these two enemies continue unopposed, your statement makes no sense if you are serious about protecting this nation.


49 posted on 07/19/2014 10:45:08 AM PDT by free_life (If you ask Jesus to forgive you and to save you, He will.)
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To: cripplecreek
I wasn’t talking to you coward.

Oh, sorry, you must have been talking to your navel, you bootlicking Putinista.

50 posted on 07/19/2014 10:52:22 AM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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