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As nations seek more MH17 access, rebels reportedly getting impatient
CNN ^ | July 2014 | Jason Hanna and Jethro Mullen

Posted on 07/26/2014 4:25:22 AM PDT by Uncle Chip

Even as investigators say they need more access to bodies and wreckage from last week's Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 crash in eastern Ukraine, the pro-Russian rebels that control the territory say they're tiring of having any probe there, a spokesman for a monitoring group said Friday.

With the site still not secure eight days after the crash, and victims' remains still lying with debris, nations such as Netherlands are pressing to send their own police and investigators to the scene. Various negotiations are under way.

But rebels controlling the area -- the same rebels that Ukraine and the United States accuse of downing the plane and killing the 298 people aboard -- hinted to an international monitoring group that they've nearly had enough, even with the small amount of investigators they've already let in.

"We were given the indication ... that their patience is almost wearing out," said Michael Bociurkiw, a spokesman for the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe, which has had a small team touring the site for days. "They're saying maybe another week and then they don't know what would happen."

That's not likely to please a number of nations that say a proper investigation still hasn't begun, including Netherlands, whose officials say they're negotiating with the Ukrainian government to send 40 Dutch military police to search for more bodies....

On Friday, the OSCE team again toured the crash site, returning to a recently discovered section of fuselage from the plane. This time -- unlike Thursday -- victims' passports and other documentation were there, Bociurkiw said.

"We can't draw any conclusions. But for sure, those were not there the last time we were there," he said. "Perhaps someone placed it there. We don't know" ...

(Excerpt) Read more at edition.cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: mh17

1 posted on 07/26/2014 4:25:22 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip
Like I said earlier, a real President would have gotten Ukraine's assent and then sent the First or Second Marine Expeditionary Force to secure the disaster perimeter. We would have made it plain that they were there to secure the site for investigation but they would generously return fire in kind if fired upon.

No real President, though.

2 posted on 07/26/2014 4:50:13 AM PDT by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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To: Uncle Chip

CNN nothingburger agitprop

http://thelibertybeat.com/anti-propaganda-law-repealed-state-department-free-to-broadcast-directly-to-americans/


3 posted on 07/26/2014 4:55:14 AM PDT by dforest
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Ukraine: Rebels Have Taken All Plane Crash Bodies [July 20th]

Associated Press journalists saw the pro-Russia rebels putting bagged bodies onto trucks at the crash site Saturday in rebel-held eastern Ukraine and driving them away.

On Sunday morning, AP journalists saw no bodies at the crash site and emergency workers were searching the sprawling fields only for body parts. No armed separatists were seen at the site.

Ukrainian Emergency Ministry spokeswoman Nataliya Bystro said Sunday that recovery workers in the rebel-held territory had been laboring under duress and were forced to give the bodies to the armed gunmen.

“Where they took the bodies — we don’t know,” Bystro told The Associated Press.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/ukraine-russia-helping-destroy-crash-evidence-24631209

The Russian-backed rebels took away and kept atleast 38 bodies from the scene to a morgue in Donetsk to remove the shrapnel from them, and now appear to be bringing bodies back and salting the crime scene with them.


4 posted on 07/26/2014 5:00:18 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Chainmail

It’s not the US President’s call.

It’s the call of those who had citizens on the plane — the Netherlands, Australia, Malaysia, Britain, Indonesia ...

That’s why their Prime Ministers of those countries are taking the lead and sending troops to get their citizens back out of the grubby hands of the Russian-backed rebels.

The only US citizen on the plane was a dual citizen with the Netherlands.


5 posted on 07/26/2014 5:05:09 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: dforest

Looking for another status upgrade???


6 posted on 07/26/2014 5:05:51 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip

Seems you are. LOL

Is it lonely in there?


7 posted on 07/26/2014 5:06:35 AM PDT by dforest
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To: dforest

I laugh —

There isn’t anything in that story that is in the least bit debatable and yet you take issue with it.

You are so predictable —


8 posted on 07/26/2014 5:22:12 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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The reason for the Australian and Dutch troops to be sent in is that we are 10 days into this international crime and we still have this:

“The band of inexperienced Kalashnikov-wielding recruits in charge in this corner of Ukraine has refused access to international forensic experts.”

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2706513/MH17-dead-remain-crash-site-nine-days-tragedy.html#ixzz38ZqE39Li


9 posted on 07/26/2014 5:32:31 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip

True, nothing debatable, just nothing at all.

Actually, you should be more upset that Obama got rid of propaganda laws.

Not many people know about it.


10 posted on 07/26/2014 5:32:52 AM PDT by dforest
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More than a week after Malaysian Airlines Flight 17 came down in eastern Ukraine, Malaysian investigators have not yet been able to access the entire crash site, Malaysia’s Prime Minister Najib Razak said Saturday....

A statement from Najib’s office said that since a deal was struck with the rebels on access to the crash site, a team of three Malaysian investigators has visited on three separate occasions, on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. Each visit lasted about three hours, and the team was not able to visit all of the very large site.

The team believes that at least 30 investigators would be needed to cover the entire site, in addition to themselves, three Dutch investigators and one representative of the independent ICAO (International Civil Aviation Organization) allowed in so far, the statement said....

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/07/26/world/europe/ukraine-malaysia-airlines-crash/index.html


11 posted on 07/26/2014 5:39:10 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: dforest
Obama got rid of propaganda laws.

Well -- that should make your job easier.

12 posted on 07/26/2014 5:41:41 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip
It was a US-built plane. The country of origin of an aircraft has the responsibility to determine the cause of a US-built aircraft's loss. We are also principal members of NATO and ASEAN whose member nations lost citizens. We are also the best and most requested experts on aircraft crash forensics.

Lastly, we are the leaders of the Free World. We cannot depend on the humanity of the Russians or the Russian-backed thugs in Ukraine to secure the site or preserve evidence or to recover remains. We lead or no one does.

Has it been so long since we had an actual government that you don't remember?

13 posted on 07/26/2014 5:53:45 AM PDT by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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To: Chainmail

<>The country of origin of an aircraft has the responsibility to determine the cause of a US-built aircraft’s loss.<>

Nope — Did you miss the MH370 incident???

International law gives the responsibility for a “crash” investigation to:

1] First — the nation whose plane it is — in both cases it was Malaysia and thus Malaysia took the lead in both cases.

Note that the orange boxes were handed to the Malaysians and they handed them to the Brits who they chose to investigat them.

2] Second — the nation upon whose ground the plane plopped — in this case it is Ukraine who signed an agreement to defer those rights of investigation to the Netherlands and they now are involving the Aussies.

Boeing’s involvement is an assist to the official investigation — not to take the lead.


14 posted on 07/26/2014 6:07:34 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Chainmail

For what reason would the US President try to insert American troops into the Ukraine? There were no US citizens on board that I am aware of. Nothing about this incident threatens US security interests. We have no business getting involved other than as part of the UN or lending moral support to the Europeans. They need to handle this one.


15 posted on 07/26/2014 8:49:22 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose o f a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: Georgia Girl 2

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3185109/posts

Well, Joe Biden’s son wants to get crackin’ in East Ukraine to extend the ill gotten Biden fortunes.

He really needs those pesky “other guys” to go away.


16 posted on 07/26/2014 8:57:54 AM PDT by dforest
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To: Uncle Chip

They’re getting impatient? If we had a real President he’d announce that those thugs have 24 hours to vacate the area and turn over every scrap of wreckage they possess or the US Air Force would pound their positions into dust.


17 posted on 07/26/2014 8:58:22 AM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Lurker
If we had a real President he’d announce that those thugs have 24 hours to vacate the area and turn over every scrap of wreckage they possess or the US Air Force would pound their positions into dust.

Fortunately, we don't have a President this stupid.

18 posted on 07/26/2014 9:04:27 AM PDT by Drew68
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To: Drew68

We invaded a country and hunted down its leadership until they were all dead over a failed assassination on a former President.

Here we have a hideous case of mass murder by a bunch of drunken thugs backed up by Russian special forces and illegally transferred weapons. Tell Putin we pushed the “reset” button again.

If every scrap of wreckage and every last body isn’t in the hands of investigators within 24 hours Russia will be cut off from the international banking system until they comply. Let’s see how long he lives when his gangster buddies can’t access their money.

L


19 posted on 07/26/2014 9:10:14 AM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Lurker
We invaded a country and hunted down its leadership until they were all dead over a failed assassination on a former President.

A war with Russia would look nothing like war with Iraq did. People in this country have been conditioned to believe that "America at war" means a minuscule percentage of the population goes off to fight in places most Americans couldn't find on the map while the rest of the nation goes about their day to day activities in comfortable oblivion.

War with Russia will be nothing like this. We bomb them, they'll bomb us right back. We sink their ships, they'll sink ours. We destroy their cities, ours will burn as well.

And for what? Because some drunken, ignorant, poorly-trained separatists in a country we care little about thought they were shooting a military cargo plane and took down a passenger liner that should've never been flying over them in them first place?

No thanks.

If every scrap of wreckage and every last body isn’t in the hands of investigators within 24 hours Russia will be cut off from the international banking system until they comply. Let’s see how long he lives when his gangster buddies can’t access their money.

Russia is entirely self-sufficient. Cut them off from international banking and they'll just keep building tanks. Sure, some of the nouveau-riche living in palatial apartments in Moscow might have to barter their Rolex wristwatches but if you think cutting them off from the international financial markets will cripple their ability to make war, guess again. They've been there, done that --and won.

20 posted on 07/26/2014 9:40:38 AM PDT by Drew68
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To: Uncle Chip

At the level this atrocity occurred, we are irresponsible if we don’t assume the lead with our allies. We are the only free nation with the combat power and the expeditionary capability of doing it.

You either forget our role in the world and our alliances or you agree with Obama that we should become a fifteenth rate power like Brazil or something.


21 posted on 07/26/2014 9:43:16 AM PDT by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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To: Chainmail

Who would you rather take the lead here???

Barack Obama or the Prime Ministers of the Netherlands and Australia???


22 posted on 07/26/2014 9:49:57 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip

Us. The Marine Corps was designed for this mission.. Putin might play games with the little guys but even he isn’t stupid enough to screw with the Corps.

Obama wouldn’t do it but a real President would. He wants this nation to take the back seat in the world. He has degraded and reduced our armed forces, he has trashed our standing and he has encouraged thugs all over the world.

It needs to stop.


23 posted on 07/26/2014 11:42:28 AM PDT by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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To: Uncle Chip
Upcoming "Separatist" announcement -

Unfortunately, blast from Kiev-Nazi explosion so strong, all gold fillings fly out of victims teeth.

24 posted on 07/26/2014 11:51:00 AM PDT by Dagnabitt (Amnesty is Treason. Its agents are Traitors.)
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To: Dagnabitt
Unfortunately, blast from Kiev-Nazi explosion so strong, all gold fillings fly out of victims teeth.

Strelkov's Defence of Donetsk fundraising goal is met --

25 posted on 07/26/2014 11:59:32 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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The Dutch aren’t sure how many bodies are now in the Netherlands, but in total 227 coffins carrying remains have arrived since the shuttle flights began on Wednesday.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/aap/article-2706718/MH17-coffins-met-grieving-relatives.html#ixzz38bYd7vTX

So 71 still missing and unaccounted for —


26 posted on 07/26/2014 12:34:38 PM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Drew68

Wouldn’t be going to war against Russia. They claim there are no Russian troops in eastern Ukraine. Putin can’t have it both ways.


27 posted on 07/26/2014 2:25:07 PM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Uncle Chip

Army will be accompanying the investigators from a couple of countries that aren’t paralyzed with fear of Putin.


28 posted on 07/26/2014 2:35:53 PM PDT by ansel12 (LEGAL immigrants, 30 million 1980-2012, continues to remake the nation's electorate for democrats)
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To: Chainmail

Actually the Marines were designed for the Navy, the Army was designed for and carries out these types of missions.


29 posted on 07/26/2014 2:37:20 PM PDT by ansel12 (LEGAL immigrants, 30 million 1980-2012, continues to remake the nation's electorate for democrats)
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To: ansel12

Aw Ansel! You have to stop being so funny! Coffee almost ran out of my nose withe your last comment...


30 posted on 07/26/2014 3:52:04 PM PDT by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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To: Chainmail

There isn’t anything funny about it, it is simply fact.


31 posted on 07/26/2014 4:12:28 PM PDT by ansel12 (LEGAL immigrants, 30 million 1980-2012, continues to remake the nation's electorate for democrats)
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To: ansel12
If you had spent more than a few minutes thinking about it, Ansel 'ol Buddy, you'd remember that the Marine Corps is the only service that can be directly deployed by the President for limited expeditionary missions for short periods of time. Beirut, Santo Domingo, the landings at Mogadishu (or Peking or Nicaragua or Port-au-Prince, if you're into history) are just some examples. The Marine Corps is configured specifically to be a pre-packaged, self-sustaining force in increments from a MEU (battalion-sized with air support and combat service support) up to MEF (Division plus air wing plus Service Support Group) with sufficient supplies for 60 days of operations.

Army doesn't do that and doesn't have that charter. They'd like to, but they don't.

Need to read more than comic books Ansel if you want to increase your knowledge of real-world capabilities.

32 posted on 07/26/2014 5:11:56 PM PDT by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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To: Chainmail

For FAA investigations?


33 posted on 07/26/2014 5:37:24 PM PDT by ansel12 (LEGAL immigrants, 30 million 1980-2012, continues to remake the nation's electorate for democrats)
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To: ansel12

In a foreign country, in a combat zone, sure.


34 posted on 07/26/2014 7:16:02 PM PDT by Chainmail (A simple rule of life: if you can be blamed, you're responsible.)
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