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New Report Details What 31 US Air Force Pilots Who Flew the F-35 Really Think
The National Interest ^ | August 6th, 2016 | John Venable

Posted on 08/06/2016 9:39:08 AM PDT by Mariner

Air Force Gen. Herbert “Hawk” Carlisle, commander of Air Combat Command, this week declared the F-35A fighter jet ready for combat. While many pundits and politicians have questioned the worth of this jet, the only people who know the ground truth are the pilots themselves.

A total of 174 U.S. pilots currently have been trained to fly Lockheed Martin’s F-35A Lightning II. The Heritage Foundation recently interviewed 31 of these former F-15C, F-15E, F-16C, and A-10 pilots. Each expressed a high degree of confidence in the F-35A, their new fifth-generation platform.

Here are nine insights gleaned from those conversations:

1. Even with developmental restrictions that limit the F-35A’s responsiveness and ability to maneuver, every U.S. fighter pilot interviewed would pick the F-35A over his former jet in a majority of air-to-air (dogfight) engagement scenarios they could face.

2. A former F-15C instructor pilot said he consistently beat his former jet in mock dogfights.

3. A former F-16C instructor—and graduate of the Air Force Weapons Instructor Course of “Top Gun” fame—said the jet is constrained on how tight it can turn (G-limited) now. But even so, the rudder-assisted turns are incredible and deliver a constant 28 degrees of turn a second. When the Air Force removes the restrictions, this jet will be eye watering.

4. Three former F-16CJ Wild Weasel instructor pilots, those tasked with attacking surface-to-air missile sites, said a single F-35A can find and attack SAM sites faster and more effectively than three F-16CJ fighters working together.

5. The F-35A’s radar effectively can shut down enemy fighter and surface-to-air radars without those adversaries becoming aware they are being electronically attacked. Coupled with stealth, this jet is all but invisible to enemy radars.

(Excerpt) Read more at nationalinterest.org ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aerospace; airmen; lockheed; usaf
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To: stylin19a
..deliver a constant 28 degrees of turn a second. When the Air Force removes the restrictions, this jet will be eye watering.

from a grunt...what does removing the restrictions actually mean ?


Lack of maneuvering capability has been a big down on the F-35 by it's trolls

One of the the best turning aircraft in the world is the F-16 (F-22 excepted) it has amazing initial turning and it can sustain that rate for longer than most

The red line for the F-16 turn rate is 28 degrees per second in a very small area of the flight envelope as is shown by the diagram below.

http://www.f-16.net/forum/download/file.php?id=20016&sid=8ca4fa8ecc41abf6e6f99b6e13477428&mode=view

The F-35 currently has the turn rate training wheels set to the red line for the F-16 of 28 degrees per second for F-16 parity, but it can do much more

The F-35 has superior sustained turn rate capability over the F-16 in many areas of the flight envelope and will be able do much more when the training wheels are removed.

So much for the story that the F-35 is non maneuverable pig.

BTW the obsolete Mig 21 can really give the F-16 a nasty surprise it the F-16 tries to engage it below 400 knots. Everything is relative and all designs are compromises.

41 posted on 08/06/2016 12:47:41 PM PDT by rdcbn ("There is no means of avoiding a final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alt)
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To: rdcbn

28 degrees sustained, with a higher AOA instantaneous capability is pretty f’ing good for a “bomb truck.” Add in the all aspect sensors, stealthy targeting sensors, and jamming capabilities of its radar and you have a pretty awesome machine.


42 posted on 08/06/2016 12:56:50 PM PDT by USNBandit (Sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: Afterguard

Well, when I was in the USAF, it was top gun for navy, and red flag for af.

Did it Change? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Navy_Strike_Fighter_Tactics_Instructor_program

Doesn’t seem so.


43 posted on 08/06/2016 12:58:40 PM PDT by ImaGraftedBranch (by reading this, you have collapsed my wave function. Thanks, pal.)
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To: USNBandit
28 degrees sustained, with a higher AOA instantaneous capability is pretty f’ing good for a “bomb truck.” Add in the all aspect sensors, stealthy targeting sensors, and jamming capabilities of its radar and you have a pretty awesome machine.


Truth

44 posted on 08/06/2016 1:04:58 PM PDT by rdcbn ("There is no means of avoiding a final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alt)
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To: ImaGraftedBranch

US Air Force[edit]

Since 1949, the United States Air Force has operated a similar training program at the United States Air Force Weapons School (formerly called the “United States Air Force Fighter Weapons School” and the “Aircraft Gunnery School”), and conducts large-scale tactical training exercises (see Red Flag) at Nellis Air Force Base, Nevada. Whereas the Navy’s Top Gun program is 9 weeks long, the US Air Force Weapons School program is five and a half months long. The program includes nearly every type of aircraft in the Air Force inventory as well as courses focused on intelligence, command and control, space and cyber operations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Navy_Strike_Fighter_Tactics_Instructor_program


45 posted on 08/06/2016 1:06:40 PM PDT by mad_as_he$$
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To: Afterguard

I am at NAS Fallon on a regular basis. Never seen anything other than Navy F-18’s of all versions and the F-16’s opponent squadron there.


46 posted on 08/06/2016 1:12:47 PM PDT by mad_as_he$$
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To: ASA Vet
...every U.S. fighter pilot interviewed would pick the F-35A over his former jet in a majority of air-to-air (dogfight) engagement scenarios they could face....

WTH does that really mean? That they'd pick the F-35 in 51% of possible dogfight scenarios?

Geeze louise, even Amazon provides the actual numbers that form the approval %ages.

47 posted on 08/06/2016 1:14:40 PM PDT by Covenantor (Men are ruled...by liars who refuse them news, and by fools who cannot govern. " Chesterton)
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To: rdcbn
We are also missing a slot below the A-10 that used to be filled by the OV-10 Bronco.

We need to pull our Broncos out of moth balls and refit and modernize them for some of the low intensity CAS functions the A-10 is doing but is over kill for. We can field 4 Broncos for the price of one A-10 which gives better coverage and a rapid response to break up the type of ambush attacks the Obama ROE invite.

You're right.
But given how the A-10 is having trouble with being too old (1972), the older OV-10 (1965) would have an even steeper uphill battle to bring back than that to keep the A-10.

48 posted on 08/06/2016 1:26:38 PM PDT by Edward.Fish
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To: rdcbn

Having only seen the public data, and flown a mock up sim about six years ago, my biggest concern concern, as a pilot, would be taking in all data available. My other concern is that with the lack of a HUD the helmet mounted display needs to be extremely accurate to avoid spatial disorientation issues. The Navy is working on a new flight control regime for landing the Super Hornet that would mitigate those issues, if applied to the Lightning II.


49 posted on 08/06/2016 2:24:36 PM PDT by USNBandit (Sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: ASA Vet

Thanks.


50 posted on 08/06/2016 2:24:48 PM PDT by carriage_hill ( Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading.)
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To: Mariner
I question the numbers on the Super Hornet, not the decision. A few years ago when the Growler buy happened I went to a brief where they stated additional aircraft had pushed the line price on the Super down below $60 million.

The Navy needs both, but that number stuck out to me as being a bit high. I have been out the business for 5 years, though.

51 posted on 08/06/2016 2:33:03 PM PDT by USNBandit (Sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: Edward.Fish

Reading thru that “Pace-Finletter MOU 1952”, I can smell politics at every move, and not for the benefit of America. Many thanks for the backgrounder on it.


52 posted on 08/06/2016 9:17:50 PM PDT by carriage_hill ( Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading.)
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To: CodeToad

Lots to lose if they don’t comply.


53 posted on 08/06/2016 9:19:01 PM PDT by carriage_hill ( Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading.)
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To: al baby

:)


54 posted on 08/07/2016 2:01:27 AM PDT by stylin19a
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To: stylin19a
from a grunt...what does removing the restrictions actually mean ?

The flight computer will only allow a maximum "G" load or roll rate... probably until all the planes are fielded and software updates are done.

If the balloon goes up, the software limits will be lifted and all of a sudden the pilots will be GLOC (G Loss Of Consciousness) or doing 3 rolls a second or spinning about the yaw axis to turn into the enemy. (I'm being facetious but you get the idea)

55 posted on 08/07/2016 6:44:00 AM PDT by hattend (Firearms and ammunition...the only growing industries under the Obama regime.)
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To: rdcbn; hattend

thanks.
does this mean it will be able to go faster @ 28 degrees ? or turn even tighter ? turn longer ? the wings shear off ?


56 posted on 08/07/2016 6:53:56 AM PDT by stylin19a
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To: stylin19a

Yes

Don’t know what the G-limit is on the airframe but it will be pushing it.


57 posted on 08/07/2016 7:00:06 AM PDT by hattend (Firearms and ammunition...the only growing industries under the Obama regime.)
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To: Mariner

Lies! All lies! This aircraft is a gold plated pig and will never amount to anything. Who are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes?


58 posted on 08/07/2016 11:51:18 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
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To: Yo-Yo

You forgot the sarcasm tag./s


59 posted on 08/07/2016 11:57:26 AM PDT by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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