Skip to comments.Come and Take Them
Posted on 10/06/2017 11:54:01 AM PDT by Kaslin
The idea that gun-control advocates don't want to confiscate your weapons is, of course, laughable. They can't confiscate your weapons, so they support whatever feasible incremental steps inch further toward that goal. Some folks are more considerate and get right to the point.
"I have never understood the conservative fetish for the Second Amendment," writes The New York Times' new-ish conservative columnist Bret Stephens today. Referring as a fetish to an inalienable right that has a longer and deeper history among English-speaking people than the right to free speech or the right to freedom of religion is an excellent indicator that someone probably hasn't given the issue serious thought.
I mean, Stephens isn't contending Americans shouldn't own five AR-15s. He's arguing that the state should be able to come to your house and take away your revolver or your shotgun or even your matchlock musket.
"From a law-and-order standpoint, more guns means more murder," writes Stephens, before pulling a narrowly catered statistic that ignores the vast evidence that the number of guns does not correlate with the murder or the crime rates. What studies often do is conflate gun homicides and suicides. If Stephens wants to argue that confiscation would lead to fewer suicides, he's free to do so. But he's also going to have to explain why countries with the highest suicide rates often have the strictest gun control laws. The fact is that despite a recent uptick in crime, since 1990, the murder rate has precipitously dropped -- including in most big urban centers -- while there was a big spike in gun ownership.
Then Stephens compares justifiable gun homicides -- shooting a felon while protecting one's home, etc. -- with unintentional homicides with a gun. After some back-of-the-napkin calculation, Stephens concludes that guns are useless as a means of personal protection. Anyone who's spent 10 minutes thinking about gun control understands there is no way to quantify how many criminals are deterred by the presence of guns, or how many, for that matter, are turned away in the midst of crime. Has anyone calculated how many non-gun-owning families are safer because their neighbors own firearms?
Without getting into the practicality of confiscating more than 300 million guns, it seems odd that someone would let murderers and madmen decide what inalienable rights we should embrace. It is almost humorous to hear someone advising you not to worry about domestic tyranny as he explains why the state should eradicate a constitutional right and confiscate your means of self-defense. But Stephens comes to the likely true conclusion that you can't stop random men from killing.
To his credit, Stephens refrains from comparing random madmen with those who kill in the name of a worldwide ideological movement that relies on terrorism as a political weapon. Though we can often do something to detect the latter, the FBI would not have stopped "Mohammad Paddock," in the same way they didn't stop Syed Rizwan Farook or Tashfeen Malik or Nidal Hasan or Omar Mateen.
But my favorite part of Stephens' column is when he asks: "I wonder what Madison would have to say about that today, when more than twice as many Americans perished last year at the hands of their fellows as died in battle during the entire Revolutionary War."
Setting aside the population scale, Stephens might not know that one of the reasons the Federalists, including Madison, opposed the Second Amendment was that they believed concerns over protections from federal government were overblown because there were so many guns in private hands that it was unimaginable any tyrannical army could ever be more powerful than the general public. Others, like Noah Webster, reasoned, "The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any bands of regular troops that can be, on any pretense, raised in the United States."
"Repealing the Amendment may seem like political Mission Impossible today," writes Stephens, "but in the era of same-sex marriage it's worth recalling that most great causes begin as improbable ones."
To troglodytes like myself, the writing of the Constitution and Bill of Rights was perhaps the greatest cause of the nation. Moreover, same-sex marriage was instituted by the courts. Repealing the Second Amendment is going to take a lot more heavy lifting. There are probably too many fetishists around to make it happy.
I'm one, too. As an American and a Jew descended from people who came here escaping both Nazism and communism, I'm OK with fetishizing the Second Amendment. As a person who can read history and contrast the 19th- and 20th-century history of America and Europe -- and about anywhere else -- I "get" the fetish. And when I read columns like the one Stephens wrote today, I definitely get it.
“”I have never understood the conservative fetish for the Second Amendment,”
As I keep telling people: just because you don’t understand doesn’t mean I’m wrong.
The fact that anyone would call a fundamental right a fetish tells me all I need to know about them.
I have never understood the conservative fetish for the Second Amendment,
At least he’s telling the truth for once.
I'm sure you could fill the Grand Canyon with things he's never understood.
“The idea that gun-control advocates don’t want to confiscate your weapons is, of course, laughable”
There is no doubt in my mind that if they could do so, Progressives would round us up and haul us off to camps.
But this time the “Jews” are armed.
there are an estimated 400,000,000 firearms in USA, depending on what reports you read... easily is actually well over half a BILLION, however, given how many unregistered firearms there are floating all over everywhere (and in nearly everyone’s home safes, too?)
no power on earth could disarm the American people even if the American people all suddenly decided to cooperate
which is definitely NOT gonna happen. Not in a million years.
The American people purchase or make firearms to defend
themselves and their families and neighbors. Nobody is gonna take that away, nobody. Anyone trying to do it will be engaged in that despicable immoral business for a VERY VERY short time. go fighre
Repeal the 16th and 17th Amendments.
is there a well-managed funeral or cemetery company or fund that we could invest in?
(if the commies try to steal our firearms, the funeral business is gonna BOOM! .. so to speak, ha!)
would make a spectacular investment
I have never understood the conservative fetish for the Second Amendment,
The RKBA is an issue that can and does transcend political groups.
I have known otherwise flaming liberals who were more RKBA than so-called “Golfers with Guns” on the right.
After 25+ years fighting in one fashion or another to protect (or, rather, RESTORE) the 2nd Amendment, I have come to a few conclusions:
1) The other side simply does not CARE what arguments we use, what statistics we throw at them, how you can prove this or that about the intent of the Founders or our history. They just want to ban guns, PERIOD.
2) They pay no attention to court cases that go against them - just look at how long it has been since the Heller decision, and DC is now first getting to establishing a (supposedly) reasonable set of procedures for getting a CHL.
3) They NEVER stop trying - any incremental victory that they can get, no matter how small or insignificant it appears to us, they will take. The “bump-fire” stock controversy that arose this week is a PERFECT example of this. “So, maybe 10,000 or 50,000 people have one of these things, and they aren’t accurate, and they might ruin your barrel, etc. - let’s throw them a bone to show how reasonable we are, then they won’t bother us again” - WRONG!!!!!!! They will take this victory, because it is actually HUGE for them. It will enshrine in law, and in the minds of the pols and people, that an inanimate object causes crime, and must therefor be controlled or banned. They ALWAYS push for more, they NEVER give up. They ask for 10, get 5, and then come back the following week or month for 25.
4. Any attempt to show that we are “reasonable” is not going to convince them of anything, it is not going to protect other aspects of the 2nd Amendment, and IS going to show us to be both foolish and weak - it shows that we can be rolled.
1. NEVER compromise with them, period! It accomplishes less than nothing.
2. Hit them back HARDER. The only thing that makes them back off is a threat to their lifestyle - threaten their seat in office credibly, and then they will leave you alone. Fear works. The only reason that NJ residents still have guns is that the NJ NRA played very dirty in the early and mid-’90s - I knew several of the key players, and they all told me that only threats (not of violence, of course, but to their livelihoods or reputations) worked. The ability to deliver the opposite - support or campaign contributions - helped to convince a lot of them.
This is a WAR - for the very soul of our country and, because we are the leader of the Free World, for our entire civilization. If the government treats us this badly when there are 400 million guns in our hands, how will they treat us when they have succeeded in whittling that number down to 10 million or less? What the Germans, Russians and Chinese experienced in the mid-20th Century at the hands of their governments awaits us if we lose our rights.
Fight them tooth and claw - give up nothing, EVER. Fight dirty...because, rest assured, the gun grabbers are doing the same - and that will pale into insignificance if they ever succeed.