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Kelly: In the face of such evil, pacifism is immoral
SeattleTimes ^ | 26 Sept. 2001 | Michael Kelly

Posted on 09/26/2001 8:39:21 AM PDT by flamefront

Pacifists are not serious people, although they devoutly believe they are, and their arguments are not being taken seriously at the moment. Yet, it is worth taking seriously, and in advance of need, the pacifists and their appeal.

It is worth it, first of all, because the idea of peace is inherently attractive; and the more war there is, the more attractive the idea becomes.

It is worth it, secondly, because the reactionary left-liberal crowd in America and in Europe has already staked out its ground here: What happened to America is America's fault, the fruits of foolish arrogance and greedy imperialism, racism, colonialism, etc., etc. From this rises an argument that the resulting war is also an exercise in arrogance and imperialism, etc., and not deserving of support. This argument will be made with greater fearlessness as the first memories of the 7,000 murdered recede.

It is worth it, thirdly, because the American foreign policy establishment has all the heart for war of a titmouse, and not one of your braver titmice. The first faint, let-us-be-reasonable bleats can even now be heard: Yes, we must do something, but is an escalation of aggression really the right thing? Mightn't it just make matters ever so much worse?

Pacifists see themselves as obviously on the side of a higher morality, and there is a surface appeal to this notion, even for those who dismiss pacifism as hopelessly naive. The pacifists' argument is rooted entirely in this appeal: Two wrongs don't make a right; violence only begets more violence.

There can be truth in the pacifists' claim to the moral high ground, notably in the case of a war that is waged for manifestly evil purposes. So, for instance, a German citizen who declined to fight for the Nazi cause could be seen (although not likely by his family and friends) as occupying the moral position.

But in the situation where one's nation has been attacked — a situation such as we are now in — pacifism is, inescapably and profoundly, immoral. Indeed, in the case of this specific situation, pacifism is on the side of the murderers, and it is on the side of letting them murder again.

In 1942, George Orwell wrote, in Partisan Review, this of Great Britain's pacifists:

"Pacifism is objectively pro-Fascist. This is elementary common sense. If you hamper the war effort of one side you automatically help out that of the other. Nor is there any real way of remaining outside such a war as the present one. In practice, 'he that is not with me is against me.' "

England's pacifists howled, but Orwell's logic was implacable. The Nazis wished the British to not fight. If the British did not fight, the Nazis would conquer Britain. The British pacifists also wished the British to not fight. The British pacifists, therefore, were on the side of a Nazi victory over Britain. They were objectively pro-Fascist.

An essentially identical logic obtains now. Organized terrorist groups have attacked America. These groups wish the Americans to not fight. The American pacifists wish the Americans to not fight. If the Americans do not fight, the terrorists will attack America again. And now we know such attacks can kill many thousands of Americans. The American pacifists, therefore, are on the side of future mass murders of Americans. They are objectively pro-terrorist.

There is no way out of this reasoning. No honest person can pretend that the groups that attacked America will, if let alone, not attack again. Nor can any honest person say that this attack is not at least reasonably likely to kill thousands upon thousands of innocent people. To not fight in this instance is to let the attackers live to attack and murder again; to be a pacifist in this instance is to accept and, in practice, support this outcome.

As President Bush said of nations: a war has been declared; you are either on one side or another. You are either for doing what is necessary to capture or kill those who control and fund and harbor the terrorists, or you are for not doing this.

If you are for not doing this, you are for allowing the terrorists to continue their attacks on America. You are saying, in fact: I believe that it is better to allow more Americans — perhaps a great many more — to be murdered than to capture or kill the murderers.

That is the pacifists' position, and it is evil.

Michael Kelly's column appears regularly on editorial pages of The Times. The Washington Post Writers Group can be contacted via e-mail at writersgrp@washpost.com.



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With us or against us. The pacificist disingenuously says he or she is against all fighting -- the implicit support of terrorists is obvious except to them. Ask them what have they done to stop further attacks. Are they putting their bodies infront of the speeding airplane? Got that, phil donohue?

Pacifism is evil, by this logic.

1 posted on 09/26/2001 8:39:21 AM PDT by flamefront
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To: flamefront
As Granny always said: "Ain't nothing in the middle of the road but yellow lines and dead possums!"

The people should be supporting the people who are ensuring their freedoms!

2 posted on 09/26/2001 8:46:34 AM PDT by TrueBeliever9
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To: flamefront
Thanks, this was to me the most important part of this good article:

In 1942, George Orwell wrote, in Partisan Review, this of Great Britain's pacifists:

"Pacifism is objectively pro-Fascist. This is elementary common sense. If you hamper the war effort of one side you automatically help out that of the other. Nor is there any real way of remaining outside such a war as the present one. In practice, 'he that is not with me is against me.'"

As we see the organized efforts of the so called peace or Antiwar.com side, these simple words of Orwell should be a standard response to all of their treason attempts. This is how they stopped us in the Viet Nam war, which resulted in the slaughter of millions after we left Nam!

3 posted on 09/26/2001 8:48:14 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: flamefront
Pacifists like Phil Donahue take notice. You are with us, or you are with the terrorists.
4 posted on 09/26/2001 8:50:12 AM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer
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To: flamefront
What's that say about the religious in this country: priests, nuns, bishops, ministers, etc. It's a ridiculous slam at those who hold strong religious convictions to claim that they are therefore pro-terrorist.

bite me.

5 posted on 09/26/2001 8:52:32 AM PDT by WriteOn
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To: flamefront
It's easy to be a pacifist in a country sworn to protect you from violence.
6 posted on 09/26/2001 8:53:55 AM PDT by jimkress
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To: flamefront
Well written.
7 posted on 09/26/2001 8:54:45 AM PDT by VA Voter
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To: flamefront
If you are for not doing this, you are for allowing the terrorists to continue their attacks on America. You are saying, in fact: I believe that it is better to allow more Americans — perhaps a great many more — to be murdered than to capture or kill the murderers.

Well said. It is perhaps fortuitous that, if this attack had to come, that it came now and woke us up to the true danger of terrorism before they had weapons of mass destruction to use against us.

8 posted on 09/26/2001 8:56:25 AM PDT by Straight Vermonter
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Phil Donahue wasn't advocating pacifism, he was speaking out against indiscriminate bombing, and supports a cautious deployment of ground troops, if it must come to that.
9 posted on 09/26/2001 8:57:16 AM PDT by Egregious Philbin
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To: flamefront
Pacifism is evil, by this logic.

Yes, not only EVIL but COWARDLY too. Not necesarrily because those who expouse it are physical cowards--some may be, but others are not: but because it is MORAL COWARDICE that provides a convenient absolute that allows pacifists not only to avoid facing responsibility for their actions (or inaction), but to feel MORALLY SUPERIOR while doing so.

10 posted on 09/26/2001 8:57:56 AM PDT by Hugin
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To: flamefront
Kelly is pretty close here, I think. But...

Where a thoroughgoing pacifism really breaks down, in my opinion, is that it devalues human life. If the lives of one's own family, one's own neighbors and one's own countrymen are not worth fighting for, then what is. John Lennon was wrong, there are things worth living and dying for.

Of course, coming from the same liberal left that argues that a fetus is not a human, the pacifist's effort to further devalue human life is no big surprise.

Just a note here, because to be fair, I personally believe that a 'My country right or wrong' attitude is just as demeaning to human life because it places ideology over human life. Sometimes our country is flat wrong and that is why from time to time we must stand up and say so. But in this case, the wrong position, yes the immoral postion, for our country to take would be for us to do nothing. We must respond and we must respond with all the force that is necessary to take a stand for the 7,000 souls who died as victims of this terrible evil.

A failure to respond would be to say that those 7,000 people were really of no value. When the God of the universe died on a cross for those 7,000 people He made the ultimate statement regarding the value of human life. If we fail to act it may well be that we are denying Him.

11 posted on 09/26/2001 9:06:01 AM PDT by ObfusGate
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To: Egregious Philbin
Phil Donospew is a liberal pacifist idiot.... Is he your idol?
12 posted on 09/26/2001 9:12:03 AM PDT by ohioman
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To: basil,Gracey,TXBubba,groundhog,The Bat Lady,anymouse,jobshopper
To not fight in this instance is to let the attackers live to attack and murder again; to be a pacifist in this instance is to accept and, in practice, support this outcome.
13 posted on 09/26/2001 9:13:19 AM PDT by DrewsDad
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To: WriteOn
What's that say about the religious in this country: priests, nuns, bishops, ministers, etc. It's a ridiculous slam at those who hold strong religious convictions to claim that they are therefore pro-terrorist.

Sorry but this is quite a leap in logic. None of my friends who love Jesus think we should ignore this attack. They are differentiating between revenge and justice. Revenge is wrong. Justice is righteous.

bite me.

No thanks.

14 posted on 09/26/2001 9:14:12 AM PDT by DJ MacWoW
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To: ObfusGate
Well put.

Making the right decision requires action.

15 posted on 09/26/2001 9:15:00 AM PDT by flamefront
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To: DrewsDad
Pacifists like Jesus and Ghandi take notice. You are with us, or you are with the terrorists.
16 posted on 09/26/2001 9:16:03 AM PDT by Hidy
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To: ohioman
I can see you've really thought it through. I was watching O'Reilly last night, I heard what Donahue said, and I reported it. No amount of smear can change the fact that he advocated restraint, not out-and-out pacifism. Perhaps ignorance is your idol?
17 posted on 09/26/2001 9:17:53 AM PDT by Egregious Philbin
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To: Grampa Dave
By the way I just noticed after a long period of quiet Vicente Fox is now just referring to pacifism in his conditionalized support of the U.S.:
18 posted on 09/26/2001 9:18:59 AM PDT by flamefront
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To: flamefront
Excellent.
19 posted on 09/26/2001 9:20:13 AM PDT by boycott
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To: Hidy
Pacifists like Jesus and Ghandi take notice. You are with us, or you are with the terrorists.

Jesus never said one word about war, except that there would be "wars and rumors of war." His was not an earthly kingdom.

20 posted on 09/26/2001 9:31:06 AM PDT by sinkspur
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