Posted on 09/29/2001 5:12:17 AM PDT by foreverfree
A Web Site With the Inside Dope on the Middle East
by Sridhar Pappu and Gabriel Snyder
No matter how much President George W. Bush and Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld plead that their new war on terrorism will require a severe clampdown on media access, the public’s appetite for up-to-the-minute leaks and inside reporting shows no sign of abating.
Part of this is generational, of course. Lines like Mr. Rumsfeld’s “the Defense Department is not going to discuss operational issues” won’t cut it with an audience that got accustomed to hearing about grand-jury testimony as soon as it was given, blue Gap dresses and their stains, and admissions of affairs during allegedly closed police interviews.
But in this new battleground, it is natural to assume there will be new sources of inside dope. And in the days following the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon—and as the U.S. geared up for a military response—people have begun passing around a link to Debka.com, a crudely designed, Jerusalem-based Web site that offers Middle Eastern military, diplomatic and intelligence information far more detailed (and frightening) than what is offered by many news organizations. At its best, Debka.com reads like a tip sheet from the desert, from people who seem to know a lot more than Jeff Greenfield.
The Web site begins ominously, with one-line updates at the top of the page like “German KSK Commandos Dropped by Helicopter into Afghanistan Sunday Night, to Join U.S. and British Special Forces,” or “Russian Intelligence Officers Guide U.S. CommandosThrough Afghan Mountains Following Putin’s Offer of Cooperation.” Many of these “tips” offer little or no sourcing. Then there is a series of brief items of about 600 words or so, often sourced just to “Washington sources” or “Palestinian sources” or “Israeli intelligence sources.”
A lot of the material on Debka.com is just plain scary, the kind of stuff that makes you want to close your eyes and hide under your desk. On Sept. 14 there was an unattributed report of “an estimated 30 to 50 suicide killers … waiting inside the U.S. for their orders to strike.” And then there was another report (also unattributed) describing Osama bin Laden’s army as “not ragged rabble, but a well-drilled, dedicated Islamic legion of at least 110,000 zealots, raring to take on Western armies and unafraid of elite U.S. Delta, Rangers and Seals or British S.A.S. commandos descending on their strongholds.”
But on several occasions, Debka.com has beaten the Western media to information that has later shown up in U.S. newspapers. On Sept. 16, for example, the site was reporting that U.S. war planners were airlifting the 82nd and 101st Airborne to Pakistan, as well as contemplating a campaign into Iraq. This was reported before the Bush administration leaked that one of the hijackers may have been connected to Saddam Hussein.
As a result of information like this—and some pretty quick word-of-mouth in the U.S.—Debka.com has experienced a massive surge of traffic in the past two weeks. Since the Sept. 11 attacks, it has gone from 150,000 visitors a week to 250,000 per week, said Giora Shamis, one of the two Israeli journalists who run the site. (Mr. Shamis and his partner, Diane Shalem, also publish a weekly newsletter at $120 a year, which at the moment has 320 paying customers.) Debka.com claims its readers include American military and intelligence officials, as well as foreign correspondents covering the Middle East.
As for the veracity of Debka.com’s information, that is harder to assess. Considering how tight-lipped the Bush administration is being about its war plans—and the current level of rumor-mongering, paranoia and conflicting reporting—it’s tough to cross-check many stories about military planning.
But one Debka.com story that looked particularly prescient was its report on Saudi Arabian reluctance to allow the U.S. use of a major airfield as its central base of operations. On Sept. 22, when the Associated Press was moving a story headlined “Saudi Arabia, Turkey Cooperating in Anti-Terrorism Effort, Encouraging U.S. Officials,” Debka.com reported that Saudi Arabia had “refused to let the U.S. use the kingdom’s new combined air operations command center at Prince Sultan Air Base near Riyadh.” That refusal, the Web site said, would delay the beginning of the American offensive against Afghanistan. Indeed, two days later, on Sept. 24, The New York Times published a front-page story about problems the U.S. was having in getting permission to use the Saudi air base.
Mr. Shamis—who was born in Israel and says he’s worked as a military and intelligence reporter in the region since the 1970’s for daily papers and The Economist—said he started the site because of the circumspect nature of foreign-affairs reporting. Journalists covering international affairs often write their dispatches in the same cautious and euphemistic language as the diplomats they cover, Mr. Shamis said. Which is not to say their reports aren’t accurate, he added—it’s just that their messages are not always apparent to the average reader.
The Saudi Arabian story, he said, was a prime example. “With all due respect, The New York Times’ fragile, handle-with-care, approach on U.S.-Saudi relations has not changed in the last 10 years,” Mr. Shamis said. “Hinting and not telling may serve diplomatic purposes, but does not always satisfy the informed reader.”
Ms. Shalem, who was born in England, has lived much of her life in Israel working as a journalist for The Economist and other news organizations. She agreed with her partner’s assessment of foreign coverage: “I think [readers] are a lot more intelligent than they are given credit for being. And I think very often, people get very resentful when you patronize them. And we try not to do that.”
But what about the warnings from American officials? After all, Mr. Rumsfeld has, in his public comments, made revealing information tantamount to putting lives at risk. Mr. Shamis said the site’s received some calls and e-mails from readers in the American military or intelligence services to express concern. “And somebody from the American embassy here [in Israel] called us, concerned.”
Ms. Shalem added, “They are all very polite.”
Mr. Shamis said he’s not worried about publishing damaging information. “I think we have enough experience to put out information that will cause no harm to anybody,” he said. “Somebody might say, ‘Oh my God! They’re telling them the troops are in Tajikistan!’ But people who are in the field, they know it. It doesn’t mean the enemy doesn’t know it.”
So what is Debka.com’s mission in its dispatches from the murky world of intelligence and counterintelligence? The two reporters acknowledged a pro-Israeli bias. “Let’s put it this way,” Mr. Shamis said. “We are Israelis. So whatever bias is coming out of this, that is possible. It doesn’t mean that we are presenting and defending the official Israeli points of view, certainly. You can imagine that officials in Israel, the people who are in charge of whatever they call it, information or propaganda or whatever … they don’t like us very much.”
Prior to the Sept. 11 attacks, Debka.com was, according to a Google search, most popular among right-wing sites like WorldNetDaily.com, as well as Zionist supporters of Israel and, in a few cases, religious apocalyptics who, one supposes, wanted a real-time account of the Book of Revelation. And in any case, having an agenda does not necessarily mean that your information is always inaccurate. Just ask Matt Drudge about that blue Gap dress.
foreverfree
If Shamis has worked since the 70's in Israeli military and intelligence reporting, he has no doubt many contacts with 30 years of experience under his belt.
Something to keep an eye on, in my estimation.
Indeed, Ron...
I recently had a thread pulled because the source was DEBKA. It involved the reluctance of the Saudis to give us bases. A week later, it is pretty apparent that there was at least as much "fire" generating the "smoke" of that article as most of the "mainstream" press articles posted on here.
The thread nanny insisted I "prove" DEBKA was reliable before he or she would permit it. This attitude, as well as the chicken little approach towards military news stories is not producing ignorant terrorists. It is producing ignorant Freepers.
We have met the enemy and he is us.
What are you gonna say next, the Mossad attacked us?
Welcome to PixelPutz' world. Check my replies in the same thread for wasted breaths.
at least I don't quote from Hamas' TV station (see below). Anyone who trusts YOUR opinion needs to have their head examined - either you are a total dupe, or in the paid employ of Bin Laden.
Fox reported several months ago about Israeli spies in this country.
the link to this please? - I searched on foxnews.com - no dice - but if Israel (like France, England etc) spy on us like we spy on them (the cia has been training the plo for years), which of the two big words of "grow up" don't you understand? With jerks like you as friends, Israel SHOULD be worried that the US will sell them out.
Why would our "friends" need to spy on us? Why would they need to bug official phones IN OUR COUNTRY? !Everyone is the enemy, until they have sufficiently proven otherwise.
I am sure they are bugging your phone right now - every key that you press on the keyboard is being filtered through the JEW version of echelon!!!!! LOL.
Several news outlets reported than none of the Jewish people who worked in WTC showed up to work that day, and the reports were neatly brushed under the rug.
Here is the truth of the source of the LIE you bought into - which is it really, oh BiasedBios, should we just give you the benefit of the doubt that you have been duped in your rabid fear, or are you on the payroll - maybe you have just bought RIGHT IN TO WHAT BIN LADEN WANTS, TO SPREAD THE POISON THAT ISRAEL IS THE ROOT OF ALL OF AMERICA AND THE WORLDS PROBLEMS?
If we are not going to ELIMINATE the problem of Palestine, mainly Arafat, then Israel is an equal threat to peace.
oh, so NOW you agree that Arafat is the mother of all bin ladens and has to go - but it's up to you, President FlatusPLatus to decide how many more Jews should die, and if you don't will, it, then "Israel has to go>." Trust me, with a line like that your email probably IS being monitored...
I do not feel that we should take anyone's side all the time no matter what they allow to go on within their country. You have responded with lack of common sense once again, dip$hit.
blah blah blah. Stick to playing with postscript errors - what's the PS code that would overlay a watermark on your posts that reads "ignore my drivel"?
They have made no effort to diffuse the situation, only ensuring America's necessity to correct their mistakes over the last 30 years. Keep your head up your ass, then. I can see it has permanent residence there. All the Middle East is a threat, if they choose to participate in skirmishes back and forth, without getting to those responsible, then they are a threat to THIS country.
To hell with the idea that we should be held responible for their warring. I do not feel that we SHOULD be involved in the middle east at all, but since that issue has been forced, we should nuke the region and all those who sympathize with them. Put the bleeding hearts like you on the front line and see how many of the scum will defend ya!
All you can do is go from thread to thread, to follow me around, when nobody yanked yer chain. I had no comments directed to you, so piss off.
They have made no effort to diffuse the situation, only ensuring America's necessity to correct their mistakes over the last 30 years. Keep your head up your ass, then. I can see it has permanent residence there. All the Middle East is a threat, if they choose to participate in skirmishes back and forth, without getting to those responsible, then they are a threat to THIS country.
To hell with the idea that we should be held responible for their warring. I do not feel that we SHOULD be involved in the middle east at all, but since that issue has been forced, we should nuke the region and all those who sympathize with them. Put the bleeding hearts like you on the front line and see how many of the scum will defend ya!
All you can do is go from thread to thread, to follow me around, when nobody yanked yer chain. I had no comments directed to you, so piss off. If you would actually PAY ATTENTION to the news, rather than hide on the anonymous internet, you would have heard about the contracts on Bin-Laden's head (I'll bet he's really your illegitimate father). It seems to make you angry when I mention that all other countries are the enemy, and I believe our country is better and stronger. Therefore, you should look at what you have typed all weekend....seems that you are working for Bin-Laden and middle-eastern enemies.
Making "deals" with the terrorist only shows that they too must have something to gain through all the violence. Hearing them cry about it over and over, only to make deals, give up land, and compromise with terrorists leaves one to think they want event to continue just as they always have been for the last 30 years. Eliminate the threat, or the US should ELIMINATE YOU!
My other thoughts on the Jewish situation, although I believe the government would not publicly make statements of fighting with the Israeli's, if the Palestinians are not eradicated, the threat continues.
I care not about the plight of foreigners in other nations. I worry more about our own children being fed rather than children of our enemy. Our resources have been going overseas for ages, as we are the #1 donator of food and aid to the middle east, yet they continue to blame us for their own woes. Let them starve while killing each other over a scrap of worthless land. When they bring their trash to our shores, I think it should be pointed out that although Israel has showed the world that they can live amongst the enemy, they have DONE NOTHING to eliminate the threat and wipe out their enemy once and for all.
How many "peace talks" are they going to have with Arafat before they actually DO something. After 30 years, you would think these ignorant people would see the error of their ways. Either eradicate all palestinians or give up. Allowing bombing after bombing to occur is not how to prevent the same events from re-occurring. All terrorist groups originate from training in Palestine terror camps, which should have been the primary target. Arafat should have been assasinated before taking power. You cannot make peace with your enemies until you have brought them to their knees and they can no longer present a threat to peace.
Now that this activity may continue until my children or grandchildren come of age is the only thing that frightens me. I am not afraid to face the enemy or those who sympathize with them in this country.
However, the cowards do not fight. They only bomb and attack the ones who cannot defend themselves. If they refuse to control their own hostilities toward each other, then the problems should be dealt with. We nuked two cities in Japan for much less death, which was inflicted upon a military target.
because it was posted by Pravda and Hamas' news sites, and only you and a few dozen others in the US and millions of muslims bought into it - keep failing to retract your erroneous post, and you accidentally keep working FOR bin laden.
My other thoughts on the Jewish situation, although I believe the government would not publicly make statements of fighting with the Israeli's, if the Palestinians are not eradicated, the threat continues.
welcome to the club - now which part of which post by almost EVERY ISRAEL SUPPORTING FREEPER calling for the elimination of the PLO did you miss?
I think it should be pointed out that although Israel has showed the world that they can live amongst the enemy, they have DONE NOTHING to eliminate the threat and wipe out their enemy once and for all.
Tell it to Powell and Bush (here are their emails: secretary@state.gov, President@whitehouse.gov - 2 days ago Powell sent a letter to the Senate effectively killing a bill that wold have cut off $100 million in MORE US TAXPAYER FUNDED aid to Arafat - TO ARAFAT, who has received 900 million from the US so far. Today a guy asked the WH spokesman in the daily news conference why the US was handing out all this money to Arafat, and he repeated the same line with the same stupid grin on his face - "the WH is interested in all parties who are interested in peace in the ME," or some such crap.
As for the socialist moron Peres you showed in the pic, EVERY RW JEWISH FREEPER VILIFIES HIM. So, if you have a problem with Israel not going after Arafat, scream at Bush and Powell, who have decided to go along with clinton's policy that tolerating Arafat is necessary to appease the Saudis (and now out "allies" Iran, and Syria). Like I said, welcome to the club - but you may want to reconsider your hammering of the FReepers here who SHARE YOUR VIEWS.
How many "peace talks" are they going to have with Arafat before they actually DO something.
If you believe this in your heart, then go to the Kahane site where there are many who COMPLETELY AGREE WITH YOU, and are condemned by the US state department for it (and risk arrest in the US for supporting them, and risk death in Israel for same). (note this site is loading VERY slow today.)
And with all due respect, try and get your news on the Mideast from people who agree with you, not those who SUPPORT ARAFAT and BIN LADEN. Try Israel National News, the right wing pirate station that can't STAND Peres and his girlfriend Yasser (and barely tolerates Sharon's latest ambivalence), and try the Golan Shall Not Fall site, born out of the fight to keep Syrian terrorism at bay, and FILLED with solid intel and news. Or you could be reading and forwarding incisive essays by Christians and Jews on how Israel should be dealing with the terrorists who share the common goal of destroying the US and Israel at the Freeman Center, where many share your view that you can win their hears and minds when you have your enemy by the b@lls!
After 30 years, you would think these ignorant people would see the error of their ways. Either eradicate all palestinians or give up. Allowing bombing after bombing to occur is not how to prevent the same events from re-occurring. All terrorist groups originate from training in Palestine terror camps, which should have been the primary target. Arafat should have been assassinated before taking power. You cannot make peace with your enemies until you have brought them to their knees and they can no longer present a threat to peace.
You get three membership points - except you are off by 2 zeros - after 3000 years we have not figured it out that we are avoiding one of the biggest commands by G-d, to wipe out Amelek and his descendants, the terrorists who murdered our elderly and weak as we left Egypt. And if I posted this here as a separate thread, not in rejoinder/explanation, I would be (probably will be anyway) blasted as a racist, arab-hating, Kahanist war-monger. Get it now? Gentiles get to rain death and destruction on their enemies. But G-d help us Jews (here at FR or in real-time) if we do it on our own...
This was reported by MSNBC and other AMERICAN news services
welcome to the club - now which part of which post by almost EVERY ISRAEL SUPPORTING FREEPER calling for the elimination of the PLO did you miss?
What I am saying is if ISRAEL will not destroy their enemy and only encourage their enemy to drag the US into the fight, their loyaly to our country is in question. It has been more than 30 years and Israeli's keep playing the game. I have grown weary of those who expect us to take a stand in the country. I say ignore them all, if they are going to continue to play the cards delt to them by the palestinian "government". We should bring an entirely new deck full of ACES if we are to be involved. No diplomacy for barbarians, they only understand BOMBS and BULLETS. Any war which claims to be based on religion is a lie. Regardless if it be from Israel or Afganistan, any cease fire agreements which are not honored by either side, should be nuked...IMMEDIATELY! The other side would get the hint that we are not playing their game any more.
If you believe this in your heart, then go to the Kahane site where there are many who COMPLETELY AGREE WITH YOU, and are condemned by the US state department for it (and risk arrest in the US for supporting them, and risk death in Israel for same). (note this site is loading VERY slow today.)
I am suprised for you to mention agreement, after venting on me about how I should care about the plight of the poor people under the thumb of an oppressor. I think America took care of our problem, but unfortunately, other countries did not follow our example. Rather than admit they are wrong, they would rather destroy us from within, proving their point that their ideas are right.
I am unaware of the groups you mention, and am only able to give my perspective on the subject, from growing up in the time of the first airline hijakkings, and the escalation of such activity, rather than ridding the problem from the world forever.
I normally do not apologize for any views I have or any posts I make, but I do think it was tragic that you figured I was "anti-Jew" or racist by my statements. I cannot put much into these boxes, and try to clarify on replies. I would hope that you would challenge my points, rather than attack in the future.
I never cared much for the middle-east or the people I have met from the region. I always felt their best and brightest should be working on reforming their own governments rather than seek sanctuary here, and bringing the fight to our soil.
Please remember, I put this country FIRST, above all others, right or wrong. I back the government regardless if I do not like the situation (had to make an exception with Clintoon). I did not feel our former occupant of the White House was fit for Dog Catcher in Little Rock, but apparently there are those out there that would rather learn the hard way.
I don't believe that America should constantly stand guard over Israel when they pick a fight. What has been going on back and forth there in the last 30 years is a joke. If they are not going to eliminate the problem, the become PART of the problem.
Somebody teach those CHILDREN not to throw rocks at armed SOLDIERS. That would be a good place to start. If we can make a truce when all the facts are before us, why can there be peace elsewhere? Now the American Military will have to "create" peace since others will not strive to obtain it on their own.
You blame Jews for not "wiping out" the problem long ago, coming up with a final solution for the area.
You basically condemn Jews for not doing something that if they did do, you would immediately condemn as racist on their part. While I understand the logic, Israel is a democracy, and democracies tend not to operate in such manner. None of the surrounding countries are democracies. Israel is in a tough position. Your hostility towards the Jews has a long pedigree.
I really have no beef with either side in what their battle is over, a small piece of desert, and belief of "ownership". I am more concerned with situations on our soil rather than worry about foreign problems. Since they are forcing our involvement, I say to both: either live in peace, or be nuked until the land is no longer inhabitable.
When they bring their fight to my back yard, both will be eliminated, regardless of which is right.
Since I cared not for the area, or the concerns of either, I have a totally different point of view than someone who is of the Jewish faith. I never stated we should start hunting down Arabs and Jews in this country and deport them....although to you it seems I have taken that stance.
Of course it is no secret that Arafat is behind all terror groups and was the only way he was able to come to power in the first place. Palestinians have no leg to stand on in that fight, but why have the UN refused to recognize the problem? They are part of the problem. The US stands alone in this fight, now that we have been dragged into it.
The topic seems to be stuck on the Israeli situation because you stated that you sympathize with them. What ARAB nation wants to rid their country of terrorism? ZERO, that is how they came to power. I am against all countries in the middle east, even those who claim to be our "friends".
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