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Vatican: Don't Donate to UNICEF
Eyewitness ^

Posted on 10/27/2001 12:36:55 PM PDT by Notwithstanding

Just today I was in the room where the Vatican's permanent observer to the UN (Archbishop Renato R. Martino) stated that the Vatican cannot support UNICEF because it has chosen to reach beyond its legitimate mandate (to help the world's children) and now gets mixed up in advocacy of population control, abortion, and even puts its logo on pornographic children's books that they call sex eduxation texts.

The archbishop (who has served in his post for 16 years) explained that in past years the Vatican has made a symbolic donation to UNICEF, which had always served to boost donations from Catholics worldwide - but there is no longer any such Vatican donation to UNICEF.

The archbishop did praise the UNICEF for its primary roll in ensuring that 80% of the world's kids have been innoculated against many deadly dieseases - but that was in the past, and today the Vatican cannot support UNICEF's advocacy of immoral policies.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: unicef
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1 posted on 10/27/2001 12:36:55 PM PDT by Notwithstanding
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To: Notwithstanding
Good for them.
2 posted on 10/27/2001 12:39:10 PM PDT by reformed_dem
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To: patent
Ping.
3 posted on 10/27/2001 12:40:02 PM PDT by Nora
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To: Notwithstanding
I NEVER donate to those rats.
4 posted on 10/27/2001 12:42:01 PM PDT by ThePoetsRaven
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To: Notwithstanding
I believe there are some schools that encourage kids to collect monies at Halloween for UNICEF.

UNICEF Another United Nations Boondoggle

5 posted on 10/27/2001 12:42:32 PM PDT by Cagey
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To: *Catholic_list
Good for the Vatican
6 posted on 10/27/2001 12:47:19 PM PDT by NeoCaveman
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To: *UN_List
UN_List: For United Nations articles
7 posted on 10/27/2001 12:52:44 PM PDT by RippleFire
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To: Notwithstanding
I informed my sister of UNICEF's true mission a few years ago.
My neice and nephew no longer carry the UNICEF change box trick or treating.
8 posted on 10/27/2001 12:59:32 PM PDT by MissouriRepublican
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To: patent
Catholic bump
9 posted on 10/27/2001 1:02:53 PM PDT by Notwithstanding
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To: Notwithstanding
...the Vatican cannot support UNICEF...

Score, to date:
The Pope 1
The UN -188

10 posted on 10/27/2001 1:06:44 PM PDT by Alabama_Wild_Man
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Comment #11 Removed by Moderator

To: Alabama_Wild_Man
Tell that to UNICEF when they more or less beg the Vatican to change its position so that millions more Catholic donatios will flood in. I have won many sports bets having bet on the team that lost the game! Often the score does not tell the whole story.
12 posted on 10/27/2001 1:26:07 PM PDT by Notwithstanding
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To: Notwithstanding
Bump for the Vatican. A reasoned government.
13 posted on 10/27/2001 1:41:10 PM PDT by GVnana
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To: Notwithstanding
Way to go Vatican! Now if we can just get them and the American bishops to come out against pro-abortion "catholic" politicians.
14 posted on 10/27/2001 2:24:39 PM PDT by Cruise Missile Diplomacy
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To: Notwithstanding
Wow!! Finally, something that I actually agree with the Vatican on!! AMEN!! Someone's waking up over there!!
15 posted on 10/27/2001 2:27:21 PM PDT by MoJo2001
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To: Notwithstanding; seams2me
We used to get little boxes in Sunday School for our UNICEF collections, and then put them in the manger on Christmas Eve in church. I wonder if all that money went for such awful purposes back then (the 60's?)

I no longer go to that church, have left the denomination, as a matter of fact.

16 posted on 10/27/2001 2:45:40 PM PDT by Mrs. P
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To: Notwithstanding
"even puts its logo on pornographic children's books that they call sex eduxation texts" can you provide more specifics about this?
17 posted on 10/27/2001 2:57:35 PM PDT by passive1
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To: Mrs. P
My school had those UNICEF boxes in the 60s. I don't think the propaganda and corruption was anywhere near as bad then. I think the corruption - in terms of diverting the money to the personal use of bureaucrats - really got going in the 70s. The move into promoting "population control" and abortion dates from the 80s, while the promotion of "sex education" and homosexuality didn't really get entrenched until the 90s. IOW, your childhood contributions probably did more good than harm, but it would be folly to give then anything today.
18 posted on 10/27/2001 3:00:38 PM PDT by TheMole
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To: father_elijah; Antoninus; aposiopetic; Salvation; ELS; nina0113; Steve0113; el_chupacabra...
Bumping. Let me know if you want on or off the list. Click my screen name for a description.

patent

19 posted on 10/27/2001 3:14:03 PM PDT by patent
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To: MoJo2001
In relation to the UN there are probably a number of things you would agree with the Vatican on, as well as some you wouldn't. They have quite effectively fought the UN deathocracy for a number of years and slowed down (and every now and then stopped, albeit briefly) the abortion propaganda being forced on the third world.

patent

20 posted on 10/27/2001 3:16:22 PM PDT by patent
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To: Notwithstanding
Gosh, I haven't seen any Catholic bashers in here yet, am I on the right forum?

I'm sure the hateful slobbering morons will show up though. They can't help themselves from projecting their hatred.

21 posted on 10/27/2001 3:18:11 PM PDT by AAABEST
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Comment #22 Removed by Moderator

To: Cagey
Thanks for the link to the criticism on the UN. If my kid's school was pushing them to trick-or-treat for UNICEF, I'd print this and personally hand it to the principal, after I told him they wouldn't be participating.
23 posted on 10/27/2001 4:16:03 PM PDT by FrdmLvr
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To: Notwithstanding
This is wonderful news. Thanks be to our Lord.
24 posted on 10/27/2001 4:17:36 PM PDT by Havisham
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To: Notwithstanding
Kudos to the Vatican!
25 posted on 10/27/2001 4:21:02 PM PDT by nicmarlo
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To: Notwithstanding
Notwithstanding, how extraordinary that you were present to hear this good news. I will look up your posts from now on.
26 posted on 10/27/2001 4:22:02 PM PDT by Havisham
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To: Notwithstanding
Don't give to the United Way either.
27 posted on 10/27/2001 4:27:07 PM PDT by bmwcyle
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To: Notwithstanding
Bump
28 posted on 10/27/2001 5:44:41 PM PDT by nicmarlo
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To: Notwithstanding
Anglo-catholic bump!
29 posted on 10/27/2001 6:24:06 PM PDT by Eala
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To: passive1
Courtesy of the good folks at EWTN:


UNICEF's Pornographic Sex Education

UNICEF uses pornographic sex education programs. The programs were 
purchased from the Japanese Organization for International Cooperation in 
Family Planning (JOICFP) to "educate" children. The films, produced by 
JOICFP and MEXFAM, the Mexican IPPF affiliate, are titled "The Blue Pigeon" 
and "Music For Two. "

The "Blue Pigeon" is a cartoon targeted at 10 and 12-year-old children 
which graphically depicts sexual intercourse between two children attending 
a children's picnic.

"Music for Two" depicts a young girl who imagines herself married. In her 
fantasy she sees an image of a tired, overworked and overburdened, pregnant 
woman with several children. Her husband is shown as indifferent and 
uninterested in either his wife or the children. The negative message is 
that, in marriage, women become nothing more than breeders and slaves. As 
the girl acts out her sexual fantasies with a young boy in her neighborhood 
they engage in graphically depicted sexual intercourse after outfitting 
each other with birth control devices. At the end of the film, the girl 
skips off happily, having had commitment-free intercourse without the 
prospect of a burdensome marriage (Patricia Poppe, Luis Maria Aller Atucha, 
"Integrated Project and IEC Materials in Guatemala and Mexico, " JOICFP).



30 posted on 10/27/2001 6:45:45 PM PDT by Straight Vermonter
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To: AAABEST
Okay, okay. I've had a long day but I'll try to oblige. No rest for the...well, you know.

The Vatican should have bought a clue decades ago about all U.N. organizations. At least they've finally awakened and seem to understand that there is no compromise possible, no deal to be made, no influence that can be wielded against the anti-Christian U.N.

The real question is: what took them so long?
31 posted on 10/27/2001 7:30:03 PM PDT by George W. Bush
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To: George W. Bush
The real question is: what took them so long?

You sound just like Martha and Mary scolding Jesus: "Lord if you had been here, my brother would never have died." It's all His fault. It always is.

32 posted on 10/27/2001 7:37:56 PM PDT by Romulus
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To: Romulus
You sound just like Martha and Mary...

No making some people happy. People complain if you don't show up, people complain if you do...

Actually, my remarks were extremely mild and well winthin the bounds of a practical political discussion.

After all, the Vatican doesn't delude itself over Planned Parenthood. It's hard to understand why they have been so slow in condemning and defunding UNICEF and other globalist organizations. You might like to be their apologists. I won't. The Vatican is basically doing something long overdue and isn't too happy having to admit what a lot of the rest of us knew all along. At least they finally wised up after having given their imprimatur to their enemies for many years. Hopefully, they'll be aggressive in denouncing the U.N. and its full agenda.
33 posted on 10/27/2001 9:28:35 PM PDT by George W. Bush
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To: Notwithstanding
Pro-Life bump!
34 posted on 10/27/2001 10:52:35 PM PDT by Salvation
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To: George W. Bush
It's hard to understand why they have been so slow in condemning and defunding UNICEF and other globalist organizations.

Remember how the Vatican undermined the objectives of the Cairo conference? Short memory. Sometimes it's good to remain in the UN in order to prevent worse things from happening.

35 posted on 10/28/2001 2:30:55 AM PST by Aquinasfan
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To: George W. Bush
The real question is: what took them so long?

What you said.

36 posted on 10/28/2001 2:32:22 AM PST by Orual
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To: Romulus
I believe the passage you are referring to is from John 11:21-27 and is quite applicable to the upcoming feast of All Souls Day. I read something that is a very good interpretation of that passage. At the time of the death of her brother Lazarus, Martha was angry. While her sister and other friends and relations mourned the death of Lazarus, Martha marched right out to the edge of town to let Jesus have a piece of her mind. "If you had come when we called you, my brother Lazarus would not be dead," she said angrily.

How often we all feel like that. It doesn't matter if someone we miss died yesterday or twenty years of yesterdays ago-sometimes we just want to let God have it. We miss them. It hurts. Things just are not the same. And if only, if only, if only.

In fact, Martha became the first person in John's gospel to proclaim that "yes," Jesus is the Christ, and even as they speak, she knows her brother lives.

37 posted on 10/28/2001 2:40:12 AM PST by Orual
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To: Notwithstanding
Where we DON'T spend/invest/tithe our money is just as important as the places that we DO....

God Bless America!!

David

38 posted on 10/28/2001 3:11:34 AM PST by davidosborne
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To: Aquinasfan
Remember how the Vatican undermined the objectives of the Cairo conference? Short memory. Sometimes it's good to remain in the UN in order to prevent worse things from happening.

Sorry. No sale. They could have started opposing individual U.N. initiatives long before now or simply quietly discouraged their adherents from donating to UNICEF and still retained their U.N. presence and influence. Granted, the Vatican did do a lot of heavy lifting with Cairo but so did some of the rest of us who are outside the church of Rome.
39 posted on 10/28/2001 4:24:50 AM PST by George W. Bush
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To: Notwithstanding
Good.

Incidentally, the political Roman Catholicism, commonly referred to as the Vatican -- is a model supranational organization, the idea that the UN disgraced.

40 posted on 10/28/2001 5:29:56 AM PST by annalex
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To: George W. Bush
You need to hone your bashing skills a little bit more, because if you call that Catholic bashing, I'm very disappointed.

You're supposed to piss me off, not make me agree with you. Better luck next time. 8)

41 posted on 10/28/2001 6:12:02 AM PST by AAABEST
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To: AAABEST
You need to hone your bashing skills a little bit more, because if you call that Catholic bashing, I'm very disappointed. You're supposed to piss me off, not make me agree with you. Better luck next time. 8)

Well, my bona fides as a basher of Rome have been sullied. I must be anemic or something. I assure you that I can be much tougher on some topics...

But then, Rome finally is doing the right thing here (finally!) so I'm just not in the mood for a Protestant/Baptist tantrum over it.
42 posted on 10/28/2001 6:23:50 AM PST by George W. Bush
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To: Notwithstanding
Get the UN out of New York. It's a dangerous institution.
43 posted on 10/28/2001 6:34:25 AM PST by bettina0
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To: Havisham
For all I know this has been the Vatican position for some time - I passed it on merely because I personally know now first hand without a doubt that it is the official position of the Holy See. (I don't think the ambassodor was announcing a policy change yesterday - merely reiterating existing policy).
44 posted on 10/28/2001 10:47:12 AM PST by Notwithstanding
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To: George W. Bush
Your post is quite a non-sequitir. The Vatican is not opposed to the UN's existence. It is opposed to the UN or its agencies (in this case UNICEF) when they overstep thier mandate. Since the uN has no mandate to set world law or push population control, the Vatican is not at all hypocritical in supporting the UN per the UN mandate. I imagine the UN supports the idea that the nations ought to have a forum for working out problems and coming to concensus where possible. Catholic doctrine respects the sovereignty of each person - and any state sovereignty would always be subject to the sovereignty of the humen person. The Vaitcan - I would conclude - does not support a world governemnt in any way. To do so would be to support that which the Scriptures seem to deem impossible - if not futile.
45 posted on 10/28/2001 10:54:32 AM PST by Notwithstanding
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To: George W. Bush
This is the philosophy of the Holy See's ambassador:

When other nations will carry the torch for an issue, the Vatican will let them do so and stay out of it in order stay out of the controversial limelight. In other words the Holy See does not wnat to expemd its moral authority or its position at the diplomatic table when it does not have to.

Personal FYI: "forced abortion" would today be a crime for which anyone who opposed abortion in any way whatsoever might be criminally charged - were it not for the bold stance of the Vatican's UN delegation. While there are a few exceptions, conservative Christian groups have been EXTREMELY SLOW in getting involved in UN activities NGOs at the UN (this was larely because good people either failed to recognize the ridiculous influence the loonies at the UN end up having or becuase good people refused to acknowledge the legitimacy of the UN and therefor erroneoulsy thought that if they ignored the UN it would go away or be proven illegitimate). Too, the Holy See is at a distinct advantage due to its full diplomatic status. No other sovereign Christian nation has religion as its raison d'etre.

46 posted on 10/28/2001 11:09:04 AM PST by Notwithstanding
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To: George W. Bush
This is the philosophy of the Holy See's ambassador:

When other nations will carry the torch for an issue, the Vatican will let them do so and stay out of it in order stay out of the controversial limelight. In other words the Holy See does not wnat to expemd its moral authority or its position at the diplomatic table when it does not have to.

Personal FYI: "forced abortion" would today be a crime for which anyone who opposed abortion in any way whatsoever might be criminally charged - were it not for the bold stance of the Vatican's UN delegation. While there are a few exceptions, conservative Christian groups have been EXTREMELY SLOW in getting involved in UN activities NGOs at the UN (this was larely because good people either failed to recognize the ridiculous influence the loonies at the UN end up having or becuase good people refused to acknowledge the legitimacy of the UN and therefor erroneoulsy thought that if they ignored the UN it would go away or be proven illegitimate). Too, the Holy See is at a distinct advantage due to its full diplomatic status. No other sovereign Christian nation has religion as its raison d'etre. In other words, Focus on the Family and Billy Graham don't have ambassodrs at the UN who can stem the tide of crapola.

47 posted on 10/28/2001 11:10:53 AM PST by Notwithstanding
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To: George W. Bush
The Vatican is basically doing something long overdue and isn't too happy having to admit what a lot of the rest of us knew all along.

That's ridiculous. Remember Cairo? Remember Beijing? Remember IPPF, NOW, and "Catholics" [sic] for a "Free Choice [sic]" trying to get the Vatican thrown out of the UN? Do you think they wouldn't do that if the Vatican presence wasn't bollixing up their agenda?

Maybe you aren't old enough to recall this, but I am. Who was it who led the prolife movement in the beginning? Back in 1973 and before? *Catholics*. Who had the prescience to declare back in 1930 that the coming Protestant cave-in to the contraceptive culture was wrong (and trust me, if you don't think contraception has anything to do with abortion, you need to reread Roe v. Wade, because the Supreme Court disagrees with you)? *Catholics*, specifically Pope Pius XI. Who had the guts to reiterate that POV in 1968, at the height of the so-called "sexual revolution"? *Pope Paul VI*, sadly ignored by most of his flock.

We're the original pro-lifers. Don't waste your breath telling us about what "you knew all along". On the subject of life issues, we've done a lot more teaching than you know about.

Hopefully, they'll be aggressive in denouncing the U.N. and its full agenda.

They're not opposed to "the UN and its full agenda". They're opposed to the idea that sterile sex with anything, and the "right" to kill any offspring that might result, is some sort of human right that the UN needs to endorse or promote.

48 posted on 10/28/2001 11:26:32 AM PST by Campion
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To: Orual
Thanks. The Lararus episode is the best rejoinder I can think of to the God-doesn't-care crowd. M&M reproach Jesus for not having been there, but we, seeing events from another perspective, understand that there wasn't one minute that Jesus wasn't thinking about Lazarus. He was there all along. It's expressive not only of His meekness but of the theological absurdity of His accounting for His actions (being already perfect, God doesn't need to be "justified," after all) that His response is not defensive, but epiphanic.
49 posted on 10/28/2001 1:02:38 PM PST by Romulus
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To: Campion
Oh my - you are on a roll!!!
50 posted on 10/28/2001 3:22:03 PM PST by Notwithstanding
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