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Families shattered over arrest (Azmath illegal in US 9 years- John Doe2?)
Times of India ^ | HINA KAUSAR ALAM AND PAUL BENJAMIN

Posted on 11/05/2001 7:00:28 AM PST by syriacus

Families shattered over arrest

HINA KAUSAR ALAM AND PAUL BENJAMIN

TIMES NEWS NETWORK

HYDERABAD: "My son can never do such a thing," Mohammed Jahangir, father of Mohammed Jaweed Azmath, said late on Monday night.

The family is shattered over the news of Azmath's arrest as one of the suspects in Tuesday's terrorist attacks in the US. It was only after seeing Azmath's picture on TV networks as one of the two arrested suspects in the attacks that the gravity of the situation dawned on them. Jahangir and the rest of the family, including Azmath's wife,who is expecting a baby, confirmed Azmath's identity as one of the two arrested men after being shown their photographs.

Jahangir told The Times of India that Azmath, as well as Ayub Ali Khan, both friends, working in a store in New Jersey, were moving out of New Jersey to Texas after having lost their jobs. The shattered father said Azmath and Khan were promised all help by a man called Sethi from Mumbai to set up a fruit store in Texas and that was the reason why the duo was on their way to Texas.

Jahangir said the duo was in the US for the last nine years. "This nice house is thanks to the hardwork my son has put in the US.He can never be part of any such terrorist attack," Jahangir said.

Meanwhile, Ayub Ali Khan's family also confirmed that he was one of the two men detained in the US.They said that Khan and Azmath had come back from the US to Hyderabad in January and left in July back to the US. The two had first gone to the US as illegal immigrants nine years ago. Asked how they managed to come back to India without valid papers, Ayub's family said, "This could only be answered by Immigration officials." They had no knowledge about the box cutters or knives that the duo was alleged to have been carrying when arrested.

Ayub, his family said, was a trained chartered accountant, who worked in Sahara here as a clerk. The duo called their families here a week before they moved from New Jersey to Texas.


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:
Gee they were here long enough to be involved in the OKC truck bombing and the WTC van bombing.

See alsoTwo Indians being quizzed by FBI

and

Police grill families of suspects

I think that Mohammed Azmath, second guy from the left, is the same guy as John Doe#2 (the one on the far right) who is , who was supposedly seen with McVeigh around the time of the OKC bombing. I posted a response on 10/26 that said I thought he was. Was Tim McVeigh an agent of Iraq? .

Since then I've posted a 'merged' picture that shows a slightly transparent picture of Doe #2 placed over the picture of Azmath.

More recent threads on FR, concerning anthrax and Azmath's former roommates in New Jersey, makes me even more certain that Mohammed Jaweed Azmath is John Doe#2.

HUNT NARROWS FOR ANTHRAX SOURCE [feds home in on 1 postal route]

INS holding 2 men seized at apartment (anthrax letters - HANDWRITING link?)

(L to R, 1. Khan, 2. Mohmmed Azmath, merged picture of Azmath andJohn Doe#2, John Doe #2) I think Azmath (Pic #2)--looks like John Doe #2, especially around the eyes, but he is a little older and thinner. An eyewitness thought John Doe looked like a Cuban, and this guy looks like an angry Ricky Ricardo.

Also Azmath (pic #2) was suspected of being associated with someone involved in the WTC Van-bombing. Sounds similar to the OKC truck bombing.

1 posted on 11/05/2001 7:00:29 AM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
I THINK????? If i didn't KNOW better I'd SWEAR THOSE TWOPICTURES WERE THE SPITTIN' IMAGE!!!. GRill the CREEP over what he KNOW About the MYSTERIOUS Micheal Bresia(sp???) show Brecsis piture to the people who knew him and I'll wager ANYTHING they match PEOPLE!!!!
2 posted on 11/05/2001 7:12:23 AM PST by Roger_W_Isom
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To: syriacus
BTTT!
3 posted on 11/05/2001 7:14:33 AM PST by NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
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To: OKCSubmariner
Take a look at this article, OKC.
4 posted on 11/05/2001 7:15:49 AM PST by texasbluebell
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To: syriacus
This article shows that the two men have been in the US 9 years (long enough to be here for WTC bombing and OKC bombing) and lived in same neighborhood as men who were involved in 1993 WTC bombing.

Two Indians being quizzed by FBI

P BALU, NIHAL KOSHIE AND RAM KARAN
TIMES NEWS NETWORK HYDERABAD: Two men from Hyderabad, Mohammed Jaweed Azmath and Ayub Ali Khan, are among several suspects held in the United States in the wake of last Tuesday's terrorist attacks in New York and Washington. Azmath and Khan are said to be residents of Doodh Bowli in the Old City. It was the families of Azmath and Khan who noticed their pictures being flashed on television as two persons arrested from a train as suspects in the terrorist attacks.

Earlier, Azmath and Khan's families had contacted the relief helpline set up by the state government at the Secretariat here and gave the two men's names and details such as age and local address. According to their families, Khan and Azmath had planned to take a plane from New Jersey to Texas on September 11, but decided to take a train instead after the terrorist attack. Meanwhile, an agency report from Washington said the two men, when arrested from a train at Dallas, claimed they were Indians, and have been detained and taken for questioning in connection with the devastating terrorist strikes in the USA in which more than 5,000 people are feared killed.

Ayub Khan (51) and Azmath (47) were taken into custody on Sunday at a railway station in Fort Worth, Texas and were flown to New York for questioning. They were in custody "in the strongest possibility we have yet" in the nationwide Federal Bureau of Investigation probe,Texas law enforcement authorities said.

A New York report said the duo had told the authorities that they were Indians but Texas authorities said the men lied about their nationality and had no legitimate identification. The two men had $5,000-10,000 in cash and box cutters of the type used by the 19 terrorists who commandeered the hijacked jets that they smashed into the World Trade Center and Pentagon on September 11.

Authorities said Khan and Azmath had flown on Tuesday from Newark, New Jersey, on a flight bound for San Antonio, Texas but which was diverted and forced to land in St Louis after the attacks in New York and Washington.

The authorities said the two men then got on an Amtrak train but were pulled off it on Wednesday in Fort Worth for a drug check, which targeted several passengers at random.

The two were being held on possible immigration violation, although they were taken to New York for interrogation by the FBI’s joint terrorism task force. Law enforcement sources said they were trying to find out if Azmath and Khan could be linked to a doctor from San Antonio, who is also in custody, according to CNN TV network. The authorities on Saturday afternoon also searched the Jersey City apartment the two men had been sharing located in the same neighbourhood of some of the conspirators who plotted the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.

According to their landlord in New Jersey, both men lived there for six or seven years and they worked at a stationery store in New York. According to Rabouth, the landlord,Azmath was recently out of the country for several months. Their neighbours in New Jersey, according to reports, said the duo were seen nearly every day, leaving very early and coming home late for the past several years until they disappeared about a week ago.

5 posted on 11/05/2001 7:28:14 AM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
It's nice to see that the "my child could never do something like this" excuse crosses cultural boundaries. These parents are simply in denial...
6 posted on 11/05/2001 7:31:51 AM PST by LaBradford22
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To: syriacus
HYDERABAD: "My son can never do such a thing,"

We have heard this same thing from EVERY ONE of the parents of these guys!

7 posted on 11/05/2001 7:36:30 AM PST by BunnySlippers
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To: LaBradford22
It's nice to see that the "my child could never do something like this" excuse crosses cultural boundaries. These parents are simply in denial...

Nice to know the men just got married this year. From the article below:Both visited India this year and got married in March. They returned to New Jersey in July after spending nearly eight months in their hometown, their relatives said.
Is marriage part of the pre-terrorist ritual--pass on your terrorist genes in a child before you die?

Police grill families of suspects

HYDERABAD: Police began questioning on Tuesday the families and neighbours of two Indians who have been detained by the FBI in New York regarding last week's terrorist attacks.

Police and intelligence officers checked the background of Mohammed Jaweed Azmat, 47, and Ayub Ali Khan, 51, by interviewing residents of a poor district in Hyderabad.

The two were removed from an Amtrak passenger train in Fort Worth, Texas last week after authorities said they found them with box-cutting knives, hair dye and $5,000 in cash.

US officials have said that terrorists used box-cutters in hijacking at least one of the four airplanes that crashed in the United States a week ago.

On the day of the terrorist attacks Azmat and Khan had been on a flight from New Jersey to Texas, but boarded the train when the flight was diverted to Missouri. The FBI detained them in Fort Worth and flew them to New York where they are being held as material witnesses in the investigation of the terrorist attacks.

The families recognised Azmat and Khan after their photos were shown by television networks. Azmat and Khan are friends who lived as neighbours in the Doodh Bowli district of Hyderabad.

"My son is a gentleman and a person devoted to his family ... How can he do such a thing?" said Mohammed Jahangir, Azmat's father.

The two had telephoned their families in Hyderabad two weeks ago and told them about their plans to move to Texas after losing their jobs in a New Jersey store, the relatives said.

"We haven't heard from them since then," said Jahangir.

Gul Mohammed Khan, a younger brother of Ayub Ali Khan, said the two had left for the United States nine years ago with Indian passports and valid U.S. work permits.

Both visited India this year and got married in March. They returned to New Jersey in July after spending nearly eight months in their hometown, their relatives said.

Azmat married a Pakistani citizen, Amina, who is pregnant, and living with her husband's family in Hyderabad, the family said.

Gul Mohammed Khan broke down as he recounted his brother's recent visit and then seeing his face on television in connection with the terrorist attacks. "It is the biggest shock of my life," he said.

8 posted on 11/05/2001 8:07:33 AM PST by syriacus
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To: BunnySlippers
HYDERABAD: "My son can never do such a thing," We have heard this same thing from EVERY ONE of the parents of these guys!

Families shocked at the arrest of Indian suspects by Syed Amin Jafri in Hyderabad

The two Indians who are among several suspects held in the United States in the wake of the terrorist attacks in New York and Washington hail from Hyderabad.

Before seeing the photographs of Mohammed Jaweed Azmath and Ayub Ali Khan flashed on international television channels and in local newspapers, their worried family members had made enquiries at the control room helpline opened by the Andhra Pradesh government at the state secretariat.

"We are shocked by their arrest. We are really worried. But we are sure they are innocent and have nothing to do with the attacks," said an uncle of Azmath.

"They had contacted us just 10 days ago and told us that since they lost their jobs in New Jersey, they were going to Texas to join a new employer," another family member said.

According to him, the two were not highly educated and had been working in a New Jersey store since going to the US about nine years ago. The duo had returned to Hyderabad in January and stayed for about six months before returning to the US.

"As soon as we heard of the attacks, we were worried for their safety. Hence, they phoned their employer in New Jersey and we were told that they had left to join their new employer in Texas," a brother of Khan said.

"We have been seeing the media reports. We are devastated by the news. Azmath's father has taken ill. His wife, who is pregnant, is worried," a relative said. Azmath's family lives in a house that was built recently with his savings from the US. His younger brother, wife, parents and other relatives stay in the house, just a furlong away from the Kamatipura police station.

The family has been receiving a stream of journalists since Tuesday morning, even as teams of police and intelligence officials have been visiting to gather information.

Khan's family, consisting of his wife, mother, brothers and other relatives, lives nearby.

Family members said both men hold Indian passports. "We do not know whether they have residential or work permits in the US. But we are sure they would not have indulged in terrorist activity. We hope they are able to prove their innocence," they said.

Azmath, 47, and Khan, 51, were taken into custody at a railway station in Fort Worth, Texas, on Sunday and taken to New York for questioning. They had flown from Newark, New Jersey, on September 11, the day of the terrorist attacks, on a flight headed for San Antonio, Texas. The flight was diverted to St Louis, Mississippi, after the attacks in New York and Washington.

The two men were pulled out of an Amtrak train in Forth Worth for a check by anti-narcotics officers. Finding that they did not possess relevant papers, the officers held Azmath and Khan for possible immigration violations. The Federal Bureau of Investigation later took them into custody.

They had a few thousand dollars in cash and box cutters of the type used by the hijackers, according to the FBI.

Subsequently, investigators raided the Jersey City apartment that the men had been sharing and made enquiries with their employers and landlords.

9 posted on 11/05/2001 8:18:48 AM PST by syriacus
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To: NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
Kin of Indian suspects quizzed by FBI

Syed Amin Jafri in Hyderabad

Two agents of the Federal Bureau of Investigation have questioned some family members of the two Indian suspects -- Ayub Ali Khan and Mohammed Azmath Jaweed -- who are in custody in the United States in the wake of the terrorist attacks on the World Trade Centre and Pentagon. The Hyderabad police refused to confirm the reports about the visit of the two-member team. However, sources said that one FBI agent from the US and another from its liaison office in Delhi arrived in the city on Thursday.

Inquiries centred around the background of the duo, their educational and passport details and monetary transactions since they went to the US.

The IB also shared with the FBI officials, details of the investigations carried out in India.

The FBI team is expected to fly back to Delhi on Saturday, the sources added.

10 posted on 11/05/2001 8:27:56 AM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
You got me to searching for more connections, I never knew about this before:

All of the above raise some very serious questions. Near the top of the list are questions concerning how Hussain and his fellow former Iraqi soldiers got into the country and what kind of security investigations, if any, were conducted. During 1993 and 1994, President Clinton brought several thousand "former" Iraqi soldiers to America for "resettlement." Under angry prodding from the American Legion and the VFW, Congress expressed feeble "outrage" and called on the President to halt the program. The Administration never provided Congress with the information it had requested on the "resettlement." It may be, of course, that Mr. Hussain and his comrades are perfectly innocent immigrants seeking asylum from Saddam Hussein’s evil clutches, as they claim. But it should be remembered that when "master bomber" Ramzi Yousef entered the U.S. on an Iraqi passport in 1992 he also claimed to be seeking asylum and claimed to be a member of a Kuwaiti resistance group fighting Saddam Hussein. And he was not the first. Many intelligence reports had cited the aggressive effort by Saddam to infiltrate his agents into the U.S. during and after the Gulf War. In fact, the Washington Post reported on January 28, 1991 that, according to "highly classified U.S. intelligence reports," Saddam Hussein had "dispatched more than 100 terrorists, both experienced and novice, to try to infiltrate the United States." What would be the political fallout if it were discovered that Mr. Clinton’s Iraqi "defectors" had a hand in the OKC bombing?

http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/1998/vo14no19/vo14no19_mideast.htm
http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/1995/vo11no18/vo11no18_john_does.htm

11 posted on 11/05/2001 8:41:12 AM PST by FR_addict
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To: Nick Danger
Check out these pictures.
12 posted on 11/05/2001 9:03:27 AM PST by BlueHorseShoe
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To: giotto; bonesmccoy; onyx; Ladysmith; Hugh Akston; jimmyBEEgood; TheHound
Check out the picture comparisons here as opposed to the comparisons here...(http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/fr/556065/posts). Thought you might be interested.
13 posted on 11/05/2001 9:09:45 AM PST by BlueHorseShoe
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To: Paco
You might want to see this.
14 posted on 11/05/2001 9:22:16 AM PST by BlueHorseShoe
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To: FR_addict
Thanks for the overview and the links to the informative articles. I've just read them and I've saved the links for future reference, too.

The articles bring up many interesting points including the tendency of bombing masterminds to flee on an airplane soon after the explosion they've arranged. The information on all the Middle Easterners who came to the US after Desert Storm is eyeopening, too.

I especially noticed this (from the first link) ....

Terrorist expert Neil C. Livingstone was quoted in The Globe on May 16, 1995 with this observation: "There is a remarkable similarity between the methods used by Islamic terrorists in the bombing of the Marine barracks in Beirut, the attack on the World Trade Center, and the bombing in Oklahoma. The truckload of explosives is almost a signature or calling card and it is the weapon of choice among these groups." Livingstone, the author of several books on terrorism, continued: "Very typically, these terrorists have found homegrown radicals to use as dupes in the actual bombings. They have supplied the money and the technical expertise and highly skilled operatives to guide a project and then get out of town before they can be apprehended. This is exactly what happened in the World Trade Center assault, and now they are furious that we have apprehended one of their team leaders [Yousef] and brought him back here for trial."

Similarly, in April 1995 Vincent Cannistrero, former Chief of Counterterrorism for the CIA, authored an article for the Boston Globe, in which he noted the similarities between the New York and Oklahoma bombings. In addition to Cannistrero’s stature as one of the world’s foremost counterterrorist experts, he had specific information to lend authority to his evaluation. He had received a call on the day of the bombing from one of the highest placed sources in the Middle East, the head of Saudi Arabia’s Intelligence Service, who also happens to be King Fahd’s son. According to documents filed in the Oklahoma bombing trial, Cannistrero was told that Saddam Hussein had hired seven Pakistani terrorists (Yousef is Pakistani) to bomb targets in the U.S., one of which was the Murrah Building. Cannistrero then called one of the FBI’s top terrorist investigators, Special Agent Kevin Foust, to pass on the information.

Thank you again.

15 posted on 11/05/2001 9:22:49 AM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
Thanks for bolding the information. It helps when scanning the articles quickly.
16 posted on 11/05/2001 10:50:56 AM PST by FR_addict
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To: syriacus
The size and shape of the heads are totally different.
17 posted on 11/05/2001 10:54:50 AM PST by CWOJackson
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To: CWOJackson
The size and shape of the heads are totally different.

It's impossible to tell the size of their heads from the pictures; however, when the two different pictures are made the same size and merged you can see that everything matches except the jaw line at the side (including the way the widow's peak leans slightly over to one side on both of them.)

True, the lower half of the face is thinner on Azmath. He might have lost 15 pounds or so and 5 o'clock shadow might make him look thinner there.

I have to agree I am concerned about the lower jaw and the upper lip.

1. Ayub Khan, 2. Mohammed Azmath, --3.Azmath/Doe ---4. John Doe #2

18 posted on 11/05/2001 12:22:33 PM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
To me, John Doe number two always looked like one of the guards that is shown in the video when mcveigh is led from the jail to the car. I know it sounds crazy, but if you ever see that video again or have a copy, look at him. He looks like a Mexican American.
19 posted on 11/05/2001 1:56:03 PM PST by Johnny_Apollo
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To: syriacus
Using a computer you can merge any two pictures into whatever results you want.

All you have to do is look at the image on the left; that man has a long face with a large square jaw. The second man has a shorter face with a smaller jaw.

There is a distinctive space between the eye brows for the man on the left, almost none for the man on the right.

The man on the left has a narrow nose, the man on the right a wider nose.

Other than appearing Arab in original these two have little in common.

20 posted on 11/05/2001 4:46:49 PM PST by CWOJackson
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To: *TerrOrWar; gumbo; bvw; OldFriend; Fred Mertz; Plummz
More news on Azmath and Khan. I didn't know until I read this that they were out of the country, in India, between January and July. They presumably got instructions from somebody, while they were in India, to go back to New Jersey.
21 posted on 11/05/2001 5:39:47 PM PST by aristeides
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To: syriacus
How come father Mohammed Jahangir and son Mohammed Azmath have different names? Did Azmath change his name for some religious or cultish reason?
22 posted on 11/05/2001 5:41:58 PM PST by aristeides
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To: syriacus
Gee they were here long enough to be involved in the OKC truck bombing and the WTC van bombing.

Great catch! We can only hope the FBI are putting two and two together too. (And not being ordered off the trail.)

23 posted on 11/05/2001 5:58:16 PM PST by gumbo
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To: aristeides
Thanks for the ping! I noticed the man arrested from 1001 N. Olden Ave, Allah Rakha, also has a different last name from that of his brother/roommate (or, at least, a man described as his brother).
24 posted on 11/05/2001 6:00:59 PM PST by gumbo
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To: syriacus
Family members said... "we are sure they would not have indulged in terrorist activity..."

Riiiiiiight. Seems to me that's what Mohammed Atta's father said too, back home in Egypt.

And that's what that EgyptAir pilot's (al-Batoutie's?) family said too: "We're sure he didn't intentionally crash that plane."

25 posted on 11/05/2001 6:05:45 PM PST by gumbo
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To: syriacus
"Very typically, these terrorists have found homegrown radicals to use as dupes in the actual bombings.

Sure sounds like Timothy McVeigh, doesn't it?!!

26 posted on 11/05/2001 8:51:34 PM PST by NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
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To: gumbo
Translation: "Our heads are stuck deep in the desert sand here....."
27 posted on 11/05/2001 8:53:11 PM PST by NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
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To: CWOJackson

1. Ayub Khan, 2. Mohammed Azmath, --3.Azmath/Doe ---4. John Doe #2

Maybe you are looking at picture #1, on the far left, of Khan, who was Azmath's companion on the train. The picture that is in color is Khan's and it is attached by the source I got it from to picture #2 (second from left, in black and white) of Azmath.

I am ONLY comparing the three pictures on the right. You're right that in the picture on the far left Khan's eyebrows are different. Khan's eyebrows are similar to those of a lot of the guys in the pictures at the FBI. Azmath's eyebrows are very different than those of all the other guys. That was exactly the point I was making when I originally said Azmath is John Doe#2.

I did not change anything when I merged the pictures. I only made the picture of Doe#2 less opaque when I placed it over the picture of Azmath so that you could see through it somewhat.

I wish I had better computer skills so that I could do it in a way that would illustrate the exact match of the eyebrows (like having one man's eyebrows in red, and the other's in green or something.

28 posted on 11/05/2001 11:59:08 PM PST by syriacus
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To: Johnny_Apollo
To me, John Doe number two always looked like one of the guards that is shown in the video when mcveigh is led from the jail to the car. I know it sounds crazy, but if you ever see that video again or have a copy, look at him. He looks like a Mexican American.

Doe#2 was supposed to have looked like a Native American or a Cuban to some of the eyewitnesses, so a Mexican American fits well. I will take a good look at the guard when I get to see the video. I hadn't paid much attention to McVeigh's story before and I'm certainly not going to say anyone's ideas about who is Doe are 'crazy.' I feel nutty in my insistence about Azmath's resemblance to Doe.

I'm beginning to wonder if the sketch of Doe #2 isn't of two different Does the eyewitnesses saw. It's amazing how well the top of the face of Doe matches Azmath, but Azmath's jaw is thinner.

29 posted on 11/06/2001 12:14:02 AM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
"This nice house is thanks to the hardwork my son has put in the US.He can never be part of any such terrorist attack," Jahangir said.

What did these guys do that they were shipping enough money back home to buy a house? Does this jive? Or is this a kickback for services rendered?

30 posted on 11/06/2001 12:21:54 AM PST by the808bass
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To: syriacus
Simple cosmetic eyebrow plucking could account for one difference between JD2 sketch and Azmath foto. In the sketch the eyebrows are inverted V, Azmath's are thick and straight. If it was Azmath at OKC with plucked eyebrows, they could have grown back by now.
31 posted on 11/06/2001 2:26:40 AM PST by bvw
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To: syriacus; OKCSubmariner
I wanted to make sure you had the Home Page Link to the OKC bombing. There are a few more articles here.

THE NEW AMERICAN:
http://www.thenewamerican.com/focus/okc/

32 posted on 11/06/2001 6:30:11 AM PST by FR_addict
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To: the808bass
What did these guys do that they were shipping enough money back home to buy a house? Does this jive? Or is this a kickback for services rendered?

It's reminiscent of the money the families of the suicide bombers in Palestine inherit. It seems the best way for these "downtrodden" people to make big bucks is for them, or their family members, to become terrorists.

33 posted on 11/06/2001 7:57:51 AM PST by syriacus
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To: bvw
I see what you are saying, I think. The outer corners of the eyebrows continue on (downward) in the one picture. Good point.
34 posted on 11/06/2001 8:00:17 AM PST by syriacus
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To: FR_addict
I wanted to make sure you had the Home Page Link to the OKC bombing.

Thank you. I've bookmarked this on my own computer and will look at it later. It looks like an informative site.

35 posted on 11/06/2001 8:01:50 AM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
Then again, the John Doe #2 illustration is just that, an artist's illustration, not a photograph of an individual. If the artist was told, "He had a square jaw," then he/she would draw a square jaw. "Like this?" "Yeah, sort of like that." If there were two photographs to morph and compare, slight differences like the exact jawline or the precise thickness of the top lip would carry more weight. My .02, FWIW.
36 posted on 11/06/2001 8:19:42 AM PST by shezza
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To: shezza
So I'm saying, YES, it very well could be him. IOW, the slight discrepancies in the drawing are not enough to rule him out as John Doe #2.
37 posted on 11/06/2001 8:22:54 AM PST by shezza
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To: syriacus
Yikes!! It's HIM!!
38 posted on 11/06/2001 8:23:02 AM PST by Ann Archy
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To: syriacus
Indians in FBI custody get a lawyer

TIMES NEWS NETWORK

HYDERABAD: Ayub Ali Khan and Mohammed Azmath Javeed, the two Hyderabadis arrested in the US in connection with the September 11 attacks, have been provided a legal counsel by the US law enforcement authorities.

‘‘On Friday, the law enforcement authorities confirmed that Ayub Ali Khan is in the Brooklyn facility, but said he has a lawyer and knows why he has been detained,’’ The Wall Street Journal reported on Monday.

In a letter written to his family on October 19, Ayub Khan had said that he did not have access to a counsel and telephone.

‘‘We are relieved to some extent. At least now they got an opportunity to prove their innocence,’’ 70-year-old Gul Begum, Ayub’s mother, told Times News Network.

39 posted on 11/06/2001 7:04:34 PM PST by syriacus
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To: syriacus
bumping here.
40 posted on 02/25/2002 10:03:08 AM PST by thinden
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To: syriacus;thinden
My bet is still on Al-Hussaini as the most likely John Doe II. It would be nice if there was a photo available. Al-Hussaini called a TV press conference to announce his law suit challenging his JD2 status, so at least there is videotape available somewhere.
41 posted on 06/12/2002 11:50:20 AM PDT by honway
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To: honway
My bet is still on Al-Hussaini as the most likely John Doe II

There's a greater chance of your being right, than of my being right.

Whoever it is, I hope they get him. Soon.

42 posted on 06/12/2002 12:14:52 PM PDT by syriacus
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To: Ann Archy
Yikes!! It's HIM!!

Not necessarily. Remember that Jose Padilla/ Abdullah al Muhajir was apprehended at Chicago's O'Hare International Airport, then consider the arrest of Nabil Al-Marabh seven days after the 09/11 bombing....

Nabil Al-Marabh, 34

Status: In custody in New York

Al-Marabh, who listed addresss in Massachussetts, Illinois and Canada since 1994, was arrested Sept. 19 at a Burbank, Ill., convenience store. Al-Marabh once worked for Boston Cab Co., where an associate of suspected terror chief Osama bin Laden also worked.

Nabil Al-Marabh

The FBI linked Al-Marabh to Raed Hijazi, now jailed in Jordan on charges that he planned to blow up a hotel filled with Americans and Israelis on New Year's Day 2000.

Al-Marabh holds a commercial driver's license and is certified to transport hazardous materials. Canadian media reported that a man with the same name and age lived in Toronto in the mid-1990s and was collecting welfare while waiting word on his refugee application; it was denied. Authorities will not say why they were seeking Al-Marabh

more info *here*

-archy-/-

43 posted on 06/12/2002 1:15:40 PM PDT by archy
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To: syriacus
Whoever it is, I hope they get him. Soon.

Ditto

Thanks for an informative thread.

44 posted on 06/12/2002 2:45:26 PM PDT by honway
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To: honway
I'm glad you brought up this topic again. It got me to check into what has happened with our two friends, more recently.

2 detained men indicted for credit card fraud

NEW YORK : Two Indian-American men arrested from an Amtrak train in Texas a day after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in New York and Washington, D.C. have pleaded innocent to credit card fraud charges. Syed Gul Mohammed Shah (earlier identified as Ayub Ali Khan) and Mohammed Azmath entered their pleas in two separate proceedings before federal judges in Manhattan on Jan. 16. Both had been indicted on the federal charges a day earlier.

The two were indicted on credit card fraud charges after unidentified investigators were quoted as saying in news reports recently that they did not believe Shah and Azmath were in any way linked to the terror attacks.

The two men had left Newark, New Jersey, for San Antonio by plane on the day of the attacks, but were stranded in St. Louis after all flights across the United States were grounded following the terrorist strikes.

The two then boarded an Amtrak train and were in Texas when they were apprehended by authorities, who found two box cutters, hair dye, a knife and thousands of dollars on them.

The two were held and interrogated closely because box cutters were believed to have been used as weapons by the terrorists who hijacked four aircraft on Sept. 11. Two were crashed into the twin towers of the World Trade Center in New York, one into the Pentagon in Washington, while the last plane, apparently headed for the White House, crashed in Pennsylvania, after passengers grappled with the terrorists.

Lawrence Feitell, the lawyer representing Shah, was quoted as saying by news reports that it was not unusual for his client to carry a box cutter as he worked at a newsstand, “where the blades are used to open boxes and bundles of newspapers.”

The lawyer also expressed the hope that Shah would be let off lightly as “the case was now on a different track, unrelated to terrorism.” Shah is accused of selling some 15 credits cards for about $1,000 apiece, which were used to withdraw cash or buy goods worth an estimated $414,000. According to his lawyer, Shah is likely to face up to two years in jail if convicted. Azmath, on the other hand, is likely to face less than six months in prison, if convicted. He has been accused of stealing less than $15,000.

I wonder if they have served (or are serving) time.

45 posted on 06/16/2002 7:25:06 PM PDT by syriacus
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To: thinden
This is an old article, but I just came across it for the first time.

Red faces over suspects’ Indian passports
Swati Chaturvedi
(New Delhi, September 17)

An "Indian connection" with the bombing of the World Trade Center wasn't something that the Indian government had bargained for.

Having watched with glee the heat being applied on Pakistan, it's now the turn of the Indian government to squirm. For it turns out that two of the suspects caught in the US are believed to have Indian passports. With the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) asking the authorities here to come up with more information on the two, there are red faces in the Home Ministry.

The two suspects have identified themselves as Ayub Ali Khan and Mohammed Javeed Azmath and claim to be from India. Both are in their early 50s.

The FBI has told the Indian Government that the duo had "fake-looking passports”. This scenario is similar to the hijack of Indian Airlines flight IC-814 where four of the hijackers had procured passports through touts. Ostensibly, the system had been overhauled and new checks introduced. However, as the latest case proves, it is still relatively easy to fool the system.

Says a senior official at the Research and Analysis Wing: "If this turns out to be a case of security lapse, we will really have egg on our face after all our pious pronouncements on terrorism.” What officials really fear is that the two could be Arabs or Pakistanis who took advantage of the touts to get passports. It's almost a replay of Kandahar as the suspects there had also managed to get passports issued using fake names very easily.

At that point the Home Ministry had debated how to make the system foolproof. Sources say while the situation has improved in Delhi, other passport offices continue to be plagued by touts.

Fake Indians?

* Ayub Ali Khan and Mohammed Azmath picked up from Amtrak train

* Caught with box cutters, hair dye and $5,000

* Claim to be from Gorakhpur and Bangalore

* They could be Arabs or Pakistanis who got passports through touts

* Theirs and Kandahar hijackers’ case could stamp India as a haven for fake passport seekers


46 posted on 06/16/2002 7:34:01 PM PDT by syriacus
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To: syriacus
Tuesday, May 7, 2002
Families in India anxious for release of two men detained in United States after Sept. 11 attack
By OMER FAROOQ Associated Press Writer

HYDERABAD, India (AP) - Almost eight months after two Indian Muslims were detained in Texas for questioning about the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, their families still don't know when they'll be home, though both have long since been cleared of involvement.

The two remain in custody in the United States on unrelated charges of credit card fraud that prosecutors said surfaced during a background investigation. Pretrial hearings in the case, in which both men have pleaded innocent, are scheduled to begin this month in a U.S. federal court in New York.

The wait has been agonizing for the families of Gul Mohammed Shah, 36, and Mohammed Jawed Azmath, 38, who knew nothing about the credit card charges until January.

"We are in a total despair. Eight months is not a short period," Gul Begum, Shah's 75-year-old mother, told The Associated Press.

Syeda Fatima, Shah's sister, said that she had written letters to U.S. and Indian authorities including U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, Indian Foreign Minister Jaswant Singh and the National Human Rights Commission in New Delhi - none of which have been answered.

The two men were taken off a train at Fort Worth, Texas, when police found them carrying boxcutters, several thousand dollars in cash and hair dye. The hijackers of the airliners that smashed into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon are believed to have used boxcutters.

On the day of the attacks, Azmath and Khan were on a flight from New Jersey to Texas but boarded the train when the flight was diverted to Missouri.

The two told authorities that the tools were for their work at a newsstand in New Jersey and that they were heading for Texas to find new jobs.

They were cleared of suspicion in the hijackings in January but kept in custody on charges of credit card fraud.

Shah is accused of selling 10 to 15 credit cards for about dlrs 1,000 each to other parties, who then used the cards to obtain cash or buy goods and services estimated at dlrs 414,000. He likely would face up to two years behind bars if convicted.

Azmath, if convicted, would likely face less than six months in prison because he was accused of stealing less than dlrs 15,000 through credit card fraud.

The dates for their pretrial hearing in a Manhattan federal court have been set for May 10 and May 17.

"We all will be looking forward to the hearing and pray for a positive outcome," said Tasleema, Azmath's wife.

Time may be running out for Tasleema, a 22-year-old Pakistani.

Her visa expires on May 29 and local police have asked her to leave India. She would likely be able to extend her visa if her husband were here with her.

"I have pleaded my case before police and told them that my husband is under arrest in New York," she said. "The officials have promised to help."

She gave birth to a son in December while her husband was in custody.


47 posted on 06/16/2002 7:50:14 PM PDT by syriacus
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To: syriacus
Thursday, June 6, 2002
Man arrested Sept. 12 with box cutters pleads guilty to fraud
By LARRY NEUMEISTER Associated Press Writer
NEW YORK (AP) - One of two men arrested with box cutters a day after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks pleaded guilty Thursday to credit card fraud charges.

Mohammed Azmath, 37, is scheduled to be sentenced Sept. 17 and could face eight to 14 months in prison.

Lawyer Anthony Ricco said his client might qualify for sentencing as soon as July under a special program set up to quickly process Sept. 11 detainees who admit crimes unrelated to terrorism.

Prosecutors said Azmath sold personal information to someone who obtained credit cards in his name, purchasing $58,747 in services and merchandise. Ricco said his client received only several hundred dollars for his part in the conspiracy.

Ricco said he suspected Azmath will be deported to India rather than serve the sentence because he entered the country illegally in 1999.

"He would like to stay, but he's very happy to go home," Ricco said of his client, who has a wife in Hyderabad, India.

Azmath and Syed Gul Mohammed Shah, 36, boarded a plane in Newark, N.J., on Sept. 11 to go to San Antonio. They were stranded in St. Louis when their plane was grounded along with all other air traffic after the terrorist attacks.

The men then got on an Amtrak train to Texas, where they were arrested after authorities found two box cutters, hair dye, a knife and several thousand dollars among their belongings.

Ricco said his client was not allowed to see a lawyer for three months and had been subjected to harsh treatment, including having his toe broken by a jail guard.

"He's been roughed up, cursed at, locked outside in the rain for five hours several times," Ricco said.
An associate warden at the Metropolitan Detention Center in Brooklyn, where Azmath has been held, did not return a telephone message Thursday.

Azmath and Shah were initial suspects in the sprawling terrorism probe, especially when it was learned that men who hijacked four planes on Sept. 11 used box cutters to overpower flight crews.

Later, investigators concluded the men were not linked to terrorism.

Shah has pleaded innocent to similar fraud charges.


48 posted on 06/16/2002 7:59:21 PM PDT by syriacus
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To: syriacus
This is the one. I still think that Azmath is a dead ringer for John Doe #2. I believe, truth being known, he was in the states illegally in 95 too. Everything about the drawing matches his face. Chin, eyebrows, lips, eyes, expression. I don't think Padilla looks anything like the drawing.
49 posted on 06/16/2002 8:11:19 PM PDT by WVNan
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To: WVNan
I believe, truth being known, he was in the states illegally in 95 too

I agree with you. Even both men's families admit their sons were here 9 years ago.

The family of Gul Mohammed Shah [aka Ayub Khan] even admits the two men were here illegally back then.

(From post 47) Shah is accused of selling 10 to 15 credit cards for about dlrs 1,000 each to other parties, who then used the cards to obtain cash or buy goods and services estimated at dlrs 414,000.

I wonder what names were on those credit cards.

Both the men seem pretty good at fakery and fraud. I bet it wouldn't be too hard for them to help a lot of illegals obtain more than mere credit cards. Also, it could be that the people who bought the credit cards also used the cards as aids in assuming false identities.

50 posted on 06/16/2002 9:14:14 PM PDT by syriacus
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