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"Brutus" Number I
Constitution Society ^ | 18 October 1787 | Anti-Federalist Papers

Posted on 12/06/2001 12:04:43 PM PST by Jim Robinson

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1 posted on 12/06/2001 12:04:43 PM PST by Jim Robinson
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To: Jim Robinson
A free republic will never keep a standing army to execute its laws.

This was another one that jumped out at me when I first read the "Anti-Federalist Papers." We've come a long way -- and I'm not at all happy at where we are.

2 posted on 12/06/2001 12:14:11 PM PST by Publius
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To: Jim Robinson; GovernmentShrinker
Bump and bookmarked for latter
3 posted on 12/06/2001 12:14:17 PM PST by Free the USA
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To: Jim Robinson
The Federalist Papers?  Now there's a subversive set of documents if I ever saw some.  I would that we had heeded the wisdom expressed in them.  Just these few highlited comments in red offer enough wisdom to keep us busy for the rest of our lives.

Momentous then is the question you have to determine, and you are called upon by every motive which should influence a noble and virtuous mind, to examine it well, and to make up a wise judgment. It is insisted, indeed, that this constitution must be received, be it ever so imperfect. If it has its defects, it is said, they can be best amended when they are experienced. But remember, when the people once part with power, they can seldom or never resume it again but by force. Many instances can be produced in which the people have voluntarily increased the powers of their rulers; but few, if any, in which rulers have willingly abridged their authority. This is a sufficient reason to induce you to be careful, in the first instance, how you deposit the powers of government.

A free republic will never keep a standing army to execute its laws. It must depend upon the support of its citizens. But when a government is to receive its support from the aid of the citizens, it must be so constructed as to have the confidence, respect, and affection of the people." Men who, upon the call of the magistrate, offer themselves to execute the laws, are influenced to do it either by affection to the government, or from fear; where a standing army is at hand to punish offenders, every man is actuated by the latter principle, and therefore, when the magistrate calls, will obey: but, where this is not the case, the government must rest for its support upon the confidence and respect which the people have for their government and laws. The body of the people being attached, the government will always be sufficient to support and execute its laws, and to operate upon the fears of any faction which may be opposed to it, not only to prevent an opposition to the execution of the laws themselves, but also to compel the most of them to aid the magistrate; but the people will not be likely to have such confidence in their rulers, in a republic so extensive as the United States, as necessary for these purposes. The confidence which the people have in their rulers, in a free republic, arises from their knowing them, from their being responsible to them for their conduct, and from the power they have of displacing them when they misbehave: but in a republic of the extent of this continent, the people in general would be acquainted with very few of their rulers: the people at large would know little of their proceedings, and it would be extremely difficult to change them. The people in Georgia and New-Hampshire would not know one another's mind, and therefore could not act in concert to enable them to effect a general change of representatives. The different parts of so extensive a country could not possibly be made acquainted with the conduct of their representatives, nor be informed of the reasons upon which measures were founded. The consequence will be, they will have no confidence in their legislature, suspect them of ambitious views, be jealous of every measure they adopt, and will not support the laws they pass. Hence the government will be nerveless and inefficient, and no way will be left to render it otherwise, but by establishing an armed force to execute the laws at the point of the bayonet — a government of all others the most to be dreaded.

Thank you very much Jim.  The extensive study of the Federalist Papers and other documents circa the period surrounding the creation of our nation, would lead one to realize that WE HAVE ALLOWED OUR NATION TO BECOME SOMETHING THAT HAD NEVER BEEN THE INTENTION OF OUR FOREFATHERS.  And how much less the realization of the ideal will be, should we persue the move toward globalism and world government.  Every step that removes the individual citizen farther away from the seat of decision making that affects their lives, the worse their lives will become.

It is the socialist state that we have become that disturbs me, and the complete and utter lack of individuals to recognize it, that convinces me that we are powerless to right the ship of state.  Only through the concerted focused efforts of an entity such as FreeRepublic, could that possibly be reversed.  Onward then...

4 posted on 12/06/2001 12:39:29 PM PST by DoughtyOne
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To: Jim Robinson
Reading this practically reduced me to tears ...... Someday, somewhere, free men shall again walk this earth.
5 posted on 12/06/2001 1:11:18 PM PST by thusevertotyrants
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To: Jim Robinson
Now the question is, can the people who frequant this forum realize that what this means is, its not the Democrats' fault with the Republicans being the good guys - thefault is with the Federal government - ALL of it, all its people, all its factions, all its institutions
6 posted on 12/06/2001 1:16:34 PM PST by thusevertotyrants
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To: Jim Robinson
Bump!
7 posted on 12/06/2001 1:16:45 PM PST by CJ Wolf
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To: CJ Wolf
Pulling it all together, what we have right here in our own country are all of the ingredients necessary for a totalitarian police state. We have a federal government that nobody in his right mind would trust, which lies to us incessantly, uses illegal force against its citizens with impunity, and collaborates with totalitarian dictators under cover of a massive propaganda campaign conducted by our supposedly free press. Our major information media are dominated by closet totalitarians who pay lip service to democracy while covertly promoting the interests of communist despots. The political opposition is made up largely of cowards who are so intimidated by our totalitarian propaganda media they are unable to offer effective resistance to even the most egregious violations of civil liberties by the corrupt Clinton regime. They have become, in the fullest sense of the term, Weimar Republicans. And finally, we have that which makes it all possible, a listless, docile, dumbed-down public who gape mindlessly at all of the above phenomena without the slightest glimmer of comprehension, and prattle the latest propaganda cliches dumped into their empty heads by the mainstream media.

The Elian affair has truly given us a glimpse into the abyss of tyranny. The message that comes through loud and clear is that the system isn't working. The question that remains to be answered is whether we still possess the intelligence and fortitude necessary to fix it.

Edward Zehr can be reached at ezehr@capaccess.org

Published in the May. 22, 2000 issue of The Washington Weekly

Copyright 2000 The Washington Weekly.

8 posted on 12/06/2001 1:18:32 PM PST by f.Christian
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To: f.Christian
Yes yes and yes, right up until you get to the Elian part ..... The way I saw it, the Elian saga was one all too rare instance where the Fed actually realized and exercised their proper role. The decision was Elian's father's to make, and noone elses.
9 posted on 12/06/2001 1:23:15 PM PST by thusevertotyrants
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To: thusevertotyrants
A LOOK INTO THE ABYSS

What Elian Tells Us About Ourselves

By Edward Zehr

"They have become, in the fullest sense of the term, Weimar Republicans."

Oh no, the reader thinks upon seeing the subtitle of this piece, not another article about Elian. But this series of articles is only incidentally about Elian -- it's really about us and what is happening to us. The Elian affair is like a mirror that reflects our hidden face, the one we never identify with ourselves because we always imagine that it belongs to somebody else.

For example, I get e-mail from people who have chanced to read one or more of these articles and drop me a cordial line or two just to let me know what a numbskull I am. After all, the way I tell the story is not the way they have heard it. If my version were correct it would mean that they have been grossly misinformed, and the implications of that are too terrible to contemplate.

It would mean that in order to be properly informed they would have to stop skating over the surface of issues such as these, letting the anchor people do all the heavy lifting, and start doing their own thinking. But thinking can be kind of like work. Besides, a lot of people just don't quite have the hang of it. The raw material required to do one's own thinking consists of facts gathered from a wide variety of sources, not just the one that happens to materialize when the TV set is switched on.

The "facts" presented by the mass media are typically folded into a smarmy batter of tendentious fiction calculated to elicit a response from the viewer that will be useful in advancing the hidden agenda which the presstitutes are paid to promote. The viewer, who does not comprehend that he or she is being manipulated responds emotionally, as though watching a soap opera or a TV series. After all, most people have a lot more experience responding emotionally to TV plots than they have at thinking critically and analytically. The script writer manipulates the emotions of the audience who respond in a predictable fashion. The viewers are being conditioned to react in a certain way. The leap from the semi-conscious emotional response evoked by TV "entertainment" to the conditioned response elicited by the politically motivated propaganda inserted into "news" presentations is a short one.

THE FACE IN THE MIRROR

The black-shirted, brown-shirted and red-banner-waving totalitarians of the twentieth century missed the point on a grand scale. All that rough stuff is really unnecessary in building a totalitarian state. In fact, if overdone, it tends to give the game away. Goebbels was the one who had it right, not Himmler. Concentration camps are a drain on the economy. That doesn't mean that you cannot turn the occasional group of retrograde religious fundies into crispy critters if...

10 posted on 12/06/2001 1:30:02 PM PST by f.Christian
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To: thusevertotyrants
Kai su, Teknon?
11 posted on 12/06/2001 1:30:52 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic
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To: Doctor Stochastic
say what?
12 posted on 12/06/2001 1:33:34 PM PST by thusevertotyrants
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To: Doctor Stochastic
If your comment is in referance to the Elian ordeal, then here goes: The decisions regarding the future of an 8 year old boy rest with his parents - even if those parents have political idealogies different from our own. Elians relatives in Miami, although well meaning, in the end were eventually keeping the boy away from his father, supposedly for his best interest but thats not whats really relevant here. Bottom line is, they were kidnappers - The police force took the child from the kidnappers and gave him back to his father - end of story. It seems to be a very unpopular stance to take, but I offer that I have no interest and never HAD any interest in what was best for Elian - my interest is in how to defend liberty - i.e. - my right to make decisions for myself and for my dependants
13 posted on 12/06/2001 1:39:53 PM PST by thusevertotyrants
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To: thusevertotyrants
Janet Copperfield...you like him?
14 posted on 12/06/2001 2:04:05 PM PST by f.Christian
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To: thusevertotyrants
You gotta be kidding. Busting down a citizen's door and coming after him in the dead of night with hooded machine gunners to take a six year old boy is the federal government's duty?
15 posted on 12/06/2001 2:20:58 PM PST by Jim Robinson
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To: thusevertotyrants
"..the fault is with..." By design I believe. I don't think the founding fathers believed there to be a perfect govenment so they set it up to be inefficient in order for it to be able to do the least amount of damage.

I've no business commenting really--I haven't read the entire article. It's long. I need to print it out and read it.

16 posted on 12/06/2001 2:23:02 PM PST by Boxsford
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To: thusevertotyrants
'kidnappers'? They may have wanted something for that boy that their father didn't, but they did not kidnap the child. His mother brought him over here. (or attempted to do so) Still, I follow you about the rights of the father. Something sorely missing in this nation too. Our gov. was way out of line, however, they should have gone through the court system. That avenue had not been exhausted.
17 posted on 12/06/2001 2:31:26 PM PST by Boxsford
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To: Luis Gonzalez
bttt
18 posted on 12/06/2001 2:35:47 PM PST by f.Christian
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To: thusevertotyrants
"Kidnappers"? You bought into the whole ball of lies from the left. The DoJ requested, on more than one occasion, that the Federal Courts deciding the case, issue an order compelling the Lazaro Gonzalez family to turn Elian over to Juan Miguel, the Federal Court refused to act in that manner each and every time the request was made. Furthermore, those same Federal Judges issued a Court order mandating that Elian remain on US soil until his case had been heard, and a decision rendered.

The DoJ had a warrant sworn out for one Elian Gonzalez, an illegal alien, believed to be hiding at "(insert Lazaro's address here)". Elian was here under a Federal Court order, impossible to be here illegally if a Federal Courts tells you that you can't leave, and if he was indeed arrested, his Miranda rights were never read to him, and council was denied.

Elian Gonzalez was born out of wedlock, and Juan Miguel was a non-custodial parent. There where no tests run to authenticate the claim of fatherhood on Juan Miguel's part. When originally interviewed in Cuba by a US INS agent, Juan Miguel was asked whether he would like to go to the USA to get Elian, he answered "no".

Do you believe that in the US, courts should award custody of an orphaned child to a non-custodial parent without ascertaining paternity first?

You are supporting one of the most criminal acts perpetrated by the Clinton administration, and a violation of at least two, if not more, amendments to the Constitution.

19 posted on 12/06/2001 3:28:59 PM PST by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Luis Gonzalez
bttt
20 posted on 12/06/2001 4:29:24 PM PST by f.Christian
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