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The Scout, the suspect and the SWAT team Shooting:
Baltimore Sun ^ | 18 March 2002 | Gail Gibson, Michael James and Laura Barnhardt

Posted on 03/18/2002 3:06:32 AM PST by Lloyd227

Edited on 09/03/2002 4:50:07 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

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To: Melinator
"Pheasants" LOL! Sort of like trap and skeet: "PULL!"
141 posted on 03/18/2002 2:19:36 PM PST by Travis McGee
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To: harpseal
I note that a significant part of my book involves fed up local LEOs doing an "after hours" op in POVs against the STU base.
142 posted on 03/18/2002 2:22:57 PM PST by Travis McGee
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To: fogarty
It sounds to me that Christopher Barga was an Affirmative Action hire employed to fulfill The FBI's quota for Idiot-Americans!
143 posted on 03/18/2002 2:23:41 PM PST by albee
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To: Lloyd227
I hope the author isn't trying to downplay the fact that this young man has earned Eagle Scout: something that's very tough to earn. It's a TREMENDOUS investment of time and effort, and it's only gotten harder in recent years.

But, some boys keep at it. Worth noting: an entire patrol of my troop - seven boys total - recently earned their Eagle. That's 35% of the troop, where nationally it's maybe 2-5% of all Boy Scouts go on to earn Eagle.

I like to believe that that indicates something: the pendulum is swinging back. The dreks at the FBI - and their power-mad handlers - have nothing on the generation that will supplant them in the coming decades.

144 posted on 03/18/2002 2:28:43 PM PST by Darth Sidious
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To: harpseal
If I remember correctly they made a civil rights violation charge against him and the local FBI did come in for awhile but I can't recall what they did. This was back in 95 or 96 when I had an injury that took me off the road, so my focus was on re-hab.

This will probably sound tin foil hattish but I believe we will continue to lose our rights and slide to tyranny because of our moral decline. It's just hard to tell if we'll go out with a whimper or have another civil war.

I'm thinking war.

145 posted on 03/18/2002 2:40:18 PM PST by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Travis McGee
I know quite a few that are fed up LOL.
146 posted on 03/18/2002 2:43:10 PM PST by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Cap'n Crunch
I don't think the nation has been this dangerously split since 1860.
147 posted on 03/18/2002 4:18:52 PM PST by Travis McGee
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To: Darth Sidious
You are underestimating the potentcy of Federal bureaucracy, my boy. Go and check out the Norman Mineta thread -- the Feebs are growing mightly this year, and many a good scout will be lost to a culture of no account gold-brickers.
148 posted on 03/18/2002 4:23:07 PM PST by bvw
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To: bvw
Yep, I agree. The FBI has never really been about law enforcement. They are a domestic intelligence agency, which is the same thing that the Gestapo and the Tontons Macoutes were: secret police. A republic such as ours doesn't require such an agency and in fact is put in danger by its existence.
149 posted on 03/18/2002 4:50:56 PM PST by Twodees
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To: bvw
Such changes were always sold as necessities. I remember being taught in jr. high school that the Civil Service Act was passed to end the spoils system. That's an odd thing to call the flushing out of bureaucrats at the end of a presidential administration. Ending the spoils system benefitted the political class by establishing a permanent segment of that class in DC to insure continuity for the less assuredly permanent positions of career politicians holding elective office.

The Civil Service Act should be repealed along with the 14th through 17th amendments. Of course, IMO, the list of what is ripe for repeal would probably be nearly impossible for me to complete in the time left to me.

150 posted on 03/18/2002 5:03:41 PM PST by Twodees
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To: Lloyd227
Whatever spin the FBI gives this matter, it's clear that the entire operation, not just the stop, was bungled. I have no doubt whatsoever that the FBI will declare this a "justified shooting" and none of the Keystone Kops will be disciplined or relieved. And I have no doubt whatsoever that a jury, if it gets that far, will decide for the two victims. The FBI doesn't give one single damn about that -- it's your money.
151 posted on 03/18/2002 5:20:47 PM PST by Whilom
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Comment #152 Removed by Moderator

To: Travis McGee
Law enforcement currently suffers from three plagues :

1. Militarization

2. Federalization

3. Politicization

"Takedown" stops w/o clearly marked cars and uniforms are not "cool". Why approach the vehicle and leave cover if you are so "certain" that the situation is that "hot"? etc. etc. etc.

153 posted on 03/18/2002 8:20:48 PM PST by lawdog
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To: lawdog
"Why approach the vehicle and leave cover if you are so "certain" that the situation is that "hot"?'

From the evidence and their record, it would appear that this bunch simply enjoys the thrill of the kill.

and for those of you still in the business, clean up your industry or get out. What comes next will not be pretty.

154 posted on 03/18/2002 8:27:13 PM PST by Lloyd227
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To: lawdog
No doubt about it, and it's far more dangerous than 90% of Americans realize, or have ever even thought about.

That's why I'm writing the book; have you read this excerpt? "The Raid: New Fiction from the War On Domestic Terrorism"

155 posted on 03/18/2002 8:27:46 PM PST by Travis McGee
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To: Lloyd227
They bring their ultra gung ho "pray for war" mentality directly from the Rangers, SEALs, Marines etc to federal law enforcement SWAT teams.

These federal SWAT guys are not in any way investigators; they are hit men, pure and simple, with itchy trigger fingers.

156 posted on 03/18/2002 8:30:34 PM PST by Travis McGee
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To: Lloyd227
It's time for these people to remember what "Public Servant" means.

Bump that.

157 posted on 03/18/2002 8:42:20 PM PST by cascademountaineer
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To: nunya bidness;Travis McGee

"From the horse's mouth"

For Immediate Release

January 21, 1998

Washington D.C. FBI National Press Office

Following the recent arrests of law enforcement officers in West New York, New Jersey; Starr County, Texas; Detroit, Michigan; and Cleveland, Ohio,

FBI Director Louis J. Freeh today said, "The insidious nature of police corruption inherently undermines the confidence of the American people in one of the basic tenets of democracy--that law enforcement officers will honestly and fairly protect and serve the citizens to whom they answer. The selfish and deceitful acts of a few cannot be allowed to impugn the integrity of the law enforcement profession. For these reasons, vigorous investigation of police corruption is a FBI national priority and will remain so."

Freeh made the comments following the arrest by FBI Special Agents today of 59 persons in the Cleveland area, including 42 officers from five law enforcement agencies in Cleveland and its suburbs charged in Federal warrants with conspiracy to distribute cocaine. The defendants include 18 police officers and 24 corrections officers. The agencies are the Cleveland Police Department; Cuyahoga County Sheriff's Office in Cleveland; Cleveland Heights Police Department; East Cleveland Police Department; and the Brooklyn, Ohio, Police Department. Nine other persons accused of impersonating law enforcement officers also were charged with conspiracy to distribute cocaine. In addition, eight persons were charged in an FBI undercover operation against organized crime.

"Great credit must go to the overwhelming majority of honest police throughout the country, including those in the Cleveland area, for their vigorous efforts to prevent and combat corruption," Freeh said. "National law enforcement organizations also have been unrelenting in efforts against corruption, and the FBI is proud to be the partner of all in this essential work. Nation-wide organizations taking such major steps include the International Association of Chiefs of Police, the National Sheriffs' Association, and the Major City Chiefs."

Freeh said part of the national scope of the allegations of police corruption was also shown in three other separate cases in which the FBI made arrests in the past week:

Three Detroit police officers were charged on January 14 with conspiring to commit a robbery of approximately $1 million. In Starr County, Texas, the sheriff, a justice of the peace, and five county jailers were charged on January 14 with bribery and conspiracy to commit bribery. Nine current or former West New York, New Jersey, police officers were charged on January 13 with racketeering involving protection of prostitution and illegal gambling.

"Those arrested and charged are innocent until proven guilty but I cite corruption allegations, particularly those systemic in nature, as part of a pattern that is of growing concern to all honest local, state, and federal law enforcement personnel throughout the country," Freeh said.

Freeh said, "In recent years the FBI has arrested police officers for corruption in every region of the nation, in large, medium-sized and small cities, towns and villages; from the inner city precincts to rural sheriff's departments.

"Statistics show the FBI's commitment in fighting these threats to the integrity of the criminal justice system," Freeh said. "From 1994 to 1997, a total of 508 persons were convicted in law enforcement corruption cases investigated by the FBI. Many more officers were convicted in cases stemming from organized crime, drugs, or on other non-corruption statutory basis. Nearly 45 percent of the police corruption cases during that period were drug related."

"To their great credit, police officials throughout the nation support efforts to expose corruption and many departments have created significant reforms," Freeh said. "We are all in this together and must join forces to root out corruption at every level: local, state, and federal; police departments from our largest cities to our smallest hamlets; sheriff's departments from urban areas to the most sparsely-settled countryside.

"No law enforcement agency, and certainly not the FBI, is immune from the scourge of corruption. The FBI is as tough or tougher on its own personnel as on any other agency, and we have arrested FBI Special Agents, and obtained convictions, on a variety of charges," Freeh said.

"Police corruption knows no state or regional borders. It must be attacked not only by everyone in the law enforcement profession but also by elected officials from the governor's office to the state legislature to the mayor's office to the city council," Freeh said. "Ultimately, it is the public that must demand from their elected officials and law enforcement executives an absolute commitment to integrity."

Freeh said, "Police corruption aids criminals and reduces the level of protection that police give to the public, particularly in those neighborhoods already victimized by crime. Law enforcement must have 100 percent dedication to its sacred oath to protect the public from harm, but corrupt police officers will not protect the public from anything--not the worst crimes.

"All law enforcement agencies must work to make certain that the men and women of their departments are held to the highest standards of integrity, and I cannot stress strongly enough the importance of joint, cooperative efforts by the FBI with all other law enforcement agencies in the nation to go forward together in this crucial fight against corruption," Freeh said.

"Together, we must ensure that the law enforcement profession hires only the best; trains those officers regarding integrity issues; closely supervises them; and aggressively investigates when allegations of misconduct arise. For it is only through a clear, forceful and united message by the vast majority of honest and dedicated law enforcement professionals-- that corruption will not be tolerated--that we can hope to retain the trust and confidence of the American people," Freeh said.

"For the FBI, a vigorous anti-corruption program is among our highest national priorities, and will continue to be," Freeh said.

158 posted on 03/19/2002 3:12:43 AM PST by Donald Stone
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Comment #159 Removed by Moderator

Comment #160 Removed by Moderator

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