Mannix the Liberal vs. Kulongowski the Conservative?

Oregon Magazine ^ | Aug, 2002 | Larry Leonard

[EBUCK]

It was an amazing end to July. Kevin Mannix, the Republican candidate for Oregon governor said that those employees whose retirement plan losses at PGE were due to the shenanigans at parent company ENRON, should receive compensation from the state.

If you live in Oregon, that would be from you. (The money the state spends comes out of your pocket.)

Next, Ted Kulongowski, the Democrat candidate for Oregon governor said that considering the tight fiscal situation the state faces, bailing those employees out that way is not a good idea.

Did you follow that?

The conservative wants to spend tax dollars covering the losses of people who work for a private company, and the liberal does not. It's like Hitler barring the way into a death camp, and the Jews fighting to get in.

The fair question to ask is, what's next?

Well, there's the matter of the schools. Mannix could continue adjusting his image to the left by offering to triple state support. Kulongowski, heading to the right, could demand teacher pay cuts. Only the terminally stupid would believe either man, but the terminally stupid comprise a surprisingly large portion of the general public.

You can identify them easily. They're all around you. They call "rap" music. They support arrest quotas based on racial, gender and sexual preference numbers. They think PBS is a non-partisan network, Democrats are not connected with big business, Janet Reno had nothing to do with Clinton escaping Senate conviction on the impeachment charges, Terry McAuliff never made a stock investment that gave him an 18,000% return, John McCain had nothing to do with the Keating Five, the Oregon Health Plan doesn't cover illegal aliens and Br'er Rabbit hates briar patches.

Well, Clinton proved it works. These days, a politican can tell the American public anything he wants. No matter how big the lie, how titanic the hypocrisy, the American public will mostly believe it. Up is down, wrong is right, day is night. It was P.T. Barnum who said you could never go broke underestimating the taste of the American public. Seems that holds for intelligence, now, as well.

Maybe I'll write in Clint Eastwood. Or that cartoon guy who sells propane in Texas. We need a real cowboy, I think. A straight shooter. Are there any left? (LL)

[EBUCK]

This Mannix guy is a RAT in RINO clothing. He's a gun grabber and a liar. If this is what we're going to have to choose between come Nov. we're never getting out of this funk.

EBUCK

[EBUCK]

Check this out.

EBUCK

[B Knotts]

What makes you say he's a gun grabber? He wasn't my first choice, but he has still made it clear he is against raising taxes, which Kulongoski would certainly try to do.

[EBUCK]

Go to Oregon Firearms Federation (OFF) and get into the links.

http://www.oregonfirearms.org/

http://oregonfirearms.org/news/audio.html
(This is an audio link to his house floor speech)

He's not the worst we have to contend with but he's not what he makes himself out to be, not by a long shot.

EBUCK

[EBUCK]

but he has still made it clear he is against raising taxes

He's against raising taxes but not against increased spending. Increased spending cannot be done without increasing taxes eventually. That's the gimmick IMO. Eventually the budget will be so overrun that increasing taxes will become necessary and "excusable" because we are so far in the red.

Bush is doing the same thing. While I do enjoy the tax cut we got he has done nothing to cut spending, as a matter of fact he's increased spending substantially. Same mistake his father made.

EBUCK

[B Knotts]

Well, he supposedly wants to cut other areas, to increase spending on police and colleges.

I voted for Jack Roberts in the primary, as I thought he was a marginally better choice, but now it's down to Mannix vs. Kulongoski, which is a no-brainer.

[EBUCK]

I voted for Jack Roberts in the primary, as I thought he was a marginally better choice, but now it's down to Mannix vs. Kulongoski, which is a no-brainer.

I hope he lives up to his rhetoric. I'll end up voting for Mannix only if he answers the following questions I've sent to him correctly.

1. If elected, what will you do about the wildfire situation?

2. If elected, what will you do to support Oregon's constitutionaly guranteed right to keep and bear arms?

3. If elected, what will you do to get Oregon's economy back on track?

EBUCK

[ThreeYearLurker]

He's not a rat in RINO clothing, he is a rat. He has been all his life until 1997. He didn't fool me, and that's why I didn't vote for him in the primary. If you are a conservative in Oregon, you are guaranteed to be screwed for at least the next four years.

[EBUCK]

If you are a conservative in Oregon, you are guaranteed to be screwed for at least the next four years.

And I was in such a good mood, until you posted that. Thanks.

EBUCK

[AuntB]

It seems all of them will say whatever it takes to get the liberal/enviro vote. Where the heck we go from here? We have to vote Mannix. I wish it were not so, but it is.

[EBUCK]

Sucks to be us. Lesser of two....oh whatever...this sucks.

EBUCK

[AuntB]

Sucks. Yes, indeed.

[WaterDragon]

I'm going to vote for Mannix THIS time, but he will definitely be ON PROBATION for four years.

I couldn't agree with you less about Bush, EBUCK. He has indeed slowed down the Democratic Congress spending as much as he could. It will take time for this nation to be weaned away from wanting a nanny gov't. Did you see that news item about the National Firefighters Union coming out against him for not giving them as much MORE money as they wanted?

We have to get him a Republican Congress this fall, and then hold the Republicans feet to the fire over taxes and for holding the socialists in our government-funded academia and federal bureaucracies accountable.

[blackie]

Them's the breaks...I'll vote for Mannix...sigh...

[EBUCK]

I couldn't agree with you less about Bush, EBUCK.

2003 proposed Presedential Federal Budget = 2.1 trillion.
Last year = 1.87 trillion.

Sorry, but I don't see it, that's an 11% increase.

Granted, if Gore were elected last it could be a slightly greater increase but "better" aint good enough for me.

As always, respectfully,

EBUCK

[EBUCK]

..sigh..indeed. Perhaps Mannix will allow some thinning at least.

EBUCK

[blackie]

Maybe...and he won't veto the helmet law repeal like Kizzy did, everytime...

[Clinging Bitterly]

> the terminally stupid comprise a surprisingly large portion of the general public

Yup.

A lot of what's said here about Mannix, I can believe.
It has not been all that long since he was a proud Democrat.

It's sad that of all the Republicans in the primary, Mannix was hands down the best choice. I did actually hold my nose when I punched out his chad.

And it's predictable that Ted K would run to the right of him, and that other Democrats are also running to the right on guns and other issues, such as taxes.
Recent polls confirm that the public is still opposed to tax increases to solve the current pretend budget crisis.

As for Hank Hill, I dunno. I like him, and we like our propane grills, but he and Ma Richards are a bit too chummy for my comfort.

Dave in Eugene

[EBUCK]

Now that would be great. I'd sing his praises from here to Bend if I wasn't required by law (or insurance companies as it were) to wear a helmet while getting there.

EBUCK

[EBUCK]

It's sad that of all the Republicans in the primary, Mannix was hands down the best choice. I did actually hold my nose when I punched out his chad.

Being a registered LPer I didn't have the "pleasure" of voting in your primary. It almost seems as though they put up a crappy candidate on purpose, but just crappy enough to not be as crappy as the other guy.

Can you imagine if Car dealers worked in the same fashion? People would be riding bikes in no time.

EBUCK

[blackie]

I like wearing a full face helmet when riding fast as I don't like fairings or windshields.

I also like not wearing one while puttin' around town...

It should be our choice, as are most things the government controls...

Freedom Is Worth Fighting For !!

Molon Labe !!

[blackie]

I didn't vote in the pubbie primary either...
I'm a registered Independent... :o)

Molon Labe !!

[EBUCK]

I used to be independant but the lack of mail from the independant non-party prompted me to seek out an existing group of folks from which I could stay informed.

EBUCK

[EBUCK]

It should be our choice, as are most things the government controls...

It's funny how the insurance companies got the gubment to put forward the idea that helmets lower "collective" insurance costs. In the same way that they got seatbelts forced on us too. I know for a fact that seatbelt/helmet laws, in fact, did not lower my insurance bill one red cent. Hysteria mixed with some really gruesome pictures pulls that off every time.

EBUCK

[blackie]

I get plenty of info from the people and groups I donate money to... :o)

[blackie]

The only thing that lowers the cost on anything, is free market competition...not government regulations... :o)

Freedom Is Worth Fighting For !!

Molon Labe !!

[Clinging Bitterly]

Well ya know I used to be more of a Republican than these days. Quit the county GOP committee some years ago. It was obsessed with one issue (Lon Mabon's) at the expense of other important stuff. The party was, and probably still is, seriously divided, and the anti-Mabon side would, after you did away with the issue of gays, make a very fine bunch of Democrats.

I usually voted with the conservatives (and I do oppose the promotion of homosexuality in schools, gay marriage, abortion without parental permission, etc.), but the local party never had much to say, in the presence of the media, on the fiscal issues - taxes, devolution of government, etc., so when the 11:00 news came on, there was always gay this, abortion that, and the gratuitous walking out of the "moderates" scene. In other words, just a circus.

The majority of the county's legislative districts are at least partially within the Eugene & Springfield city limits, and those districts almost never elect Republicans.
I get Jim Edmundson, Kitty Peircy, the pretend hispanic Susan Castillo, and so on. West Eugene would not elect these people if the GOP candidate were promoted by the county party and made to look just halfway decent.

But it's hopeless.
Oregon has, in fact, had a GOP controlled legislature for a good number of years now and it is passing legislation that the pre-term-limit RAT controlled legislature would never have gotten away with. It creates government powers, tax increases, and burdensome regulation ad-nauseum, and every single thing that is remotely good or limiting is vetoed by the RAT governor. The end result of every legislative session is a dream come true for every government loving leftist in the land.

So how is the Oregon LP getting on? Any plan to elect anyone to anything this time around?

Seriously, I'm considering going that way. I'm pretty much a small "l" anyway, and I like (most of) what the BIG "L" claims to stand for.

As it stands right now, we're all getting hosed real good.

Dave in Eugene

[Tailback]

I honestly believe that the Republican parties in California and Oregon were infiltrated by secret Communists who's goal is to destroy the party from within. I think that Hatfield was one of them and his disgusting deciding vote against the balanced budget amendment is evidence of that fact. The Oregon Republican party is an absolute joke, they couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag. The scumbag democrats in this state have given the Pubbies plenty of ammo but they never, ever, use it. OK, so maybe I should be wearing tinfoil but what else can explain their complete ineptitude?

[EBUCK]

From the LP Oregon Website.

2002

Dan Fitzgerald US Senate
Beth King US Representative District 01
Mike Wood US Representative District 02
Kevin Jones US Representative District 03
Chris Bigelow US Representative District 04
Mac Sawyer US Representative District 05
Thomas Cox Governor
Kevin Schaumleffle State Representative District 34
Theresa "DarkLady" Reed State Representative District 42
Mark Vetanen State Assembly District 28

Here is a link to Tom Cox's proposed budget. It's a little under-formatted but the savings are obvious. Link here

EBUCK

[EBUCK]

OK, so maybe I should be wearing tinfoil but what else can explain their complete ineptitude?

How else can we explain the OR pubbies running a lifelong rat for governor?

EBUCK

[Clinging Bitterly]

Interesting website. Says that Mannix was essentially begging LP to not run anyone for governor, because they would take away some of his votes - like Libertarian votes were his birthright or something.

On Cox's budget numbers, I would agree with 100% of those items that he would propose to eliminate becuse they serve no legitimate government function. But there were other items that he would propose to increase, and I don't see justification to increase a darn thing. The overall numbers were still higher than '97-'99, while consumers' dollars (the source of every penny of taxes) are not. Well I'll look more at what this guy is all about.

Dave in Eugene

[EBUCK]

I think the budget is more of a compromise than an outright LP budget (which would be a whole lot lower IMO). From what I've read Cox is a pretty reasonable fellow and he doesn't strike me as a hardline LPer.

On another subject, I just got an E-Mail from Dan Fitzgerald asking for money. Seems that he's having trouble getting into the voters pamphlet (about 1500 bucks). He's running against Gordon Smith (R).

EBUCK