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Muhammad, Malvo May be Connected To Alabama Terror Camp
newscourt.com ^ | 10-24-02 | john pender

Posted on 10/24/2002 6:00:09 AM PDT by kingfish45n

newscourt.com - Authorities are investigating into possible ties between John Muhammad, John Lee Malvo and a training camp reportedly linked to Islamic terrorists in Marion, Alabama. European law enforcement officials believe Muslims were using the camp to prepare for a holy war, according to a July 25 2002, report by ABC NEWS.

An investigation by Britain's Scotland Yard led to the discovery of "Camp Ground Zero," in Alabama. Bullet-riddled school buses and police cars with mannequin targets were scattered around the grounds. Inside a large warehouse were shot-up mannequins, in domestic settings, with blood-like stains on them.

Ground Zero's operators - also British - offered world-class training in automatic weapons and urban warfare, supposedly to fight terrorism. Marion police became suspicious of the use of buses and police cars as targets, but the camp owners refused to comment on the matter in July.

"In the United States, it is not illegal for anyone to receive military training, high-grade military training," said Rohan Gunaratna, author of Inside Al Qaeda. We know of a number of cases where Islamic terrorists came and trained in this country in the early 1990s. It is likely that this scale of training is still continuing," Gunaratna said.

The most radical of London's Islamic clerics, Abu Hamza, told ABCNEWS in a July 2002 phone call that America's laws make paramilitary training easy, "like a picnic."

British intelligence officials told ABC NEWS they were examining ties between Hamza, who is said to have recruited alleged "20th hijacker" Zacarias Moussaoui, and Zain-ul-Albidin.

The pressing question for police is whether there is a connection between the camp, John Muhammad and John Malvo.

The credit card that Muhammad allegedly used as a transfer account for the $10 million demanded in ransom by the D.C. snipers belonged to a woman who was killed in a liquor store robbery in Marion, Ala., last month. Police also report that Malvo's DNA was found at the scene of that robbery and murder.


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; US: Alabama; US: District of Columbia; US: Maryland; US: Virginia
KEYWORDS: alfuqra; alqaeda; blackmuslims; blackpanthers; jamaatalfuqra; newblackpanthers
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so much for the "angry white male" garbage...the media experts are running for cover about now..major damage control...amazing...world net daily, newsmax and newscourt all reported the police BOLO weeks ago..hte major media totally ignored it....
1 posted on 10/24/2002 6:00:09 AM PDT by kingfish45n
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To: kingfish45n
http://www.nbc13.com/news/1578748/detail.html

MONTGOMERY, Ala. -- State officials say an investigation uncovered no evidence that a camp near Marion was used as a terrorist training camp.

Wednesday night, ABC News said the camp could have possible ties to Osama bin Laden's terror network.

A Tuscaloosa man operates the Marion Camp, called Ground Zero USA.

Marion Police Chief Tony Buford said he was misquoted. Buford said the camp is used by police officers from Alabama and Louisiana for training that includes target practice.

NBC News first reported in December that a man with alleged Al-Qaida ties, named Zain Ul Albidin, was arrested in Great Britain. Albidin alleged that terrorists trained in the camp in Marion.

A spokesman for Gov. Don Siegelman and Department of Public Safety officials said they are aware of the reports. But after conducting background investigations of the site they found no reason to be concerned.

The camp made news again Wednesday because Albidin is being questioned in connection with the terror attacks of Sept. 11.

2 posted on 10/24/2002 6:05:32 AM PDT by Retired Chemist
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To: Shooter 2.5
ping - maybe... (a pair of Islamics)
3 posted on 10/24/2002 6:08:33 AM PDT by CapandBall
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To: kingfish45n
If its terror related it will be covered up.
4 posted on 10/24/2002 6:10:32 AM PDT by dalebert
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To: kingfish45n
Islam is a religion of peace, rape, homicide-bombing and cowardly sniper attacks.
5 posted on 10/24/2002 6:13:50 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum
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To: kingfish45n
Ummm, what is BOLO? Just wondering...JFK
6 posted on 10/24/2002 6:15:39 AM PDT by BADROTOFINGER
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To: Retired Chemist
Islam is a peaceful religion as long as the women are beaten, the boys buggered, and the infidels killed.
7 posted on 10/24/2002 6:18:31 AM PDT by jrlc
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To: BADROTOFINGER
Be On the Look Out

(words to live by...)
8 posted on 10/24/2002 6:18:38 AM PDT by Redbob
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To: kingfish45n
MOntgomery, Al police chief Wilson says he knows nothing about a Ground Zero training facility in Marion, Al. He says no credit card information came from the liquor store shooting that happened there. He says the gun used in that shooting is not the same gun used in sniper shootings.

The Chief says much of the information being reported by the media is incorrect.

From the scroll at the bottom of the MSNBC screen, Police are not clear if Montgomery AL shooting is connected to DC sniper.

9 posted on 10/24/2002 6:19:11 AM PDT by YaYa123
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To: Redbob
Oh ok, thanks!...JFK
10 posted on 10/24/2002 6:19:28 AM PDT by BADROTOFINGER
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To: dalebert
If its terror related it will be covered up.

And if its not terror related, half of FR will still claim it is anyway. So its a ctach-22. No mater what they say, Freepers will still say its terror related.

11 posted on 10/24/2002 6:20:30 AM PDT by FreeTally
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To: CapandBall
Mornin Cap....... I wonder if this guy is a registered Dem too? Sure glad he's not an angry white male. Do we know yet exactly what model gun he used?
12 posted on 10/24/2002 6:21:24 AM PDT by umgud
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To: Redbob
MSNBC Brian Williams says, "Hubris"..this may all come down to one word, "Hubris".

Does this man think he's writing a cheap detective novel with his mouth? Everything he says reeks of over the top drama!!

13 posted on 10/24/2002 6:21:37 AM PDT by YaYa123
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To: kingfish45n
Nice to know that there is a camp named "Ground Zero," the monniker for the WTC site, operating on US soil and that it has been investigated in the past for possible links to Islamic terrorism.
14 posted on 10/24/2002 6:21:59 AM PDT by Fulbright
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To: YaYa123
MOntgomery, Al police chief Wilson says he knows nothing about a Ground Zero training facility in Marion, Al.

Well, that's obviously BS if he said it like that. The police chief obviously knows about CGZ.

15 posted on 10/24/2002 6:27:34 AM PDT by FreeTally
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To: umgud
I still wonder if these guys are opportunists.

Opportunists who know something because there is some connection.

The prior post was right, the authorities are falling all over themselves to say it is not connected to moslem terrorism.
16 posted on 10/24/2002 6:27:41 AM PDT by longtermmemmory
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To: kingfish45n
"so much for the "angry white male" garbage...the media experts are running for cover about now..major damage control...amazing..."

Yes indeedie. Last night, Aaron "Errin'" Brown looked as though he were covering his daughter's funeral on CNN's Newsnight - wincing every time he was forced to:

1. Say the name Muhammed;
2. Show the "pic' o' th' perp";
3. Describe the suspect as a BLACK and a MUSLIM.

CNN, for a while, seemed to have a policy of ALWAYS ID'ing the warrantee as "Williams" first and "Muhammed" second. By this morning, that policy, wisely, has been reversed.

I can't wait to see the post-mortems on the rest of the nets today. They were all gearing up for a MAJOR MAJOR push against Southern red-neck crazed Republican NRA members.

Michael

17 posted on 10/24/2002 6:28:42 AM PDT by Wright is right!
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To: Fulbright
Nice to know that there is a camp named "Ground Zero," the monniker for the WTC site, operating on US soil and that it has been investigated in the past for possible links to Islamic terrorism.

Its been there for years - its a legit place - unfortunately, anyone can rent it or train there. The owners have never been suspected of anything illegal.

18 posted on 10/24/2002 6:29:21 AM PDT by FreeTally
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To: FreeTally
The police chief smiled real big when he said it. He added:

Until this morning, when I heard about it from the media...I had never heard about it.

I didn't put that in quotes because it's not exact, but it is exactly the thought I heard him convey.

19 posted on 10/24/2002 6:30:25 AM PDT by YaYa123
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To: kingfish45n
Here's a July story about Camp Zero. http://english.pravda.ru/main/2002/07/26/33240.html
They were being investigated by the govt even back then.
20 posted on 10/24/2002 6:30:52 AM PDT by FreeInWV
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To: Wright is right!
CNN, for a while, seemed to have a policy of ALWAYS ID'ing the warrantee as "Williams" first and "Muhammed" second. By this morning, that policy, wisely, has been reversed.

I was watchiing FOX and MSNCB all last night and they seemed to reluctantly call him anything other than John Mohammed. Saying "Alan Williams" was rare, and only after his last name was called "Mohammed".

I don't understand where people get this idea they are playing down his obvious muslin name and past conversion.

21 posted on 10/24/2002 6:31:52 AM PDT by FreeTally
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To: FreeTally
This is the Montgomery Chief of Police....I think Marion is quite a distance south of Montgomery, south even of Fort Rucker.

He's on MSNBC right now.

22 posted on 10/24/2002 6:32:33 AM PDT by YaYa123
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To: YaYa123
I didn't put that in quotes because it's not exact, but it is exactly the thought I heard him convey.

Do you find it specious that a local police chief does not know about a privately owned training facility where law enforcement, security agents and foreign government agents train?

I aint buying it.

23 posted on 10/24/2002 6:33:48 AM PDT by FreeTally
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To: FreeTally
The "unfortunate" parts are indeed its rental policy and,
of course, the name, which must be a source of amusement to the Bad Guys this morning.

24 posted on 10/24/2002 6:34:35 AM PDT by Fulbright
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To: YaYa123
Yeh, I realize the distance that Montgomery is from Marion, but I just doubt the CHIEF doesn't know this place, which is not secret by any means, exists just south of his jurisdiction.
25 posted on 10/24/2002 6:35:11 AM PDT by FreeTally
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: Wright is right!
Yes indeedie. Last night, Aaron "Errin'" Brown looked as though he were covering his daughter's funeral on CNN's Newsnight - wincing every time he was forced to:

It's going to get worse for Brown when he has to show video of John Mohammed standing guard over Calypso Louie at the MMM rally in DC from 1995.

27 posted on 10/24/2002 6:36:14 AM PDT by PJ-Comix
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Comment #28 Removed by Moderator

To: YaYa123
MSNBC Brian Williams says, "Hubris"..this may all come down to one word, "Hubris".

Speak for yourself, Brian.

29 posted on 10/24/2002 6:37:23 AM PDT by Interesting Times
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To: FreeTally
MSNBC Brian Williams is reading quote from federal official:

"No one is certain that everyone who was involved is now off the street. The all clear has not been sounded. "We've assumed it could be two people, but we've never been certain of that". "There will be no statements from officials today, declaring this seige is over."

30 posted on 10/24/2002 6:37:26 AM PDT by YaYa123
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To: Retired Chemist
Have the local police been bought off?
31 posted on 10/24/2002 6:41:42 AM PDT by twigs
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To: YaYa123
That's not surprising. I heard mentioned briefly that they are looking for a relative, maybe mother, of Malvo.

I think the feds are doing there best to not screw up and make themsleves look even more like bumbling idiots, espeically considering many Americans hold them responsible for letting the 9/11 guys in the country.

32 posted on 10/24/2002 6:44:51 AM PDT by FreeTally
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To: PJ-Comix
Frankly I've been wondering when the (anti-)American black muslims were going to be implicated in something terror related. I think their leadership (Calypso Louie) has mostly tried to stay out of it, at least publicly. This may be the end of that.

Or... it might be.... "just another isolated incident"
33 posted on 10/24/2002 6:45:36 AM PDT by johnb838
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To: YaYa123
"The all clear has not been sounded"

I am not at all convinced that this thing is over. Today may be a good day to sit back, watch, listen, and learn. IMO

34 posted on 10/24/2002 6:48:49 AM PDT by Kerberos
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To: YaYa123
This is the Montgomery Chief of Police

Chief Wilson of Montgomery Alabama made a professional appearance. He was very articulate. A reporter asked him if Maryland has the death penalty and he replied that he didn't know, but that "Alabama certainly does!. LOL.

35 posted on 10/24/2002 6:54:35 AM PDT by Norman Arbuthnot
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To: kingfish45n
so much for the "angry white male" garbage...

The reverse profiling is sickening. I am so glad that they have to eat crow this morning. The fact thta most news sources are backing away from AQ or other terror group connections is still bothersome though. I mean c'mon, the guy converted to Islam and there are reports out of Seatle that they were sympathetic to the 911 Hijackers. Need more proof CNN???

I even hear WOR Radio in NY this moring refer to the guy as John Williams. He changed his name to Muhamad when he converted to Islam. Please report the facts.

36 posted on 10/24/2002 6:56:51 AM PDT by Mixer
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To: kingfish45n

Add this 'diverse' guy to their banner.
37 posted on 10/24/2002 6:56:58 AM PDT by finnman69
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To: anniegetyourgun
*Ping*
38 posted on 10/24/2002 6:58:15 AM PDT by Pharmboy
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To: YaYa123
Thanks for that info, YaYa. I've been trying to figure how many more are out there that helped these two. My guess is three more.
39 posted on 10/24/2002 6:59:52 AM PDT by Fred Mertz
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To: umgud
Hi umgud, I'm listening to this news break on local WTOP radio out of DC. No details on the type of gun, and they sound like registered "militant muslims". They are trying to decide if they should search the car at the rest stop where they were caught, or transport the car then search. They are waiting for the search warrent...

Just braoadcast (Montgomery County police): "We are pretty sure these are the guys. Why, because we got tons of evidence"

40 posted on 10/24/2002 7:00:24 AM PDT by CapandBall
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To: Pharmboy
Hhmmm, then the guy who owns this camp is lying. He says this guy, Williams, has never been there and he's never heard of him.
41 posted on 10/24/2002 7:01:07 AM PDT by anniegetyourgun
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To: FreeTally
I was watchiing FOX and MSNCB all last night and they seemed to reluctantly call him anything other than John Mohammed. Saying "Alan Williams" was rare, and only after his last name was called "Mohammed".

Talk about selective perception. I was watching MSNBC last night when they first announced the names. It was "John Mohammed". They went with that name for a good fifteen minutes before they ever mentioned his former name, John Allen Williams. It was just a minute before Moose came on that they finally started giving both names. I think you may have been watching Fox too much. Good old Rita kept saying that Alabama was next door to Maryland. What a fool.

42 posted on 10/24/2002 7:01:43 AM PDT by Dave S
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To: IllegalAliensOUT
I just heard an interview on Fox and the owner of this camp sounded very beligerant refusing to answer any questions about who may have been training there. The owner had an obvious British or Scottish accent.
43 posted on 10/24/2002 7:04:00 AM PDT by eleni121
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To: anniegetyourgun
Hhmmm, then the guy who owns this camp is lying. He says this guy, Williams, has never been there and he's never heard of him.

Well how many hundreds or thousands have visited his shooting range in the past year or two? And who says he used either of his names when he was there. Also it may be that he has never been there.

44 posted on 10/24/2002 7:04:24 AM PDT by Dave S
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To: Dave S
Dunno. I heard one report that this camp has been closed for the last year.
45 posted on 10/24/2002 7:05:45 AM PDT by anniegetyourgun
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To: Wright is right!
I saw that, it was like a bad b movie and the lines they had to say were forced!
46 posted on 10/24/2002 7:06:16 AM PDT by TLBSHOW
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To: anniegetyourgun
You have succeeded in annoying several of us this morning with your know-nothing blather attempting to separate these home-grown islamofascists from being associated with international islamofascism. You are doing this with NO evidence that you are correct, but more and more each hour coming out about these guys being islamofascists. You should get a grip or perhaps switch to decaf. Bu-bye.
47 posted on 10/24/2002 7:07:41 AM PDT by Pharmboy
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To: PJ-Comix
LOL!! Bring on the popcorn & raisinettes!
48 posted on 10/24/2002 7:07:57 AM PDT by angry beaver norbert
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To: Norman Arbuthnot
Agree with you...the Montgomery Alabama police chief handled himself very well. Cautious, but informative, and yeah, I loved his line about the death penalty, that he didn't know about Maryland, but Alabama sure had one.

I was especially intrigued when he discussed the evidence in the liquor store shooting, that they had plenty. It must include eye witness ID, because he said the victim who lived has been very very helpful. He won't go on record about having fingerprints that could be matched up to these two now in Maryland custody, but it seems safe to assume he has them.

Oh gawd, I'm signing off MSNBC...cant' take Rick Sanchez.

Just a comment...I do not buy into the notion some are espousing here, that the national media is upset the guys in custody aren't right wing whacko nutcase white guys. I don't buy that at all. Oh, the national media is walking the tightrope not to be politically incorrect...as per usual, the national media wouldn't want to offend blacks, Jamacians, or American "peace loving" Moslems.

But at some point in time, the media will self-flagellate about how wrong their talking head experts were, how their coverage was over the top, and how wrong predictions and profiles were.

Imus will never let Bo Dietel forget it if his tv appearances were way wrong.....but I'm hoping somebody, someday, plays back every stupid, self-serving pronouncement made by Cliff Van Zandt. That "former FBI" gasshole makes my skin crawl.

49 posted on 10/24/2002 7:08:15 AM PDT by YaYa123
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To: kingfish45n
During the press conference out of Alabama, I heard the mayor mention something about the potential connections between the shooting up in "New England". Was this a geographical mistake, where the mayor thought that DC was part of New England? Or was it a potential slip-up about connections to additional shooting in New England? Anybody else here that?
50 posted on 10/24/2002 7:08:32 AM PDT by americaprd
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