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"Gun Control and Election 2002" ONESIDED debate on C-SPAN2 right now!
CSPAN2 LIve SIMULCAST now! ^ | October 25, 2002 | Hail Caesar

Posted on 10/25/2002 7:34:05 AM PDT by Hail Caesar

NATIONAL GUN CONTROL FREAKS HAVE LAUNCHED THEIR FREE MEDIA BASED ATTACKS ON AMERICAN SEMI-AUTO RIFLE GUNOWNERS!!

CSPAN2 LIve SIMULCAST now!

Saying he is a former "Marine and U.S. Congressman from Montgomery County, Maryland", Michael Barnes of the Brady Campaign to ban guns just declared that M16-like semiautomatic .223 rifles similar to what the shooter used "have no place in civilian hands". Michael Barnes just claimed that semi-auto black rifles are mainly being sold to "criminals." Bushmaster, AR-15 owners especially should take note!

Jon Cowan, "Americans for Gun Safety" Executive Director is now blabbing about "centrist, moderate positions" on "gun safety."

TUNE IN NOW or try to view recablecast on CSPAN2 later today via CPAN2 website or your cable network...

http://www.cspan.org/watch/cspan2_rm.asp


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Breaking News; Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; Politics/Elections; US: Alabama; US: District of Columbia; US: Maryland; US: Virginia; US: Washington
KEYWORDS: 2nd; ags; ar15; banglist; brady; bushmaster; civilian; gun; joncowan; libertarians; m16; marine; mikebarnes; nra; rhodesia; rifle; rkba; shooter; sniper; trt; unlist
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1 posted on 10/25/2002 7:34:06 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: *bang_list; *TRT; drZ; LiberalBuster; Mercuria; AnnaZ; secamend; Gore_ War_ Vet; Goldi-Lox; ...
TRT BUMP!
2 posted on 10/25/2002 7:35:32 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: Hail Caesar
Ah, but Mr. barnes,
they certainly do.
They are there for people
just like you.
3 posted on 10/25/2002 7:36:02 AM PDT by the gillman@blacklagoon.com
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To: 2yearlurker; 69ConvertibleFirebird; 7thson; AbeLincoln; Abundy; AL932; AnnaSASsyFR; bayliving; ...
Maryland bump!
4 posted on 10/25/2002 7:36:29 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: Hail Caesar


5 posted on 10/25/2002 7:40:40 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: Joe Brower
That's a big 10-4. Time to "kick ass and take names". ;-)


6 posted on 10/25/2002 7:48:39 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: sourcery; *UN_List; *libertarians; .38sw; 185JHP; 1FreeAmerican; 1rudeboy; ...
Bump!
7 posted on 10/25/2002 7:53:40 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: abigail2; abner; aculeus; adanaC; advocate10; afraidfortherepublic; agitator; alisasny; ...
Bump!
8 posted on 10/25/2002 7:55:58 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: Hail Caesar
volley bttt
9 posted on 10/25/2002 8:00:03 AM PDT by firewalk
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To: Hail Caesar
And due to political correctness and sensitivity to the protected classes I expect CNN to begin the show trial of the Bushmaster AR any time now.
10 posted on 10/25/2002 8:08:18 AM PDT by junta
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To: Hail Caesar
"Michael Barnes just claimed that semi-auto black rifles are mainly being sold to "criminals." Liar.
11 posted on 10/25/2002 8:13:47 AM PDT by Mr. Bungle
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To: All
Sorry folks, the program just ended. I believe you may check C-Span's website here for their rebroadcast or archives schedules:

http://www.c-span.org/watch/cspan2new.asp
12 posted on 10/25/2002 8:14:18 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: Hail Caesar
"Black rifles?"

I thought the liberal-speak term was "longarms of color."

13 posted on 10/25/2002 8:15:22 AM PDT by Poohbah
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To: Hail Caesar; gc4nra
"Saying he is a former 'Marine and U.S. Congressman [D~wanna bet?] from Montgomery County, Maryland', Michael Barnes of the Brady Campaign..."

This guy hasn't read the latest polls, eh?
One of the Liberal-Socialist brainiacs had best dispatch one of their goons to gag this moron whatwith it being so close to an election & right on the heels of the maniac sniper's assualts??

Apperantly, Barnes was already given the boot; or, he'd still be in congress, right?
So Barnes really doesn't have anything to loose by "shooting-off" his big mouth; thereby, making things even *more* difficult for his fellow active 'Rats to be re-elected?

I prefer Barnes blathers on & on & on as people are now seeing the Liberal-Socialist agenda more clearly than ever before.
One of the BIG items of that Liberal-Socialist agenda just happens to be, naturally, "Gun Control," too.

...makes spottin' one of these buggers even easier for the *challenged* among us.

14 posted on 10/25/2002 8:18:42 AM PDT by Landru
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To: Hail Caesar
Once they take the guns away, then it becomes easier for the bereaurats to go after their political adversaries and critics.
BTTT!!!!!
15 posted on 10/25/2002 8:18:42 AM PDT by E.G.C.
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To: Hail Caesar
More 'guns bad, NRA bad' BS ... pushing for "sensible gun laws", "closing the Gun Show Loophole", "we don't have enough gun laws", "we need ballistic fingerprinting", etc., etc.

This is a totally one sided "debate". Brady and AGS on the podium, no dissenting voices, no counterpoint to their lowest-common-denominator leftspeak. Apparently the NRA decided not to show up ... I don't know why.
16 posted on 10/25/2002 8:19:34 AM PDT by spodefly
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To: spodefly
The NRA has been MIA ("missing in action") here in Maryland since this particular "shooting spree" began about three weeks ago.
17 posted on 10/25/2002 8:29:53 AM PDT by Hail Caesar
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To: Hail Caesar
"Why should I care about handgun laws? They'll never come to take my rifle..."

-- typical American rifle owner

BZZTT! Wrong answer! Wish to play again?

18 posted on 10/25/2002 8:40:35 AM PDT by pabianice
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To: Hail Caesar
The enemies of Freedom are ever vigilent--ever ready to try to take your basic freedoms away. Conservatives need to respond with an understanding of what this is really all about.

Throughout the Twnetieth Century, America was beset by a number of forces on the Left; but the consistent threat--far more serious than any of the others, because it was always willing to make use of the efforts of all of the others--was that of the Fabian Socialists--those who sought to introduce a Socialist controlled Society, while appearing to be only pushing moderate reforms; only seeking something called "Progress."

That is what you see here. More of the gradualist, Fabian approach towards converting America into an egalitarian, Socialist Society. Disarming those recalcitrants who still want to live as the Founding Fathers intended, has a very high priority to such of our enemies.

William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site

19 posted on 10/25/2002 8:51:08 AM PDT by Ohioan
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To: Joe Brower
...TRUTH or DARE...???
20 posted on 10/25/2002 8:54:32 AM PDT by ALOHA RONNIE
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To: Hail Caesar
I have a lot of trouble with the NRA since they seem to support SO many gun laws. The NRA is always compromising on one thing or the other, and I think it does gun owners much more a disservice than if they would say, "no gun laws. Period." I think everytime they compromise on one more gun control issue, that tells the gun grabbers that it is acceptable. It's a slippery slope that is going to be nearly impossible to get off until someone draws a line and says, "No more."

My own personal opinion is that it will come down to whether Bush will have the balls to veto the Assault Weapons Ban renewal in 2004, as I'm quite positive it will likely pass. Until then, I guess I'll just bide my time.
21 posted on 10/25/2002 9:00:46 AM PDT by Viva Le Dissention
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To: Viva Le Dissention
Bush is not going to veto it...no way.

I wonder what percentage of laws are ever truly repealed or allowed to sunset?

.001% maybe?
22 posted on 10/25/2002 9:07:06 AM PDT by wardaddy
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To: Hail Caesar


Check it out -- CSPAN will at Saturday's Freep Rally by the Washington Monument.
23 posted on 10/25/2002 9:12:34 AM PDT by FreeTheHostages
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To: Viva Le Dissention
My guess is he will compromise like his dad did...who signed the import ban into law..each succeding president has been responsible for more restrictive gun laws some presidents more than othesr but all the elite are united in this assault on private ownership of firearms imo...regardless of party or persuassion...

Like this moron congressman who blames the weapon and not the man...

The second ammendment says that full auto M16s belongs in civilian hands..as do any arms that we the people can afford to buy or have given to us by friends realtives whoever...

There are laws governing what we the people can do with these weapons..and all who who use them in an illegal manor need to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law..

The strangest part is that the killer didnt take multiple shots with a weapon that one can own magazines that hold 20,30,40 even up to hundreds of rounds..yet he took single shots...
Any weapon is capable of taking single shots...so why ban this particular weapon...

Answer...FEAR MONGERING the great election tool of the DEMOCRATS...

ED ASSner did it to senior citizens with bad hearts...he scared the heck out of them...we dont know how many Asner put in the hospital with his phone calls...and urgent panic pitch...
I am willing to bet old commie Eds putting the fear into them didnt do them any good if the had cardiac conditions and many elderly do...

So here is another fear mongering democrat...

Truth to these bastardos is relative...the only sin they know is not getting what they want
which in this case is another pork filled govt. job..with all its perks corruption and tax payer funded retirement...public servants...not hardly...public trust scavangers is more like it...

The Marines taught this man honor..IMO it didnt take...he may be always faithfull -question is to who? or what?

When Marines go bad I am saddend as I consider them the best of the best ..it happens I guess..but its still a dissapointment
24 posted on 10/25/2002 9:18:49 AM PDT by joesnuffy
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To: Hail Caesar

The government then bestows my sandwich on the hungry man. Instead of being thankful to me, however, the man feels entitled to this benefit. In other words, the involvement of the state has utterly stripped the transaction of its moral value, even though the result is exactly the same.

The Point is the hungry man thinks the government is the good guy and thus accepts the initiation of force as a means to an end. There are several situations where people accept government initiation of force as a means to an end.

Politics suck -- politics suck objectivity out and insert irrationality in

Sometimes a small error will be compounded over and over until it becomes a massive problem.

In mid-term and presidential elections tens-of-millions of people vote for the lesser of evils despite that it still begets evil. How can so many people thinking they're right be so wrong?

"The oppressor no longer acts directly and with his own powers upon his victim. No, our conscience has become too sensitive for that. The tyrant and his victim are still present, but there is an intermediate person between them, which is the Government - that is, the Law itself. What can be better calculated to silence our scruples, and, which is perhaps better appreciated, to overcome all resistance? We all therefore, put in our claim, under some pretext or other, and apply to Government. We say to it, "I am dissatisfied at the proportion between my labor and my enjoyments. I should like, for the sake of restoring the desired equilibrium, to take a part of the possessions of others. But this would be dangerous. Could not you facilitate the thing for me? Could you not find me a good place? or check the industry of my competitors? or, perhaps, lend me gratuitously some capital which, you may take from its possessor? Could you not bring up my children at the public expense? or grant me some prizes? or secure me a competence when I have attained my fiftieth year? By this mean I shall gain my end with an easy conscience, for the law will have acted for me, and I shall have all the advantages of plunder, without its risk or its disgrace!" - Frederic Bastiat

Thus it follows logically:

"The state is the great fiction by which everybody tries to live at the expense of everyone else." -- Frederic Bastiat


25 posted on 10/25/2002 9:19:59 AM PDT by Zon
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To: Hail Caesar
I could only shake my head yesterday when Chief Moose said, "We have the murder weapon, it is off the street."

Whew, what a relief. They have the murder weapon... and, oh yeah, they might have a couple of suspects too. But at least they have the weapon. < /sarcasm >

26 posted on 10/25/2002 9:22:08 AM PDT by mr.sarcastic
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To: Zon
I meant post 25 to be posted to: Big government is still the problem ^.
27 posted on 10/25/2002 9:23:38 AM PDT by Zon
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To: Hail Caesar
LOL. I saw a little of this fiasco this morning on C-Span. Pretty funny.
28 posted on 10/25/2002 9:24:42 AM PDT by Saundra Duffy
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To: pabianice
Glad to hear someone else say that. This is something that has bugged me for a long time. "They'll never come after my deer rifle." Right. We tried to tell them--they'll call it a "sniper rifle", and say "nobody needs a gun that can shoot for miles and miles". They laughed.

Well, I'll still stand up for them even though they wouldn't stand up for me. We're all in the soup now together. I just wish that more of them had recognized it years ago. These gun-grabbers are serious and mean to take every single gun (excepting those in govt hands of course).

I am fairly certain that, when the time comes to stand and be counted, Bush will abandon us. "Gee" his Bush-bots will say, "the elections are coming up." Can't be caught standing on principle in an election year, now can we?
29 posted on 10/25/2002 9:25:47 AM PDT by alpowolf
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To: Zon
Worth reading all the same.
30 posted on 10/25/2002 9:27:36 AM PDT by alpowolf
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To: joesnuffy
When Marines go bad I am saddend as I consider them the best of the best ..it happens I guess..but its still a dissapointment

I'm with you but take comfort in the thought that when he gets to the afterlife he will run into my Dad (USMC '42-46). Dad will straighten his @ss out.

31 posted on 10/25/2002 9:31:11 AM PDT by alpowolf
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To: Hail Caesar
"Yep, Im serious....Yaaaa Moose!! Yaaaaa Law Enforcement!!!! "

Let's see.....these incomptetent, bumbling law-enforcement members:


32 posted on 10/25/2002 10:08:31 AM PDT by SuperLuminal
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To: Hail Caesar; patton; SLB; piasa
http://www.pir.org/cgi-bin/nbonlin6.cgi?BARNES_MICHAEL_D%20%28D%2DMD%29



All things leading to and from Comrade Barnes screams Communist-Socialist-Sedition-Traitor and just plain old POS Anti-American. Know your enemy...........



Stay Safe !
33 posted on 10/25/2002 10:18:54 AM PDT by Squantos
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To: Hail Caesar
This is great! We need to make sure gun control remains as hot an issue as possible for the next several weeks. Every Democrat candidate should be asked about his/her committment to ban sniper rifles such as those used in the DC shootings. Every voter should be reminded that "sniper rifles" are daddy's deer rifle.

WE need to make sure that these debates take place.

34 posted on 10/25/2002 10:19:10 AM PDT by ibbryn
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To: alpowolf
:) Thanks.
35 posted on 10/25/2002 10:29:54 AM PDT by Zon
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To: Hail Caesar
Not surprised at a one sided affair on c-span,It is a left leaning organization.
36 posted on 10/25/2002 1:33:44 PM PDT by INSENSITIVE GUY
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To: Joe Brower
I'll use em' both.
37 posted on 10/25/2002 7:39:26 PM PDT by mafree
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To: Hail Caesar
Thanks for the flag, Caesar. Let me think about what this barnes guy is saying.......

"Michael Barnes of the Brady Campaign to ban guns just declared that M16-like semiautomatic .223 rifles similar to what the shooter used "have no place in civilian hands". Michael Barnes just claimed that semi-auto black rifles are mainly being sold to "criminals."

I hope he (one day) realizes what an idiotic statement he just made. What a moron. According to his logic,

* Mainly, criminals buy semiautomatic rifles.
* Let's ban the semi's.
* Then all the criminals will suddenly start to obey the law --now, they can't get drugs anymore-- so we can prevent evil seeds like this muhammad whatever from committing crime. Yes! We can finally have our utopia!

AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!

38 posted on 10/25/2002 7:50:08 PM PDT by Chong
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To: Landru
Just another MMM9moronically mooing mouthpiece) for the gun-grabbers.

Never give up the right to self-defence!


FMCDH

gc
39 posted on 10/26/2002 9:53:32 AM PDT by gc4nra
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To: gc4nra
9=(
40 posted on 10/26/2002 9:55:02 AM PDT by gc4nra
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To: Hail Caesar
Last night I heard one of the directors of the ATF...I believe his name was Bouchard...speak about what the most important thing was about this case.

"The most important thing is that this gun is no longer on the streets."

41 posted on 10/26/2002 12:38:45 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: mr.sarcastic
I could only shake my head yesterday when Chief Moose said, "We have the murder weapon, it is off the street."

I suspect his point was that the murder weapon linked those it was found with to the crimes. About the best possible evidence. Had they caught the snipers, but not found the rifle, conviction would have been much harder.

42 posted on 10/26/2002 4:04:55 PM PDT by Restorer
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To: SuperLuminal
I doubt that they will ever explain why 7-8 people died needlessly as a result of their abject incompetence.

I'm glad you are so unusually competent. Most people are unable to take 200,000 telephone calls and immediately pick out which ones are relevant or make several tens of thousands of traffic stops and know which car contains the shooters when there is no external evidence.

I wish I was that smart!

I bet you would have been able to prevent 9/11, too!

43 posted on 10/26/2002 4:07:43 PM PDT by Restorer
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To: Chong
My personal favorite is his theory that the color of the rifle causes them to be used for evil purposes. Does he consider the color of people equally relevant?
44 posted on 10/26/2002 4:09:52 PM PDT by Restorer
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To: Hail Caesar
We should ban the leftist mafyas who create the fake currency of demagogy and ill representation of the American people. Citizens cannot be intimidated like this anymore.

The gall of fake currency makers telling us what the second amendment means and that our guns should be registered and banned.

They might as well demand the keys to my safe and my personal will
45 posted on 10/26/2002 4:13:54 PM PDT by lavaroise
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To: Restorer
My personal favorite is his theory that the color of the rifle causes them to be used for evil purposes. Does he consider the color of people equally relevant?

You see, for liberals who are adepts at faking currency, colors mean a lot to them, more so than substance.

46 posted on 10/26/2002 4:15:51 PM PDT by lavaroise
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To: Zon
When are you going to knock off this spam message. Even though I agree with it, why should I have to encounter it every time I turn around?
47 posted on 10/26/2002 4:30:18 PM PDT by Misterioso
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To: Misterioso
Your response indicates that the message is especially appropriate for you. You're a hoot!

In mid-term and presidential elections tens-of-millions of people vote for the lesser of evils despite that it still begets evil. How can so many people thinking they're right be so wrong?

"The oppressor no longer acts directly and with his own powers upon his victim. No, our conscience has become too sensitive for that. The tyrant and his victim are still present, but there is an intermediate person between them, which is the Government - that is, the Law itself. What can be better calculated to silence our scruples, and, which is perhaps better appreciated, to overcome all resistance? We all therefore, put in our claim, under some pretext or other, and apply to Government. We say to it, "I am dissatisfied at the proportion between my labor and my enjoyments. I should like, for the sake of restoring the desired equilibrium, to take a part of the possessions of others. But this would be dangerous. Could not you facilitate the thing for me? Could you not find me a good place? or check the industry of my competitors? or, perhaps, lend me gratuitously some capital which, you may take from its possessor? Could you not bring up my children at the public expense? or grant me some prizes? or secure me a competence when I have attained my fiftieth year? By this mean I shall gain my end with an easy conscience, for the law will have acted for me, and I shall have all the advantages of plunder, without its risk or its disgrace!" - Frederic Bastiat


48 posted on 10/26/2002 5:18:01 PM PDT by Zon
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To: Zon
I have no idea what you mean. FYI, I went to your page (being curious about someone who would quote less well-known Bastiat) and found your variations on this basic message repeated over and over. Not having looked closely at the posting times, perhaps, since FR was having problems last night, there was unintended repetition. That said, I have most of Bastiat's writings in my library and am sympathetic with the ideas contained in your post. Sorry if I offended.
49 posted on 10/26/2002 6:18:01 PM PDT by Misterioso
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To: Viva Le Dissention
My own personal opinion is that it will come down to whether Bush will have the balls to veto the Assault Weapons Ban renewal in 2004, as I'm quite positive it will likely pass. Until then, I guess I'll just bide my time.

Why just bide your time? There is an effort underway already, independent of the NRA, to work to ensure a renewal of the ban doesn't pass. Email SunsetTheBan@aol.com for more information.

50 posted on 10/26/2002 6:29:49 PM PDT by BCR #226
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