Anti Christ propaganda from National Council of Churches on traditional Jesus painting

http://www.interfaithbroadcasting.com/programs/ibc/ppjesus.shtml ^

[free biscet]

http://www.ncccusa.org/gifs/ppjesus.jpg NBC-TV Documentary 'Picture Perfect Jesus' Examines Hotly Debated Portrait It is one of the most recognized images of the 20th century, painted by an artist nobody knows. Received in a vision, marketed to the masses, Warner Sallman's 1940 portrait of Jesus is both comforting and controversial. So beloved, it hangs in pulpits and homes. So despised, it was once burned on the steps of the Capitol. The image was stamped on clocks, calendars, funeral fans and Sunday school material. The United Methodist production "Picture Perfect Jesus" -- scheduled to air on NBC-TV stations beginning November 28 -- is an hour-long investigation, answering two important questions: Why was this image so universally accepted? Why is it no longer so easily embraced? "Picture Perfect Jesus" is one of a series of National Council of Churches documentary presentations on the major broadcast networks each year. Click here for more program information ... and check your local TV listings for broadcast times in your area.

[free biscet]

The painting in question is the traditionally accepted image of Jesus. Why in God's name is the NCC so embarassed by it? I think that if the NCC had their way the Jesus image would be of a black Hispanic female gay handicapped pagan and fat - the PC Christ...for Christ's sake will anyone stop these jokers? I am creating a massive web page to educate all on the NCC and their communist anti Christian activities - will anyone join me. Check out my other commie church websites. Thanks!

[glory]

My parents had a bust of Jesus that used to sit on our speakers(those big wooden kind with big woofers that used to be knick knack holders on the tops;-). Anyway, the bust was a replica of this famous rendition. My grandmother also had the photo in her home.

[Lilly]

While I don't condone taking the Lord's name in vain, I do however, observe the plague of PC, visited on so many in the denominational world. I don't have a problem with the picture in question. I don't find it in bad taste. But most importantly, I realize no one knows exactly what the beautiful and majestic face of the Lord Jesus looks like.

[El Gato]

I don't know why the NCC is so upset about that rendition of Jesus. The guy could be one of the Wahabist highjackers, although his skin tone and hair color are a tad lighter than the average in that part of the world. Today that is, two thousand years ago, who knows exactly what the people in Judea looked like.

[WorkingClassFilth]

The NCC is thick with commies. I had a Marxist teacher once that used to brag about one of the past poo-bahs of the NCC that used to attend international communist functions with him. The big joke was that this guy kept trying to synthesize Marx and a social gospel and his friend, my atheist professor, used to laugh at the stupidity of imagining a materialist philosophy like Marxism could ever be permanently married. The prof used to say that he was glad for any dummy that was willing to help the cause along.

[goldstategop]

The race hustlers are also upset Jesus is not black enough for them. They're also a part of the NCC.

[Notwithstanding]

From the website: "Several church leaders interviewed for the documentary are rigorous in their critique of the image and its commercial distribution. These include, Archbishop George Stallings, Joan Chittister, Tony Campolo, David Morgan, Barry Moser, Wil Campbell, and Rev. Larry Morrison."

Look at the first three listed and you will see that this group is more about leftwing revisionism than Christianity. Stallings is a former Catholic priest who one day declared himself an independent bishop (arch-?). Chittister is a new age feminazi "nun". Campolo is spiritual adviser to the philanderer-in-chief Billy Blowjob Clinton (note, Clinton retains this title even though he is no longer president).

[rdb3]

As for me, no images of the LORD, graven or otherwise.

101 things that the Mozilla browser can do that Internet Explorer cannot.

[2nd_shift_guy]

The best rendition of the Lord that I have ever seen was of a man with his head bowed and his hands tied. The person had just been given 40 lashes. The caption said
"BEHOLD YOUR KING"!

[Mike Darancette]

I firmly believe that a person's perception of the likeness of Jesus is a matter of personal faith.

I would imagine that the NCC would prefer some androgynous multiracial image.

If Mexicans perceive the Virgin of Guadalupe as an Indian or African Christians perceive Jesus as Black I'm sure that their perceptions are closer to the truth than what the apostates at the NCC might offer.

[Notwithstanding]

If God simply forbids the making of graven images, then there are problems elsewhere in the Bible.

First, in Exodus 25:18-21, God commands Moses to make two statues of angels (cherubim) for the top of the Ark of the Covenant. Later in Numbers 21:8-9, God commands Moses to make a bronze serpent, so that the people who were bitten by snakes could look upon it and be healed. Now it is true that centuries later King Hezekiah destroyed it; however, this action was done because the people worshipped it as a god (2 Kings 18:4). In the Gospel, Jesus compared Himself to the bronze serpent (John 3:14). Continuing in the Old Testament, the inner sanctuary of the Temple contained two large statues of angels according to 1 Kings 6:23-28. In the following verses, Solomon also had the walls of the Temple decorated with carved images of angels, palm trees and flowers (1 Kings 6:29ff). During the Babylonian Captivity, Ezekiel had a vision from God about the design of the new Temple. According to Ezekiel 41:17-25, this new Temple contained graven images of angels and palm trees. These passages in the Bible indicate that God does not forbid the making of statues. If God truly condemned the making of graven images in the "Second Commandment", then He must have changed His mind later in the Old Testament.

[Notwithstanding]

According to the RSV Bible and Catholic Tradition, the First Commandment is:

(6)I am the LORD your God,...(7)You shall have no other gods before me. (8)You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; (9)you shall not bow down to them or serve them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, (10)but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments. [Deut. 5:6-10; RSV]

Verse 7 forbids the worship of other gods, while verses 8-9 forbid the making of graven (carved) images *** that would be worshipped as gods ***, i.e. idols. Now worshipping statues with divine honor is one way of worshipping other gods. Verse 7 is a general statement of the First Commandment, while verses 8-9 give a specific case of this Commandment. Verses 9-10 present the punishments and rewards that are associated with these Commandments.

[aberaussie]

I think what is forbidden is an image of Him. As my systematic theology professor said, "How can a God who is the ground of everything look like anything?" Interesting thought...

[Cicero]

[Lancey Howard]

"As for me, no images of the LORD, graven or otherwise."

8 posted on 11/23/2002 9:31 PM EST by rdb3

Your Bible references say nothing about graven images of the Lord.

[red-dawg]

These are the same IDIOTS that are behind the WWJD garbage.
What Would Jesus Drive?

[Lancey Howard]

I think the word "graven" is meant to imply a carving which is made to be worshipped. I always took the commandment to mean simply, "Don't carve a statue and worship it."

[chance33_98]

I did a google image search and found this little know PHOTO of jesus:

[Lancey Howard]

I don't know why the NCC is so upset about that rendition of Jesus.

As many on this thread have alluded, the NCC is upset by the rendition because it looks like that most vile of creatures, the white Republican man.

[Lancey Howard]

WWJD

I have no doubt Jesus would prefer something along the line of a Cadillac Escalade.

[chance33_98]

Somehow I found the above image as well, and I won't pass along the other pics I found at the site - but suffice it to say whoever made them are going to hell. For those who also wish to go to hell I will pass along the link...

[Notwithstanding]

The decalogue - a portion of which I quoted - forbids certain things: any "graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth" that a person will "bow down to them or serve".

Is is safe to say, then, that you find that any drawing/image/rendering whatsoever of anything is forbidden by the decalogue? No drawings of trees, no family photos, no movies, no sculputure, no visual arts whatsoever. Wow.

Since God incarnated as Jesus, and since the disciples of that person Jesus believed him to be God-made-man, then an image of Jesus is certainly not a misrepresentation of the incarnated Lord Jesus, the Christ. After all, God chose to mingle with us as Jesus.

[Dog Gone]

"Don't carve a statue and worship it."

Excellent advice even if it hadn't been a Commandment.

[Dog Gone]

For those who also wish to go to hell I will pass along the link...

So where's the link? I was told to go to hell at least twice this week.

[rdb3]

You have it twisted.

The Ark of the Covenant was not "worshipped" as was the golden calf.

Besides, why would I even need ANY image at all if I have the Holy Spirit residing within me? So, no thank you. As I said, for me no images whatsoever.

101 things that the Mozilla browser can do that Internet Explorer cannot.

[Notwithstanding]

I think your comment provides an accurate summary of what the commandment forbids.

If you do worship your image of Jesus, then you are sinning. If you do not worship it, but rather use it as a reminder to worhsip Him, then you are pleasing God.

[chance33_98]

So where's the link? I was told to go to hell at least twice this week.

You can cut and paste, not linking it :)

http://64.246.28.104/challenge/easter/

[Bob Z.]

Exodus 20:4-5
4
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: <<<<<<<<<<< COLON

5
Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Neither bow down to them nor make them. Neither one is acceptable to God. God is in Heaven above and was on the earth. All bases covered.

Isaiah 53:2
For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.

Isaiah 50:6
I gave my back to the smiters, and my cheeks to them that plucked off the hair: I hid not my face from shame and spitting.

His, (the one without a physical description in the Bible, outside of not being handsome and having a beard)
Bob Z.

[webber]

This picture of Jesus is "suppose" to be the one that was found on the "Shroud of Turin", the controversial burial cloth of Jesus that was imprinted into the shroud in a way that took no paint or dye. It is the "negative" as opposed to a "positive" image of Jesus which was made when Jesus Christ resurrected from the dead.
I can't say for certain whether this is the burial cloth of Jesus Christ and therefore His image on that cloth, but neither will it take such evidence for me to realize that He IS the Christ, the Messiah, The Lord, Savior, Redeemer of all who believe that He is God Almighty's "Sacrificial Lamb" for sin.

[Dog Gone]

Okay, you posted the one funny one.

[chance33_98]

I am sure you noticed several pages of that crap. Although there was one really neat gun photo there I saved. The page did inspire me to do something similar with mohammed though...

[Jael]

Doesn't a religion take out one of the Commandments?

Why do they do that?

[Bob Z.]

<>What do you see when you look at the Cross? Do you see that Christ was crucified for your sins?<>

Um, sure do. Do you? Are we to then make crosses for Jesus to die on? Hebrews 6:6
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

1 Peter 3:18
¶ For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

Hebrews 10:10
By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

<>Christ said in the NT ...."Do this in rememberance of me" <>

Yeah, take communion, not make images.

<>If you don't understand the OT you won't understand the daily sacrifice..<>

Oh, and Jesus does not daily sacrifice. He died once, WE die daily to self. Not Him.

If you do not understand either, you are most certainly lost.

2 Corinthians 4:3
But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

The issue was graven images, not the cross or communion.

His,
Bob Z.

[Dog Gone]

Yep, I went through all the pages, and there were some pretty creative images. I'm just starting to get decent with Photoshop and I think I can do what they did there, only without Jesus as the main target.

[webber]

Graven images were only prohibited if they had the intent of "Worship". That's why the commandment says, .."because He is a jealous God".

[farmfriend]

He looks like my husband's cousin, no gentile blood there.

[BenLurkin]

[BenLurkin]

[BenLurkin]

[BenLurkin]

[BenLurkin]

[BenLurkin]

[webber]

Remember though, that Jesus would NOT have any resemblence of either Mary or Joseph. It was the Holy Spirit who planted the "seed" into Mary's womb. So of course He would not have to even look Jewish. "Seed" is the result of sperm and egg coming together. Before fertilization, it is called an egg. Meaning that Mary did not supply the egg and the Holy Spirit provided the sperm. It means the fertilized egg, the "seed", was created by the Holy Spirit and placed into Mary's womb.

[mongrel]

This thread and all the replies are ridiculous. First of all, by appearances and tone, the referenced website doesn't seem upset by anything. They're just exploring the history of an artist's rendition. Second, those who are responding to this are the ones that sound upset. Why is it "leftist" to ask the question whether Jesus really looked like he stepped out of western Europe rather than the Middle East? We should at least pretend we're rational human beings on FR.

[txzman]

Be aware that the National Council of Churches is a subterfuge for Politically correct, touchy-feely all-is-one religion.

The former female head of the NCC was the de facto host for the recent UN Spirtual Convention in Geneva - no evangelicals from the US were invited.

There were spiritual Indian guides, Tarot card readers, Hindu "hugging" spirtualists, smoke trail readers, etc. American evangelicals were consdered "divisive" beacuse they believe in only One God and do not allow for "everyone is OK doing their thing".

Again: Christians who stood up for Jesus Christ were not-wanted.

[webber]

I can say one thing for sure.....
He wasn't a mongrel.

[MissAmericanPie]

Where did you get this picture, if you don't mind my asking. It reminds me of the face on the "Shroud of Turin" for some reason. I still haven't made up my mind about that relic, it's just that this picture resembles.

[mongrel]

Try again and find out how Jewish these ancesters of Jesus were: Rahab and Ruth.

You can worship your Westernized unbiblical view of Jesus or look at what the Bible actually says.

[mongrel]

Your wrote:

"Remember though, that Jesus would NOT have any resemblence of either Mary or Joseph. It was the Holy Spirit who planted the "seed" into Mary's womb. So of course He would not have to even look Jewish. "Seed" is the result of sperm and egg coming together. Before fertilization, it is called an egg. Meaning that Mary did not supply the egg and the Holy Spirit provided the sperm. It means the fertilized egg, the "seed", was created by the Holy Spirit and placed into Mary's womb."

This is part of a longstanding unorthodox heresy that claims that Jesus was fully divine and not human. Such a view is flatly rejected in numerous places in scripture and statements of orthodoxy throughout history. No mainstream evangelical, independant, nor mainline church would claim to follow this heresy.

[fabian]

I saw a painting of Jesus recently on spiritdaily.com that was drawn from the image on the shroud. It was pretty stunning, it looked so real.