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Attempt to ban Boy Scout recruiting in schools rejected
CNN ^ | 12/12/2002 | Associated Press

Posted on 12/12/2002 1:38:43 PM PST by RonF

Edited on 04/29/2004 2:01:46 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

SALEM, Oregon (AP) -- A state appeals court on Wednesday rejected an atheist mother's effort to prevent the Boy Scouts from recruiting in schools because the organization requires a belief in God.

The three-judge panel of the Oregon Court of Appeals, upholding a lower-court ruling, said allowing the Boy Scouts of America to make brief in-school presentations with no religious content doesn't violate the state constitution's ban on government involvement with religion.


(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: boyscouts; bsalist
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1 posted on 12/12/2002 1:38:44 PM PST by RonF
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To: *bsa_list
bump
2 posted on 12/12/2002 1:42:17 PM PST by Fish out of Water
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To: RonF
Actually, the mother's whole premise is wrong. There's nothing unconstitutional about the government's promoting religious belief in general, as long as the government(actually Congress) doesn't try to establish a national religion. That's why President Bush's faith-based program ideas are just fine constitutionally. We've sunk to a low low when we think we have to shun organizations like the Boy Scouts who promote religious belief in general.
3 posted on 12/12/2002 1:44:18 PM PST by yendu bwam
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To: RonF
The case stems from a 1998 lawsuit brought by Nancy Powell after scout recruiters visited her son's Portland elementary school.

Up yours, Nancy!

4 posted on 12/12/2002 1:44:35 PM PST by Paul Atreides
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Comment #5 Removed by Moderator

To: RonF
Score one against the Talibatheists and their "Dog in the Manger" mentality.
6 posted on 12/12/2002 1:50:02 PM PST by FormerLib
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To: RonF
Note to Nancy: Bite me, Loser!
7 posted on 12/12/2002 1:52:23 PM PST by Area51
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To: RonF
Yay! Score one for the BSA!
8 posted on 12/12/2002 2:09:04 PM PST by Rummyfan
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To: RonF
To the athiest mother,you not only are a "mother"but are in the minority and therefore DON'T COUNT!
9 posted on 12/12/2002 2:26:28 PM PST by INSENSITIVE GUY
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Comment #10 Removed by Moderator

To: RonF
Of course, the Boy Scouts are now a target of the homosexual activists so there's a lot of money, coming from this "oppressed" minority, behind such attacks.
11 posted on 12/12/2002 3:26:06 PM PST by FormerLib
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To: RonF
bump
12 posted on 12/12/2002 3:33:55 PM PST by LiteKeeper
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To: madg
But other schools HAVE stop such recruiting, and those decision have passed muster as well. The Federal Equal Access act regards use of facilities, not access to schoolchildren. Right?

How about leaving it up to the parents of the kids in the school to determine whether they want the Boy Scouts recruiting in the school?

13 posted on 12/12/2002 3:39:45 PM PST by yendu bwam
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Comment #14 Removed by Moderator

Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

To: RonF
This woman would probably get her son a gay mentor who molests him rather then he join the boy scouts and find god.
16 posted on 12/12/2002 4:04:30 PM PST by Sonny M
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To: madg
if we're talking about public schools, I am a taxpayer, therefor I get a say.

You certainly do not deserve one. The parents deserve the only say that should matter. You see, we truly have our children's best interest at heart.


Stay safe; stay armed.


17 posted on 12/12/2002 4:12:55 PM PST by Eaker
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To: madg
But now to asnwer YOUR question... if we're talking about public schools, I am a taxpayer, therefor I get a say.

Sure you do. You vote for your Board of Ed members just like anyone else. But if the townspeople vote for board members who represent their collective wish to have the Boy Scouts recruit in school, what's wrong with that?

18 posted on 12/12/2002 4:17:01 PM PST by yendu bwam
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To: RonF
Did this woman have nothing better to do than get her knickers in a twist because the Boy Scouts showed up at her son's school? She needs to get a life!
19 posted on 12/12/2002 4:19:21 PM PST by SuziQ
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To: madg; FormerLib
Of course, the Boy Scouts are now a target of the homosexual activists so there's a lot of money, coming from this "oppressed" minority, behind such attacks.

If one starts at the top of this page... and searches out [CNTRL-F] the very first use of "homo"... one will be directed to YOUR post. Funny, that.

No actually, it's not. A lot a good people have been completely smeared by homosexual activists as haters and bigots, for simply believing it's not prudent to have homosexual men take their teenage sons out camping overnight in their absence. Never has a good organization like Boy Scouts been so vilified and attacked by such intolerant people.

20 posted on 12/12/2002 4:20:32 PM PST by yendu bwam
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To: RonF
People need to stand up to these bullies who try to destroy you because you don't believe exactly as they.
21 posted on 12/12/2002 4:21:24 PM PST by Guillermo
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To: SuziQ
Did this woman have nothing better to do than get her knickers in a twist because the Boy Scouts showed up at her son's school? She needs to get a life!

Like the homosexuals, many atheists feel the need to vilify the Boy Scouts. They are making enemies out of a great many people. They need to be more tolerant.

22 posted on 12/12/2002 4:22:35 PM PST by yendu bwam
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To: madg
You have become our own resident Homofascist, haven't you. People are starting to stand up to the Gaystapo, thankfully.
23 posted on 12/12/2002 4:25:35 PM PST by Guillermo
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Comment #24 Removed by Moderator

Comment #25 Removed by Moderator

Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

Comment #27 Removed by Moderator

To: RonF
The scout oath and principles require belief in God, and Powell argued the school district was illegally involved with religious activity by allowing the organization to present membership information on school premises.

Using this reasoning, Powell could also argue that any teacher who has a belief in God shouldn't be allowed to teach in her son's school district.

28 posted on 12/12/2002 6:47:02 PM PST by judgeandjury
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To: madg
Talk about a non-sequiter.

Don't you have some GLSEN meeting to go to, or some Boy Scout troop to harass?
29 posted on 12/12/2002 6:48:32 PM PST by Guillermo
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To: madg
And if taxpayers say: "Don't give the BSA access to the children," what's wrong with that?

If a majority of taxpayers in a school district feel that way, that's one thing. But if only one or two taxpayers in a school district feel that way, then that's too bad for them. The minority doesn't tell the majority how things are going to be. Just because somebody is a taxpayer doesn't necessarily mean that they personally get to decide how their tax money is going to be spent.

30 posted on 12/12/2002 6:58:18 PM PST by judgeandjury
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To: Eaker
Wow, so you just get to take his (or her)money at the point of a government gun, and then allow the victim of your government sponsored robbery no say at all in how the money you helped steal is spent.

How very 'conservative' of you....

L

31 posted on 12/12/2002 6:59:13 PM PST by Lurker
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To: judgeandjury
"The minority doesn't tell the majority how things are going to be."

I think the German Reichstag felt the very same way in about 1939.

But hey, who cares about the minority view right? If they don't like it, we can just point guns at them until they shut up. And if they don't shut up, well we'll just give them a free ride in the American version of the Stolipin car, right comrade?

After all, you're the majority and that makes whatever you do alright doesn't it.

L

32 posted on 12/12/2002 7:02:23 PM PST by Lurker
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Comment #33 Removed by Moderator

Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

To: madg
Oh, of course, I'm a homosexual now, because, according to your logic, I don't subscribe to, and in fact oppose, the Homofascist agenda.

Members of the Gaystapo are the angriest, bitterest people out there.
35 posted on 12/13/2002 5:06:15 AM PST by Guillermo
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To: madg
If one starts at the top of this page... and searches out [CNTRL-F] the very first use of "homo"... one will be directed to YOUR post.

Speak the truth and shame the Devil!

36 posted on 12/13/2002 5:07:37 AM PST by FormerLib
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To: yendu bwam
A lot a good people have been completely smeared by homosexual activists as haters and bigots, for simply believing it's not prudent to have homosexual men take their teenage sons out camping overnight in their absence.

Of course, they want someone else's children to be sent out with the deviants!

Never has a good organization like Boy Scouts been so vilified and attacked by such intolerant people.

Yes, but I guess it takes a "bigot" such as we to note that fact.

37 posted on 12/13/2002 5:11:29 AM PST by FormerLib
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To: yendu bwam
Good point.

Schools have a variety of organizations that exclude someone.

38 posted on 12/13/2002 5:14:35 AM PST by Dante3
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To: Guillermo
He's merely the most recent in a long line of sexually misdirected posters. They have a need to see their perversion normalized. Soon, he/she/it will begin to realize that their deviance will never gain acceptance and they either move on or seek reparative therapy. We can only hope, for the sake of their souls, that they choose the latter.
39 posted on 12/13/2002 5:15:14 AM PST by FormerLib
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To: madg
I would say that it is the BSA that has been "smearing"... IE: "kicking out... folks for no good reason.

The rapes and molestations of thousands of teenage Catholic boys by homosexual priests would, to most, suggest otherwise. - - The fact is, homosexual activists (I did not mention YOU in my posts there, magd, and please don't pretend otherwise) have sought to smear and destroy an organization that does great good for millions of boys and families. These activists ARE among the most intolerant people in America today. Further, they hurt their own cause gravely by being so. Homosexuals do NOT have an intrinsic right to be in close quarters with other people's teenage sons.

40 posted on 12/13/2002 5:48:52 AM PST by yendu bwam
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To: Guillermo
Members of the Gaystapo are the angriest, bitterest and most intolerant people out there.
41 posted on 12/13/2002 5:54:04 AM PST by yendu bwam
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To: FormerLib
Of course, the Boy Scouts are now a target of the homosexual activists so there's a lot of money, coming from this "oppressed" minority, behind such attacks.

OK, so if thesuit was filed back in 1998 -- that was about the time they banned homosexuals. This hubub over atheists has only been recent and, IMO, represents another avenue that the act-up crowd is using to try to get at them. So, I'm wondering whether this suit is an attack by the atheists or by the gays.

I know I could be all wet with this analysis.
42 posted on 12/13/2002 6:09:29 AM PST by johnb838
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To: yendu bwam
I'm glad that the memory of what gays in the Boy Scouts did to that organization and the children in their charge has faded somewhat. However, let us never forget that the exclusion of homosexuals didn't take place in a vacuum. Pederasts nearly destroyed the BSA just like they are trying to do to the Catholic Church. The Church needs to wake up!
43 posted on 12/13/2002 6:18:17 AM PST by johnb838
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To: yendu bwam
Yes, I forgot to add that.

They are Taliban-like.
44 posted on 12/13/2002 6:21:59 AM PST by Guillermo
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To: madg
The Federal Equal Access act regards use of facilities, not access to schoolchildren. Right?

That's right Only the liberal antichristian, pro-union, pro-gay, pro-lesbian NEA has guaranteed access to schoolchildren. And its access is virtually monopolistic.

45 posted on 12/13/2002 6:26:36 AM PST by Kevin Curry
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To: johnb838
So, I'm wondering whether this suit is an attack by the atheists or by the gays.

Ask yourself if these are merely separate attacks from the same source.

46 posted on 12/13/2002 6:34:00 AM PST by FormerLib
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To: johnb838
I'm glad that the memory of what gays in the Boy Scouts did to that organization and the children in their charge has faded somewhat. However, let us never forget that the exclusion of homosexuals didn't take place in a vacuum. Pederasts nearly destroyed the BSA just like they are trying to do to the Catholic Church. The Church needs to wake up!

Unfortunately, despite the Boy Scouts' refusing to accept avowed homosexual scoutmasters, its two-deep adult rule and its strong efforts to educate teenage boys about the dangers of homosexual molestation, there are still well over a hundred boys each year who are homosexually molested in Boy Scouts. Still, the Boy Scouts has vastly improved the situation from what it was (when the incidence of homosexual molestation of scouts was much higher). And you're right, the Catholic Church doesn't get it - and needs to follow the same policies - that is, if it really cares about children first. To date, it hasn't. That's an abomination.

47 posted on 12/13/2002 6:54:44 AM PST by yendu bwam
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To: johnb838
OK, so if thesuit was filed back in 1998 -- that was about the time they banned homosexuals. This hubub over atheists has only been recent and, IMO, represents another avenue that the act-up crowd is using to try to get at them. So, I'm wondering whether this suit is an attack by the atheists or by the gays.

I know I could be all wet with this analysis.

In June of 1997, a prospective Scout was denied membership in an Explorer Post because he refused to accept the requirement to believe in God. At the time, the Explorer Post was sponsored by a Police Department. Although not cited in this link, previously a Chicago-area Cub Scout Pack lost it's charter with a local public school because an atheist tried to register his son without accepting the religious part of the program. The school took no position on the controversy itself, but didn't want to get involved in the ensuing lawsuit. That Pack eventually died out.

Atheists have been suing the BSA before the various homosexual-based lawsuits were filed.

48 posted on 12/13/2002 7:04:01 AM PST by RonF
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To: judgeandjury
Using this reasoning, Powell could also argue that any teacher who has a belief in God shouldn't be allowed to teach in her son's school district.

I don't see the connection. The BSA teaches Scouts that they should have a belief in some kind of God, or at least some kind of ethical/moral system wherein the doctrines/basic beliefs have at least some divine inspiration. Whereas a teacher who believes in God can work in the schools his or her entire career without once mentioning Him.

Having said that, I believe that allowing the BSA, GSUSA, and other organizations that require their members to believe in God to hand out recruitment flyers, etc., in the schools doesn't violate the First Amendment as long as the religious component of their program itself isn't being conducted at the school during this recruitment process.

In fact, it is a strict rule in the BSA that no Scout who is a member of a given unit can be required by that given unit to participate in any kind of religious ceremony.

49 posted on 12/13/2002 7:14:32 AM PST by RonF
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To: yendu bwam
Unfortunately, despite the Boy Scouts' refusing to accept avowed homosexual scoutmasters, its two-deep adult rule and its strong efforts to educate teenage boys about the dangers of homosexual molestation, there are still well over a hundred boys each year who are homosexually molested in Boy Scouts.

That's a pretty specific number, yendu. Where'd you get it from?

50 posted on 12/13/2002 7:15:35 AM PST by RonF
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