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California Bond Rating Cut as $35 Bln Deficit Looms
Bloomberg News ^ | 12/19 | By Dennis Walters

Posted on 12/19/2002 9:46:13 PM PST by Robert357

Edited on 07/19/2004 2:10:46 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

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To: lafayette76
Do you think we can pull 35 Billion bucks worth of oil out of the ocean floor in the next 18 months? (without any cost expenditures?)
41 posted on 12/20/2002 1:04:13 PM PST by P-Marlowe
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To: Publius6961; backhoe
I'll try and find you some. While I'm looking, read this:

CALIFORNIA'S BLACK-RUPTCY [IBD Editorial], posted May 11th, 2001.

Backhoe, can you "dig up" some more?

42 posted on 12/20/2002 1:17:44 PM PST by snopercod
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To: Publius6961; Gritty
State prepares for energy costs that could hit $100 million a day posted by Gritty on 4/21/2001:
The state's power bill could rise to $100 million a day in the coming months, raising widespread concern about the state's financial health and setting the stage for a showdown: Should the treasury be committed to keep the lights on at all costs, or should the state at some point say enough is enough and allow rolling blackouts? In a growing financial crisis that has redefined what constitutes a lot of money, the state's daily power tab has sent shivers through consumer advocates, economists and some state financial authorities who say the spending soon will drain a burgeoning surplus that ...

43 posted on 12/20/2002 1:32:14 PM PST by snopercod
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To: Publius6961
California Assembly Approves Sale Of Power Bonds Worth $13.4 Billion posted on 5/8/2001.
"This partisan vote sentences California rate payers to 15 years of energy bondage," said Assembly Republican Minority Leader Bill Campbell.

"Republicans proposed $5 billion in rate cuts for utility rate payers and $1.5 billion in rate cuts for municipal utility rate payers. Democrats would rather spend the surplus than reduce power rates."


44 posted on 12/20/2002 1:38:01 PM PST by snopercod
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To: Publius6961
And now for the piece de resistance:

The California electricity crisis is becoming a California financial crisis. from 10/29/2001:

For more than a year, California has suffered through blackouts, brownouts and an economic form of mass hysteria. Watching the governor of California, Gray Davis, exhibit the symptoms of economic idiocy became a reliable amusement for the rest of the country. As he said so accurately when the problem materialized, Davis could have solved it in 20 minutes had he been willing to let electric rates rise.

Instead, the governor tried to save consumers by insulating them from reality and assuring that free-floating wholesale prices of electricity exceeded fixed retail prices. Thus Davis turned a problem into a crisis, in which first the two major utilities bought power to sell at a loss, and then the state took over the sucker's role. In only a year, the utilities lost more than $15 billion and the state lost more than $12 billion.

I am the greatest. I am the greatest!

45 posted on 12/20/2002 1:43:53 PM PST by snopercod
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To: P-Marlowe
Very easily. The state can auction off exploration and drilling rights, and keep a percentage of the royalties. There's oil and gas everywhere from Santa Barbara to the North Coast.
46 posted on 12/20/2002 1:49:29 PM PST by lafayette76
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To: Publius6961
And for desert: California, Meet Indonesia [power crisis], posted on 3/15/2001:
California is demonstrating a third lesson, too. If you can borrow on your own credit, you can do whatever you want no matter how stupid folks in Washington think you are.

To buy electricity because generators won't sell to its utilities, California's state government plans to borrow $10 billion this year on Wall Street. That's roughly what the International Monetary Fund has lent Indonesia in the past three years, but Indonesia had to promise energy-price increases to get the money.


47 posted on 12/20/2002 1:50:42 PM PST by snopercod
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To: snopercod
We can just let the Socialists keep running California, and in a few years, its newly-acquired Third World status will qualify it for all those wonderful IMF and World Bank deals!
48 posted on 12/20/2002 1:55:56 PM PST by lafayette76
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To: marujo
Workers comp is safety net for injured workers. The state of California has made it more profitable to be injured than work.

An employee stopped coming to work in order to travel out of state with his new girl. A replacement worker was hired. It was not the first desertion for the employee. He was terminated upon his return and is now receiving unemployment and has a pro-bono attorney to sue for a fraudulent worker's comp claim for 'upper body" repetitive motion problems. In the mean time, he can't make his car payments and so he flees the state.

This is a normal scenario in Missouri. Any one can get unemployment and workers comp settlements. It takes an act of god and hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost time and attorneys fees for a small business owner to protect his integrity and prevent fraud. The system is geared to support fraud.

Bureaucrats and attorneys have created permanent full time employment for themselves in the workers comp field.

49 posted on 12/20/2002 2:01:37 PM PST by Podkayne
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To: marujo
Yes,the "ish"is about to hit the proverbial fan.The more taxes-less services combination is a recipe for total meltdown.Schools with forty five to fifty kids in a class will very shortly be ungovernable,burning out teachers as they cope with drastically reduced support staff such as security guards and custodians.
Then the tax increases will lead those who can to get the hell out of paradise to get going as rapidly as possible,leaving behind the low paying service workers,welfare dependents and the ultra rich Hollywood types who will be sheltered temporarily from the mounting chaos around them.
I have to stay five more years till I retire then its Arizona or Texas for me-assuming my Bay Area property is still worth SOMETHING by then!
50 posted on 12/20/2002 3:29:56 PM PST by Riverman94610
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To: Imal; Robert357
Maybe CA should apply to the IMF for a loan just like any other banana republic.
51 posted on 12/20/2002 3:43:08 PM PST by Pining_4_TX
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To: Pining_4_TX
So much envy - such an invidious emotion. California isn't going anywhere. To suggest that would be to say the Rio, Mexico City, Sao Paolo, etc don't thrive. It will continue to be as it always has been, only at different levels. The model for CA isn't disaster, but merely a reflection of the societies/cultures that reduced this state to its current level.

That is, a rich upper class (which will include, due to purchase power, any middle class wage earner), and the multitudes of poor and destitute.

There's too much wealth, and too great of an educated business class to abandon CA altogether. But what we will get is a bifurcation in the division of wealth. And this begin to occur shortly as the state pulls out of financing local programs and leaves it to cities/districts.

Wealthy areas like the Penninsula, West LA, and coastal OC/SD will easily be able to finance local programs to keep classrooms size down and infrastructure maintenance up.

But in the bario that is LA, watch out. The gang warfare that is going on right now is unstoppable. And we will begin to see 50+ kids in classrooms where nothing is being taught.

But like I said, as long as you're behind the gate with the ocean in your back-yard, no one that can pull off staying is going anywhere...especially to someplace like Texas.

52 posted on 12/20/2002 3:56:58 PM PST by Snerfling
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Comment #53 Removed by Moderator

To: Pining_4_TX
Maybe CA should apply to the IMF for a loan just like any other banana republic.

To get such loans the 3rd world countries need to agree to impose certain fiscal constraints on their spending. Wall Street rating agencies will be trying to impose those on California anyway. I can't see California legislators voluntarily giving in without some posturing and fighting. That means they might as well work it out and humor Wall Street for loans and Wall Street will treat them for the banana republic mentality that they show.

54 posted on 12/20/2002 5:17:30 PM PST by Robert357
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To: Snerfling
Excellent.
55 posted on 12/20/2002 5:39:18 PM PST by snopercod
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To: Snerfling
My comment was meant as a joke, but perhaps CA is turning into a banana republic. As you say, there will be very wealthy people living behind walls and masses of the underclass conducting gang warfare in slums. The middle class will shrink to almost nothing. Hmm, kind of sounds like Mexico, doesn't it?

Lest you think I am being smug, Texas and other states are heading in the same direction. The parasites are killing off their hosts.

56 posted on 12/20/2002 5:40:36 PM PST by Pining_4_TX
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To: Robert357
It may be worse than everyone thinks. Can anyone tell me the amount of CA bonds that Calpers is holding?
57 posted on 12/20/2002 5:53:43 PM PST by Crusader21stCentury
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To: Crusader21stCentury
I don't remember how much CalPers is holding but it is on the Treasurer's website. The loan that looks really crocked is the high interest loan from the Teachers pension system. Something has to be wrong with that one.
58 posted on 12/20/2002 9:44:28 PM PST by Robert357
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To: Snerfling
Very well said, very sad, but quite insightful.
59 posted on 12/20/2002 9:46:52 PM PST by Robert357
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