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Federal Grand Jury Duty - How to Get Out of It???(Vanity)
N/A | 30 Dec 02 | Texson66

Posted on 12/30/2002 8:02:29 AM PST by texson66

Instead of winning the Powerball lotto, I just won the federal grand jury lotto. In case you are unaware, the term of a FGJ(Federal Grand Juror) is 18 MONTHS! Sure they "pay" you for your public service: $40/ a day and 36.5 per mile. They are sure not paying the per diem rate for federal workers!

Essentially, you are required to take a 20% pay cut for a year and a half of "public" service!

Well, I am not willing to go into "indentured servitude" for the feds. I have a family and a mortage with a demanding job that requires a lot of travel.Plus 21 yrs of military service has to count for "public duty"!

Any suggestions on how to get out of this "duty"???


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government
KEYWORDS: federalcourts; grandjury; indenturedservitude; publicservice
Yeah, I know ....a great and noble duty yada yada yada! But here are a couple of links to "FGJ duty" experiences:

Our Unjust Justice System

FGJ Experience & Critique

1 posted on 12/30/2002 8:02:30 AM PST by texson66
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To: texson66
Any suggestions on how to get out of this "duty"???

Be sure to bring one of those pocket Constitutions with you when they initially call you in. When asked about your political beliefs, state your honest belief about the importance of limited government and that you believe the feds have usurped powers. They won't want you on their rubber stamping machine, and you won't have to lie to get tossed out...

2 posted on 12/30/2002 8:05:31 AM PST by dirtboy
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To: texson66
Did you just get a letter in the mail? Simply do not respond.

If it was a registered letter and you picked it up, better go to plan B.

(Hint: never pick up a registered letter, they are always bad news.)
3 posted on 12/30/2002 8:09:31 AM PST by the gillman@blacklagoon.com
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To: dirtboy
I certainly agree with your statement! Will try this approach then!
4 posted on 12/30/2002 8:10:05 AM PST by texson66
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To: texson66
I got off regular federal jury duty honestly by questioning a SCOTUS decision relevant to the case - I genuinely believed that it allowed double jeopardy in certain cases, and it would affect my ability to impartially judge the evidence. Of course, it also didn't hurt that my ex-wife had clerked for the federal prosecutor in the case (don't think you'll be able to try that approach, that's why I didn't mention it).
5 posted on 12/30/2002 8:13:04 AM PST by dirtboy
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Comment #6 Removed by Moderator

To: texson66
Called for jury duty and being pre-interviewed by the opposing attorneys to see if any of us should be dismissed because we knew any of the parties, etc., I told them (the attorneys) that based on prior court experience I had had that as far as I was concened the instant I believed one of the attorneys or clients or witnesses was lying, that side immediately lost the case in my mind.

Both attorneys immediately dismissed me.

They realized I was damn serious.

7 posted on 12/30/2002 8:15:25 AM PST by jigsaw
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To: texson66
Ask the court clerk what type of pistol you can carry concealed while in the building. When they say you can't, act horrified and tell them that the bad guys will get you and you fear for your safety. Act really paranoid. They may reconsider. I've never been called, but as a LE professional, I would simply state that they must be guilty, otherwise the police would not have arrested the perps.
8 posted on 12/30/2002 8:15:40 AM PST by AlaskaErik
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To: lavocat
Well, it is a duty IF you feel that the Federal government is right in usurping many of the former state government functions. I dont. I pay taxes, vote, and served for 20 years in the military. How much civil duty do you do??? :-)
9 posted on 12/30/2002 8:19:00 AM PST by texson66
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To: dirtboy
SO telling the GJ that I am a drunk won't get me off?
10 posted on 12/30/2002 8:21:51 AM PST by Recon by Fire
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To: AlaskaErik; jigsaw
Unfortunately, this is a grand jury not a trial jury. So, I
would have to listen to the Feds ONLY in making a bill of
indictment. No defense attorneys are allowed in the GJ room.
11 posted on 12/30/2002 8:22:57 AM PST by texson66
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To: texson66
tell them you are a white supremacist and your against the death penalty
12 posted on 12/30/2002 8:26:29 AM PST by ContentiousObjector
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To: texson66
Several good tips have been given already. I was called for jury duty, did not want to serve and in the review process stated some VERY strong opinions. Was quickly excused. The worst thing you can do is appear to be neutral and remain quiet.

Any indication you can give as to either the innocence or guilt of the parties involved and stick with it will probably cause you to be released. Best wishes.

13 posted on 12/30/2002 8:28:11 AM PST by MeneMeneTekelUpharsin
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To: lavocat
This specific post involves a grand jury, which is only used to determine if indictments will be drawn up. A trial jury does not last nearly as long in most cases.

14 posted on 12/30/2002 8:31:07 AM PST by Alberta's Child
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To: All
This is a little off the point, but I thought I would throw it in. I believe it was Steven Wright who said:

"If you are ever accused of a crime in this country you feel confident in the fact that you will be tried by a jury consisting of people too stupid to get out of jury duty."

15 posted on 12/30/2002 8:34:03 AM PST by mbynack
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To: texson66
I got off a jury once..

They asked me if I thought the defendent would lie on the stand.

I replyed:

Why not? Our president did, and look what happend to him -- nothing!

Needless to say they did not select me...
16 posted on 12/30/2002 8:34:58 AM PST by max_rpf
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To: texson66
I have no problem serving on a trial jury as long as I don't get stuck in court for months. However, in my experience lawyers do not like to keep professionals on the jury because they are not easily swayed.

I once had a lawyer tell me that he always does his best to get engineers and accountants off the jury in his cases.

17 posted on 12/30/2002 8:37:25 AM PST by Alberta's Child
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To: texson66
$40/day is a 20% pay cut? You make $250/week for "a demanding job that requires a lot of travel"? This doesn't sound right.
18 posted on 12/30/2002 8:39:26 AM PST by GovernmentShrinker
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To: AlaskaErik
I would simply state that they must be guilty,

The summons was for a grand jury, not a trial jury. Since a prosecuting attorney wants a grand juror who will rubber stamp the indictments, your statement would probably guarantee that you would serve.

19 posted on 12/30/2002 8:42:10 AM PST by PAR35
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To: texson66
Any suggestions on how to get out of this "duty"???

Just got out of Federal jury duty last week. I have MS, and had to have my doctor fax info to the clerk. They wouldn't take my word that I can't see well enough to drive to court, among other things. I wonder if the fact that I spend much of my time FReeping would have made any difference in voir dire.... I'd like to think so.

20 posted on 12/30/2002 8:44:32 AM PST by lorrainer
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To: GovernmentShrinker
$40/day is a 20% pay cut? You make $250/week for "a demanding job that requires a lot of travel"? This doesn't sound right.

I think he was referring to the hit he would take in his salary by not being there the days he would serve on jury duty. If he made 100K per year, and missed out on salary (and commissions) because of his absense of 20K per year, the $40 a day doesn't add too much.

I thought GJ duty was once a month, so the better question is where he got the 20%.

21 posted on 12/30/2002 8:55:26 AM PST by 1L
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To: GovernmentShrinker
Federal Grand Jury Duty will probably involve two days a month, possible four, depending on the district. Of course, it could be as little as one day a month, also depending on the district.

Of course, you could bring up your opposition the notion of the Grand Jury, but as it is required by the Fifth Amendment to the Constitution, you'll be unlikely to get it removed from the Constitution before your term of service begins.

As a last resort, you could go in a tell all the other Grand Jurors (who are also being inconviencned), that you are much more worthy of being excused than they because of your prior service to your Country and your much better paying job. This will likely only antagonzie them, but it could be fun.

And last of all, in Shelby County, TN, you recieve exactly $6.00/day for jury service - no mileage allowance, no parking fees, nothing more than the $6.00. So be glad it's the Federal Government that has requested you to perform your Constitutional Duty, because if it were the state, you'd have to find some way to make up that $34.00/day plus mileage you would be missing.
22 posted on 12/30/2002 9:01:40 AM PST by quienyo
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To: texson66
Why don't you tell the judge that your initial reaction was worry about the 20% pay cut you'd effectively be taking. However, upon reflection, you've figured out some "other ways" that will more make up the difference. Then go on to ask if there are any other grand juries in need of someone right now...
23 posted on 12/30/2002 9:08:23 AM PST by NittanyLion
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To: GovernmentShrinker
Sorry. I meant that I will lose a day's pay ($40 is the feds idea of compensation)(4 days paid out of five= 80%) AND after 10 days of duty my company will not compensate me after that period of time.
24 posted on 12/30/2002 9:26:58 AM PST by texson66
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To: texson66
You're making me nervous. I got called for petit jury duty on our local county court next week--first time ever for jury duty for me, so it should at least be interesting. And I get a parking pass and $6/day, w00t!

(How much do I hate my job that I'm looking FORWARD to jury duty?)

}:-)4
25 posted on 12/30/2002 9:29:10 AM PST by Moose4
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To: texson66
tex...You get paid while in military??? Get a pension now??? Servitude????
26 posted on 12/30/2002 9:29:50 AM PST by cynicom
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To: dirtboy
Of course, it also didn't hurt that my ex-wife had clerked for the federal prosecutor in the case (don't think you'll be able to try that approach, that's why I didn'tmention it.

I managed something similar when faced with a juror background questionaire that asked *occupation* to which I answered, quite accurately *newspaperman/ syndicated columnist.*

The next question stated *describe duties of employment position.* Barely resisting an urge to fill in the blank with *attempt to appear awake* I wrote in *reportage and research into political corruption, to include judicial misconduct and favoritism and judicial impropriety investigations by Commission on Judicial misconduct, impeachment, and/or disbarment*

Guess who did not have to serve on the jury...but who DID cover that trial as a newspaperman. A year or so thereafter, the prosecuting attorney who'd brought the case was arrested on federal charges, convicted and jailed, and oh yes, disbarred. 20 felony counts, including forgery indictments related to charges of defrauding some 14 former clients of a total of at least $790,000....

For some reason, those in the judge's office didn't care to play any more after that....

-archy-/-

27 posted on 12/30/2002 9:51:14 AM PST by archy
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To: cynicom
My military service was an honor and a duty which I was proud to perform.

You get paid in the military at a rate well below industry standards...retirement "pay" is compenstation for those many
years of such pay and the years of moving around. I fulfilled my duty for 20 years, the US government is now meeting their end of the bargain (in most cases... free medical services come to mind...)

The servitude I am referring to is the unfair jury selection process: no lawyers, teachers etc are ever called. See the links above.

I've done my duty for my country...I dont want to be in the
service of the Feds in their courts as they take over more and more of what should properly be done by the states.

Most Federal procescutors apparently believe they can get the FGJs to "rubber stamp" their plans. I do not want to be a party to endure this type of pressure.

28 posted on 12/30/2002 9:53:08 AM PST by texson66
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To: texson66
would you want a lawyer or a teacher sitting on a jury if you were in the dock????
29 posted on 12/30/2002 9:58:17 AM PST by cynicom
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To: texson66
I believe that your company is REQUIRED to pay you while you are on jury duty, and to give you time off. Sometimes they take your jury duty pay, sometimes they let you keep it. Tell the judge your company won't play ball. He'll handle it for you.
30 posted on 12/30/2002 10:02:17 AM PST by Grammy
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To: cynicom
Many teachers would be great...lawyers....wel, I see your point!! LOL! :-)
31 posted on 12/30/2002 10:51:52 AM PST by texson66
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To: Grammy
Yes. My company will pay for 10 days of jury duty. So that might cover 2 and a half months (if I perform jury work once a week). After that, I have to take LWOP (Leave wothout pay)for the next 15 and a half months.
32 posted on 12/30/2002 12:14:06 PM PST by texson66
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To: texson66
I think they are required to pay you for ALL the time off. Tell the judge. I had a friend who also did grand jury duty. The judge ordered her company to pay her for all her jury duty time. She did, however, have to give them her jury duty "pay" and work harder on her days there to try to catch up with all her work 8-)
33 posted on 12/30/2002 1:08:19 PM PST by Grammy
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To: texson66
Tell them that because of the severe financial burden you would bear, combined with your past experiences with the government and knowledge of other bad experiences by others, that you would automatically be prejudiced against the state and therefore could not render a fair judgment.
34 posted on 12/30/2002 7:46:11 PM PST by Mind-numbed Robot
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