Free Republic
Browse · Search
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Evidence Of Tunguska-Type Impacts Over The Pacific Basin Around The Year 1178 AD
SIS Conference ^ | Emilio Spedicato

Posted on 01/26/2003 9:36:14 AM PST by blam

Evidence Of Tunguska-type Impacts Over The Pacific Basin Around The Year 1178 A.D.

Emilio Spedicato

University of Bergamo, Piazza Rosate 2, 24129 Bergamo, Italy,

In year 1178 A.D., as related by Clube and Napier in their book The Cosmic Serpent, a strange event was observed to affect the Moon, which may be explained by a large impact on the hidden face, originating the Giordano Bruno crater. A number of observations suggest that catastrophic cometary or meteoritic impacts around the same time also affected the Pacific basin: Maori legends of great fires destroying forests and the moa bird, to be associated to the recently found Tapanui craters; dynastic changes and migrations throughout Polynesia; very intense El Niño activity with flooding of the coastal Peruvian regions; demise of the local Moche civilizations, and the birth of the Incas civilization higher in the Andes; the emigration of the Aztects from the Pacific coast to the interior in the most well protected area from tsunams; unusually intense typhoon activity in the Chinese-Japanese see; unusually strong floods in Northern China with diversion of the course of the Huang Ho; unusually cold wheather in the Mongolian plateau, probably a main reason for the Mongolians invading nearby areas; a great sign in the sky seen by the boy Gengis Khan forecasting his future of world master; the number of comets seen in the sky as recorded by Chinese astronomers was unusually higher.


EMILIO SPEDICATO born in Milano, graduated in Physics and has been working since 1971 in numerical analysis (linear algebra and optimisation) and applied mathematics. His main work, with Abaffy and Broyden and several Chinese mathematicians, has been the development of the ABS algorithms, which unify the field of algorithms for solving linear algebraic equations and linearly constrained optimisation and provide novel and better methods than their classical counterparts (e.g. the implicit LX algorithm which is generally faster and more accurate and has less storage than the classical best algorithm, Gaussian elimination). Since 1979 he has been involved in the catastrophical reproach of homo sapiens history and related events in the Earth history. He has proposed that Hispaniola was the original location of Atlantis and is working on a project aiming to study mathematically the feasibility of a revised "polar model" approach to the history of the solar system (transition from a configuration with aligned planets in synchronous revolution around the Sun to the present configuration after capture of Jupiter at a time when homo sapiens already inhabited the Earth). He is professor of Operations Research at University of Bergamo.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Presented at the SIS Conference: Natural Catastrophes during Bronze Age Civilisations.

TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 1178; archaeology; baillie; basin; catastrophism; davidrohl; emiliospedicato; evidence; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; history; impacts; mikebaillie; pacific; rohl; spedicato; tunguska
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-63 next last

1 posted on 01/26/2003 9:36:14 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: blam
Emilio Spedicato

Last to hit the stage was Emilio Spedicato, the Professor of Operations Research (a mathematical discipline) at Bergamo University. He had flown from Italy especially to be at the Mysteries of the Past conference.

Emilio treated the audience to a visual guide to the origins of the solar system and the possible mechanisms behind the appearance of comets, asteroids and other types of so-called Apollo objects in the inner solar system. He also confirmed that the Carolina bays cometary event at the end of the Pleistocene epoch might well have been responsible for the rapid climatic changes which eventually brought the last Ice Age to a sudden close some 11,500 years ago (I date these events around a thousand years later by using Carbon-14 data untainted by recalculations made using dendrochronology). Such an almighty impact would have caused a nuclear winter that re-advanced the ice sheets for a period of around 200 years (conforming with our knowledge of the brief re-advances known as the Valders in America and the Younger Dryas in Europe). Afterwards the climate would have warmed rapidly causing the melting of greet ice-sheets and glaciers, particularly in the northern parts of the American continent. The result would have been the rapid drowning of low-lying regions of the globe, including the Caribbean.

To finish his lecture, Emilio introduced the audience to his own theories on the true location of Atlantis. Using the basic evidence independently reviewed by myself and David Rohl, he has come to the conclusion that Plato’s Atlantic island was Hispaniola, the second largest island in the Greater Antilles group.

Evidence for this conclusion, he says, comes from the fact that the coasts of Atlantis were said by Plato to have been particularly precipitous, a description which applies very well to Hispaniola’s coastline. Moreover, since there have been no major changes to the shoreline since the termination of the glacial age, geologists can safely say that this is how the island would have looked in the time-frame proposed by Plato for the destruction of Atlantis.

On Hispaniola a roughly rectangular-shaped plain exists in the south-eastern corner of the island. Similar to the irrigated plain described in the CRITIAS, it is shielded to the north by a range of hills. Plato asserts that the size of the Atlantean plain is 3000 stadia (552 kilometres) by 2000 stadia (368 kilometres). This, Emilio feels, comes close to matching the overall size of Hispaniola, which is orientated east-west and measures approximately 650 x 300 kilometres; he dismissed the neighbouring island of Cuba as a possible candidate since it is too large to fit the island being implied by Plato.

One possible candidate for the location of the Atlantean city would, in Emilio’s estimate, be the lowland region of Hispaniola known as the Plaine de Cul-des-Sac. It is bordered north and south by mountains. Moreover, it possesses several lakes, including Lake Enriquillo, the surface of which is currently below sea-level. There is every reason to suggest that the lake could contain coralline structures, today covered by sediment, which might well help to explain the red, white and black stone said by Plato to have been used to construct the city.

The Taino of Hispaniola referred to the island as Quisqueya, the ‘mother of lands’. Did this denote, he suggested, its importance as a mythical homeland to the peoples of the Caribbean archipelago during prehistoric times?

If Hispaniola is Atlantis, then the other islands said by Plato to have formed the Atlantean empire would constitute the principal islands of the Greater Antilles, namely Cuba and Puerto Rico, a point I would not query. However, I have grave doubts about Hispaniola being Atlantis and address each and every one of the points raised by Emilio in its favour within GATEWAY TO ATLANTIS. Furthermore, you can read about the growing debate over the true location of Atlantis in the article on the work of Paul Felix Cabrera to be found elsewhere on this site. Yet the sheer fact that an academic of Emilio Spedicato’s calibre has concluded that Atlantis was the neighbouring island to the one proposed by myself only strengthens each other’s claims for having found the true location of Atlantis. I now have no doubt whatsoever that we are within a hare’s breath of uncovering the final mysteries of what is arguably one of the greatest mysteries of the past 2000 years.

2 posted on 01/26/2003 9:41:30 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam
Carolina Bays
3 posted on 01/26/2003 9:46:09 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: blam

Carolina Bays. (500,000 of these along the east coast of the US)

4 posted on 01/26/2003 9:48:16 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: blam
It is interesting that catastrophism is coming back. Sounds a bit like Velikovsky.
5 posted on 01/26/2003 9:48:46 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam

Carolina Bays

6 posted on 01/26/2003 9:50:26 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: blam
I now have no doubt whatsoever that we are within a hare’s breath of uncovering the final mysteries of what is arguably one of the greatest mysteries of the past 2000 years.

"Hare's breath"???? Likely ought to be "hair's breadth". Not doing his credibility any favors by making such a mistake, huh?

7 posted on 01/26/2003 9:50:40 AM PST by The Electrician
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

Sounds a bit like Velikovsky...

Not if you pay full attention to what Velokovsky says.

8 posted on 01/26/2003 9:50:57 AM PST by js1138
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: blam
Thanks again for giving us the benefit of your efforts
9 posted on 01/26/2003 9:53:26 AM PST by bert
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

There is some minor evidence...but nothing overwhelming. It is curious that the Incas chose the mountains to build upon...nothing from their society exists prior to the 1200 period, and eventually...they did give up the mountains.
10 posted on 01/26/2003 9:53:28 AM PST by pepsionice
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: blam
Update On Underwater Megalithic (Cuba)
11 posted on 01/26/2003 9:56:17 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: js1138
Thanks for the spell check. I read the guy 40 years ago-roughly.Just remember the impression i.e. Venus moving around etc. It was catatrophism though.Then we have Alvarez with his comet strike wiping out the dinosaurs-If I remember correctly. At any rate I wonder if this interest tells us more about the psyche of scientists than about reality. Just a thought.
12 posted on 01/26/2003 9:56:27 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: blam
13 posted on 01/26/2003 10:01:42 AM PST by Centurion2000 (The meek shall inherit the Earth. The stars belong to the bold.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

No one in geology has ever denied the possibility of asteroid impacts. The problem with catatrophism as it was theorized 50 years or more ago, is it attempted to explain what are obviously gradual processes. In the entire history of the earth there are only a handful of suspected worldwide catastrophes. The 1908 impact was a blip.
14 posted on 01/26/2003 10:01:53 AM PST by js1138
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: blam
A Catastrophic Scenario For Discontinuities In Human History
15 posted on 01/26/2003 10:08:33 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: js1138
Going Into The Water: A Survey Of Impact Events And The Coastal People Of South-East North America, The Caribbean, And Central America
16 posted on 01/26/2003 10:15:32 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

"Then we have Alvarez with his comet strike wiping out the dinosaurs."

That was Alvarez...and his meteorite was at Chixalub, just off the Yucatan, 65 millions years ago.

Impacts have greatly affected humans in the last 12k years.

17 posted on 01/26/2003 10:19:26 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

Did Asteroids And Comets Turn The Tides Of Civilization?
18 posted on 01/26/2003 10:21:49 AM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: blam
19 posted on 01/26/2003 10:26:32 AM PST by Fiddlstix (Tag Line Service Center: Tag Line Repairs Here! Good Used Tag Lines For Sale! Inquire Within)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: js1138
When I had the sciences 40 to 45 years ago. There was no discussion of catatrophism except to say it was refuted. That is why I brought up the "return to catatrophism" topic. Of course there has been few world wide disasters in the history of the earth. If many more we would not be discussing this topic. Personally the modern catatrophists have convinced me.
20 posted on 01/26/2003 10:26:32 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: blam
The article illustrates what I mean by catatrophism. Interesting.
21 posted on 01/26/2003 10:32:22 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: js1138
By the way now that we are discussing the topic If I recall correctly catatrophism was believed "put to bed" circa the 1840's to 1860's. If inclined I'll look it up in an old geology text from the late 1950's. This is one of the advantages of age-not too many advantages though.
22 posted on 01/26/2003 10:35:55 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

There was no discussion of catatrophism except to say it was refuted. That is why I brought up the "return to catatrophism" topic.

It has been refuted as a cause of major geological phenomena. It is returning as an explanation of a handful of biological extinctions. Satellite photos have given us evidence of large craters, but these are not the cause of features like the grand canyon.

23 posted on 01/26/2003 10:43:19 AM PST by js1138
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

From my brothers Geology text "Introduction to Physical Geology" 2nd edition 1962. Page4 "...those who held this view, the catatrophists, were in the ascendancy until late in the eighteenth century....James Hutton of Edinburgh formulated the principle of uniformity of process..." My memory was off by about 50 -60 years.
24 posted on 01/26/2003 10:43:52 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: js1138
That is what I'm saying it is returning. You are correct to the extent that catatrophism no longer "explains" features like the Grand Canyon. I tend to think though that there is some insight into the scientists psyche by the return of the doctrine. However, I do not insist.
25 posted on 01/26/2003 10:48:25 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

I tend to think though that there is some insight into the scientists psyche by the return of the doctrine.

Certainly. Science responds to evidence.

26 posted on 01/26/2003 10:55:14 AM PST by js1138
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: js1138
"Certainly. Science responds to evidence."

Or to social anxiety. Catatrophism carries with it the fear it could happen at any time. Once again I do not insist. It is just an undeveloped thought. A great thinker once said that "physics is just an exegesis of our world view ."

27 posted on 01/26/2003 11:01:55 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (Further, the statement assumed)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: blam
You know, if this phenomenon was observed and recorded in a religious text, I wonder how much effort would go into discrediting it.

( Just for the naysayers--many thought Troy was a myth until Schliemann found it )

28 posted on 01/26/2003 11:14:55 AM PST by Tench_Coxe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: RadioAstronomer; longshadow; PatrickHenry
29 posted on 01/26/2003 11:15:09 AM PST by Aracelis
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

Catatrophism carries with it the fear it could happen at any time

While I'm not a Catastrophist (after Velikovsky), I nevertheless of the opinion that catastrophes have decidedly shaped our world. And yes, Terra Firma and our fragile veneer of civilization are sitting ducks for any future impacts.

30 posted on 01/26/2003 11:20:41 AM PST by Aracelis
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

Like you apparently, I see Velicovsky, while probably wrong in his theories in the vast majority, to have been a necessary curative to an over statement of gradualism.

Once the vast possibilities of catastophic change were openly discussed, the eye of the general science reader continued to look for instances where it might apply but dogma had kept it unconsidered.

31 posted on 01/26/2003 11:23:50 AM PST by KC Burke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: blam
Summa dem rabbits is preddy wide, i hears.
32 posted on 01/26/2003 11:28:39 AM PST by eno_
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: blam
33 posted on 01/26/2003 11:49:55 AM PST by Lessismore
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: blam
34 posted on 01/26/2003 12:55:51 PM PST by razorback-bert
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Tench_Coxe
"You know, if this phenomenon was observed and recorded in a religious text, I wonder how much effort would go into discrediting it."

Read Exodus. The 1628BC explosion of Santorini/Thera/Akatori provided the fireworks and the plagues for that event.

The 5,600BC flooding of the Black Sea is as good a site as any for 'Noah's Flood'.

35 posted on 01/26/2003 2:12:45 PM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: Lessismore; RightWhale; JudyB1938; #3Fan; albee; yoe; ET(end tyranny); FreeLibertarian; Bohemund; ..
(Thanks, I'll post the whole article. I could not find it)

1. Introduction

As related by Clube and Napier in their monograph The Cosmic Winter, see [1], in the year 1178 A.D. four wise men of Canterbury were sitting outside on a clear and calm 18th June night, a half Moon standing placidly in the starry sky. Suddenly they noticed a flame jutting out of a horn of the Moon. Then they saw the Moon tremble and its colour change slowly from light brilliant to a darker reddish tone. Such a colour remained for all the time the Moon was visible during that phase. This story is found in a manuscript version of Canterbury annals, that was shown to Clube by a medieval English history specialist.

When the hidden face of the Moon was first photographed by a lunar mission, a large and clearly very recently produced crater was visible near the lunar north polar region. It was named the Giordano Bruno crater. Its recent origin is shown by the absence of secondary superimposed craters. The crater is considered to have been produced by a cometary or meteoritic impact with a body of 2-3 kilometers size, implying an energy in the range of hundred of million of megatons. The year of the impact might well be 1178 A.D., thereby explaining the observations recorded in the Canterbury annals, as first proposed apparently by Hartung [2].

Now it is known that cometary or meteoritic impacts do not happen on a purely stochastic way and that almost contemporary multiple impacts are a rather common event. This follows from the fact that the impacting bodies are often part of a stream of objects (comets, Apollos,...) produced by the disintegration of an initially larger body, by causes like internal instability or disrupting tidal forces by planets near which the object has passed. While the stream tends with time to expand and dissolve, its existence is nonetheless the reason for a likely multiplicity of impacts (notice for instance that the Wien University geologists Alexander and Edith Tollmann in [3] have given geological arguments for a seven-fold multiple cometary impact over Earth oceans at circa 6500 B.C.) and for an enhanced probability of impacts at the time the Earth is crossing the stream region.

By the above arguments, the following question naturally arises: was planet Earth, whose cross section is much larger than the Moon's (by a factor about 15), also impacted around the year 1178? Preliminary to this question: was the Earth crossing a stream around 1178? Then, if the Earth was hit, where was the event or the events and which were the consequences?

In the following nine sections we give arguments for likely multiple impacts over the Pacific basin, with dramatic consequences for the people living in that area and some, albeit delayed, dramatic consequences also for the Mediterranean region.

2. Evidence of the crossing of a cometary stream in the year 1178 A.D.

There are at least two pieces of information that indicate that the Earth crossed a cometary stream during the late 11th and the 12th century, with a peak around the half of the 12th century.

The first information comes from European history. Frequent and scaring appearances of large comets were indeed a main factor that contributed to the special psychological climate that led to the Crusades, which were often seen, at least at the popular level, as a means for atonement of sins, the divine wrath expressing itself through the menacing comets. A great comet appeared during a meeting of bishops, where a decision had to be taken for starting the first Crusade, and was a final argument in favour of the Crusade.

The second piece comes from Chinese astronomers, who were routinely recording comets and fireballs. Such recordings have been the object of a study by Clube [4]. They show a very clear peak of sightings around the middle of the 12th century, the peak being over ten times higher than the average background. It is interesting to notice that a similar peak is also present at about half the 6th century, a time when, according to several Byzanthin historians quoted by Gibbon [5], e. g. Malala, Procopius and Theophanes, many scaring comets appeared in the sky. That was also the time of the great Justinian plague, which decimated the population of the Mediterranean region, killing up to 90% of the population according to some estimates. This depopulation was certainly a major factor which facilitated the Arab expansion some three generations later.

3. Arguments from New Zealand Maori legends

From New Zealand two arguments come. First we have the Maori legends stating that, several centuries ago, fire came from the sky, burned most of the forests and killed the Moa birds (the Maori adamantly reject the western scholars opinion that overhunting was the reason for the Moa disappearance). Secondly there is the recent finding of a number of shallow and definitely very recent impact craters, named the Tapanui craters, in the South Island. Additionally, layers of soot, datable at the cratering time, have been detected in several places. The Tapanui craters and the presence of soot can be taken as a confirmation that "fire" came from the sky, burned the forests and killed the Moas, as the Maori legends state. The time of the event has been estimated at circa 800 years ago, therefore falling at our proposed date. For more information on the event see Steel and Snow [6] and Pajak [7,8].

4. Arguments from Polynesia

It is known, see Heyerdahl [9] and Fornander [10], that at the end of the 12th century there have been severe disruptions throughout the archipelagos in Polynesia, leading to discontinuities in the local dinasties and to generalized migrations, mainly in the direction from North America to the Hawaiis and to the other islands. Heyerdahl writes (see quoted monograph, pp. 169,170): A. Fornander, a notable early Polynesian genealogist, after a life-long study of Polynesian tribe history claimed that about 30 generations reckoned from the end of the last century bring us back to a period when the aristocracy in almost all groups took, so to say, a new departure. From then on, during a period of a few generations, all royal lines were interrupted and substituted by new ones. A migratory wave swept the island world of the Pacific, embracing in its vortex all the principal groups, and probably all the smaller. Its traces were deep and indelible. It modified the ancient customs, creed and polity. It even affected the speech of the people.... new tutelar gods succeeded the earlier deities, new place names replaced old ones... the construction of the pyramidal stone platforms also seemed to have ceased during this period... traditional narratives show that an early people were found in Hawaii, Cook Islands and New Zealand by the later Polynesians...the later immingrants conquered their predecessors, who were not exterminated but absorbed.} The date of the events can be set between the years 1100 and 1200, see also the work of another Polynesian genealogist, Percy Smith [11], an interval which brackets our proposed date 1178.

To this time it is also possible to relate the migration that, according again to Heyerdahl [12,13], brought a community of Melanesian people to Easter Island, which at that time was inhabited by a completely different type of people (high stature, reddish hair, europoid features) and a more advanced culture, one of whose main elements was the construction of the famous giants. For several centuries the Melanesian people lived as slaves and worked in the quarries to build the statues. Then, probably in the year 1670, they rebelled and killed most of their masters (apparently only one adult male was left alive).

5. Arguments from South America

In South America we first observe, at the time under discussion, the rather sudden demise of the great coastal civilizations (Mochicas, Chimus,...), that, inter alia, had build huge pyramids (the largest of the Tucume pyramid, near the northern Peru town of Lambayeque, had a square basis with a side of about 800 meters; while only about 70 meters high, its total volume was about 30% greater than that of the great Giza pyramid) and a complex system of canals for irrigation. The demise was sudden and without recovery. It was also associated to substantial ruin of the pyramids, by evident erosion by flood (the pyramids were not build in stone but with compacted soil), and of the irrigation system.

Secondly, we observe, immediately following the demise of the coastal civilization, the rise, in the high Andine range, of the new Incas civilization. The Incas, in the course of three centuries, till they collapsed under the Spaniard aggression, probably benefiting to a large extent of the construction techniques previously developed by the coastal people, founded a great empire extending from present Colombia to Chile, well connected by an efficient road system. The Incas royal family claimed a very ancient origin and also differenciated itself from the common people by the use of a special form of language (the royal Quechua). According to a recently found manuscript dated to the year 1611 and containing information attributed to Blas Valera, (see Laurencich Minelli et al. [14]), a Jesuit with a Spanish father and an Incas mother, the Incas royal family traced its origin to the 6th century (quite intriguingly, a time of great cometary activity and of the Justinian plague), when two groups of migrating people are claimed to have reached South America, one from the West (Tartaria) and one from the East, these last people being called Viracochas and being white dressed. A fighting followed their meeting and most of the Viracochas were killed. The royal Incas family descended from intermarriages between the people from the West and the surviving Viracochas.

The development at this time, after the collapse of the coastal civilization, of a civilization of essentially high mountains can be intriguingly explained if the coastal civilization was destroyed by a natural catastrophical event, like a great tsunami, which scared enormously the survivors and the neighbouring people. The coastal area was then abandoned and the civilization restarted on higher, presumibly safer, land. Effects of wheather changes, e.g. drier conditions along the coast, may also have contributed to this geographical displacement.

Thirdly, analysis of past El Niño behaviour indicates unusual conditions at the time under consideration. Information on past intensity of El Niño can be obtained by analysis of the oceanic sediments, particularly by the relative abundances of certain shellfish which develop only when the water temperature rises above a certain level (the El Niño current is cold, so a strong El Niño wipes out most of this shellfish). Recent analysis, see Heyerdahl [15], has shown that El Niño activity has dramatically peaked around the middle of the 12th century. An unusually strong El Niñno not only would result in a disruption of the normal local Pacific fauna, but would provoke very strong torrential rains over the usually dry Peruvian coastal region. This may have been the main cause of the observed strong erosion of the Tucume pyramids and a factor for disruption of the local irrigation system. We however suspect that the demise of the coastal civilization has to be related to a very dramatic and killing tsunamic wave.

6. Arguments from Central America

The fifth argument comes from Central America, relating to the origin of the Aztec civilization and to some extent explaining the Aztec obsession with human sacrifice.

When Cortes reached central Mexico, he met there the stronghold of the Aztects, who were living in a rather small region west of the great Popocatepl--Ixtacihuatl volcanic range, in a bowl shaped region of circa 2.000 square kilometers, completely surrounded by mountains, the local rivers sending their waters not to the ocean but to a marshy lake at the center of the region, lake Texcoco (now almost completely dried up). In the middle of the lake, on a number of small islets, the Aztec capital Tenochtitlan was build, counting at Cortes time possibly over one million people (in one of his letters to Charles 5th, the Spanish emperor, Cortes, see [16], claimed that over 400.000 persons in the city had died of the epidemics, smallpox, brought by the Spaniards; due to the ferocity of the fighting possibly more people died of wounds and several thousands survived the destruction).

It appears from geography that the Aztects had chosen to live and in particular to build their capital in a region whose main feature, from the point of view of the presently discussed scenario, was to be well protected, thanks to its elevation and to the surrounding mountain ranges, by a possible rise of the ocean, or a possible tsunamic wave.

Now it is known from several sources, particularly from one of the few surviving codices, namely the so called codex Ramirez, see [17], that the Aztecs were not native of central Mexico, but had reached that region only a few centuries before Cortes's arrival. Their original place, named Aztlan, was located on the Pacific coast, probably near the present city of Mazatlan, some 300 km. north--west of Guadalajara. According to studies by Vaillant [18] and Brundage [19], their migration started around the middle of the 12th century, Brundage actually proposing the date 1168, which is amazingly close to the date we are considering (and since this date is an estimate, one cannot exclude that the correct year was indeed 1178).

Why did the Aztecs move from a coastal region to a high land? We conjecture that, similarly to what happened to the coastal region of Peru, also the Pacific coastal region of Mexico was affected by a huge tsunami. The surviving people were immensely scared and took refuge up to the Mexican plateau in the marshes of Lake Texcoco. Probably they interpreted the catastrophe in religious terms as a punishment by their gods for not being sufficiently pious. Thus they adopted a policy of strong piety, meaning in their religion a policy of human sacrifices, which scandalized the Spaniards, but whose roots can probably be traced in the reenactment of past catastrophical events in the solar system...

7. Arguments from Japan

Around 1178 there is an important political discontinuity in the Japanese history, given by the passage of the political power, after a period of intense fighting, from the southern Taira dynasty (with capital Miako, now Kyoto), to the northern Minamoto dynasty (with capital Kamakura, near Edo, now Tokyo). Termination of the fighting is around the year 1182. This political event may certainly be a chance occurrence in our context, save for a possible hint to unusual meteorological conditions. A major event of the war was the unexpected destruction of the southern fleet by a very violent typhoon. This too could be a chance event, but the similar fate meeting not many years later the Chinese--Mongolian fleet sent by Khubilai Khan to attempt the conquest of Japan, as related by Marco Polo, may be taken as suggestive of unusually irregular and strong typhoons in the north-west quadrant of the Pacific basin, thereby parallelizing the unusual behaviour of El Niño at that time around the coasts of Peru.

8. Arguments from northern China

The 12th century is a critical time in northern China. From a political point of view the corrupt and decaying regime of the late Song dinasty leads to social unrest and widely spread rebellions, so graphically described in the great Chinese classic novel The Water Margins (probably written later, but there is no consensus on either the author or the time of writing). Northern China was occupied by Juchen tribes from Machuria in the second half of that century. Additionally natural disasters at unprecedented level affected the region, among which main was the flood of the Huang He (the Yellow River). So catastrophical was this flood that the previous northern Song capital, the great city of Kaifeng, was almost completely destroyed and, moreover, the river changed its exit into the sea, moving it in 1194 from a location north of the Shandong peninsula to one south of it, hundreds of kilometers away (the river has returned to its previous exit in 1852 after another severe flood). Whether the natural disasters at this time are a chance event or are correlated with the other observed events, in particular with a possible modification of the typhoon regime and the strong increase of El Niño, is a question that deserves further study.

9. Arguments from Mongolia

In the annals of Khubilai Khan, the Yuan dinasty emperor of the second generation after Gengis Khan, well known as the host of Marco Polo, it is written that "my great ancestor Gengis Khan saw a sign of change in the sky ... and arose in the North", as in the annals translation made by the Eastern Cultures curator of the Royal Ontario Museum in Toronto and available in the library of that museum (the above sentence is actually readable in a poster in the room devoted to China). Now Gengish Khan, firstly named Temujin, is believed to have been born in 1165, hence in 1178 he would have been 13 years old. He might have observed one of the great fireballs or falling comets or asteroids, which were recorded with unusually high frequency at that time by Chinese astronomers.

The conquest of the greater part of Asia and even of part of Europe by the Mongolian horsemen in the space of one generation is one of the great events of history. The extraordinary personality of Gengis Khan, a man with enormous intelligence, will, long range planning and additionally shamanistic powers, was certainly a main factor behind the Mongolian expansion. In the Secret History of the Mongols, see [20], the Mongolian drive tends to be explained in terms of avenging wrongs, including the destruction of the family of Gengis Khan (he survived by hiding himself in the waters of a river) and the wrongs that his tribe suffered by the nearby ( Christian Nestorian) Tayichud and Kereit tribes. The attack of the Mongolians against Persia, then a huge empire, under Selgiuchid sultans control, stretching from Anatolia to Central Asia and including Afghanistan and part of India, which led to some of the worst massacres in history and to such a devastation of Central Asia that these countries have not yet recovered, is similarly explained in terms of a vengeance against the sultan Jalal--ad--Din, who had ordered the murder of peaceful Mongolian merchants, see Ata Malik Al Juvaini [21]. However behind these personal and very classical motivations there are probably other more objective reasons that made it almost necessary for the Mongolians to leave their original land (a high plateau with continental climate and very cold winters, particularly in the region where Gengis Khan was born, north-west Mongolia, partly now belonging to Siberia) for other lands with a better climate. Here we suggest that the main reason was indeed an unexpected and dramatic change of climate in Mongolia, with winters much colder and more snowy than usual, the snow cover probably not melting during the summer, thereby making the normal pastoral life almost impossible. An indication that such was the case, and that the deteriorated wheather conditions lasted for about two generations, can be found in the quoted work of Ata Malik al Juvaini. This Persian author, born in a Khorasan family, became governor of Persia after the conquest by the Mongolians. He wrote a rather monumental history of the Mongolian conquest, around 1260, after the Alamut fortress, the stronghold of the Ishmaelites (the Assassins), was taken (the Alamut castle had one of the greatest libraries of medieval times; most books were burnt, but Al Juvaini personally selected a number to be saved. Which ones.....? Maybe here is the origin of maps like the Piri Reis map, and of exoteric books upon which Blavatsky claimed to base her ideas). In his history Al Juvaini states that at about the time of the fall of Alamut it had again become possible to grow apple trees in Mongolia, a fact, he explicitly notes, wich had not been possible for two generations. This is a definitive indication of a very severe wheather deterioration in the Mongolian plateau starting from about our date 1178. Apple trees are indeed resistant to very cold temperatures, at least in many varieties cultivated for ages throughout Europe and Asia. In 1979 a cold wave swept throughout Russia, temperatures dropping to --50 centigrades in Moscow (water pipes inside the building of the Computing Center of the Academy of Sciences froze and exploded; thus no water was available for sanitation.... fortunately my arrival there was at the beginning of May, when temperature in one week passed from freezing to over 40 centigrades...). In Kirov, some 600 km. north--east of Moscow, temperature dropped to --55 centigrades. Apple trees survived in the Moscow region, but were killed in the Kirov region.

If a severe weather problem was behind the Mongolian expansion, a similar reason may have been behind other great migrations and wars involving the pastoral people, e.g. the Huns and the Scythians. In particular there are arguments that this may have been the case concerning the great Scythian invasion of Middle East and Egypt, referred to by Diodorus. In a future paper we will argument that the Hyksos who invaded Egypt at the time of Dudimose (Tutimaios in Manetho), just after the Hebrew escaped under Moses leadership, as Velikovsky argumented, see [22], and Rohl [23] has confirmed, were Scythians, as wild and destructive as the Mongolians at the time of Gengis Khan, and that their name means exactly it the clan of the horsemen.

10. Arguments from Europe

Apparently there are no particular discontinuities in Europe in the second half of the 12th century, a period of rather intensive economic growth, a fact therefore indicating that, if a catastrophe hit the Pacific basin, it did not affect the opposite hemisphere. However at the beginning of the 14th century Europe is affected by the great Black Death epidemics, usually attributed to the bacterium of plague ( bacillus pestis ), which, albeit certainly not as destructive as the Justinian plague, still killed an estimated 30% of the total population (this percentage varying from place to place, Bohemia quite intriguingly escaping almost completely). The plague seems to have started in Mediterranean ports, involved in trade with the East, and along the caravan roads leading to central Asia. While Hoyle and Wickramasinghe [24] have suggested that the agents of the plague were bacterial material arrived from the sky and brought by comets (and that was a time of intense cometary activity....) the general consensus is that the plague came from Mongolia, where bacillus pestis is a common host in a variety of rats (and, be careful if you want to caress them, in Californian squirrels too...). In our proposed scenario of a severe wheather disruption in the Mongolian region, it may be surmised that the bacteria became more virulent and/or had easier access to a population immunologically weakened by famine and other difficulties. Or, and here we take the Hoyle et al. suggestion, the bodies impacting in the Pacific region, including the northern China and Mongolian region, may have brought a fresh resupply of bacterial material, possibly characterized by mutations. Such bacteria may have again found their usual host, the rats, and attacked more easily a population weakened by climate changes, famine and war and not yet immunized against the new mutation.

11. Final conclusions

In the previous sections we have given a number of intriguing arguments supporting the hypothesis that around the year 1178 the Pacific basin was subject to catastrophical events, of a probable extraterrestrial origin:

a -- political discontinuities (in Peru, Mexico, north-east Asia, Polynesia, Easter Island)

b -- abundance of unusually strong "signs in the sky ", in the Maori legends, the Chinese astronomers records, the Mongolian annals

c -- unusual wheather conditions, very strong El Niño, probable irregular beheviour of the typhoons near Japan, catastrophical flooding in Northern China and unusually severe cold in Mongolia.

The above evidence has not been collected via a systematic study of the people of the Pacific region at that time, but has come via rather casual readings, hence a systematic survey of the possible sources is almost certainly bound to provide further confirmation. For instance, the rather sudden and puzzling disappearance of many of the pueblo people in the southwest of northern America, which can be traced back to that time, might be associated with the global catastrophe that apparently affected the Pacific region.

12. Acknowledgments

The author is deeply indebted, for stimulating discussions and the provided information, to dr. Thor Heyerdahl, whom he was allowed to visit in his beautiful manshion in Guimar, Tenerife, to prof. Victor Clube, whom he visited in Oxford, and to prof. Dixon, whose wide range and deep critical knowledge in so many areas has been a driving factor behind his work in this area.

This work has been partially supported by ex 60% University of Bergamo funds.

36 posted on 01/26/2003 2:58:53 PM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: blam
Evidence Of Major Impact Events In The Late Third Millennium BC
37 posted on 01/26/2003 3:13:54 PM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: blam
Meteor Clue To End Of Middle East Civilisations
38 posted on 01/26/2003 3:20:57 PM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; seamole
Will you kindly put this in the "Gods, Graves, Glyphs" file.
39 posted on 01/26/2003 3:27:38 PM PST by blam
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: blam
Thanks for all your links, blam.

Fascinating, as always.

40 posted on 01/27/2003 5:52:48 AM PST by happygrl (Be's what YOU owe to life.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: The Electrician
Hare's breath

Faint aroma of carrots.

41 posted on 01/27/2003 5:55:33 AM PST by katana
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: blam

Copy of the cover of
"The Hollow Earth" by R. Bernard,
showing the true nature of our world.

42 posted on 01/27/2003 6:00:54 AM PST by Cultural Jihad
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: katana
Hare's breath
Faint aroma of carrots.

ahhh What's up doc? End of the world you say?

43 posted on 01/27/2003 6:06:05 AM PST by commish (Freedom Tastes Sweetest to Those Who Have Fought to Preserve It)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: Cultural Jihad
For a long time I have been intrigued by the concept of the Hollow Earth. I remember reading Raymond Bernard's book on the subject ( The Hollow Earth - 1979 ) in the mid 1980's and felt a strong affinity for the whole idea. Next, I read a strange book called "Etidorhpa" by John Uri Llyod written in the late 1890's about a person who traveled from the Outer Surface to the Inner Surface of the Earth and carrying when he arrived at the center of the Earth crust. But before I lose our readers, let me define what the Hollow Earth Theory states!

According to Mr. Bernard (see diagram above) our world is hollow, with the crust of the earth being 800 miles thick. There exists two openings at the North and South Pole, each hole having a circumference of 1400 miles wide. At the center of the earth is not a molten core but an inner sun which is six hundred miles wide and is 2900 miles from the Inner Surfaces. The diameter of the lip at the opening at the poles is 1200 miles long, thus a person can not see the other side of the opening.

Therefore, there exists three worlds on our planet, the outer surface, where we live, the middle earth which purportedly is lined with many caverns, tunnels (made by someone), Inner Cities and people who live there and lastly the Inner Surface. How Gravity works then is the following. For the people who live on the outer surface, Gravity holds them down. For the people that live in the middle earth, the closer they get to the center of the crust (i.e. - 400 miles down), the less effect gravity will have upon them. In the book, "Etidorhpa", when this individual traveling down into the earth reached the center of gravity, i.e. where there is no gravity --- he was able to move by the power of his mind, his heart stop beating and he didn't need to eat. He described gigantic vegetation that lives under the earth as this lesser pull of gravity allows things to grow larger. Lastly for the people who live on the inner surface, they would also feel gravity pull on them to walk on this surface but since there is an inner sun (called the "Atoma", by channeler Michael Kant who appears in our crystal skull book Mysteries of the Crystal Skulls Revealed) they would have sunlight 24 hours a day. There is supposedly land masses and water bodies that exist on the Inner Earth, the same as the outer surface except the vibration and energy in the Inner Earth is more pure and of a higher vibrational frequency (some say a 4th dimensional frequency).

For people who have claimed to travel to the Inner Earth, they state that the people they encounter in this region are usually very tall. Some other individuals have speculated that descendants of Atlantis and Lemuria live in this Inner Utopia and therefore they are thousands of years ahead of us technologically and spiritually. Some others say that possibly the Mayans may have gone into this location as well, to explain where they disappeared. Again, according to our channeler Michael Kant, he claims that 12 galactic races came to our Earth long ago and created their first city underground in the 4 Corners area. Each race brought with them a crystal skull and body which contained the gentic coding of their race and cosmic knowledge. Six tribes decided to stay on the surface of the Earth and Six tribes went into the Inner Earth. Now all twelve tribe exist in the Inner Earth. It is also believed that other Extraterrestrial races may have bases in the Inner Earth as well. Michael describes in our book being taken by a Pleiadian Space Ship and given a tour of the Inner Earth.

In 1982, while traveling on faith throughout the western part of the U.S., I had the fortune to meet Ed Palmer in Portland, Oregon, who is the founder of the Cosmic Science Research Center. Ed told us a very strange tale about how he was an exchange baby, that he was originally from Orion but when he was very small, the true Ed Palmer was exchanged for him. He claimed that when he has had a physical examination that there are some differences in his body and also that he has some type of mental plate in his head in which if a UFO comes close, he hears a buzzing sound. Even though Ed was in his 70's or 80's, he definitely had more energy and excitement of life than I at this time (being 27). In any case, Ed gave us a pamphlet that he shared with others about the Hollow Earth. In this pamphlet it said that all planets are Hollow (in Bernard's book, Mr. Bernard explains that what appears to be the pole cap we see of Mars, is actually the light of Mar's inner sun shining out of the pole. Furthermore Bernard states that the Aurora Borealis that is only visible up north is the reflection of the inner sun off clouds passing over the opening of the pole. Also that some explorers of the North Pole have discovered the closer they get to the Pole, the warmer it gets instead of the colder. Could the Mammoths discovered frozen in Siberia with fresh food in their mouth be actually Mammoths that live in the Inner Earth which has a warmer climate, and somehow got lost and wondered into the outer surface?) and that Ed even had a ride on a UFO to the moon which is hollow and that the ETs use the moon to construct spacecraft inside, hidden from our prying eyes. Ed explains that when a planet is formed it is first just gas which is rotating. He said that the heavy particles eventually expand out and create the planet's surface and the lighter particles contract to form the central sun.

Another connection with the Inner Earth relates to Admiral Byrd. It is purported that when the Admiral went to explore the North Pole that he actually entered into the Inner Earth at the opening at this pole. Included below, you will see a purported diary by Admiral Byrd that discusses he made contact with an advanced people in this area who showed him their world and asked for him to take a message back to the surface dwellers and government of their concern about a future vision they had of our destroying our world and since this is their home as well, they of course wanted to prevent this. If such a people do exist, it is theorized that possibly some of the UFOs we see are not extraterrestrial but intraterrestials, as our elder brothers keep an eye on us. It would require a spacecraft that can negate the force of gravity to fly out ouf the Polar Openings as gravity would pull any boat or airplane to follow the outer-to-inner surface. Another spiritual channel we have been in communication with is Christine Hayes of the Star of Isis Foundation in San Antonio, Texas. She claims to be receiving telepathic information from the people who live in the Inner Earth.

Lastly, a good source on Internet for Hollow Earth related information is the mailing list created by Jan Lamprecht of South Africa. She has been fascinated with the Hollow Earth for a long time. If you would like to join her mailing list, she can be contacted at email address: Below is a list of information we have been given permission to share which comes from the mailing list (we added some entries from our files to the resource section):


44 posted on 01/27/2003 6:06:58 AM PST by Cultural Jihad
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: katana
unusual wheather conditions

Hare's breath--whether Jupiter was captured recently and Atlantis is on Hispaniola and the plague came from comets. The UN should send Hans Blitzed to investigate.

45 posted on 01/27/2003 9:20:40 AM PST by RightWhale
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: blam

Chaco Canyon

In the period between A.D. 1125 and 1180, very little rain fell in the region. After 1180, rainfall briefly returned to normal. From 1270 to 1274 there was another long drought, followed by another period of normal rainfall. In 1275, yet another drought began. This one lasted 14 years.

When this cycle of drought began, Anasazi civilization was at its height. Communities were densely populated. Even with good rains, the Anasazi were using their land to its limits. Without rain, it was impossible to grow enough food to support the population. Widespread famine occurred. People left the area in large numbers to join other pueblo peoples to the south and east, abandoning the Chaco Canyon pueblos and, later, the smaller communities that surrounded them. Anasazi civilization began a long period of migration and decline after these years of drought and famine. By the 1300s, it had all but died out in Chaco Canyon.

46 posted on 05/16/2004 11:07:28 AM PDT by razorback-bert
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: blam
A note, anyone who visits Mesa Verde and other cliff dwellings can plainly see these people were scared stiff of something.

47 posted on 05/16/2004 11:18:14 AM PDT by razorback-bert
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: blam
Thanks Blam. Looks like it never got added. It's in there now, but I'm not pingin' the list any more tonight. :') That Hollow Earth crap put me off too.
Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on, off, or alter the "Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list --
Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
The GGG Digest
-- Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

48 posted on 11/25/2004 7:11:20 PM PST by SunkenCiv ("All I have seen teaches me trust the Creator for all I have not seen." -- Emerson)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]


49 posted on 04/05/2006 11:31:41 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SunkenCiv

I read about 1/3 of it, while thinking that I'd see it before. Then I saw the date. You got me again.

50 posted on 05/12/2006 12:36:01 PM PDT by ASA Vet (Those who know don't talk. Those who talk don't know.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-63 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794 is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson