[Diddle E. Squat]

Already posted here:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/865177/posts

Next time do a search first.

[RabidBartender]

Where does Simon Crowell and Paula Abdul fit in all of this?

[cookcounty]

"The Flag or the Cross?"

You're advocating the worship of chunks of wood? HOW PAGAN of you!!!

[Stopislamnow]

I'm gonna find a UBER-ZOT photo and just blow everyone away one day when I figure out how to post it.

[Mentos]

I am curious to find out why some of my fellow Christians still recite the pledge of allegiance. When you "pledge your allegiance" to an inanimate object you are basically worshipping that object. Am I missing something here? Why do some of us choose to salute and break one of the most important commandments? Shouldn't our pledge of allegiance be to God, and not a piece of cloth? The pledge of allegiance to the flag basically states that we will (blindly) support the flag and the actions of our government without question. That is the very essence of what idolatry is all about! Please check out the attached article.

Riiiiiiiiight.....

[anncoulteriscool]

You are a complete idiot...and as for "thinking out of the box"...you cant even think outside of the lock box". LOL!

[RaceBannon]

(1 Pet 2:13 KJV) Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme;

(1 Pet 2:14 KJV) Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.

(1 Pet 2:15 KJV) For so is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men:

(1 Pet 2:16 KJV) As free, and not using your liberty for a cloak of maliciousness, but as the servants of God.

(1 Pet 2:17 KJV) Honour all men. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honour the king.

(1 Pet 2:18 KJV) Servants, be subject to your masters with all fear; not only to the good and gentle, but also to the froward.

(1 Pet 2:19 KJV) For this is thankworthy, if a man for conscience toward God endure grief, suffering wrongfully.

(1 Pet 2:20 KJV) For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.





(Rom 13:1 KJV) Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

(Rom 13:2 KJV) Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

(Rom 13:3 KJV) For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

(Rom 13:4 KJV) For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

(Rom 13:5 KJV) Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.

(Rom 13:6 KJV) For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.

(Rom 13:7 KJV) Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.



(1 Tim 2:1 KJV) I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;

(1 Tim 2:2 KJV) For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.

(1 Tim 2:3 KJV) For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

(1 Tim 2:4 KJV) Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

(1 Tim 2:5 KJV) For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

[vishnu2]

Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's and render to God the things that are God's.

[Chad Fairbanks]

What about that whole 'Render unto Caser what is Caeser's...' thingie? The bible clearly provides a mechanism for fealty to a human leader or government, provided it doesn't substitute for The Lord...

Groovy, eh? ;0)

[tbpiper]

I am curious to find out why some of my fellow Christians still recite the pledge of allegiance.

Because most of us are perceptive enough to know the difference between God and the flag and how to properly prioritize our affections. By the way, I find your legalism embarrassing. It's no wonder the secular world thinks we're stupid.

[mhking]

Y'still there, moron? C'mon! We like batting the mice back and forth between us...

[Cicero]

Give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's; give unto God that which is God's.

[oceanperch]

Just from your title the first thought that came into my head was Texe Marrs.

[jeremiah]

See the bible for reports of banners and flags used by ancient Israelis for to symbolize tribes and unity of purpose.

[bethelgrad]

what are you a Jehoveh's Witness? Come on dude. Pick your battles better.

[DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet]

[LalahLand]

1: I did not post this under Breaking News, or News. Apparently the Mods changed it or something.

2: I came here for intelligent discourse with fellow Christians, and judging by the hateful remarks here, either you guys are frauds, or not Christians.

3: Does anyone have anything intelligent to add to this discussion? Is this the type of place where if the masses doesn't agree with your post you're shunned, ignored, deleted?

[OHelix]

Well... I don't think it's fair to just label LalahLand an idiot. I don't think I agree that it's idolatry to pledge alegiance to the flag, but I can see how someone could believe that. I scimmed the article, and I can agree with the notion of you can't promise allegiance to God and to something else without potentially limiting your allegience to God. Paul even went so far as to make that same point regarding marriage. Marriage is permitted, but he makes the case that your heart will be divided, and you will serve the desires of your spouse more than the desires of God... And even goes so far as to say he thinks it is better to remain unmarried for that reason.

That said, a few years ago I did decided I could not in good concience pledge allegiance to the flag. And I usually don't bring it up because I know many, if not most, Americans would take offense, and not understand why. When I'm in a place where it is being said, I will usually stand with the others and put my hand over my heart but not say the words. Not to be deceptive, but simply not to draw attention to it, as I realize most would not understand why. My decision was based on the commandment not to take oaths. I may not understand the commandment properly, but my understanding of that commandment is the basis for that decision. I do not have to take an oath of allegiance to be faithfull to my country. I made a similar decision involving swearing on the Bible in court. I will not do that. Not taking an oath does not prevent me from giving truthfull testimony any more than not pledging allegiance to the flag makes me unable be faithfull to my country.

So for me it comes down to obeying the cherished traditions of my country, or obeying God's word. And I must obey God's word even if everyone I love dissaproves. There are many who refuse to take such a pledge because they've been poisoned against America, and I am not in that group. And I would be offended to be associated with them.

I've thought a great deal about this in the past, and come to the conclusion that I could never hold office because of the requirement of taking an oath. I would be very willing to serve in the Armed Services, but I do not know if they would allow it without an oath. I'm old enough now it's probably a moot point, but if things go badly I may be called and have to deal with it. I know the courts have made some provisions for others who hold that view, it may be that the Armed Services have too. But it's something I avoid because I know people will be acusatory.

[Washi]

Dear LalahLand,
Your incredibly accurate username aside, I have to take issue with your premise.
We do not worship the flag. We worship what the flag stands for.

All of the rights that you have are given to you by God.

Our flag represents the country that recognizes that our rights are "God-given" and not "government given".

We do not give praise to America because it gives us these rights, we give praise to America (and its flag) because it realizes that God gives us these rights, and reccognizes where these rights come from.

Washi

[VRWC_minion]

Which is why I would never say the pledge without adding "Under God"...