Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

US should be "embarrassed" over failure to find WMDs: ex-spies
Agence France-Presse (AFP) ^ | 4-18-03 | Gina Doggett

Posted on 04/18/2003 3:52:41 AM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer

WASHINGTON, April 17 (AFP) - The US government should be "embarrassed" over the apparent failure to uncover weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, retired intelligence officials who opposed the war said Thursday.

"It's going to be very embarrassing when it turns out they have nothing to declare," said Eugene Betit, a former defense intelligence analyst who belongs to Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS), formed in January to speak out on the use of intelligence to justify the war.

Another, former CIA station chief Ray Close, said: "I'm hoping they will be embarrassed into acknowledging a role for some independent body. And who could it be but the UN?"

As the "smoking gun" continued to elude US sleuths in Iraq, chief UN weapons inspector Hans Blix called for experts to return to the country to determine whether the weapons allegations -- the main justification for going to war -- had any foundation.

US Secretary of State Colin Powell said Thursday he was "reasonably sure" that proof will be found.

"We are quite confident of our intelligence," he told Jim Lehrer of PBS public television.

"There was a huge intelligence collection effort with all of our agencies working together to come up with the body of knowledge that we took to the UN, and that we had been presenting before the world for a long period of time," he said.

Adding to the pressure, Russia, a veto-wielding member of the UN Security Council, said it would not support the lifting of UN sanctions against Iraq unless UN inspectors confirmed the absence of weapons of mass destruction.

But Washington has so far rejected such calls, and US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld on Thursday sought to deflect concerns that evidence could be planted.

"The (US search) teams have been trained in chain of control, really like a crime scene," Rumsfeld told Pentagon staff.

He said: "They will have people with them who will validate things, they will have the ability to take pictures, and to make sure that the control over any piece of evidence is as clear as it possibly can be."

Rumsfeld warned however: "That will not stop certain countries, and certain types of people from claiming, inaccurately, that it was planted."

Retired CIA intelligence analyst and VIPS member Ray McGovern told AFP: "Some of my colleagues are virtually certain that there will be some weapons of mass destruction found, even though they might have to be planted.

"I'm just as sure that some few will be found, but not in an amount that by any stretch would justify the charge of a threat against the US or anyone else. "

He added: "Even if the planting were discovered by and by, they'll say, 'ok, the weapons were planted -- fine.'"

McGovern said he was alluding to a remark by Powell after it emerged that a letter purporting to show that Iraq had sought to procure uranium from Niger -- a key argument in the case for war and cited in President George W. Bush's January 28 State of the Union address -- was a forgery.

Powell told NBC: "It was the information that we had. We provided it. If that information is inaccurate, fine."

VIPS, made up of 25 former intelligence officials in the CIA, State and Defense Departments, Army Intelligence and FBI, made their first public statement on February 5, critiquing Powell's presentation before the UN Security Council seeking an international mandate for the war.

"Never before has a group of veteran CIA graduates -- all cum laude -- gotten together to critique the government," McGovern said.

CIA spokesman Tom Crispell, asked for comment on the former officials' remarks Thursday, said: "They're criticizing policy, not intelligence."


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Germany; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; Russia; United Kingdom; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: armchairspies; illegalweapopns; iraqifreedom; postwariraq; rayclose; raymcgovern; vips
Ex-generals, ex-presidents, and now ex-spies.

Wankers all.

1 posted on 04/18/2003 3:52:41 AM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
America should be proud to have held Iraq accountable to the cease fire agreement of '91 regardless. Saddam had many months to export his WMD's to his many allies. Hey, they are not done looking, American troops are amassing military assets in western Iraq near the Syrian border. Iraq's not the only place to look. Anything new on the 3 Iraqi flagged cargo ships doing circles in the Indian Ocean?
2 posted on 04/18/2003 3:58:37 AM PDT by HankReardon
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
Amen to that!
3 posted on 04/18/2003 3:59:11 AM PDT by MEG33
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
Ahhh yes, a "French" new agency. Yep, they want us to buy their crap alright. Let the Boycott roll on, folks...
4 posted on 04/18/2003 4:02:02 AM PDT by Caipirabob (Democrats.. Socialists..Commies..Traitors...Who can tell the difference?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
LOL, they are falling into W's trap. President Bush is going to let all the pundits and "experts" and his political enemies just string out the rope and tie their own nooses. Then he's going to wait until one night, when we least expect it, to announce an address to Congress and the American people. He'll announce the death of Sadamn and the discovery of WMD's with pictures and documentation. Of course Ted Kennedy will call W a liar, so I think he should go into one of the testing facilities without MOP gear to prove that W is a liar. I think that's fair, don't you?
5 posted on 04/18/2003 4:06:50 AM PDT by Beck_isright ("QUAGMIRE" - French word for "unable to find anyone to surrender to")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
Shouldn't the French be embarrassed that they supported a mad man like Saddam who is responsible for the torture, rape, and murder of millions of people. I guess not.
6 posted on 04/18/2003 4:07:18 AM PDT by Always Right
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
The only thing America should be embarrassed about is not taking Saddam out sooner.
7 posted on 04/18/2003 4:08:28 AM PDT by Always Right
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
People should google VIPS if they get a chance. The crowd they hang out with says it all. Wankers is an apt description.
8 posted on 04/18/2003 4:13:05 AM PDT by mewzilla
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS)

Isn't that a spin-off from the Betty Ford Clinic?

9 posted on 04/18/2003 4:13:22 AM PDT by trebb
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
We're only three and a half weeks in Iraq and another premature declaration. <Yawn
10 posted on 04/18/2003 4:16:49 AM PDT by goldstategop ( In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
"It's going to be very embarrassing when it turns out they have nothing to declare," said Eugene Betit, a former defense intelligence analyst who belongs to Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS), formed in January to speak out on the use of intelligence to justify the war.
Man, will their faces be red or what?--for about ten minutes.

After watching children escape from Iraqi children's prisons, who bloody cares about WMDs?
11 posted on 04/18/2003 4:36:57 AM PDT by Asclepius (to the barricades)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
I sure am glad they are ex-spies, ex-generals and ex-presidents.... when they were active, we got 9-11.
12 posted on 04/18/2003 4:48:46 AM PDT by smith288 (Visit my gallery http://www.ejsmithweb.com/fr/hollywood/hollywood.php)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
If either of these countries leaders ever have the gall to show up here in the USofA, we should massively Freep to kick em' out!
13 posted on 04/18/2003 4:49:42 AM PDT by JustPiper (Anti-War Protestors Are The Terrorist's Bodyguard!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
Eventually the WMD will turn up. I'm happier that the Salman Pac terror camp and the terrorist group in Northern Iraq were taken out, not to mention capturing the Achille Lauro terrorist. How many more went to ground and will be captured? How many more were financed by Saddam?

Problem with the liberals is that they are so blinded by their quest for power they cannot see the full circle.

14 posted on 04/18/2003 4:50:08 AM PDT by OpusatFR (Using pretentious arcane words to buttress your argument means you don't have one)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Beck_isright
I hope you are right. I do notice that a) we haven't had any follow up on the thousands of chemical-available warheads; b) we haven't had any followup on the mobile truck; c) we haen't heard anything about the 50 gal "pesticide" cannisters; and d) we haven't heard anything else about the many "buried" mobile labs that were reported.

It is POSSIBLE that we are accumulating all this stuff and will reveal it at the appropriate time.

I am getting concerned, though, that either Powell's tips were off, or mis-interpreted, and that we won't find any. (Again, that in itself should NOT have been the only reason to conduct this war, but I am concerned that it was made such a major rationale.)

15 posted on 04/18/2003 5:04:37 AM PDT by LS
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: LS
I'm not even concerned. W has his smirk going already as the DNC and world socialist community (or are they one and the same) start to panic and accuse him of going to war under false pretense. We are finding lots daily. It's just a matter of who do we want to embaress; the French, the Germans, the Russians or all of them.
16 posted on 04/18/2003 5:17:14 AM PDT by Beck_isright ("QUAGMIRE" - French word for "unable to find anyone to surrender to")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: LS
IMO, WMD's were not the main reason for toppling Saddam. It seems to me that the idea of disarming Saddam was more meant as a way to bring on board the UN and sway world opinion. Not successful in any case.

I believe the primary reason for the "regime change" was to fight terrorism. After all, groups such as Al Qaeda cannot exist in a vacuum, their existence requires friendly governments such as Saddam's. Therefore, regime change ended one state which harbored and aided terrorists and hopefully substituted it with one friendly to the U.S.

Very suddenly, the entire complexion of the Middle East may have changed. Only Syria and Iran remain as active enemies of the U.S., with the Iranians chomping at the bit for their own "regime change" and the Syrians are enjoying a healthy new respect for us. Those who would spread terror find their bases of operations and support rapidly shrinking and becoming very insecure.

Meanwhile, the U.S. has freed the Iraqis and the world from a monster who brutalised his own country and who has demonstrated that he is potentially dangerous on a global level.

And I do believe the threat of WMD's was real.

17 posted on 04/18/2003 5:26:11 AM PDT by Sam Cree
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Beck_isright
I agree-- if anything was released, the world socialist
comunnity would (and by this article PLAN TO) say we
planted the evidence. We will need incontrovertible proof
that Saddam was not only making but EXPORTING WMD!! I
believe that is why Syria is so nervous.

By the way--I think Syria is a feint--Libya will be next.
18 posted on 04/18/2003 5:29:33 AM PDT by mj1234
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
"Another, former CIA station chief Ray Close, said: "I'm hoping they will be embarrassed into acknowledging a role for some independent body. And who could it be but the UN?"

He's "hoping?!" A clear leftist agenda, IMO.

19 posted on 04/18/2003 5:29:42 AM PDT by Sam Cree (liberals are the axis of evil)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Beck_isright
"...I think he should go into one of the testing facilities without MOP gear to prove that W is a liar. I think that's fair, don't you?"

I don't know where the military would ever find MOPP gear big enough to fit Ted Kennedy anyway!

20 posted on 04/18/2003 5:34:48 AM PDT by Destructor
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS), formed in January to speak out on the use of intelligence to justify the war

What a bunch of class acts. What's next? Selling any secrets they might still remember because they don't like current policy? Wankers, indeed.

Hell hath no fury like a bureaucratic functionary put out to pasture (especially an incompetent bureaucratic functionary put out to pasture).

21 posted on 04/18/2003 5:36:28 AM PDT by niteowl77
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
Retired CIA intelligence analyst and VIPS member Ray McGovern told AFP: "Some of my colleagues are virtually certain that there will be some weapons of mass destruction found, even though they might have to be planted.

This idea of the US planting WMDs so they can find them has been latched on to by every anti-American whiner out there. It is such a stupid argument. The Iraqis have tons of this stuff. When we find (and we will) 20,000 gallons of anthrax, these folks are going to look even more stupid than they do now. What? Did we haul it in there in a giant convoy of semis that no one happened to see even though the country is swarming with media types (not to mention to the embedds)?

The Left is setting itself up again! At some point you think they would see they are only hurting themselves. Let's hope it's not too soon.

22 posted on 04/18/2003 5:58:38 AM PDT by Pete
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
They're criticizing policy, not intelligence.
I do not give a counterfeit farthing about their opinions... or Sarandon's... or Robinson's... or Sandy Duncan's ~giggle~... or Sheen's or Garafalo's. A pox on them all.
23 posted on 04/18/2003 6:00:55 AM PDT by Clara Lou (Democrats... united as ever in opportunism and error.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
It is enough that we have found terrorist training camps and terrorists in Iraq. We don't need no steenking WMD to prove that Saddam was a threat to the US.

Although I believe we will find WMD anyway.
24 posted on 04/18/2003 6:06:55 AM PDT by Maceman
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: LS
THINK BACK

Tony Blair would never have gone along if there are no WMD's. They will be announced at the appropriate time as another suggested so the naysayers are finally silenced.
25 posted on 04/18/2003 6:10:34 AM PDT by alisasny
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Beck_isright
>>It's just a matter of who do we want to embaress; the French, the Germans, the Russians or all of them.

The Democrats.

26 posted on 04/18/2003 6:11:00 AM PDT by FreedomPoster
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Nita Nuprez
Ping. Lots of potential Garofalo Award winners in this article.

By the time the DC Chapter presents the Awards, we'll probably have hard public evidence that Iraq was swimming in WMD.

27 posted on 04/18/2003 6:11:10 AM PDT by TontoKowalski
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Caipirabob
NEVER FORGET!

Gotta keep this alive. Share this link with all like minded family and friends. They are feeling the heat.

15000 french products that you can boycott:

http://howtobuyamerican.leethost.com/b-db-boycottfrance.shtml
28 posted on 04/18/2003 6:37:06 AM PDT by schaketo (The frenchies and their ilk now take Iraq's place in the "Axis of Evil"!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: alisasny
I certainly hope so. For me it isn't a big deal: Saddam harbored terrorists, end of story. But I think many Americans will be more skeptical of Bush's national security program if SOME aren't found.
29 posted on 04/18/2003 6:45:19 AM PDT by LS
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: Sam Cree
Re: #17.

Your analysis is the best summary I have yet seen.

30 posted on 04/18/2003 6:46:18 AM PDT by Urbane_Guerilla
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: Destructor
"I don't know where the military would ever find MOPP gear big enough to fit Ted Kennedy anyway!"

It's called a 10 man tent in civilian speak.
31 posted on 04/18/2003 11:13:18 AM PDT by Beck_isright ("QUAGMIRE" - French word for "unable to find anyone to surrender to")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: mj1234
"By the way--I think Syria is a feint--Libya will be next."

I concur. Have you noticed that our Med battle group is still there? I think Qaddafi should be very nervous. We did not start this war over Anthrax or inspections. I think Sadamn and Qaddafi have or were close to having nukes. W might go down in history as the President that prevented a nuclear World War by starting a conventional one.
32 posted on 04/18/2003 11:15:13 AM PDT by Beck_isright ("QUAGMIRE" - French word for "unable to find anyone to surrender to")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer
apparent failure (interpretation, a editorial opinion)

As the "smoking gun" continued to elude US sleuths in Iraq (another editorial interpretation)

Retired CIA intelligence analyst and VIPS member Ray McGovern told AFP: (Are they part of the Earth is flat organization?)

"Never before has a group of veteran CIA graduates -- all cum laude -- gotten together to critique the government," (Factually incorrect, JFK)

So, we have an article citing former CIA members (top ranking stellar performers, self proclaimed) who claim something that is now interpreted and editorialized by someone who states factually incorrect information.

Besides lacking in substance, the article was written in poor style and is inaccurate.

This is just another Journalist attempting to capitalize on the spirit of contempt for the US in his nation. Regardless of what the US does, it will not be adequate in volume, time, justification and if all else fails it will be made relative and interpreted as failure though it was a complete success (i.e. the Combat phase itself). The fact that the US has not found WMD instantly is now a failure just as the war was a failure in his mind until Iraq imploded. He is searching for a justification to his views; he already knows the answer to the question though “US bad, US wrong”. In so far, he is not a journalist who is answering questions or really analyzing, rather he is a commentator, a stylish interpreter of current events, someone with opinions.
33 posted on 04/18/2003 11:40:14 AM PDT by Red6
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Red6
This is just another Journalist attempting to capitalize on the spirit of contempt for the US in his nation.

Well said, and unfortunately all too familar these days.

34 posted on 04/18/2003 4:27:45 PM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer (The democRATS are near the tipping point.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson