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Full official text - Roadmap
IMRA/ US State Dept ^ | 4-30-03

Posted on 04/30/2003 4:10:18 PM PDT by SJackson

Wednesday, April 30, 2003
Full official text - Roadmap

Full official text - Roadmap

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/ps/2003/20062.htm

Press Statement

Office of the Spokesman

Washington, DC

April 30, 2003

[IMRA: This is consistent with previous versions that have been available. Under the roadmap the Palestinians make declarations, "start" taking actions, but have no obligation to actually achieve anything significant regarding ending the terror infrastructure. In sharp contrast, Israel is expected to stop defending itself (no action against "civilians" when terrorists are considered "civilians") and be silent regarding Palestinain violations ("All official Israeli institutions end incitement against Palestinians.").

The roadmap represents a major achievement for the Palestinians: It imposes Palestinian positions regarding final status issues: independent Palestinian state, reference to right of return via citation of Saudi inititative and more - all this as it reduces the requirements for Palestinian action to a new low.]

A Performance-Based Roadmap to a Permanent Two-State Solution to the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict

The following is a performance-based and goal-driven roadmap, with clear phases, timelines, target dates, and benchmarks aiming at progress through reciprocal steps by the two parties in the political, security, economic, humanitarian, and institution-building fields, under the auspices of the Quartet [the United States, European Union, United Nations, and Russia]. The destination is a final and comprehensive settlement of the Israel-Palestinian conflict by 2005, as presented in President Bush’s speech of 24 June, and welcomed by the EU, Russia and the UN in the 16 July and 17 September Quartet Ministerial statements.

A two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict will only be achieved through an end to violence and terrorism, when the Palestinian people have a leadership acting decisively against terror and willing and able to build a practicing democracy based on tolerance and liberty, and through Israel’s readiness to do what is necessary for a democratic Palestinian state to be established, and a clear, unambiguous acceptance by both parties of the goal of a negotiated settlement as described below. The Quartet will assist and facilitate implementation of the plan, starting in Phase I, including direct discussions between the parties as required. The plan establishes a realistic timeline for implementation. However, as a performance-based plan, progress will require and depend upon the good faith efforts of the parties, and their compliance with each of the obligations outlined below. Should the parties perform their obligations rapidly, progress within and through the phases may come sooner than indicated in the plan. Non-compliance with obligations will impede progress.

A settlement, negotiated between the parties, will result in the emergence of an independent, democratic, and viable Palestinian state living side by side in peace and security with Israel and its other neighbors. The settlement will resolve the Israel-Palestinian conflict, and end the occupation that began in 1967, based on the foundations of the Madrid Conference, the principle of land for peace, UNSCRs 242, 338 and 1397, agreements previously reached by the parties, and the initiative of Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah – endorsed by the Beirut Arab League Summit – calling for acceptance of Israel as a neighbor living in peace and security, in the context of a comprehensive settlement. This initiative is a vital element of international efforts to promote a comprehensive peace on all tracks, including the Syrian-Israeli and Lebanese-Israeli tracks.

The Quartet will meet regularly at senior levels to evaluate the parties' performance on implementation of the plan. In each phase, the parties are expected to perform their obligations in parallel, unless otherwise indicated.

Phase I: Ending Terror And Violence, Normalizing Palestinian Life, and Building Palestinian Institutions -- Present to May 2003

In Phase I, the Palestinians immediately undertake an unconditional cessation of violence according to the steps outlined below; such action should be accompanied by supportive measures undertaken by Israel. Palestinians and Israelis resume security cooperation based on the Tenet work plan to end violence, terrorism, and incitement through restructured and effective Palestinian security services. Palestinians undertake comprehensive political reform in preparation for statehood, including drafting a Palestinian constitution, and free, fair and open elections upon the basis of those measures. Israel takes all necessary steps to help normalize Palestinian life. Israel withdraws from Palestinian areas occupied from September 28, 2000 and the two sides restore the status quo that existed at that time, as security performance and cooperation progress. Israel also freezes all settlement activity, consistent with the Mitchell report.

At the outset of Phase I:

+Palestinian leadership issues unequivocal statement reiterating Israel’s right to exist in peace and security and calling for an immediate and unconditional ceasefire to end armed activity and all acts of violence against Israelis anywhere. All official Palestinian institutions end incitement against Israel. +Israeli leadership issues unequivocal statement affirming its commitment to the two-state vision of an independent, viable, sovereign Palestinian state living in peace and security alongside Israel, as expressed by President Bush, and calling for an immediate end to violence against Palestinians everywhere. All official Israeli institutions end incitement against Palestinians.

Security

+Palestinians declare an unequivocal end to violence and terrorism and undertake visible efforts on the ground to arrest, disrupt, and restrain individuals and groups conducting and planning violent attacks on Israelis anywhere.

+Rebuilt and refocused Palestinian Authority security apparatus begins sustained, targeted, and effective operations aimed at confronting all those engaged in terror and dismantlement of terrorist capabilities and infrastructure. This includes commencing confiscation of illegal weapons and consolidation of security authority, free of association with terror and corruption.

+GOI takes no actions undermining trust, including deportations, attacks on civilians; confiscation and/or demolition of Palestinian homes and property, as a punitive measure or to facilitate Israeli construction; destruction of Palestinian institutions and infrastructure; and other measures specified in the Tenet work plan.

+Relying on existing mechanisms and on-the-ground resources, Quartet representatives begin informal monitoring and consult with the parties on establishment of a formal monitoring mechanism and its implementation. +Implementation, as previously agreed, of U.S. rebuilding, training and resumed security cooperation plan in collaboration with outside oversight board (U.S.–Egypt–Jordan). Quartet support for efforts to achieve a lasting, comprehensive cease-fire.

-All Palestinian security organizations are consolidated into three services reporting to an empowered Interior Minister.

-Restructured/retrained Palestinian security forces and IDF counterparts progressively resume security cooperation and other undertakings in implementation of the Tenet work plan, including regular senior-level meetings, with the participation of U.S. security officials.

+Arab states cut off public and private funding and all other forms of support for groups supporting and engaging in violence and terror.

+All donors providing budgetary support for the Palestinians channel these funds through the Palestinian Ministry of Finance's Single Treasury Account.

+As comprehensive security performance moves forward, IDF withdraws progressively from areas occupied since September 28, 2000 and the two sides restore the status quo that existed prior to September 28, 2000. Palestinian security forces redeploy to areas vacated by IDF.

Palestinian Institution-Building

+Immediate action on credible process to produce draft constitution for Palestinian statehood. As rapidly as possible, constitutional committee circulates draft Palestinian constitution, based on strong parliamentary democracy and cabinet with empowered prime minister, for public comment/debate. Constitutional committee proposes draft document for submission after elections for approval by appropriate Palestinian institutions.

+Appointment of interim prime minister or cabinet with empowered executive authority/decision-making body.

+GOI fully facilitates travel of Palestinian officials for PLC and Cabinet sessions, internationally supervised security retraining, electoral and other reform activity, and other supportive measures related to the reform efforts.

+Continued appointment of Palestinian ministers empowered to undertake fundamental reform. Completion of further steps to achieve genuine separation of powers, including any necessary Palestinian legal reforms for this purpose.

+Establishment of independent Palestinian election commission. PLC reviews and revises election law.

+Palestinian performance on judicial, administrative, and economic benchmarks, as established by the International Task Force on Palestinian Reform.

+As early as possible, and based upon the above measures and in the context of open debate and transparent candidate selection/electoral campaign based on a free, multi-party process, Palestinians hold free, open, and fair elections.

+GOI facilitates Task Force election assistance, registration of voters, movement of candidates and voting officials. Support for NGOs involved in the election process.

+GOI reopens Palestinian Chamber of Commerce and other closed Palestinian institutions in East Jerusalem based on a commitment that these institutions operate strictly in accordance with prior agreements between the parties.

Humanitarian Response

+Israel takes measures to improve the humanitarian situation. Israel and Palestinians implement in full all recommendations of the Bertini report to improve humanitarian conditions, lifting curfews and easing restrictions on movement of persons and goods, and allowing full, safe, and unfettered access of international and humanitarian personnel.

+AHLC reviews the humanitarian situation and prospects for economic development in the West Bank and Gaza and launches a major donor assistance effort, including to the reform effort.

+GOI and PA continue revenue clearance process and transfer of funds, including arrears, in accordance with agreed, transparent monitoring mechanism.

Civil Society

+Continued donor support, including increased funding through PVOs/NGOs, for people to people programs, private sector development and civil society initiatives.

Settlements

+GOI immediately dismantles settlement outposts erected since March 2001. +Consistent with the Mitchell Report, GOI freezes all settlement activity (including natural growth of settlements).

Phase II: Transition -- June 2003-December 2003

In the second phase, efforts are focused on the option of creating an independent Palestinian state with provisional borders and attributes of sovereignty, based on the new constitution, as a way station to a permanent status settlement. As has been noted, this goal can be achieved when the Palestinian people have a leadership acting decisively against terror, willing and able to build a practicing democracy based on tolerance and liberty. With such a leadership, reformed civil institutions and security structures, the Palestinians will have the active support of the Quartet and the broader international community in establishing an independent, viable, state.

Progress into Phase II will be based upon the consensus judgment of the Quartet of whether conditions are appropriate to proceed, taking into account performance of both parties. Furthering and sustaining efforts to normalize Palestinian lives and build Palestinian institutions, Phase II starts after Palestinian elections and ends with possible creation of an independent Palestinian state with provisional borders in 2003. Its primary goals are continued comprehensive security performance and effective security cooperation, continued normalization of Palestinian life and institution-building, further building on and sustaining of the goals outlined in Phase I, ratification of a democratic Palestinian constitution, formal establishment of office of prime minister, consolidation of political reform, and the creation of a Palestinian state with provisional borders.

+International Conference: Convened by the Quartet, in consultation with the parties, immediately after the successful conclusion of Palestinian elections, to support Palestinian economic recovery and launch a process, leading to establishment of an independent Palestinian state with provisional borders.

-Such a meeting would be inclusive, based on the goal of a comprehensive Middle East peace (including between Israel and Syria, and Israel and Lebanon), and based on the principles described in the preamble to this document.

-Arab states restore pre-intifada links to Israel (trade offices, etc.).

-Revival of multilateral engagement on issues including regional water resources, environment, economic development, refugees, and arms control issues.

+New constitution for democratic, independent Palestinian state is finalized and approved by appropriate Palestinian institutions. Further elections, if required, should follow approval of the new constitution.

+Empowered reform cabinet with office of prime minister formally established, consistent with draft constitution.

+Continued comprehensive security performance, including effective security cooperation on the bases laid out in Phase I.

+Creation of an independent Palestinian state with provisional borders through a process of Israeli-Palestinian engagement, launched by the international conference. As part of this process, implementation of prior agreements, to enhance maximum territorial contiguity, including further action on settlements in conjunction with establishment of a Palestinian state with provisional borders.

+Enhanced international role in monitoring transition, with the active, sustained, and operational support of the Quartet.

+Quartet members promote international recognition of Palestinian state, including possible UN membership.

Phase III: Permanent Status Agreement and End of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict -- 2004 – 2005

Progress into Phase III, based on consensus judgment of Quartet, and taking into account actions of both parties and Quartet monitoring. Phase III objectives are consolidation of reform and stabilization of Palestinian institutions, sustained, effective Palestinian security performance, and Israeli-Palestinian negotiations aimed at a permanent status agreement in 2005.

+Second International Conference: Convened by Quartet, in consultation with the parties, at beginning of 2004 to endorse agreement reached on an independent Palestinian state with provisional borders and formally to launch a process with the active, sustained, and operational support of the Quartet, leading to a final, permanent status resolution in 2005, including on borders, Jerusalem, refugees, settlements; and, to support progress toward a comprehensive Middle East settlement between Israel and Lebanon and Israel and Syria, to be achieved as soon as possible.

+Continued comprehensive, effective progress on the reform agenda laid out by the Task Force in preparation for final status agreement. +Continued sustained and effective security performance, and sustained, effective security cooperation on the bases laid out in Phase I.

+International efforts to facilitate reform and stabilize Palestinian institutions and the Palestinian economy, in preparation for final status agreement.

+Parties reach final and comprehensive permanent status agreement that ends the Israel-Palestinian conflict in 2005, through a settlement negotiated between the parties based on UNSCR 242, 338, and 1397, that ends the occupation that began in 1967, and includes an agreed, just, fair, and realistic solution to the refugee issue, and a negotiated resolution on the status of Jerusalem that takes into account the political and religious concerns of both sides, and protects the religious interests of Jews, Christians, and Muslims worldwide, and fulfills the vision of two states, Israel and sovereign, independent, democratic and viable Palestine, living side-by-side in peace and security.

+Arab state acceptance of full normal relations with Israel and security for all the states of the region in the context of a comprehensive Arab-Israeli peace.

[End]
Released on April 30, 2003


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: fulltext; reference; roadmap

1 posted on 04/30/2003 4:10:19 PM PDT by SJackson
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on or off this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

===================================================

Not a deal we'd force on Iraq or the Afghanistan.

2 posted on 04/30/2003 4:12:58 PM PDT by SJackson
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To: SJackson
Does it say turn left at Albuquerque?
3 posted on 04/30/2003 4:25:20 PM PDT by Diddle E. Squat
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To: SJackson
Oh, this will definitely work,... and if anyone is interested there is a bridge for sale in Brooklyn.
4 posted on 04/30/2003 4:29:07 PM PDT by dmeara
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To: SJackson
The problem has always been that the Palestinians want all of the West Bank with the Jewish people gone and the Israelis want all of the West Bank and the Palestinian people gone. Both sides want land and peace.

Now Bush (and just about the rest of the world) have reached a Solomon-like solution to split it in two. The US should monitor and guarantee fixed and secure borders for both and allow peace to grow. It's the only solution that has not been tried.

5 posted on 04/30/2003 4:35:34 PM PDT by ex-snook (American jobs need balanced trade - WE BUY FROM YOU, YOU BUY FROM US)
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To: ex-snook
The problem is that any Palestinian state will inevitably devolve into a terrorist state, from which to attack Israel.

As long as the "Palestinian" Arabs won't accept Israel's existence, there will not be a long-term peace.
6 posted on 04/30/2003 4:39:03 PM PDT by tomahawk
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To: SJackson
Bookmark for later reading...

However, I hope this "roadmap" puts the onus on the palestinian drivers.
7 posted on 04/30/2003 4:40:11 PM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer (The democRATS are near the tipping point.)
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To: ex-snook
the Palestinians want all of the West Bank with the Jewish people gone and the Israelis want all of the West Bank and the Palestinian people gone.

The Palestinians want all of ISRAEL (of course that includes all the West Bank and Gaza) with all the Jewish people gone and the Israelis have 1.2 million Arab citizens of Israel with full equal rights.

Not even Meir Kahane envisioned a totally Arab-free Israel, but the Palestinians insist on a total ethnic cleansing of all Jews from "their state."

8 posted on 04/30/2003 4:42:30 PM PDT by Alouette (Why is it called "International Law" if only Israel and the United States are expected to keep it?)
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Bump for later.
9 posted on 04/30/2003 4:43:42 PM PDT by Lyford
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To: SJackson
Bump
10 posted on 04/30/2003 4:45:12 PM PDT by OXENinFLA
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To: SJackson
I would think the Bush administration would want a Palestinian state, were that a viable solution. However, it is obvious such a state would only secure the Palestinians a more secure base for terrorist operations against Isreali civilians, not to mention anyone they consider their enemy throughout the world.

This roadmap will not fly because the Palestinians will not abandon their use of terrorism to accomplish their long-stated goal of destroying the Isreali state. All this roadmap will accomplish is to once again demonstrate this.

11 posted on 04/30/2003 4:47:48 PM PDT by dmeara
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To: SJackson
archive later
12 posted on 04/30/2003 4:48:09 PM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: SJackson
Now we will see how much state sponsered terrorism has affected the equation for peace in the Middle East. With Iraq out of the way, will Iran and Syria continue to pay for missle attacks, homicide bombings, hijackings, etc.?

Only at their own peril.
13 posted on 04/30/2003 4:52:47 PM PDT by limitedgov
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To: SJackson
I ask ALL at FreeRepublic to give President Bush the same support and faith in this endeavor as we have given the President's decisions WRT war. There are enemies of peace on both sides here. Sharon's courage and skill and sincerity will be every bit as tested as will be the new Palestinian leadership's.

My prayer continues to be, "Thy Will be done".

14 posted on 04/30/2003 5:19:02 PM PDT by Phil V.
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To: dmeara
Oh, this will definitely work,... and if anyone is interested there is a bridge for sale in Brooklyn.

ah....that would'nt be a clinton bridge to the 21st century would it...or was that duck dodgers of the 21st century

15 posted on 04/30/2003 5:20:19 PM PDT by joesnuffy (Moderate Islam Is For Dilettantes)
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To: SJackson
When compared to the lands held in arab islamic hands...Israel is the size of a pack of cigarettes in the middle of a football field...

To carve out a piece of Israel as a homeland for a people who are not a people..but a group of hulligan invaders is insane

The arab muslims simply do not want nor will they allow a piece of their homeland to be carved up to give their own bretheren a homeland...

Give Arafat nation status and you just legitimized terror a means to a political end...
and a base camp from which to launch attacks against Israel..

This is a great victory for terrorists and their means...

The Palestinians are Lebanon's problem...they should take them...and we should force them to do so..as well as establish them (Palys) in their govt and all institutions by force..as long as we are bullying someone into accepting the Palestinans terrorist demands...why is it not an arab islamic country

Rather than Israel...??

IMO Because to screw Israel is pleasing to the arab muslims pulling American strings imo
Saudis who own the bond market and stock market...who are guaranteed high oil prices
We havent paid them back for 09-11 and avoid any such notion...
CAIR is smiling
16 posted on 04/30/2003 5:28:44 PM PDT by joesnuffy (Moderate Islam Is For Dilettantes)
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To: SJackson; dennisw; Alouette; Yehuda; Prodigal Daughter; BearWash; IFly4Him; Jeremiah Jr; 2sheep; ...
final and comprehensive settlement = final solution
two-state solution = divide the land for gain

A settlement, negotiated between the parties, will result in the emergence of an independent, democratic, and viable Palestinian state living side by side in peace and security with Israel and its other neighbors wickedness against the holy [land] covenant i.e. diving the land for a price ("peace dividend") and axiomatically, death and destruction. The roadmap for peace = the broad road to perdition.

Pali state = dividing the land for a false promise of peace peace when there is no peace = an abomination roadmap to desolation IOW a covenant with death and agreement with hell.

Give this brilliant midweek idea what, 62 weeks?
Who conceived this night vision er nightmare?

Vis-a-vis the Palestinian-Israeli conflict, the King's most outstanding achievement is generally considered the “roadmap” for Mideast peace — a concept that the Monarch conceived and persuaded Bush to adopt.

The “roadmap,” envisaging the establishment of a Palestinian state by 2005, represented a revolutionary approach to Palestinian-Israeli peace-making in that it hinged on international consensus over an endgame, to be executed according to a precise timeline.

A document drafted by the international quartet for Mideast peace — the US, UN, EU and Russia — is now expected to be officially published shortly.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/832531/posts

17 posted on 04/30/2003 5:49:52 PM PDT by Thinkin' Gal (Pali state i.e. dividing the land for a price = abomination that makes [Israel] desolate)
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To: Thinkin' Gal
. . . a concept that the Monarch conceived and persuaded Bush to adopt.

Ah! . . . here we go again. "Bush, the idiot puppet who has been hoodwinked as a result of deficient intillect, unable to conjur up any sort of "vision thing" on his own . . . a doofus totally dependent on others for policy. . . Bush, the "victim".

Thinkin' Gal, THINK!

18 posted on 04/30/2003 6:23:59 PM PDT by Phil V.
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To: limitedgov
will Iran and Syria continue to pay for missle attacks, homicide bombings, hijackings, etc.?

There's the kicker. I doubt very much that they will.

Only at their own peril

They are not that bright you know, probably not bright enough to recognize that peril for what it really is. Heck, neither of them every liked Saddam anyway.

19 posted on 04/30/2003 6:30:14 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: Phil V.
What is the matter with you? Doofus king claims he invented the road map idea. Doofus "quartet" thinks the roapmap is just peachy. They are all peddling fertilizer: C-R-@-P
20 posted on 04/30/2003 6:30:59 PM PDT by Thinkin' Gal
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To: SJackson
the Quartet [the United States, European Union, United Nations, and Russia].

Now there is a nice unbiased group. NOT! The UN is composed of a bunch of representatives of tyrants and dictators, many of them Arab, and very firmly anti Israel. Russian has supported Israel's enemies, first as the Soviet Union and continuing as Russia, for decades. The European Union is overrun with Arabic Muslims and many of the European countries had and have signifignet anti semitic groups within them. Only he US has been a "friend" to Israel, but the many Arabists in the State department are always fighting that position. Instead of holding their coat, as friend would, we've held them back after their enemies have struck the first blow, and many subsequant ones besides. I don't understand why the US thinks that what works and is right for us, is wrong and/or won't work for them.

21 posted on 04/30/2003 6:42:05 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: SJackson
Anything in there that gives freedom to Arabs in Lebanon or Syria?

Interesting how democracy is only needed for Arabs of the west bank and not for Arabs of the other countries.

22 posted on 04/30/2003 6:47:26 PM PDT by WOSG (All Hail The Free Republic of Iraq! God Bless our Troops!)
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To: Thinkin' Gal
I just hope the strategery is still coming from the White House and not the State Dept, 'cause this sure looks like 'same old same old' and a new anti-terrorist twist is needed to have this mean something.

Frankly, one state - 2 states - n states .. doesnt matter ... what matters is whether people have freedom or tyranny.
And whether they live in a civil society or barbaric one.

23 posted on 04/30/2003 6:51:28 PM PDT by WOSG (All Hail The Free Republic of Iraq! God Bless our Troops!)
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To: Thinkin' Gal
Bush don't buy C - R - @ - P!

Trust da man, please.

24 posted on 04/30/2003 6:55:34 PM PDT by Phil V.
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To: SJackson
At the outset of Phase I:

+Palestinian leadership issues unequivocal statement reiterating Israel’s right to exist in peace and security and calling for an immediate and unconditional ceasefire to end armed activity and all acts of violence against Israelis anywhere. All official Palestinian institutions end incitement against Israel.

Phase I, step one. Has never happened. Don't expect it ever will. This whole thing won't even get off the ground this go-round. Maybe in a few years when Iran is free, Iraq is cranking along, and Arafat is dead. Not now. The Pali's just don't have it in them to stop cursing the Jews with every breath. Not yet, anyway.

25 posted on 04/30/2003 6:59:25 PM PDT by rogue yam
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: ex-snook
The problem has always been that the Palestinians want all of the West Bank with the Jewish people gone and the Israelis want all of the West Bank and the Palestinian people gone. Both sides want land and peace.

No, the problem has always been that the Palestinians want the utter, unequivocal annihilation of Israel, period. It's all they've ever wanted and it's all they'll ever want. In the much-ballyhooed Clinton summit at Camp David, Israel offered a stunning (and stupid) 95% of all Palestinian demands. They quickly said no. If that doesn't make the situation clear, nothing will.

MM

27 posted on 04/30/2003 7:16:16 PM PDT by MississippiMan
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Comment #28 Removed by Moderator

To: dmeara
This roadmap will not fly because the Palestinians will not abandon their use of terrorism to accomplish their long-stated goal of destroying the Isreali state. All this roadmap will accomplish is to once again demonstrate this.
That's why terrorism is the first pit stop on the course. It's both the out and the pressure on the PA. Bush can walk saying they didn't comply. The danger is not that the PA doesn't comply, it's that the Administration accepts half-measures. This not being the Clintoon years, I think it's a reasonable expectation that this reality on the PA will prevail. If it doesn't, the President has a legitimate and convenient back door.

This will work.

I predicted the week after Sept 11 that it will end with a Nobel for Bush or Powell, most likely Powell. I stand by that prediction and I see it more certain than ever. It will be the first Nobel to mean something in ages.

29 posted on 04/30/2003 7:35:44 PM PDT by nicollo
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To: Alouette
Ha ha, love your tag line!
30 posted on 04/30/2003 7:37:51 PM PDT by Donna Lee Nardo
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To: El Gato
"...I don't understand why the US thinks that what works and is right for us, is wrong and/or won't work for them."

And there it is in a nut shell. What a double standard. The Israelis -- more specifically, the JEWS -- are still second class citizens in the eyes of the international community...and even particulars within the U.S.

Thing is, I don't think they're going to tolerate it much longer. Their national mindset just doesn't strike me as being condusive to being led to the slaughter as in centuries past.

They have guns now. Big ones. And they know how to use them.

An officer of the Golani Brigade during morning prayer after entering the city of Ramallah

31 posted on 04/30/2003 7:52:04 PM PDT by Salem (FREE REPUBLIC - Fighting to win within the Arena of the War of Ideas!)
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To: Phil V.
"I ask ALL at FreeRepublic to give President Bush the same support and faith in this endeavor as we have given the President's decisions WRT war ... My prayer continues to be, 'Thy Will be done'."

I'm a solid Bush supporter myself and would hope more than anyone else he could take the brass ring on this one, but the Bush Administration is going to get burned on Jerusalem, all good intentions notwithstanding.

So we pray ... and wait.

32 posted on 04/30/2003 7:57:15 PM PDT by Salem (FREE REPUBLIC - Fighting to win within the Arena of the War of Ideas!)
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To: nicollo
That's why terrorism is the first pit stop on the course. It's both the out and the pressure on the PA. Bush can walk saying they didn't comply. The danger is not that the PA doesn't comply, it's that the Administration accepts half-measures. This not being the Clintoon years, I think it's a reasonable expectation that this reality on the PA will prevail. If it doesn't, the President has a legitimate and convenient back door.

Agreed. This is a clever continuation of administration policy as laid out by President Bush in a speech last year. It puts the onus squarely on the PA, but will not result in a Palestinian state, or necessarily peace in the region for the foreseeable future.

There is a pattern here. They are making the Palestinians an offer they cannot and will not accept, much as they did to the Taliban when they asked them to cough up Al Qaeda, and to Saddam when they demanded unfettered weapons inspections.

It will only work to reveal the intransigence of the Palestinian position.

33 posted on 04/30/2003 8:35:50 PM PDT by dmeara
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To: dmeara
There is a pattern here. They are making the Palestinians an offer they cannot and will not accept, much as they did to the Taliban when they asked them to cough up Al Qaeda, and to Saddam when they demanded unfettered weapons inspections.
Precisely. This Administration has been brilliant, genius, at forcing its opponents to the full logic of their positions. France and Russia did as much to bring about the Iraq war as Saddam himself. The President gave them every opportunity to avoid it.

The same will play out with the Palestinians, as you say. I see it working to the positive rather than the negative. The key is, unlike Oslo, if it fails it falls of its own weight, and it doesn't bring us down with it. Therefore, I think it will work. The Pallies will have no choice but to play ball.

I also think that this will all result in a free Lebanon, free of Syria, Hezbolla & Co. If it doesn't, there's no resolution; it either does or it doesn't.

34 posted on 04/30/2003 8:47:01 PM PDT by nicollo
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To: SJackson
Phase I - Security
"+Palestinians declare an unequivocal end to violence and terrorism and undertake visible efforts on the ground to arrest, disrupt, and restrain individuals and groups conducting and planning violent attacks on Israelis anywhere.

+Rebuilt and refocused Palestinian Authority security apparatus begins sustained, targeted, and effective operations aimed at confronting all those engaged in terror and dismantlement of terrorist capabilities and infrastructure. This includes commencing confiscation of illegal weapons and consolidation of security authority, free of association with terror and corruption. "


Now I get it. The PA is supposed to do what the Isralies have been doing for the past two years. I'm sure they have the equipment necessary. And after each homicde bombing they all go "opps". *sigh*
Good luck......... works (in theory) for me.
35 posted on 04/30/2003 9:00:14 PM PDT by bart99
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To: bart99
THIS IS LIKE A COMPLICATED GAME OF TRUTH OR DARE. DARE THE PALIS TO CHANGE, OR FIND OUT WHAT I KNOW IS THE TRUTH. THE TRUTH ACCORDING TO ME IS THAT THE PALESTINIANS (AND THE ARAB WORLD AS A WHOLE) CANNOT STAND THE FACT THAT A DEMOCRACY AND WHATS WORSE IS EVERYTIME THE ARABS ATTACK ISRAEL THEY LOSE. CAN YOU IMAGINE BEING 5 LARGE NATIONS AND BEING BEATEN REPEATEDLY BY A SPECK ON THE MAP? IT DOESNT MAKE FOR A FRIENDLY NEIGHBORHOOD ATMOSPHERE. IN MY OPINION WE WILL NOT SEE TRUE PEACE SHOWN ON THE PART OF THE ARABS TOWARDS THE ISRAELI'S IN MY LIFETIME, ALL I CAN HOPE FOR IS THE SAFETY OF MY FAMILY, MY COUSINS SERVING IN THE MILITARY AND THOSE WHO ARE CIVILLIANS.....MAY G-D WATCH OVER THEM!!!!!!
36 posted on 04/30/2003 9:33:34 PM PDT by priceofreedom
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To: bart99
THIS IS LIKE A COMPLICATED GAME OF TRUTH OR DARE. DARE THE PALIS TO CHANGE, OR FIND OUT WHAT I KNOW IS THE TRUTH. THE TRUTH ACCORDING TO ME IS THAT THE PALESTINIANS (AND THE ARAB WORLD AS A WHOLE) CANNOT STAND THE FACT THAT A DEMOCRACY (ESPECIALLY ONE RUN BY THE ZIONIST INFIDELS) AND WHATS WORSE IS EVERYTIME THE ARABS ATTACK ISRAEL THEY LOSE. CAN YOU IMAGINE BEING 5 LARGE NATIONS AND BEING BEATEN REPEATEDLY BY A SPECK ON THE MAP? IT DOESNT MAKE FOR A FRIENDLY NEIGHBORHOOD ATMOSPHERE. IN MY OPINION WE WILL NOT SEE TRUE PEACE SHOWN ON THE PART OF THE ARABS TOWARDS THE ISRAELI'S IN MY LIFETIME, ALL I CAN HOPE FOR IS THE SAFETY OF MY FAMILY, MY COUSINS SERVING IN THE MILITARY AND THOSE WHO ARE CIVILLIANS.....MAY G-D WATCH OVER THEM!!!!!!
37 posted on 04/30/2003 9:34:47 PM PDT by priceofreedom
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To: Phil V.
This will be a difficult process, but I have strong confidence in President Bush. He is the leader most likely to find a workable solution for peace in the Middle East.
38 posted on 04/30/2003 9:36:28 PM PDT by HAL9000
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To: priceofreedom
You are referring to the six day war, I presume. Well, Egypt and Jordan have since signed peace treaties with Israel.... and have accepted their "right to exsist". Other countries have not...... and that's a condition of the roadmap for the PA to do. I don't expect that even if they do, they'll live up to it. But, any success of peace in the region is not dependent on the PA, but on it's neighbors - like Syria, Lebanon, (Iraq is no longer a problem), and others. If syria, for example, actually gives up their occupation of lebanon, and does away with all terrorist support, etc, etc...... that will have more effect on peace than what the PA does.

I don't believe peace is going to come by 2005. Maybe never. But..... if any kind of WMD hits Israel, Israel is ready to retaliate quite directly. They aren't going to 'negotiate'..... they'll use their nukes on Damascus and others if necessary. They have nothing to lose but their country. And I 'think' their neighbors know this. Which is why the "homicide attacks" are as much of violence that anyone will do. Imagine what would happen if rockets started raining down on Israel from Hezbollah located in Lebonon. Israel isn't going to just 'talk'..... and that's what scares the hell out of Damascus, since they control Lebanon.

The roadmap is DOA I'm afraid. Arafat has to be gone first. And other countries must sign the peace treaties. The PA isn't even a state - they can't sign a thing. But.... I'm willing to watch.
39 posted on 04/30/2003 9:55:58 PM PDT by bart99
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To: HAL9000
"This will be a difficult process, but I have strong confidence in President Bush. He is the leader most likely to find a workable solution for peace in the Middle East."


You have more confidence than I do. As mentioned in earlier posts in this thread, Bush left himself a way out by demanding a cessation to terrorism as a condition for peace. Even IF the PA would be willing to stop instigating their "homicide bombings", the terrorist groups won't stop. Hence the other countries in the region must be willing to fight their own and quell the terrorist groups. That is what complicates the entire process.
40 posted on 04/30/2003 10:00:17 PM PDT by bart99
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To: nicollo
Think you said it best.

Another thing I've noticed about Bush is he seems to think 20 steps into a strategy ... this is how he checkmates opponents every time. It's going to take a miracle to pull this off, but if anyone can do this it is Bush :-)
41 posted on 04/30/2003 10:04:25 PM PDT by Tamzee (I wondered why somebody didn't do something. Then I realized... I am somebody! - Anonymous)
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To: bart99
The way I look at it, what Syria does and what the PA does are one and the same. without Hamas, Hizbullah etc. located in Damascus the PA's power would be greatly diminished and would render the Pali's innefective against Israel. (even though we all know that if Israel wanted to end the problem they could in a matter of minutes.) The problem is, Israel is a moral nation opposed (many of them atleast) to such actions as carpet bombing the Pali's etc. So what we have is a stale mate. I think that more wight needs to be put on the Pali's and the Arab world as a whole to put an end to this...and if they wont, and end needs to be created.
42 posted on 04/30/2003 10:21:06 PM PDT by priceofreedom
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To: priceofreedom
" I think that more wight needs to be put on the Pali's and the Arab world as a whole to put an end to this"


I agree....... the region is an integral part of this, or it won't work.
43 posted on 04/30/2003 10:30:29 PM PDT by bart99
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To: Salem
Great picture!
44 posted on 05/01/2003 3:03:58 AM PDT by Alouette (Why is it called "International Law" if only Israel and the United States are expected to keep it?)
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To: Thinkin' Gal; Light Speed; Yehuda; dennisw; Simcha7
Jerusalem resident looks at a poster placed by Israelis opposed to "road map" peace plan drafted by the international community
45 posted on 05/01/2003 10:31:49 AM PDT by Jeremiah Jr (Everybody goes to Rick's)
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To: Phil V.
Gog/George

Excerpt:

Ha-ha-ha. That's not me laughing, that's Heaven laughing, for as the Yiddish expression goes (after translation, that is), Man plans and G-d laughs. In fact, someone wrote me and told me that George Bush would have attacked Afghanistan earlier had weather conditions not delayed him until the 22nd day of Tishrei.

I can't confirm that fact yet, but it doesn't matter anyhow. The fact is that after weeks of preparation and deliberation, George Bush Jr. finally let loose on Sunday, October 7th. However, according to the Jewish calendar in Israel, it was already (just barely) Monday, 22 of Tishrei - Hoshana Rabbah - the one day of the year that G-d judges the gentile nations as well as the Jewish people.

One person tried to convince me the other day that the Teimani pronunciation of the word "Gog," is to say the "g" (gimmel in Hebrew), the same way we do when we say "George." Then, something happened to the "r" (raish in Hebrew) sound along the way, though I can't remember what. But, when he was finished, we had "Gog m'Gog" (George Bush Jr., son of George Bush Sr.).

It was a nice try, but for all we know, it is true. After all, it is unusual that the son should be president two terms later, just when another conflict in the Middle-East and Asia has quickly duplicated his own father's dilemma. And, it is even more unusual that the son should have the same name as the father, "George."

How we take subtle historical coincidences for granted, and brush them off easily only because they are not blatant enough four our liking. It's like taking an exam in school, and then getting up and going over to the examiner to complain, "Hey! I don't like this question. It doesn't indicate enough what the answer is!" You have to appreciate that point, because it could have happened during Clinton's era, but didn't, as if it was waiting for George Bush Jr. to get into the White House, something he did only after great controversy. We forgot about that one already, didn't we? From a Torah point of view, such "suspense" is always a sign that Heaven is directly involved in the event in question, and that we, the Jewish people, are being given a chance to wake up and do teshuvah. The results, we are being told, are being made dependent upon our choice. Not that I'm saying that Al Gore would have been the better choice. Apparently there is a tradition that the Great Wall of China was also called the "Wall of Al Magog." Isn't his father's name George, also?

RABBI WINSTON'S WEEKLY PARSHA PAGE
- Parshas Lech-Lecha
Parshas Lech-Lecha

The Madrid Conference Middle East Peace Conference October 30-31, 1991... Spain
Mr. George Bush, President of the ...
Madrid Conference

...at the same time...

Coast Guard Perfect Storm Images
  The Real Perfect Storm Coast Guard Images From October 1991 A special From Coast Guard News. ...
The Perfect Storm

Ezekiel 38
18 "And it will come to pass at the same time, when Gog comes against the land of Israel," says the Lord GOD, "that My fury will show in My face. 19 For in My jealousy and in the fire of My wrath I have spoken: "Surely in that day there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel, 20 so that the fish of the sea, the birds of the heavens, the beasts of the field, all creeping things that creep on the earth, and all men who are on the face of the earth shall shake at My presence. The mountains shall be thrown down, the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.

George is coming against The Land.

46 posted on 05/01/2003 10:46:03 AM PDT by Jeremiah Jr (Everybody goes to Rick's)
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This is really becoming some Greek drama..which is infact a tragedy...son hates father..father is too gutless to act...lets family die!

Israel,...do you think the "Diamond" crowd in Europe even lift their head..and sigh over Jerusalem?....

How about the money venders in N.Y. city?..all that Insurance/re-Insurance?.

Israel is about as focused on their troubles as they were after David Died...

There ownself destructive ways make it easy for another to come and rob them totally.

You have to see the real Israel Historic....the one that sends people who just escaped the Nazi furnace...and have no expierience in battle ...none..send them to a fort to get slaughtered....so that the incident can be used politcally.

Thats why a Sharon bites his lip about what really happened to Yitzak Rabin...why Sharon can one minute slaughter Egyptians....then boot Settlers out of their homes in Sinai for the weasle in Cario...then say as he did today.."That maybe that should not have happened".

If it were not for the Almighties promise to Avraham..this crowd would be toast long ago.

47 posted on 05/01/2003 11:46:11 AM PDT by Light Speed
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To: Salem
but the Bush Administration is going to get burned on Jerusalem

And this is true by the spelled-out support of the Abdullah initiative mentioned that contains the explicit and clearly emphasized main reference to the 1948 UN General Assembly Resolution 194 which, in turn, makes specific mention of "return" and Jerusalem lands.

We are served by neither Saudi or the U.N. and should force a new peace settlement of our own or get out of the way IMO.

This guy gets the message:
[Israeli] Minister of Strategic Affairs lambasts Roadmap-incompatible with Bush's intent to fight terror

48 posted on 05/13/2003 1:48:22 PM PDT by flamefront (To the victor go the oils. No oil or oil-money for islamofascist bioweapon production.)
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To: SJackson
bump
49 posted on 05/13/2003 6:57:06 PM PDT by JamminJAY (This space for rent)
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