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Psychiatric Association Debates Lifting Pedophilia Taboo
CNSNews.com ^ | 6/11/03 | Lawrence Morahan

Posted on 06/11/2003 2:18:54 AM PDT by kattracks

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To: kattracks
The slippery slope at work.
51 posted on 06/11/2003 5:21:29 AM PDT by Kuksool
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To: Torie
People whose sexual interests are atypical, culturally forbidden or religiously proscribed should not necessarily be labeled mentally ill, they argued.

This is why I fight the tide and always will.

52 posted on 06/11/2003 5:21:52 AM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Kuksool
Exactly!
53 posted on 06/11/2003 5:22:33 AM PDT by kattracks
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To: maxwell
Two things that need to be highlighted:

1. Many psychiatrists and psychologists enter their profession because they're screwed up themselves and wanting to figure things out. That's why deviancy is continually defined down.

2. This article is incredibly clever. It focuses on the pedophilia to get people enraged, but the real story is the gender identity issue. This is thesis, antithesis, synthesis in bold print. Thesis: Legitimize pedophilia. Antithesis: That's too extreme. Synthesis: Okay than we'll just legitimize a little thing like gender identity confusion. The activists are forcing the normal psychiatrists to spend their energy on the pedophilia issue, after which they'll be too tired and have spent too much capital to fight the gender identity issue. All this in cuckoo-land (San Francisco) where this stuff is normalized and the activists will be out in force.
54 posted on 06/11/2003 5:31:07 AM PDT by mongrel (white judges do get off)
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To: Kevin Curry
I'm not sure I need to be lectured by someone who admitted to growing weed in his garden.
55 posted on 06/11/2003 5:33:14 AM PDT by Lazamataz (POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE D)
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To: MEG33
I know sex with a child is not going to be legal in my lifetime.

I agree, cuz the first mo-fo I hear about doing it with a kid legally will get killed by me.

56 posted on 06/11/2003 5:34:10 AM PDT by Lazamataz (POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE D)
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To: hellinahandcart
Those "other psychiatrists" need to be taken out back and whipped

Preferably without their consent.

57 posted on 06/11/2003 5:35:24 AM PDT by Lazamataz (POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE DO NOT CROSS POLICE TAGLINE D)
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To: mict42
Psychiatry is not a science, it's an agenda

Well said.

58 posted on 06/11/2003 5:36:17 AM PDT by FourPeas
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To: Lazamataz
You make my point!
59 posted on 06/11/2003 5:39:26 AM PDT by MEG33
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To: kattracks
Nothing is abnormal except normal behavior.

All religions are good and must be promoted - unless they claim that man is inherently evil. Then it's open season.

If it feels good, do it.



60 posted on 06/11/2003 5:46:31 AM PDT by petuniasevan (Sodom and Gomorrah? Pikers. Amateurs.)
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To: kattracks
Either there is a natural law or there isn't. In the latter case, everything is permissible. Everything. Most Americans are afraid to face this hard dichotomy; acceptance of it requires either reform or a descent into hell. The APA, however, is simply following the argument to its (il)logical conclusion.
61 posted on 06/11/2003 5:47:34 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: kattracks
"And other psychiatrists have written, again in scientific journals, that if children can be forced to go to church, why should 'consent' be the defining moral issue when it comes to sex?" she said.

Hmmmmmm, putting it in those terms...

BUGGER A BABY = CHURCH SUNDAY SCHOOL

How could anyone disagree?
62 posted on 06/11/2003 5:50:19 AM PDT by carlo3b (http://www.CookingWithCarlo.com)
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To: jazzlite
I was molested as a child by a stranger in our home.

Any tips for protecting my two girls? I never leave them alone with any male. And I have yet to let them go into a friend's house without being under a trustworthy mother's supervision.

63 posted on 06/11/2003 5:51:17 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: kattracks
Conditions of our descent:

a) Busting wide open
b) Carried in a hand-basket
c) Sliding down on a greased pole
d) All of the above
64 posted on 06/11/2003 5:56:46 AM PDT by AD from SpringBay
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To: TN4Liberty
I have always said that when Homosexuality is accepted as a normal part of culture then Pedophilia would be next.

The fact that they would even consider this is very sad!

65 posted on 06/11/2003 5:57:19 AM PDT by jgrubbs
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To: mongrel
Thesis: Legitimize pedophilia. Antithesis: That's too extreme. Synthesis: Okay than we'll just legitimize a little thing like gender identity confusion.

Good points, all.

Part of my problem with this sort of thing is, I am a scientist (a REAL scientist) and I find it hard to "legitimize" anything in psych., etc. as remotely "scientific". The way my mind works is, I automatically view all this hoopla as folks piddling around trying to validate their opinions (under duress of sociopolitical activism, no less). That's all this is-- a sociopolitical exercise. Nothing scientific, or even academic, about it.

Before I got all riled up about NAMBLA roaming the streets looking for whom it may devour, I reminded myself that the age-of-consent issue is one that will preclude the legalization of pedophilia, as far as the law is concerned. At least for a while. With these recent attempts by PP et al. to do away with parental consent requirements for medical procedures like teen abortions, e.g., one has to wonder, however. I am still recovering from last night's beans and Stoli but I think that for some reason, activists of all stripes are working to make children out to be autonomous in matters of sex and reproduction, two areas in which even the most mature of us have a hard time negotiating in life. Just something that has been knocking around in my head lately, trying to understand what I see as a trend...

66 posted on 06/11/2003 5:58:03 AM PDT by maxwell (Well I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation...)
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To: mict42
Psychiatry is not a science, it's an agenda

Well Said!

67 posted on 06/11/2003 6:00:50 AM PDT by Fiddlstix (http://www.ourgangnet.net)
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To: kattracks
In previous articles, psychiatrists have argued that there is little or no proof that sex with adults is necessarily harmful to minors. Indeed, they have argued that many sexually molested children later look back on their experience as positive, Nicolosi said.

"And other psychiatrists have written, again in scientific journals, that if children can be forced to go to church, why should 'consent' be the defining moral issue when it comes to sex?" she said.

There are some very sick psychiatrists out there!

68 posted on 06/11/2003 6:00:54 AM PDT by jgrubbs
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To: LizardQueen
I really have trouble seeing this happening. Beyond the whole "disorder" issue, one of the big reasons that it's a crime is because children are considered to be incapable of informed consent.

I can see a big push by the pedophiles to get age of consent lowered nationwide. Currently, Canada has it at 14, and I can see it being pushed for in the US.

The main targets of gay pedophiles are young teens, rather than pre-adolescants. (The push for lowering consent still further will come later)

Consider the madness that has the US considering that a young person does not have the maturity to drink alcohol responsibly until 21, yet is mature enough to cast a vote for President at 18, and is mature enough to have sex which involves risk of pregnancy or a fatal disease at an even younger age

69 posted on 06/11/2003 6:06:44 AM PDT by SauronOfMordor (Java/C++/Unix/Web Developer looking for next gig)
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To: kattracks
In previous articles, psychiatrists have argued that there is little or no proof that sex with adults is necessarily harmful to minors. Indeed, they have argued that many sexually molested children later look back on their experience as positive, Nicolosi said.

Of course many of these molested children are living fulfilled lives suffering from Same-sex Attraction Disorder in some facet of the homosexual lifestyle.

Remember that 'homosexuals' do not reproduce, they recruit.

70 posted on 06/11/2003 6:25:30 AM PDT by John O (God Save America (Please))
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To: SauronOfMordor
That brings up an interesting point. Isn't pedophilia, strictly speaking (at least in hetero terms, leaving aside gays for a moment) an unhealthy (ie sick) sexual interest in pre-adolescent children? An interest in adolescent teens under the age of 18 is more socially unacceptable than it is a deviant desire - show me a healthy male who isn't at least somewhat sexually aroused by a healthy 15 year old girl.
71 posted on 06/11/2003 6:28:58 AM PDT by -YYZ-
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To: William Terrell
from the article:
Homosexual activists have long argued that gender identity disorder should not be assumed to be abnormal.

The problem (for them) is that GID is easily treatable and has a pretty good cure rate. If it's not a mental illness why can it be cured?

you->My nomination for the Most Conflicted Statement of the year. Wonder what the reaction of any of these Honorable Doctors would be if they barged in and found "Uncle" Ben diddling their little boy, or little girl?

Why, they'd join in of course. Sexual deviants are as sexual deviants do. (the truth of the matter is that they probably sponsored the activity as "Indeed, they have argued that many sexually molested children later look back on their experience as positive" and they didn't want their children to miss out.)

I agree with scientology in one and only one area. (most) Psychiatrists are not to be trusted. (I guess even a broken clock is right twice a day)

72 posted on 06/11/2003 6:31:34 AM PDT by John O (God Save America (Please))
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To: jwalsh07
And other psychiatrists have written, again in scientific journals, that if children can be forced to go to church, why should 'consent' be the defining moral issue when it comes to sex?" she said.

I wonder what Linda Nicolosi's "disorder" is. Whatever it is, it is a threat to the public square.

73 posted on 06/11/2003 6:32:28 AM PDT by Torie
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To: kattracks
In 1973, the American Psychiatric Association removed homosexuality from its list of disorders.
74 posted on 06/11/2003 6:35:33 AM PDT by jgrubbs
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To: maxwell
"WTF? Those are some "learned journal articles" that I would like to see."

Well, sure. Often a molested child or teenager responds maladaptively to the trauma of molestation, building a structure of defenses that rests on the premise that he is "gay" and this is a good thing to be. He *has* to maintain that the molestation was a positive experience, or the whole house of cards comes tumbling down.

If he ever realized that his so-called "sexual orientation" wsa nothing more than a maladaptive response to a terrible trauma, what would he be? Just somebody who had something terrible done to him and let it lead him into disordered sexual behavior.

As long as he can keep his defenses in place, he's a member of a "community," of a self-anointed elite, a morally superior soldier in the front lines of the war against repression and bigotry--I mean, "everybody knows" that "gays" are more sensitive, artistic, creative, intelligent, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

Who would want to give all that up just to be a poor schmuck who suffers from same-sex attraction disorder because he was molested?

It's not surprising that many whose entire self-image centers on their homosexual behavior would in memory recast the molestation that precipitated their disorder as an "awakening," a "learning experience," as the first time they "knew what they were" and knew there were others "like them."

Nor, sadly, is it surprising that many of the nutbars who make up the APA would buy into that crap.

But "scientific journals?" Yeah, like Hustler Magazine is a religious tract.
75 posted on 06/11/2003 6:41:40 AM PDT by dsc ("Holistic" is only part of a word.)
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To: kattracks; .45MAN; AKA Elena; al_c; american colleen; Angelus Errare; Antoninus; aposiopetic; ...
How much longer, Oh Lord?!?
76 posted on 06/11/2003 6:54:02 AM PDT by Polycarp (Free Republic: Where Apatheism meets "Conservatism.")
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To: Torie
And other psychiatrists have written, again in scientific journals, that if children can be forced to go to church, why should 'consent' be the defining moral issue when it comes to sex?" she said.

I wonder what Linda Nicolosi's "disorder" is. Whatever it is, it is a threat to the public square.

This article reads like Nicolosi supports removing these "mental illnesses", but she also authored "A Parent's Guide to Preventing Homosexuality" I would think she would be against this. Here is a Web site with more information about her and links to the National Association of Research and Therapy of Homosexuality website

http://www.gospelcom.net/cgi-ivpress/author.pl/author_id=1313

77 posted on 06/11/2003 7:01:31 AM PDT by jgrubbs
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To: gcraig
"And other psychiatrists have written, again in scientific journals, that if children can be forced to go to church, why should 'consent' be the defining moral issue when it comes to sex?" she said."

Ummm...because listening to religious speech is in no way comparable to having sexual acts perpetrated on one's body?

Is she really that stupid? Or does she just think her audience is that stupid?

She needs to try a simple thought experiment. Offer her the choice of somebody unattractive forcing her to perform sexual acts she doesn't like, or of listening to some religious speech for an hour.

That one is really a no-brainer.
78 posted on 06/11/2003 7:04:01 AM PDT by dsc ("Holistic" is only part of a word.)
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To: maxwell
"I reminded myself that the age-of-consent issue is one that will preclude the legalization of pedophilia, as far as the law is concerned. At least for a while."

But for how long? England, I'm sure you know, just lowered the age of consent for buggering a boy from 18 to 16.
79 posted on 06/11/2003 7:07:42 AM PDT by dsc ("Holistic" is only part of a word.)
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To: -YYZ-
show me a healthy male who isn't at least somewhat sexually aroused by a healthy 15 year old girl.

This is why I supervise the activities of my almost-15-year-old daughter

80 posted on 06/11/2003 7:13:05 AM PDT by SauronOfMordor (Java/C++/Unix/Web Developer looking for next gig)
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To: SauronOfMordor
"The main targets of gay pedophiles are young teens, rather than pre-adolescants."

I think it's important to keep clear that attraction to teens is a typical symptom of same-sex attraction disorder and not a separate disorder.

This is one of the dirty little truths about SSAD that make it look dangerous and unattractive, so activists try to deny it. One way they do that is to refer to any underage victim as a "child" and attribute such offenses to pedophilia and not SSAD.

The sad fact is that where there are SSAD sufferers, teen boys are at risk, and it has nothing to do with pedophilia (which is an attraction to the pre-pubescent).
81 posted on 06/11/2003 7:15:14 AM PDT by dsc
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To: kattracks
"And other psychiatrists have written, again in scientific journals, that if children can be forced to go to church, why should 'consent' be the defining moral issue when it comes to sex?" she said.

So if child of 3 forced to eat peas and to go to sleep then can be force raped too? Why should Russia follow West, again?

82 posted on 06/11/2003 7:15:35 AM PDT by RussianConservative (Hristos: the Light of the World)
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To: kattracks
This is shocking - because in paraphilias, there is probably actual brain damage or brain abnormalities contributing to disordered attraction and/or an inability to empathise.

Sexual attraction to pre-pubertal children is a manifestation of an abnormal mind.
83 posted on 06/11/2003 7:16:24 AM PDT by SarahW
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To: SauronOfMordor
"This is why I supervise the activities of my almost-15-year-old daughter"

Why, because of pervs like me? (LOL)

Or you agree that this a normal attraction for males in general? (And btw, I don't disagree with the social unacceptability of relationships between grown men and adolescent girls - even if their bodies are fairly mature, they are not socially or intellectually mature. Maybe in another time it was normal to marry girls off at 14 or 15, but that time is not now, not here).
84 posted on 06/11/2003 7:20:21 AM PDT by -YYZ-
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To: kattracks
Indeed, they have argued that many sexually molested children later look back on their experience as positive, Nicolosi said.

"And other psychiatrists have written, again in scientific journals, that if children can be forced to go to church, why should 'consent' be the defining moral issue when it comes to sex?" she said.

This person is truly INSANE. Equating church attendence with pedophilia is an abomination.

85 posted on 06/11/2003 7:21:36 AM PDT by Centurion2000 (We are crushing our enemies, seeing him driven before us and hearing the lamentations of the liberal)
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To: kattracks
This should make our Libertarian friends cheer.
86 posted on 06/11/2003 7:23:15 AM PDT by BOOTSTICK
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To: Torie
Actually she seems to be one of the good guys, pointing out the crap some sickos have written. She should have sourced it, though.
87 posted on 06/11/2003 7:36:59 AM PDT by nina0113 (I didn't steal that line, I liberated it)
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To: SauronOfMordor
Consider the madness that has the US considering that a young person does not have the maturity to drink alcohol responsibly until 21, yet is mature enough to cast a vote for President at 18, and is mature enough to have sex which involves risk of pregnancy or a fatal disease at an even younger age

I agree that this is nuts. And think that half of those kids sent to Iraq couldn't legally drink a beer in celebration when they get home!

My view is that we need to pick a reasonable age when adulthood is declared - I like the idea that it's 17 or 18 (ie. out of high school) and that's when the drinking, marriage, military service, sex, etc. can begin. I don't like the inconsistencies of the laws right now.

LQ

88 posted on 06/11/2003 7:41:56 AM PDT by LizardQueen
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To: BOOTSTICK
This should make our Libertarian friends cheer.

Are you another of the anti-libertarian trolls who labels them all as pedophiles, or what?

LQ

89 posted on 06/11/2003 7:42:45 AM PDT by LizardQueen
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To: LizardQueen
Try reading the Libertarian party platform adopted april, 2000, then read the chapter "Children and families", then read where it says ;" Children are also individuals, with individual rights, some children may seek to be emancipated from their parents, and those who do, should be allowed to do so, as long as they accept the responsabilities of adulthood.Errrr case closed!
90 posted on 06/11/2003 7:57:13 AM PDT by BOOTSTICK
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To: dsc
"Who would want to give all that up just to be a poor schmuck who suffers from same-sex attraction disorder because he was molested."

Here be truth.
91 posted on 06/11/2003 8:03:46 AM PDT by headsonpikes
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To: LizardQueen
I've been thinking much the same lately regarding age of majority.
92 posted on 06/11/2003 8:26:50 AM PDT by been called a cynic
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To: Aquinasfan
I was molested as a child by a stranger in our home. Any tips for protecting my two girls? I never leave them alone with any male.

I'll answer your last question, first.. Being careful about leaving the girls, or a boy, alone with a woman, has been good info in the past, however, today that isn't any less threatening, but it's a fair start. However my niece is still undergoing withdrawals from learning that a gym teacher has been abusing her daughters' friends for 2 years.
Regarding your concern about what to do to protect your kids and keep them safe.. I treat the gay problem much the same way I teach them the most basic and obvious everyday threats. I teach the kids not to touch a hot stove, look both ways before crossing the street, don't eat anything given to you from strangers, and never ever trust a queer!!
BTW, I tell them to stay away from anyone that gives them a queezy, creepy, or just plain bad feeling..so that covers most liberals as well.. :-)

93 posted on 06/11/2003 8:42:01 AM PDT by carlo3b (http://www.CookingWithCarlo.com)
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If I imagine a Saudi iman reading an article like this
I begin to understand their loathing of our culture.
94 posted on 06/11/2003 8:48:23 AM PDT by DeepDish
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To: kattracks
Well, I see the lunatic left is making their move to condone pedophilia...
95 posted on 06/11/2003 9:01:44 AM PDT by Teetop (Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first.)
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To: Teetop
"Well, I see the lunatic left is making their move to condone pedophilia..."

Removing it as a mental illness is NOT condoning it, any more than saying murderers are not necessarily mentally ill. If you have a victim, it's still a crime.

96 posted on 06/11/2003 9:04:48 AM PDT by Qwerty
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To: Polycarp
"How much longer, Oh Lord?!?"

You've got a bit of a flair for the dramatic.

Have a donut or something while you wait.

97 posted on 06/11/2003 9:07:23 AM PDT by Qwerty
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To: Smile-n-Win
Wow, you said it before I could.

The lunatics are running the asylum...

98 posted on 06/11/2003 9:08:13 AM PDT by Im Your Huckleberry
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To: mongrel
Yes, many psychologists and psychiatrists are suffering from mental disorders themselves.
Usually Bipolar(manic depressive) or Schizophrenia.

Brings us to the corallory: It takes a nut to know a nut.
As well as: It takes a monster to know a monster.
And so on and such.
99 posted on 06/11/2003 9:16:26 AM PDT by Darksheare (Nox aeternus en pax.)
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To: mongrel
Exactly. Inmates are now running asylum, for 40 years or so now. Old medical textbooks are the best, if you can find them, and haven't been purged from the libraries in your area.
100 posted on 06/11/2003 9:22:21 AM PDT by Freedom4US
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