Powell's call to fight Hamas

The Age ^ | June 13, 2003 | Staff

[fightinJAG]

Powell's call to fight Hamas June 13, 2003

US Secretary of State Colin Powell urged the world community today to fight radical Palestinian groups like Hamas, which claimed responsibility for the suicide attack that killed more than a dozen people in Jerusalem yesterday.

"I've been on the phone most of the morning talking to the leaders in the region, to encourage them to come down hard on Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ) and the other terrorist organisations that are determined to deny us this latest opportunity for peace," Powell told an economic conference here.

"(These groups) are determined to deny the Palestinian people the opportunity to have their own homeland, ... determined to use terror to destroy the promise that was put before the world last week in Aqaba.

"We are just as determined to not let that happen, and we are encouraging the Palestinian leadership, we are encouraging the Israeli leadership, to act with determination, to punch through this wave of violence, to make sure that it does not stop us, so that we can continue moving forward on the roadmap to peace."

Later, he told reporters it is "incumbent on every nation around the world to speak out and put the hammer down on Hamas and the PIJ, and stop funding them, stop allowing any resources to go to them".

[DannyTN]

"we are encouraging the Israeli leadership, to act with determination, to punch through this wave of violence"

Would have liked it better if it said "to punch out this wave of Hamas violence", before returning to the peace process.

[Excuse_My_Bellicosity]

These guys are losing me. Bush and Powell were cursing Israel yesterday for going after Hamas leaders. What's Israel supposed to do, use harsh language?

[Petronski]

Clever triangulation.

[Bobby777]

well, I'll be darned ... those darn aliens have come down and switched Colin Powell with a pod ...

this can't be the former appeaser ... he's done better the last few months ... I hope it's not all for show, but that he's awakened to the reality of ME terror ...

[Justice]

Cool...now all the administration's energy is going toward weeding out the ultra-Pallies.

This should take about 3-4 weeks.

[DoughtyOne]

Colin, what the hell took you so long? This is the exact policy that should have been put in play on Inauguration day January 2001. The terrorist groups are 'Peace Enemy' number one. Telling Israel they should punch right on through them is exactly right. Exterminate the idiots, negotiate fairly with whoever is left over.

This is the only policy that will every see the Roadmap followed. I salute you, although you drug your feet far too friggen long fella.

[DoughtyOne]

When Powell walked out of the UN yesterday with Kofi Annan, neither of them damned Israel. Instead the condemned the latest bombing of the bus and didn't even mention the retaliation.

Bush damned the bus bombing in no uncertain terms and failed to damn Israel too.

This is the first time they have adopted this policy and I salute them for it.

If you heard a derogitory remark about Israel I sure missed it. I think they are coming around. Otherwise I join you in your comments.

[PoorMuttly]

"Hammerdown," Mr. Secretary.

[DoughtyOne]

I think you meant the Uber Palies and the Uber Arabs. ;-)

[Lent]

"I've been on the phone most of the morning talking to the leaders in the region"

The region being uhmm, their Arab brethren? Really well spent dime there Powell.

[Cachelot]

this can't be the former appeaser ... he's done better the last few months

Someone just gave his leash a sharp yank ;).

[Madame Dufarge]

Yes.

[Howlin]

Bush didn't open his mouth today.

[Howlin]

He called Abbas and told he that he CAN do something to stop them.

[Robert_Paulson2]

What makes you think we will do anything against arafat's hordes?

I will believe it, when I see arafats head on a pike... and not until. Any perceivedtolerance of Israel's right to defend herself from arafat, fatah, hamas et.al., is NON existant in the long term.

When we land marines on the south end of Gaza to keep the bad guys from escaping, whilst Israel eradicates the bad guys in a pincer movement... to the gags, screams and saber rattling of the arabs, russians and chinese, and their puppets....

then I will believe.
until then "help thou mine unbelief!" is a bit more honest.

[Yardstick]

Clever triangulation.

This looks like a new angle to me. They're increasing the resolution a bit, dividing the palestinian side of the equation from just "palestinians" into "good palestinians" and "bad palestinians (and other bad arab elements)". This is clever, since it allows forceful action to be taken against the bad elements while evading the accusation that such actions are aimed at the group, "palestinians", as a whole.

[winner3000]

It's Hammer time!

[DoughtyOne]

Wed Jun 11, 6:43 PM ET

Add Politics - AFP to My Yahoo!

WASHINGTON (AFP) - US Secretary of State Colin Powell (news - web sites) and UN Secretary General Kofi Annan (news - web sites) urged Israel and the Palestinians to remain committed to the peace process despite recent violence.

"This is the time for us to remain steadfast, to continue moving down the path that was laid out at Aqaba last week by the leaders who were assembled," Powell told reporters, referring to the three-way summit between US President George W. Bush (news - web sites), Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon (news - web sites) and
Palestinian prime minister Mahmud Abbas.

He urged all nations of the world to condemn wanton acts of terrorism which take innocent lives.

The comments followed a new suicide bombing in Jerusalem that left at least 16 people dead.

In response, Israel launched helicopter attacks into the Gaza Strip (news - web sites) that, according to Palestinian sources, left at least nine people dead.

Annan, who called the suicide bombing "utterly reprehensible" urged Israeli and Palestinian leaders to stay the course set in Aqaba.

"We thought finally we were going to move forward, and I hope the leaders will not be deterred by these violent acts," said the UN secretary general.
 

The is the Yahoo AP report of Powell's comment to which I refered yesterday.  Although the information presented is accurate, a false impression was created.

Powell's first and most strident comments addressed the senseless defenseless bus bombing, (paraphrasing his comments).  It wasn't until toward the end of his remarks that Powell encouraged both sides to keep working toward peace, even then it was more of an afterthought to his main remarks.

Annan's comments urged both sides to please keep working toward peace, but his comments by no means implicated that Israel was wrong to do what it had done.

This was the best anti-terrorist after incident comments I'd seen from these men, and I hoped it signaled a new direction.

Terrorism is the enemy of civilized society.  Trashing Israel in any way for responding to it with a hammer approach is self-defeatist.  It undermines them, it's undermines our policies toward terrorism, and it undermines all of society which cannot countenance terrorism under ANY circumstances.

I might add, Bush's comments were equally as good along the same lines.  I really appreciate that, from Bush and Powell.

[DoughtyOne]

Well I would never ask him to refrain from making comments, but if he is inclined to ask Israel to show restraint or condemn them for damaging prospects for peace by defending themselves, it's just as well that he does.

I am hopeful that he and Powell have adopted a new more realistic approach to Israel combating terrorism. If so, it's long over due, but I still salute them for it.

[Howlin]

I think that's exactly why he didn't say a word about it today.

[Courier]

Powell said what he always says.

Tragic but should not derail the Peace Process and Road Map.

That is a direct slap at the Israeli dead.

The previous day, when Israel attempted to kill the Hamas bastard, Powell implied that this might set back the Peace Process.

In both events, Israel was on the receiving end of a US slap. That Hamas was also criticized is BS. The entire Palestinian entity is riddled with terrorism.

[wretchard]

Well of course. President Bush set up the strategic environment to fight the radical Pallies. The PA isn't a local organization; it isn't even elected. It's a creation of the Arab world funded by Europe.

Phase 2 is to put isolate the radicals and force the Arab world to appoint someone halfway pliable. Hence, the easing out of Arafat in favor of Abbas. Now, the idea is to isolate Hamas. Abbas, in his evil little heart wants Hamas and Arafat gone. Why? They are his rivals. But he's too chicken hearted to take them on. So he'll let Ariel Sharon kill the Hamas people, tut-tutting for effect. But inwardly, he's pleased as punch.

And people still think President Bush is stupid.

[Robert_Paulson2]

Rice: Israel and Palestinian Authority must work as partners

Rice was asked about Bush's rebuke of Israel for its missile attack on a Hamas leader days after a weekend attack by Hamas and other militants on four Israeli soldiers. Specifically, she was asked how the United States can ask Israel to sit still if the new Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abbas, won't arrest terrorists or dismantle the terror structure.

The Palestinian leadership, she said, is trying to strengthen security services that "have not been devoted to fighting terror" and have even abetted it in the past.

And Israel, she said, must "recognize consequences" from the way it battles terrorism.

---

the above is all from another article earlier today...
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/927932/posts?page=2

---

I am sorry to say, D-1, that this administration is but a day or two from choking off Israel's response and blaming JOOS for causing these problems by not moving the peace process along faster... dying more quickly and evacuating the land as fast as the arabs can blow up whatever joos are left.

Administration officials just don't understand it: "Why can't they just die... dead joos and land for peace! THEY want us to answer for a moment the key moral question at the forefront here 'What would hitler do??? Neville Chamberlin???'"

Listening to Condi and presidential spokesmen for the last year or two, you might be led to believe that Israel's refusal to do the above (die like good joos and give up their land to arab terrorists imported from saudi arabia, egypt, Iran and Iraq, or Syria, or 25 other islamic nations) is the REAL cause for arab terrorism in the world!

Everytime I hear the "islam is peace" crap I want to puke. Bush is either very deceived or being disingenuous. The lie about "land for peace" has never worked either. Neither does lying down to die like a good jew instead of fighting back till your enemies are vanquished.

Bush steps on Israel EVERY TIME they move in to take out the bad guys... he usually has the good graces to wait a week to ten days after a busload of them are incinerated...

But consider... if Israel wipes out the problem altogether, there won't be any pseudo "palestinians" left alive to take possession of the "kill all joos" palestinian state he wants to create... TWO states is HIS delusion, not mine.

I give it till tuesday of next week before the bush administration's "must show restraint on both sides" propaganda starts up again... but perhaps I will be wrong and administration officials will link the "cycle of terror" to BOTH sides again before Sunday night...

[RightWhale]

punch through this wave of violence

Come down hard. If the Palestinians can't or won't, they need to step aside and watch, from a safe distance.

This is Powell? Is he back in the Army?

[Petronski]

Yes, those are the other two points of the triangle I had in mind.

[blam]

"When we land marines on the south end of Gaza to keep the bad guys from escaping, whilst Israel eradicates the bad guys in a pincer movement... to the gags, screams and saber rattling of the arabs, russians and chinese, and their puppets.... "

Nope, not one US soldier. The IDF is more than capable of taking care of this problem...if allowed to.

[Robert_Paulson2]

Notice he expressly left out ISRAEL in his request to punch out hamas?

He compromised here for the sake of the Arab Street as that is where his State Department's sympathies lie...

Israel, needs only OUR go ahead to do it right and finish off hamas in 6 weeks or less. Sadly this would 'humiliate" the islamic pan arab world... and force them back into their subjugative state, like the 7th century barbarians they are...

So his calling on arabs to crush hamas... is like asking an army of Nevada legal hookers to stop the hookers on state street in chicago...

phoney...

[RightWhale]

Egypt needs to stay out.

[Robert_Paulson2]

Won't happen. (letting israel do the "right thing,"that is.)

Bush, Condi and the arabists at State, will never let the pan arab world face the reality of a victorious and crushingly powerful Israel, if it is within their power to stop it.

I agree we should green light them.
I also think we should support them in any way we can.
and do so publicly.

This we should do, if only as demonstrating our commitment and solidarity with Israel in the global war on terrororists (who 98 percent of the time... are pan arab islamic radicals).

[Robert_Paulson2]

which was why I think it might be good to put a USA buffer at the south end of Gaza... btw...

[RightWhale]

Or in Egypt. By invitation, of course.

[Robert_Paulson2]

Of course.

[DoughtyOne]

I have been very critical of the Bush, Powell, Rice reaction to terrorism in the past. Yesterday I noted Bush and Powell's speaches personally. I watched. This report doesn't do right by either of them.

In light of this I am not convinced that Condi Rice's comments are given in context with the full weight of her condemnations of terrorism and it's perps present.

Look, if I find that this is an accurate report, I'll join you.

I think Israel should kill every single person who keeps making terrorist threats against it, if he has to tromple Lebanon to get to Syria to do it. The Hezbalah loud mouths should be silenced once and for all. If you speak for them, you're dead. Same thing with all the other terrorist organizations.

If a head of state is found to be paying these people, Israel should out them and give them fair warning to stop it or else. If they don't stop, I'd consider it an act of war and act accordingly.

If Bush, Powell or Rice can distinguish between Israel's right to exist and the wrongness of terrorism, so be it. I will be on their case pronto.

[DoughtyOne]

Guys, I have five words for you. No US troop involvement. EVER!!!!!!

5,000 year conflict. Get it? ;-)

[DoughtyOne]

  I developed this specifically for Israel.  You're welcome to use it whenever you like.

[Robert_Paulson2]

that was funny lent. roflmao... I got a picture from it in my head, couldn't stop grinning.

---

I can just see some reporter saying that to CP in a news conference... with a closeup of powell's face, as he says....

absolutely nothing.

---

my question:
do YOU think Powell believes these calls could actually produce anything but a few more shiploads of terrorist "palestinian" imported fighters and weapons from the key players in the region?

I know what I believe. I am curious... does powell actually dream that his phone calls would turn these towel heads around in their resolve to support the eradication of jews, and eventually all Christians, hindus and buddhists who don't convert and submit to their delusion?

I would love to see the question posed JUST as you typed it... and a closeup kodachrome of the priceless "kodak moment".

[Lent]

He called Abbas and told he that he CAN do something to stop them.

I'm sure that was a useful phone call.

[Robert_Paulson2]

"NO, ARIEL... the pedal on the right... push hard... NOW.....":

[Robert_Paulson2]

I am hoping YOU are right.

[DoughtyOne]

Well, that's one take. Look, I think of this as more than two sides. You have Israel, then you have the Palestinains, then you have the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th... sides who are all terrorists. I'm not convinced that Abu Mazen doesn't want peace. I am very convinced that the other groups obviously don't.

My point is that I see Sharon conducting his anti-terrorism campaign while still negotiating with Abu Mazen. If Abu Mazen refuses to, then you are of course right.

In that case you may be right for several reasons. Mazen may in fact support terrorism though the back door. There is a chance that he would like to instigate peace, but he cannot control the terrorists. Then again he may in fact fear for his life if he were to try to hard for peace and offend some hardliners on his own side. Don't forget Sadat or Begin.

I would like to see Israel persue peace with Mazen as far as it will take them, if he's willing, while blistering the terrorist groups at the same time. After all, if Mazen truly wants peace, Sharon would be doing it for him too.

If not we'll know in time and we can tell Mazen to go kiss Arafat's a--.

[Mr. Mojo]

"I've been on the phone most of the morning talking to the leaders in the region, to encourage them to come down hard on Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ)

Powell forgot to mention Fatah....(no surprise).

And does he honestly believe the "leaders in the region" will "come down hard" on the very terrorist orgs they finance?

[DoughtyOne]

What bothers me is that your question and many others are so fundamental and obvious, yet they seem overlooked every step of the way.

[Mr. Mojo]

The administration should know that the chance of a successfully negotiated settlement between the parties involved is precisely zero. Not slim, but ZERO. Jihadists are not people who'll change their ways after listening to reason. Many people (including those in the current administration) seem to forget that we're in a war to the death with these fanatics (including their state sponsors), and that the only way to deal with the situation is to kill every last one of them. There's no other way.

[Bobby777]

I do believe you are correct! LOL ...

[DoughtyOne]

I do agree that every person bent on Israel's destruction will have to be eliminated or change their mind before peace can be achieved. You start whacking enough numbers of them and they'll get true religion. Until then it's open season and good hunting.

[Mr. Mojo]

I do agree that every person bent on Israel's destruction will have to be eliminated....

Not just Israel's destruction, but ours as well. Israel is merely a bit more conveniently located for them. WE are the big prize.

[joesnuffy]

when arafat is hanging from a lamp post in downtown Jerusalem..then I will believe

[Excuse_My_Bellicosity]

Bush back-pedalled after he got smacked on the floor of Congress:

Bush Under Fire in Congress for Criticizing Israel

WASHINGTON, June 11 Supporters of Israel in and out of Congress assailed President Bush (news - web sites) today for criticizing Israeli attacks on Palestinian militant groups as the administration worked to protect its Middle East peace initiative from a new cycle of violence.

On a day of new attacks and counterattacks by Israeli and Palestinian militant forces, diplomats said there was concern in the administration that without dramatic improvement of some kind, the peace initiative known as the road map could founder.

A day after he criticized Israel for its attempt to kill a militant Palestinian leader, Mr. Bush today denounced a suicide bomb attack on a bus in Jerusalem that killed 16 people and wounded more than 100.

"I strongly condemn the killings," he said, "and I urge and call upon all of the free world, nations which love peace, to not only condemn the killings, but to use every ounce of their power to prevent them from happening in the future."

At a hearing of the House International Relations Committee, Representative Gary L. Ackerman, said that Mr. Bush's rebuke might lead his critics "to think of the word hypocrisy."

"How can we take certain actions in response to terrorism, and then tell others that when they do the same exact thing that it is not helpful?" Mr. Ackerman, a New York Democrat, said during questioning of William J. Burns, the State Department's senior diplomat for Middle Eastern affairs.

The influential pro-Israel lobbying group, the American-Israel Public Affairs Committee, known as Aipac, issued a rare criticism of Mr. Bush, if only obliquely. Israel, it said, "will and must take the responsibility to fight terrorist organizations" and "it should be the policy of the U.S. to support" such actions.

The bombing today was an apparent retaliation for Israel's attempt to kill Dr. Abdel Aziz Rantisi, a top leader of Hamas, on Tuesday. It happened at about the same time as an Israeli missile attack in Gaza.

Despite the violence, senior administration officials said that the peace initiative was still alive.

Secretary of State Colin L. Powell and Kofi Annan (news - web sites), the United Nations (news - web sites) secretary general met and urged calm.

"There are those who do not wish to see the Palestinian people achieve a state living side by side in peace with Israel," Mr. Powell said. He called on Israel, the Palestinians and the Arab nations in the region to "remain steadfast, to continue moving down the path that was laid out at Aqaba last week by the leaders who were assembled."

Mr. Powell was referring to a summit meeting in Jordan last week attended by Mr. Bush, Prime Minister Ariel Sharon (news - web sites) of Israel and the Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abbas.

Mr. Annan called on the Israelis and Palestinians to "stay the course."

But there was an unusual quality to the statements given the inflamed situation. If there was a new wrinkle to the day's developments, it was the criticism directed at Mr. Bush for his rebuke of the Israeli government on Tuesday.

Reflecting dismay that a new round of violence might undermine the spirit achieved in Aqaba and Sharm el Sheik, Mr. Bush said the attack on the Hamas leader would not help Israel's security. His statement drew fire from those saying that Israel had carried out the attacks to defend itself, just as the United States has done.

Representative Robert Wexler, a Florida Democrat, said Israel's use of military force to protect itself against "a ticking time bomb factory" was "100 percent justified."

Representative Tom Lantos of California, the ranking Democrat on the International Relations Committee, defended Israel's right to protect itself, saying that the Palestinian Authority (news - web sites) under Mr. Abbas was unable to do the job. If the Palestinians will not disarm terrorists, "then Israel clearly will do so," he said.

"We would do so," he continued. "Any self-respecting society will do so. People in government have to defend their citizens."

Appearing before the committee, Mr. Burns, the assistant secretary of state for Near Eastern affairs, acknowledged under sharp questioning from Democrats that Mr. Abbas would probably have to take forceful steps to disarm and dismantle terrorist groups if the peace initiative were to succeed. "I believe he is committed to doing the hard things that are going to be required to make that possible," Mr. Burns said.

But a diplomat in touch with the administration said that the situation was so perilous that Mr. Abbas could be ousted from power if the cycle of violence did not abate. He said that there would be a meeting in Europe later this week of envoys focusing on the Middle East.

The envoys from the United States, the European Union (news - web sites), the United Nations and Russia are to prepare for a higher-level meeting attended by Secretary Powell in Jordan on June 22. The group, known as the quartet, devised the step-by-step plan to end violence and establish a Palestinian state in three years. The plan was endorsed by the Palestinians and, in a qualified manner, by Israel last week.

Despite the hopeful words from many sides, the fast-changing situation was putting new pressure on Mr. Bush to get more involved in saving the peace negotiations.

On one hand, Israel sought today to dispute the American analysis that led the Bush administration to condemn the attack on the Hamas leader. Israeli officials said that far from being a mere political spokesman for Hamas, Dr. Rantisi was part of a faction within Hamas that advocated attacks on Israel as a means to destroy Mr. Abbas, who is also known as Abu Mazen.

"There has been an ongoing debate within leadership circles in Hamas over the last few days about how to approach Abu Mazen," an Israeli official said. "One faction has said we have to fight against Abu Mazen and intensify terrorism. This faction lies outside Hamas itself in Damascus, Jordan and elsewhere. Rantisi is one of their most vocal forces."

But other diplomats said the Israelis had to know that the attack would provoke a new cycle of violence and make it impossible for Mr. Abbas to keep what little support he has among Palestinians.

[DoughtyOne]

Thank you for that post. So that's why he got his act together yesterday. Good. Maybe somebody was able to talk some sense into him on this issue. It's about time.

One thing that I noticed as he began to speak, he ruminated for about one half to one minute before he very slowly and carefully chose his words. It was quite obvious this was a man who was not throwing out just any comments.