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Home-schooling standoff (MA Liberals try to get state custody for 'abused' home-schooled kids)
Metrowest Daily ^ | 6/13/03 | Beecher

Posted on 06/13/2003 12:26:29 PM PDT by pabianice

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The Liberals will never, ever give up trying to keep your kids in the public school cesspool (they send their own kids to private school... hello, Ted Kennedy? Hello, John Kerry?...)
1 posted on 06/13/2003 12:26:30 PM PDT by pabianice
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To: pabianice
H O W T O C O N T A C T U S

Massachusetts Department of Social Services

Central Office

24 Farnsworth Street

Boston, Massachusetts 02210

(617) 748-2000

Harry Spence, Commissioner

The Department of Social Services (DSS) has 29 Area Offices across Massachusetts.

2 posted on 06/13/2003 12:30:14 PM PDT by pabianice
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Comment #3 Removed by Moderator

To: pabianice
"We have legal custody of the children and we will do with them as we see fit," DSS worker Susan Etscovitz told the Bryants in their Gale Street home. "They are minors and they do what we tell them to do."

Both sides agree that the children are in no way abused mentally, physically, sexually or emotionally, but legal custody of the children was taken from Kim and George Bryant in December 2001. The children will remain under the legal custody of DSS until their 16th birthdays.

The parents have been ruled as unfit because they did not file educational plans or determine a grading system for the children, two criteria of Waltham Public School's home schooling policy.

This is tyranny!

4 posted on 06/13/2003 12:32:35 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: pabianice
When an opponent declares, 'I will not come over to your side, 'I calmly say, 'Your child belongs to us already...What are you? You will pass on. Your decendants, however, now stand in the new camp. In a short time they will know nothing but this new community.

- Adolf Hitler
5 posted on 06/13/2003 12:33:30 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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Just one of the numerous reasons I permanently moved out of the People's Socialist RepubliK of Taxachusetts.

American liberty might have been born there, but now the only place you'll see it in Mass is under a glass in a museum.

6 posted on 06/13/2003 12:35:38 PM PDT by freeeee
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To: pabianice; Amelia; ianincali; FLAMING DEATH; Lady Eileen; ReagansShinyHair; No More Gore Anymore; ..
Ping
7 posted on 06/13/2003 12:36:39 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: the gillman@blacklagoon.com
My thoughts EXACTLY.
8 posted on 06/13/2003 12:37:36 PM PDT by AAABEST
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To: pabianice
"We do not believe in assessing our children based on a number or letter. Their education process is their personal intellectual property," said Bryant.

Sounds like a nutcase to me. Why wouldn't a homeschooling parent test their kids? Something fishy going on here. Just what is it that these kids KNOW that can't be measured by a test? Furthermore, why should these kids be excemt from testing? Why must they be the exception to the rule?

9 posted on 06/13/2003 12:37:56 PM PDT by nmh
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To: pabianice
Both sides agree that the children are in no way abused mentally, physically, sexually or emotionally, but legal custody of the children was taken from Kim and George Bryant in December 2001.

Now that the State has custody, I would expect the mental, physical, sexual, and emotion abuse to begin real soon. It's for the Children.

10 posted on 06/13/2003 12:39:49 PM PDT by ClearCase_guy
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To: pabianice
Reading this has made me so angry my heart is pounding.
11 posted on 06/13/2003 12:39:51 PM PDT by Bahbah
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To: nmh
If you think the state has a right to know what is going on in your kids head, then you have succombed to the mind-numbing of the left.

It is one thing to willingly choose to have the state look after your kids' education.

It is true tyranny for the state to demand such control.
12 posted on 06/13/2003 12:40:40 PM PDT by Notwithstanding
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: pabianice
We have legal custody of the children

The state has custody of all children in the Fourier commune of Mass. Why don't they simply remove all children at birth and take them to the state nursery?

14 posted on 06/13/2003 12:41:43 PM PDT by RightWhale (gazing at shadows)
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To: nmh
why should these kids be excemt from testing?

Yeah!! Standardized tests might help them learn to spell! What do you think?

Seriously, the parents are fighting for a principle. By what law does the State have final say over the education of children? Don't the parents matter?

15 posted on 06/13/2003 12:41:48 PM PDT by ClearCase_guy
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To: nmh
These folks sure do look like nutballs.


16 posted on 06/13/2003 12:42:02 PM PDT by Notwithstanding
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To: nmh
Why must they be the exception to the rule?

Because the Stat has no place demanding testing on free citizens. The rule must be abolished.

It is a little thing we call self determination, a Liberty thing.

17 posted on 06/13/2003 12:42:04 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: pabianice
George Bryant said he was arrested six years ago, after not attending a meeting that the city contends he was summoned to.

OK let me get this straight, we're arresting people for such high crimes as missing meetings.

WTF?!

>8/

18 posted on 06/13/2003 12:42:10 PM PDT by AAABEST
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To: nmh
Why must they be stamped out copies of what some bugeyed socialist monster says they should be?

This is Massachusetts, land of middle school fistf**king classes.

The question is, what the heck are they doing living in that cesspool?
19 posted on 06/13/2003 12:44:09 PM PDT by the gillman@blacklagoon.com
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To: AAABEST
city contends he was summoned to

He was summoned by the CITY and the School!

King George....is that you?

20 posted on 06/13/2003 12:45:11 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: nmh
Furthermore, why should these kids be excemt from testing? Why must they be the exception to the rule?

Who gets to set the rules? The state? What if some day they make it a "rule" that parents who teach their children that liberals are evil must give up their children - would that be an acceptable "rule"? Which "rules" would be over the top for you? Or all of them legitimate? Maybe a tax on tea? How about special government stamps for all official business? Those don't sound too bad now do they? Yo, King George, we changed our mind...

The government is poking into areas are not their business, while real crimes are constantly committed. It is kind of like setting speed traps on Interstates - while the side streets are in the hands of rapists, murderers, etc.
21 posted on 06/13/2003 12:45:18 PM PDT by safisoft
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To: Thud
FYI
22 posted on 06/13/2003 12:46:28 PM PDT by Dark Wing
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To: Notwithstanding
"These folks sure do look like nutballs."

Well, Nyssa's a cutie, for sure.
23 posted on 06/13/2003 12:46:57 PM PDT by MineralMan
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To: nmh
"We don't want to take the test. We have taken them before and I don't think they are a fair assessment of what we know," said Nyssa Bryant. "And no one from DSS has ever asked us what we think."

She sounds like a well-spoken young lady for 13 years old. I can imagine what a public-schooled student would say.

"We don wanna take no test. We took em before and they ain't fair."
24 posted on 06/13/2003 12:46:58 PM PDT by Lunatic Fringe (Tip the Pizza guy!)
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To: CyberCowboy777
It is indeed tyranny. It should disturb the hell out of you how blatant it is and how thoroughly and easily it reaches into ever facet of American life.
25 posted on 06/13/2003 12:47:13 PM PDT by thoughtomator (Road Map = Road Kill)
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To: Notwithstanding
OMG!!! Is that a PITBULL in that picture???

I'm amazed the 4 cops that came with DSS didn't riddle it with bullets "for the children".

26 posted on 06/13/2003 12:47:24 PM PDT by freeeee
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Comment #27 Removed by Moderator

To: nmh
Furthermore, why should these kids be excemt from testing? Why must they be the exception to the rule?

What gives the state the right to impose such a rule in the first place?

28 posted on 06/13/2003 12:47:37 PM PDT by Sloth ("I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!" -- Jacobim Mugatu, 'Zoolander')
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To: nmh
There is evidence that government education system is not a safe place for kids nor a place that fosters learning.



Found on the net:



One of the misuses of the words "schooling" and
"education" is the common reference to "compulsory
education." That is a misnomer if there ever was
one. There are no compulsory education laws--laws
which require that all children be educated. As is
commonly known, huge numbers are not educated to any
minimum level, including many who graduate from
high school.
29 posted on 06/13/2003 12:48:17 PM PDT by Notwithstanding
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYatchClub; Snow Bunny; mhking; knighthawk; rintense; adam stevens; MeeknMing; ...
Tyranny Ping


30 posted on 06/13/2003 12:48:17 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: Notwithstanding
To me, they look like completely average people. If I passed those people in the street I probably would barely even register their existence... and I tend to be pretty aware of my surroundings (you gotta be, living in NYC).
31 posted on 06/13/2003 12:50:02 PM PDT by thoughtomator (Road Map = Road Kill)
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To: homeschool mama
Ping
32 posted on 06/13/2003 12:50:25 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: freeeee
Looks like a Wheaton. Probably has such a nervous twitch they ran out of ammo after missing repeatedly:)

33 posted on 06/13/2003 12:50:43 PM PDT by the gillman@blacklagoon.com
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To: safisoft
You'll be glad to know the United States Supreme Court agreed with you in a similar case 32 years ago. the Peoples Republic of Wisconsin threatened Amish parents with all sorts of vile punishments because they deprived their children of the benefits of a government sanctioned education. In Wisconsin v. Yoder, the Supreme Court ruled that the 1st Amendment trumps the Department of Education.
34 posted on 06/13/2003 12:50:55 PM PDT by Mr. Lucky
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To: nmh
Even if you accept that not submitting your children to the test is a crime (which I don't), wouldn't you say that stealing the children qualifies as an 'excessive' fine under the 8th Amendment (or alternately, as a 'cruel' punishment)?
35 posted on 06/13/2003 12:52:44 PM PDT by thoughtomator (Road Map = Road Kill)
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To: Notwithstanding
What on earth looks nutty about this family?
They look like a perfectly normal family.
What don't you like? The dog?
36 posted on 06/13/2003 12:53:06 PM PDT by TaxRelief
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To: pacman50
Ping
37 posted on 06/13/2003 12:53:39 PM PDT by cmsgop (Has anyone seen my Schwab ?)
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To: pabianice
"We have legal custody of the children and we will do with them as we see fit," DSS worker Susan Etscovitz told the Bryants in their Gale Street home. "They are minors and they do what we tell them to do."

Ah! The sweet smell of public education. Last time I checked, I have legal custody of my child; and I will raise him and educate him the way I see fit. Aside from that basic fact, through the involuntary confiscation of my income in the form of taxation for the funding and existance of DSS and public education, I would conclude that I have more of a say than this hitler-wannabie _itch and all her uncaring, communist bureaucrats! Kudos to this family for having the gnads to stand up for principle, freedom, and common sense in parenting.

38 posted on 06/13/2003 12:53:53 PM PDT by BureaucratusMaximus (if we're not going to act like a constitutional republic...lets be the best empire we can be...)
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To: TaxRelief
He is kidding, I believe.
39 posted on 06/13/2003 12:54:20 PM PDT by cmsgop (Has anyone seen my Schwab ?)
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To: the gillman@blacklagoon.com
Let me get this right. DSS had no legal authority to do anything with those kids and the police were there and also said that they had no intention of forcefully taking the children. Right?

Okay, my instructions to the DSS busybody would be this, "I will not discuss the matter with you nor anyone you bring. Please leave my property or I will ask these nice officers to arrest you for trespassing. Good bye and good riddance."
40 posted on 06/13/2003 12:54:26 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Even if the government took all your earnings, you wouldn’t be, in its eyes, a slave.)
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To: pabianice
Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies, The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

- C.S. Lewis
41 posted on 06/13/2003 12:55:15 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: TaxRelief
I think Not was being facetious.
42 posted on 06/13/2003 12:55:22 PM PDT by Sloth ("I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!" -- Jacobim Mugatu, 'Zoolander')
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To: pabianice
Is there a web or email address for DSS and the School?
43 posted on 06/13/2003 12:55:55 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Professional FReeper. Do not attempt.)
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To: TaxRelief; Notwithstanding
He was being sarcastic.
44 posted on 06/13/2003 12:56:53 PM PDT by AAABEST
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To: nmh
Perhaps they parents believe that what they teach their children is their own business. It is not like they could do much worse than the piblic schools anyway.
45 posted on 06/13/2003 12:57:01 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Even if the government took all your earnings, you wouldn’t be, in its eyes, a slave.)
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To: nmh
What do they know that can't be measured by a test?

Some homeschooling families don't learn subjects in the same order that public school children learn them. They'll do a "unit study" and cover a broad range of topics all at once. Some families prefer to go at the child's pace (i.e. don't give them algebra if they don't understand basic math).

If that's the case with this family, the state may jump on a slightly low area and say, "These children need our help!" The children would then be stuck in the public school system wherever the state wanted to put them. Unlike their public school peers who are automatically moved with their class no matter what their grade is.

46 posted on 06/13/2003 12:57:05 PM PDT by Democratic_Machiavelli
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To: Blood of Tyrants
You are polite and a gentleman.(lady?)

I might have had the good manners to send them away, rather than shoot them, but they would have had to race the rotties to the gate.

It's over three hundred yards. :)
47 posted on 06/13/2003 12:57:21 PM PDT by the gillman@blacklagoon.com
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To: Blood of Tyrants
the police were there and also said that they had no intention of forcefully taking the children. Right?

NO, the police we're there to "shame" the parents into making their kids take the test. It's one of those "What will everyone think?" kind of things that help to separate sheeple and cowards from principled people with character and integrity.

48 posted on 06/13/2003 12:58:07 PM PDT by BureaucratusMaximus (if we're not going to act like a constitutional republic...lets be the best empire we can be...)
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To: pabianice
DSS...
The last two letters there fit perfectly. SS.
49 posted on 06/13/2003 12:58:40 PM PDT by Dan from Michigan (When someone tells me 'my way or the highway', I take the highway)
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To: nmh
Furthermore, why should these kids be excemt from testing? Why must they be the exception to the rule?

If you believe the parents have the right to do as they see fit regarding the education of their children, then you have your answer.

50 posted on 06/13/2003 12:59:12 PM PDT by cruiserman
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