Trashing the Constitution

FAME (Foundation for the Advancement of Monetary Education) ^ | 6-16-03 | Edwin Vieira

[Misterioso]

What has government has done to our money and our Constitution? And what can be done? We must return to a full gold standard for this Republic to be saved.

[Henrietta]

bump for later reading

[Misterioso]

· In terms of personal relationships, our monetary system violates the sanctity of contracts, because one does not know what will be the value of future payments. That is, it violates the notion of keeping promises, which is the glue that holds civilization together.

This paragraph describes the effect that is mostly overlooked by opponents of fiat money. The damage goes beyond destruction of the mechanism of production to include the destruction of morality.

[Jason_b]

I prefer to call it a gold coin standard to emphasize that the standard is in the coin (as per Article 1 Section 10 clause 1) and not the paper warehouse receipt. And it is the coin that must be produced for taxes and debts, not substitutes.

"That is, our money has nothing to tie it to reality. It is part of the spiritual world. Today, economists describe money as an “illusion.” "

This I disagree with. What ties our money to reality is that we must compete for it in order to pay property taxes to keep our property. I worry as in times such as these with people losing their jobs, money is harder to come by, and it is harder to pay property taxes and mortgages---for some impossible. This is how the ruling elite in government and the bankers "harvest" wealth away from the people. It is no illusion when your house gets sold on the courthouse steps or is foreclosed. In that sense our debt-based fiat is all too real.

Article 1 Section 10 Clause 1 makes it impossible to pay debts with anything but gold and silver coin. This is why new language has been invented: we don't pay debts anymore; we discharge them with limited liability. Don't ask for references---it's from memory.

I would have added to Art 1 Sec 10 Cl 1 something that makes it impossible for a lender to lend anything but the physical gold and silver coin. That would ensure that he lends what he has to lend and no more with which he could earn illicit interest.

[secretagent]

I don't see the illicitness of lending with interest. Please explain.

[Sid Rich]

bump for later read

[DPB101]

I can divide this degeneration essentially into two categories. One is the application of the so-called “theory of the Living Constitution.”

Liberals are not right about much but they are correct about this. We do have and have always had a "Living Constitution." Tradition, legal precedent and popular opinion have always trumped what is codified in the constitution as the supreme law of the land.

That the Supreme Court "interprets" the constitution, that justices are hermeneuticians, is the greatest falsehood in American politics. Justices go with the wind. Sometimes before the wind, sometimes behind, but always, long term, with the wind.

The question conservatives pose of "Where is that in the constitution?" gains nothing. Doesn't matter what the constitution says. Never has, never will. Rights are more than the constitution. The founders knew that. They expected people to demand those unwritten rights people assume they have be honored. And that has been the case. Only way to change it is to change what rights people believe they hold.

[GhostofWCooper]

Great read, and right on the money.

I love this judge, who said, "An unconstitutional act is not a law; it confers no rights; it imposes no duties. It is, in legal contemplation, as inoperative as though it had never been passed.”

In 1886 they didn't know about all those penumbras and emanations in our beloved Constitution.

[Jason_b]

If I have 100 ounces of silver, and you want to borrow it because you need it and can't find a better deal anywhere else, and I'm willing to lend it for a fee, then you can pay me back over time the 100 ounces, plus 5 ounces if that is what we agreed on. There is nothing wrong with this. It is not unreasonable for you to pay interest to me, or me to you if I borrow. I'm being paid for curtailing the use of my savings for a time. But if you go to the bank, and the banker has issued paper promises to pay in gold and silver coin beyond his ability to cover them, then he has promised what he cannot deliver. He has lied to the portion of the population that would be unable to redeem its claims were there a sudden desire of the people to return their paper and get their gold back. A lie in business is fraud. Don't forget, it is their gold, not the bank's. The bank is merely holding it. But why does the bank lie to a portion of the population this way? Because there is money in it for the banker. He can charge interest on money lent that people believe exists, that does not. This is illicit interest. The lending for interest what does not exist. It leads to the eventual wrecking of the economy because once the process gets started, it is hard to stop. And though it feels good for a time, it cannot go on forever. And when it stops, people lose homes, and go hungry.

My suggestion to force lenders to lend the gold and silver coin will ensure that only that which is lent, is that which they have. When they have lent all the gold and silver coin allowable by the depositors' time deposits, the lending will stop until more time deposits are received. This will allow the the economy itself to control lending, and prevent the banker from overlending using paper. Paper can still pass from hand to hand, and can perhaps be lent between non-bank parties. But if a debt is to be paid it must be paid in gold or silver coin, and if a debt is to be created at a bank the principal amount must be delivered to the borrower in the form of gold and silver coin.

[secretagent]

Thanks. As I understand your point, fractional reserve banking defrauds immediately - a Ponzi scheme.

[Veracious Poet]

I suggest that all of you that are interested in the truth about the economic, fiscal and monetary policies/history of the US read:

The Creature from Jekyll Island...by G. Edward Griffin

Be warned though, you may not be prepared for how deep the rabbit-hole goes...

[Veracious Poet]

I suggest that all of you that are interested in the truth about the economic, fiscal and monetary policies/history of the US read:

The Creature from Jekyll Island...by G. Edward Griffin

Be warned though, you may not be prepared for how deep the rabbit-hole goes...

[Veracious Poet]

I suggest that all of you that are interested in the truth about the economic, fiscal and monetary policies/history of the US read:

The Creature from Jekyll Island...by G. Edward Griffin

Be warned though, you may not be prepared for how deep the rabbit-hole goes...

[secretagent]

Thanks.

(I see you had the same frustration I had in slow posting speed - FR gets indigestion sometimes)

[Veracious Poet]

Sorry, the forum seemed to go all whacky on me...lol!

[Sloth]

What's so special about gold?

[Misterioso]

Gold keeps the government honest.

[Sloth]

How? Gold has no more intrinsic value than any other natural resource. Why not have a coal standard or a uranium standard?

[Consort]

Yes, only 5 people in the entire universe determine what the US Constitution means; not the Congress or the President or the Pope or the Founding Fathers.....

[tpaine]

Yes, only 5 people in the entire universe determine what the US Constitution means; not the Congress or the President or the Pope or the Founding Fathers.....
19 -con-


Wrong again, of course. The plain words & concepts of the constitution itself clearly state its meaning.

Many here refuse to believe its basic simplicity. - They want it to support their particular agenda. - Damn shame.