Today I shot my first handgun, a 9mm Glock model 19 (vanity)

self

[rudy45]

I hope I got the model right. It holds 10 rounds, and is hammerless.

Questions:

Why is the spent shell hitting me in the face? I thought it's supposed to go off to the side.

I had a tendency to flinch and blink when I fired. Should that go away with practice?

Was I loading the magazine the right way, by inserting one round at a time and pushing down on the ones already in the magazine? Wouldn't it be easier to have some lever or slide on the outside of the magazine, that would depress the "floor" all the way, thereby making loading easier?

How does this model compare (in terms of size, weight and recoil) to Sig P232 .380?

Thanks.

[FateAmenableToChange]

I suspect that the officer trying to cuff him might also have needed a change of underwear at that point. He reacted more than the suspect did.

If you look at the video before she shoots, it appears that the point of aim is at the chest of the officer attempting to cuff the suspect. Watch how much she lowers the point of aim before the AD that impacts just to the right of the suspect's head - to get that low, she had to be negligently aiming at the other officer. I'm betting that she noticed that she was aiming at the officer's chest, said "oh my" and got all nervous and sweaty as she lowered the gun and then looked around to see whether anyone else noticed that she almost shot her partner. At that point, her finger convulsed on the trigger. What a moron.

[HumanaeVitae]

Do yourself a favor and get a Sig or an HK

I'll agree to that one. I have 2 HK's, a 9mm full-size USP and a Compact .40. Awesome guns, a little pricey, though.

[archy]

I hope I got the model right. It holds 10 rounds, and is hammerless.

The 19 is the *middle bear* 9mm version, not quite as lengthy as the original Glock 17 model, the first version introduced and known as the P.80 to the Austrian military, nor as compact as the smaller glock 26, meant for use as a hideout version. The Model 19 is thereby a nice compromise, though I prefer the balance of the longer model 17, having had both model 17s and 19s [and the mini-Glock in the .45 caliber Model 30 version]

Why is the spent shell hitting me in the face? I thought it's supposed to go off to the side.

It is, and it will sometimes, particularly when the pistol is fired from the left hand. The ejection port of the Glock was purposely designed to be very large and open to lessen the possibility of an ejecting case being caught as the slide snaps back forward; this was a particular concern with the fully-automatic mechanism of the Model 18 9mm pistol, outwardly resembling the Model 17 but with the additional option of emptying it's magazine in less than a second. Accordingly, a 33-round extended magazine was also developed for the model 18, which can be used in the other 9mm guns as well. That might be something for you to consider as a potentially useful accessory someday. But practice and familiarity with the individual gun helps. BTW, it's worse when a piece of hot brass gets caught between your eyeglasses and eyelid. Ow.

I had a tendency to flinch and blink when I fired. Should that go away with practice?

It can be unlearned. A good coach can be a particular help, as can work with a subcaliber training unit, not available from Glock but made as an aftermarket accessory. A seperate .22 handgun is nearly as useful as a training aid, however, and is a fun challenge to master in its own right.

Was I loading the magazine the right way, by inserting one round at a time and pushing down on the ones already in the magazine? Wouldn't it be easier to have some lever or slide on the outside of the magazine, that would depress the "floor" all the way, thereby making loading easier?

Yes it would, and such an integral or seperate loading tool has been built into several submachinegun designs and one or two handguns in the past. But it increases the mechanical complexity and could be a detriment to concealment, so seperate loading assist devices are available, including one from Glock specificly for their pistols, and there's such a device from the Triple-Break company that I've always favoured, very similar to the one the US Army provided for the M3 submachinegun. They're usually available at well-stocked gun shops in the $15-$20 range, or can be found online *here* priced at $15.95 each. They're particularly useful if either you have a great many magazines to reload, or only one that you have to recharge between firing strings. It does help to have several magazines available, in practice or especially if troubles come your way.

How does this model compare (in terms of size, weight and recoil) to Sig P232 .380?

the Sig is a bit smaller, and since the distance between its front and rear sights is less due to the shorter barrel, is a bit harder to shoot as well; this is called the sight radius and is usually more of an issue to practical accuracy than any ballistic shortcoming from the different barrel lengths. The .380 cartridge of the Sig is less powerful, making it less effective, particularly in the hands of a shooter less certain of perfect placement with the less powerful cartridge. Again, every little bit helps, and the more practice you get with either, the better.

The Sig has an aluminum alloy frame, thus lighter to carry but subject to wear and scratching moreso than a steel frame, and possibly more susceptable to peening or cracking from extensive shooting. The famed Walther PPK in the same caliber was available either way, and was most generally preferred in the steel-framed version; likewise the excellent Russian Makarov and former Communist bloc copies thereof were of steel, and are quite sturdy for extended longterm use.

Thanks.

Any time! And FReegards...good luck with curing that flinch [dry firing practice helps] and the straying brass problem.

-archy-/-

[TexasCowboy]

"Why is the spent shell hitting me in the face?"

Because the Glock is a piece of crap.

"I had a tendency to flinch and blink when I fired. Should that go away with practice?"

No, not while firing a Glock. It's a piece of crap.

"Was I loading the magazine the right way,"

There is no right way; the Glock magazine is a piece of crap.

"How does this model compare (in terms of size, weight and recoil) to Sig P232 .380?"

You've got to be kidding! That's like comparing a cow chip to steak dinner.

Now that I've totally destroyed your confidence in your toy, let me show you a REAL gun:

[gcruse]

No one ever listen to Zathras.

LOL   You not the one!

[Nachoman]

Go to http://www.glocktalk.com and put yourself into a veritable glock stupor. You are now officially qualified to join the cult.

[Eaker]

Talk about crap!!!

I was with TC and convinced him to buy a Sig because he just wasn't the right caliber to own a Glock!!

Eaker

[humblegunner]

No, not while firing a Glock. It's a piece of crap.

Are those loud angry knocks I hear at your door???
I just called Eaker and was told he had just lit out like
a bat out of hell, destination unknown...

[TexasCowboy]

LOL!
I just LOOOOOVE to stir up sh*t!!

[Eaker]

I just LOOOOOVE to stir up sh*t!!

Stir'n it, steppin' in it, makin' chile with it.......

TC ain't got no limits!!!

;<)

[Ichneumon]

I had a tendency to flinch and blink when I fired. Should that go away with practice?

Yes, but it goes away even faster with a bit of mental playacting. Each time you go to fire it, tell yourself that *this* time it's unloaded, it's *not* going to make a big bang noise, jump in your hand, and throw brass down your shirt, honest, you're just going to make it go "click" on an empty chamber. That's right, lie to yourself. Don't pull the trigger until one part of your brain has at least semi-convinced the other part that you're just "dry-firing" this time. Yes, this actually helps.

If you're a fan of the movie "The Matrix", you can also repeat, "There is no spoon". ;-)

The more you anticipate the point in the trigger pull where things go "boom", the more you'll be unable to avoid either hesitating for a moment at that point, or "snapping" the trigger at that point. Either makes for lousy accuracy. Your trigger squeeze should be gentle and smooth, *not* jerky. It shouldn't be like trying to trigger a mousetrap while yanking your hand out of the way of its jaws. Also note the word "squeeze" -- try to concentrate on a motion that's more like gently squeezing the pistol (i.e. pressing the trigger backwards while pressing the handgrip forwards with equal amounts of force. Too many people try to literally "pull" the trigger, which can make the whole pistol rotate against a "pivot point" where the back of its handgrip meets the crook of your thumb, pulling the point of aim up, or to the right, or both (and the more you jerk the trigger instead of squeeze, the more the amount of pivot).

As you squeeze the trigger, the point where the gun goes "bang" should always come as somewhat a surprise to you. Try hard *not* to anticipate it.

Was I loading the magazine the right way, by inserting one round at a time and pushing down on the ones already in the magazine?

That's how most people do it, yeah.

Wouldn't it be easier to have some lever or slide on the outside of the magazine, that would depress the "floor" all the way, thereby making loading easier?

Maybe a bit, but relying on a tool leaves you up the creek when you need to load up without a tool handy (which may be the case either for your own firearm, or another). You might as well learn the "unassisted" way from the start. And it's not that hard.

[Hugin]

Even better is over 1000 rounds through it with no hiccups.

Ditto the Witness. Almost the same gun, but for some reason the magazines are not interchangeable.

[dix]

Thanks for the ping Eaker. I’m left handed as you know, but I’ve never had a problem with the ejection system.
As far as the flinching thing, I shoot a Glock 27, and that’s a lot of lead in a relatively small frame. For me to overcome the flinching thing the other posters are right, just keep shooting, and it will go away. Ain’t no doubt about it the Glock is one fine weapon. Thanks again for the referral when I was looking for a handgun.

[LibKill]

Congratulations! You have discovered a deeply hidden truth. A handgun is just another machine, no better or worse than the engine in your car.

Now, take the NRA safety course. It will be good for you and it will also give you a chance to meet experts who know all that anyone needs to know about guns.

Ask questions, admit that you know little about guns. They will respond positively, they will be delighted to give you info about firearms.

[TexasCowboy]

"Ain’t no doubt about it the Glock is one fine weapon."

Okay, Dix! Now how much did Eaker pay you to say that?
When I drag out that new Walther PPK at the next shoot, I want you to shoot my Sig and my Walther.......then tell me about the Glock.

[Eaker]

Looking forward to our next shoot!!

How are yer feelin'?

[Eaker]

I want you to shoot my Sig and my Walther.......then tell me about the Glock.

After yer done being embarassed, then we can take'em to the car wash and clean them with hot soapy water!!! Yer's will just be a big ole hunk-o-rust by the time you get home and ours will be ready for the next shoot!

Eaker

[TexasCowboy]

Tom, I was working overseas one time with a guy who had just bought a diver's watch for $1500. in Paris.
Bill said, "This watch is good to 800' of water!"
I said, "Uh....do you dive?"
He said, "No, but I might some day."

My point is that if I run completely out of Hoppe's #9, I'll go to Academy and buy some more before I go to the car wash.

And I always embarrass myself on the pistol range!
I've gotten used to it.

OH! Slight correction:
That's a Walther P99, 9mm, instead of a PPK.

[Eaker]

;<)

[TexasCowboy]

Damn!
I'm ready for the shoot!!
My finger's itching!

[dix]

Coming back like gangbusters. Next week is the third week in the cycle, my energy level will be high, and I will be ready to go.

[harpseal]

Blue Glaser cartridges are great

Agreed.

Wearing a GLOCK or NRA ballcap will ward of bad guys more then your concealed GLOCK will

The NRA firearms instructors hat does the the trick nicely.

A leather pouch on a belt, worn in cross-draw position left of your belt buckle (even empty) along with the ballcap will educate the criminal mind and prevent most uneccessary confrontations

Very very true.

As to the rest they go without saying.

[NYFriend]

the Sig 220 series are really nice. I've never owned one, but have had the opportunity to shoot one. My father had a P226 with tritium sights, and he loved it. The grip got slippery when your hands were wet or sweaty. But, the grip sure beats an S&W 669, or an M9 Beretta. Still have to say that the glock, for what it was ment to be (reliable issue military pistol), is a good gun. It's not a match gun, it's not a show gun. But it's cheep, it tends not to rust, and I've never seen a frame failure on one. I think a Glock 27 .40 (baby glock) would be my first and last choice for a cheap (less than $600) pistol. But, I still think a five shot revolver is a fine choice for nearly everyone who isn't a cop. .38+p or .357 Magnum (I've heard that the .357 doesn't perform much better than .38+p from a snub nose because the powder burns too slow). I think a .38 will do, but I know most people don't. If your worried, Rozzi and Charter Arms make (or made) a five shot .44 Special revolver with a 2 or 3 inch barrel. I think Smith and Wesson makes one too. They are all five shot, and are smaller and lighter than a .44 magnum. They come out about the same as a medium frame six-shot .357.

[jake hoyt]

Its called "flinching"- you are probably over anticipating the recoil in the firearm ( yes,although 9mms are usually "low recoil",lack of familiarity/fear factor can cause a person to wrist snap after a round is fired).Other than that you may be using an improper stance or holding the weapon too close to your body as well as not firmly- try a "weaver" stance and ask your local ranger operator to give you pointers if you don't have a friend thats law enforcement or prior military.

[jake hoyt]

I'll never understand why people "huff" over hi-cap magazines.What ARE YOU going to do with with Hi-cap Mags- history and weapons deployment has proven that Hi-cap mag or rifle clips don't improve accuracy nor do they really give that extra option.Police officers SHOT better when all they had were 6-shot revolvers;Military armed forces ( Army/Marines) were successful up until they replaced the semi-auto m-1 /m-14 with the "spray and pray" M-16 ( the current M-4 shoots ONLY 3-rd bursts,not full auto!) For home defense if you can't counter a threat with (10) rds in a semi-auto pistol,don't you think that you're in "trouble"?I was in Van Nuys when the North Hollywood shootout (1997) occurred. Both Suspects were heavily armed with Assualt rifles modified to fire fully auto and hi -cap magazines, and the "supposedly" outgunned police officers STILL shot them down with combined fire , not from hi-cap mags but from concentrated fire ( no cops died on that one).Clinton Administration had nothing to do with the fear of criminals getting the Hi-cap mags and spraying everything they saw (remember this- the REPUBLICANS were in control of Congress while "Slick Willie" reigned!).Learn to USE the weapon and if you feel so scared about having only a "10" rd mag, do like everyone else , including the Thugs,-go buy more (10)rd mags.......

[risk]

I won't defend the capacity limits (I hope they're repealed one day for us all one day) but I agree: just practice the double-tap and get it right both times. Know your target. Know your background. Never fire unless you're sure.

Yes, this means practice, practice, practice.

[jake hoyt]

What the? 9mm and .45 cal have been proven by the FBI to have "virtually " the same effectiveness in shootings -both are 70-75% stoppers.The .45 has the "hype" because it was the only gun used by the military for 90 yrs!With the exception of ball ammo, the 45 cal is pitiful and doesn't deliver the fabled "one shot" stopping power(better look at 38 long, the 357 mag, 41 mag, or 44mag for that type of damage.) The problem with 9mm is over penetration( ball ammo or FMJ rds)- best most effective rd for home defense is still the old .38 cal semi jkt'ed hollow point or safety slug at close range, and the more effective .40 cal(which is why MORE police Depts ,Sheriffs Depts, and State Police agencies are tossing their 9mms AND 45s for the .40!), I have personally seen a .45 jhp rd (230 grs Win.850+ fps) "peel apart" upon striking a carwindshield at LESS than 10yds, then barely penetrate a car door of a nissan maxima -susp gave up only cause he feared a rd would hit him sooner or later) That knock down power? what good is it against armored targets! 45s won't even penetrate 6 layers of a level 2A vest!Its good in that it can deliver a larger bullet to a soft a target and cause trauma,(big holes cause more bleeding, and hopefully shock to the bad guy, which is why Spec Ops units slow them down EVEN more with suppressors/silencers).Its the same argument with the .308 vs .223 crowd. For utility and home defense, i'd suggest a .38/357 revolver in 4 bbl(easy to clean, and store away) then a 9mm with 124 gr jhp or 115 gr jhp "silvertip"- .higher expansion,low recoil,easy to bring on target for smaller statured males/females that aren't very familiar with handguns, then the .45 cal for the homes of us "neanderthal" types- as for a duty weapon -the .40 Sig (226) or the glock-it'll bring you home and can do what the 9mm and .45 can't (big bullet hole, better penetration)

[jake hoyt]

Hit it on the head-a citizen in their home,after calling "911"(here in L.A. that means a 10-15 min response-Yikes!)and loudly "warning" the intruder , had better know their weapon.(2) to the Body and failure drill (one to the head at 5 yds max.) should stop a violent suspect.if they miss?well hopefully ,the Criminal isn't armed and will flee...

[KneelBeforeZod]

I had was at a range and the empty brass hit the partion and bounced up and got stuck between my face and my eyeglasses. nice and warm...

[jake hoyt]

Oooh-gah! Me think, Glock Crap!!! okay "Hulk", how bout this-ever shoot an old 1911 (talk about crap) then shoot a kimber match or les byer(SP?) 1911 45. SWEET, same with the GLOCK. They (Glock) had quality control issues in the mid 90s and guess what, some of those guns are still in dealers cases out there.The Glock was a military first weapon, meaning it had to be soldier proof first then fire functionally second.Same philosophy with the Glock in Law enforcement .Have you seen the crappy Sig "Pro" being sold as a"cheaper"(yep "cheaper") alt. to the 226/229 for police agencies-shoot the -"pro" and you'll say the same thing,"Crap".As a utility gun, the glock is rock simple, can be bought with accurized parts and fire 2" groups at 25yds consistantly.We're talking a decent out the box gun with quality for "joe citizen", not the gun enthusiast or Copper. Heck if all he needed was a no frills roscoe,i'd even suggest a "sleeper" gun, the under valued ruger semi- autos in 9mm and 45....

[risk]

I got one in the eye (up and over the rim of my eye wear) the other day. Adrenaline kept it from hurting at first. By nightfall the surface of my eye was obviously scratched.

[zeeshan]

i have done research into the problem , why the ejected catridges hit my face . its because of bigger ejection ports on glock and hk handguns. the ejection port extends upwards and some rounds are not ejected sideways but upward and backward to the face. what do you think?

plus, i am right handed but my dominant eye is left so gun is right in front of my face so, the probability of ejected catridge hittin my face is higher compared to shooters with right dominant eye.

can you please guide me in choosing the a handgun in .45 auto with following chracteristics?

1. extreamely reliable and very durable

2. polygonal barreling and other any features for highest accuracy.

3. ejection port to the right (not extended upwards).

4. decocker and manual safety(with safety on the pin should be blocked and not just the trigger).

5. fast target accquisition sights ( eg 3 dots or glock type sights , and perferrably night sights to glow in dark)

6. medium or just compact size for concealed carry( but in no way the compactness should compromise the reliability and durability factor. meaning, size factor can be compromised but not the reliability and long service life factor of the gun).

7. smoothest and lightest trigger pull possible as in my experience trigger pull adds considerably to acccuracy.

8. light weight if possible (but not at the stake of any traits mentioned above).

your help will be very much appreciated,

zeeshan

[50mm]

Very curious. Posting to a 5 year old thread.

[Focault's Pendulum]

Yeah! Get out of here newbie....this is where we hold our secret meetings.

[raygun]

I had a tendency to flinch and blink when I fired. Should that go away with practice?

Stop being afraid of the gun. Dont' grip the gun too tightly, don't fear the kick and percussion. Be the bullet. Forget the gun.

[50mm]

Uh, the noob is at post 82.

[Focault's Pendulum]

I know. I didn't want him to know about the Secret place.

[raygun]

My first experience with a handgun was with the U.S.A.F. issue .45 semi-auto.

So I can not only sympathize with you, I empathize with you.

Long guns on the other hand don’t bother me so much. I shot 36 out of 40 - 38 was sufficient for a markshman ribbon - on the range in U.S.A.F. boot camp (first time I’d ever shot a firearm in my life) with iron-sighted M-16 at 100 yds. Subsequently, times I’ve gone to the range with buddies who let me shoot their firearms, I told ‘em their scopes / sights were off by this much in that quadrant. They either took it in to get it professionally sighted (if they didn’t know how to), or adjusted it accordingly. Then I’d be able to put multiple rounds through the same hole.

I just never cottoned to the .45 that’s all. Unfortunately I’ve never shot anything else, so I couldn’t tell you how I’d appreciate 9mm or 10mm anything.

The one handgun that I’m pretty certain I’d like is a Walther P-38. Its so balanced that it must be nice to shoot. What impressed me so much with that gun is that my hand didn’t feel like it was holding a gun, or that a gun was in my hand, but that the gun and my hand were one. I can’t describe the feeling any other way.

Small caliber, but sweet weapon. It has at least a 10 round clip, semi-auto, and if you can’t hit whatever enemy is trying to kill you in a single clip, you deserve to die. Its that simple.

I think something like that is a perfect urban weapon. A .45 would be bad news here in the apartment.