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Acts of God: America's Warning Not to Divide Israel
CBN ^ | June 26, 2003 | Jennifer James

Posted on 06/28/2003 8:49:26 AM PDT by yonif

Since its modern establishment, the state of Israel has been a hotbed of controversy. Jews and Palestinians have long battled over who should rightfully inhabit the land of Israel, a land promised to the Jews 4,000 years ago. In the Bible, the book of Genesis details the covenant God made with the descendants of Abraham.

"On that day, the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, 'to your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the river of Euphrates.'" - Genesis 15:18.

For more than a decade, America has led attempts to settle that dispute, each time encouraging Israel to bring its covenant lands to the bargaining table, this time with the "Road Map" peace plan. Bible scholars say that may be a costly decision for the U.S. as America again stands at odds with God's covenant promise.

U.S. Consul General Jeffrey Feltman said, "What we need to do now is implement and focus on how we get the two sides back to a political process and towards the vision of a two-state solution: Israel and Palestine living side by side."

On April 30, 2003, America was positioned as the catalyst to jump-start the so-called "solution" to the Middle East crisis. As U.S.-backed Palestinian Prime Minister Mahmoud Abbas was sworn in, the "Road Map" peace plan was set in motion.

The very next day began the worst month of tornadoes in American history, more than 500 in a single month. Normally, 1,000 tornadoes hit the United States each year, but this year, in just eight days in May, 375 twisters ripped across the heartland of America.

While in Israel, Assistant Secretary of State William Burns told a group of left-wing activists that "common sense" would override the conservative and Christian viewpoints concerning the road map.

May 9th, 2003, President Bush addressed students at the University of South Carolina. Bush called on the Palestinians to embrace the road to peace, and see the flag of Palestine raised over a free nation.

Hours later, tornadoes returned and Oklahoma City again became the bulls-eye for deadly twisters, reducing what was left of businesses and homes to splinters and bricks. The tornadoes of May devastated the Midwest with the third worst property damage in American history. Since then, the Road Map has endured a rocky road to June, coinciding with what may be America's most rain-drenched spring in history.

On the East Coast there have been less than 10 rainless weekends the entire year. And in the West, certain crop-eating pests are having their best year in six decades amid dry conditions.

In the early stages of the Road Map peace process, weather catastrophe and recent violence in Israel have competed for the headlines. That violence coupled with America's own battles at home are leading some to question the Road Map. Is there a connection between dividing the Holy Land and utter disruption? Some Bible scholars think so.

In the book of Joel, God warns against dividing the land of Israel. Joel 3:1-2 says, "...I will enter into judgment with them there on behalf of my people and my inheritance, Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations; and they have divided up my land."

Bill Koenig, author of Israel: The Blessing or the Curse, said, "We know for a fact that God gave this land, through the Abrahamic covenant, He gave the land of Israel to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and their descendants, and this land is God's land."

Koenig said the U.S. should not consider such chaos a coincidence. "These are warning signals, these are warning judgements to America that this is My covenant land and it's not to be traded for promises of peace and security. This land is not to be parceled," he said.

In the last 12 years, the U.S. has stepped up its efforts to pressure Israel to give up her covenant lands, several times sharing the spotlight with major storms.

On October 30, 1991, in a meeting scheduled by the first President Bush, Israelis and Palestinians discussed ways to achieve peace in the Middle East. Opening talks focused on trading the lands of Israel for a peace agreement.

That same day, thousands of miles away, a powerful storm was brewing off the coast of Nova Scotia. On October 31st, what would be called "The Perfect Storm" smashed into New England, pummeling the President's Kennebunkport, Maine home with waves 30 feet high. It was a storm so rare that the weather patterns required to create it only happen once every 100 years.

August 23rd, 1992, Middle East peace talks resumed in Washington, D.C. The issue remained surrendering the biblical lands of Judea and Samaria in exchange for peace. Hundreds of miles south, Florida was the target of the worst natural disaster in American history. Hurricane Andrew tore through with an eye more than 30 miles wide and winds up to 178 miles per hour leaving a $32 billion disaster.

Koenig said, "The world leaders have attempted to parcel the covenant land, so as Israel's property and land is at risk, so is the property of the nation that's promoting the peace process. And I might add that the greater the pressure on Israel to give up this property, the greater the repercussions and the greater the following events that take place afterwards."

In the Bible, the prophet Zechariah warned the nations that would come against Jerusalem. "On that day, when all the nations of the earth are gathered against her, I will make Jerusalem an immovable rock for all the nations. All who try to move it will injure themselves," says Zechariah 12:3.

Koenig said, "We have the nations of the world right now siding with the Arabs and the Muslims that are focused on the covenant land, but we know God is standing with the nation of Israel."

Is America playing a dangerous game? As the Road Map peace process encounters resistance, the Bush administration's determination to see it through has escalated.

Secretary of State Colin Powell said, "We have a plan, we have the commitment of leaders and now we have to execute that plan, keep moving forward and not allow ourselves to be distracted or thrown off point, from the promise that's out there with the Road Map, by this surge of violence. We've got to punch our way through it."

But, up against biblical prophecies, Koenig said America is standing against the very Word of God and should expect major obstacles.

"I believe the Lord will allow these events to happen that disrupt the peace process," he said. "As long as you are going to have a terrorist infrastructure that's allowed to co-exist in the nation Israel, we're going to have a problem."

And with those same terrorist groups opposed to America's brand of peace, the future of the Road Map is dim. Israelis maintain they will be relentless to protect their country while all plans to split up the tiny nation may be curbed.

Koenig said, "God loves the nation of Israel. He still, to this day, loves this nation. He is in hot pursuit of the people of Israel. Through these events, we look at the tragedies and we look at the trials, but God's trying to wake up the world."


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Government; Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: cbn; divide; god; idf; israel; land; terrorists
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To: Matchett-PI
I hope you don't expect me to treat ocean tankers full of conjecture, assumption, presumption, interpretation . . .


as fact.
151 posted on 07/01/2003 9:48:51 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: MEGoody
I don't know how much he is pressured and threatened with death by the puppet masters.

I don't know how much he has to choose his battles and put most of his energy and risk in to the highest priorities.

He has limited political currency, as well.
152 posted on 07/01/2003 9:50:09 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: Cacophonous
The Scriptures say yes--

1) it's called Prayer and GOD HIMSELF INSTITUTED IT. It is HIS choice to be influenced by our prayers. HE'S THE ONE who declares HE delights in such.

2) Moses demonstrated rather impressively that man can influence God. St Paul wasn't so bad at it either.
153 posted on 07/01/2003 9:51:45 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: disclaimer

Is that Nick Nolte?

154 posted on 07/01/2003 9:51:57 AM PDT by Diddle E. Squat
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To: Cacophonous
You are wrong.
155 posted on 07/01/2003 9:53:52 AM PDT by gedeon3
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To: MississippiMan
QUITE SO.

FOR SURE!

UNCONDITIONAL.
156 posted on 07/01/2003 9:54:47 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: Diddle E. Squat

157 posted on 07/01/2003 9:56:08 AM PDT by Diddle E. Squat
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To: Jhoffa_
IMHO,

THERE'S BASICALLY 2 REASONS FOR THE BLESSINGS WE HAVE ENJOYED AS A NATION.

1) To whatever degree we've followed God's Word and worked to share it liberally abroad as well as to demonstrate God's Love through our generosity around the world.

2) Supporting and protecting Israel.

We are rapidly becoming too decadant to demonstrate God's Word well except the reaping and sowing curses part. If we dump Israel--God help us. Thankfully, we are still sending many missionaries out.
158 posted on 07/01/2003 9:57:55 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: Just mythoughts
Well stated.
159 posted on 07/01/2003 9:59:03 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: hope
Amen! For sure!
160 posted on 07/01/2003 10:00:23 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: disclaimer
Thanks.
161 posted on 07/01/2003 10:01:16 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: MissAmericanPie
Well stated.
162 posted on 07/01/2003 10:05:28 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: Cacophonous
Your post is so bad, I hardly know where to start!

The prophesy recorded in Jeremiah 31 is directed to both the House of Israel, which consists of the Northern Ten Tribes of Israel, and the House of Judah.

Jeremiah 30
4   And these are the words that the LORD spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah.

Then follows the now familiar pattern of the need for punishment upon both Houses of Israel by military defeat and scattering in exile, but resulting in the complete accomplishment of God's purposes by their eventual regathering as being seen today in both Jewish and Christian circles.

10   Therefore fear thou not, O my servant Jacob, saith the LORD; neither be dismayed, O Israel: for, lo, I will save thee from afar, and thy seed from the land of their captivity; and Jacob shall return, and shall be in rest, and be quiet, and none shall make him afraid.
11   For I am with thee, saith the LORD, to save thee: though I make a full end of all nations whither I have scattered thee, yet I will not make a full end of thee: but I will correct thee in measure, and will not leave thee altogether unpunished.

It's futile to try to make this prophecy refer to the Christian Church because in no time in its history was the Christian Church punished by scattering, exile, and captivity as was the Tribes of Israel?

24  The fierce anger of the LORD shall not return, until he hath done it, and until he have performed the intents of his heart: in the latter days ye shall consider it.

These words bring to mind a parallel passage in the Book of Isaiah 27:8-9

From the KJV
Isaiah 27
8   In measure, when it shooteth forth, thou wilt debate with it: he stayeth his rough wind in the day of the east wind.
9   By this therefore shall the iniquity of Jacob be purged; and this is all the fruit to take away his sin; when he maketh all the stones of the altar as chalkstones that are beaten in sunder, the groves and images shall not stand up.

From the JPS (1917) Jewish Bible Tanakh
8  In full measure, when Thou sendest her away, Thou dost contend with her; He hath removed her with His rough blast in the day of the east wind.
9  Therefore by this shall the iniquity of Jacob be expiated, and this is all the fruit of taking away his sin: when he maketh all the stones of the altar as chalkstones that are beaten in pieces, so that the Asherim and the sun-images shall rise no more.

By this (exile and captivity) therefore shall the iniquity of Jacob be atoned.  It is worth noting that Isaiah here indicates that the exile would serve as an atonement for the sins of the people. Such an idea of atonement for sins might come as a surprise to those used to thinking in Christian terms only.

Fortunately, God's plan does not end with punishment and abandonment of His people, Israel.  Jeremiah 31 starts out with the hopeful declaration of the LORD, Himself, "At that time (that is, "in the latter days," see Jeremiah 30-24)...I will be the God of all the families of Israel, and they shall be My people."

Jeremiah 31:1
At the same time, saith the LORD, will I be the God of all the families of Israel, and they shall be my people.

God promises the descendants of Israel (who, through captivity, exile, and intermarriage with Gentiles became assimilated and inculturated Gentiles today) that they will find "grace in the wilderness" (verse 2).

2   Thus saith the LORD, The people which were left of the sword found grace in the wilderness; even Israel, when I went to cause him to rest.

Followed by the most moving promise of all, "I have loved you with an everlasting love" (verse 3).

3   The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee.

It would be a mistake, at this point, to assume that these promises are made only to the House of Judah, the Jewish people; on the contrary, read closely verses 5, 6, and 9b:

5   Thou shalt yet plant vines upon the mountains of Samaria: the planters shall plant, and shall eat them as common things.
6   For there shall be a day, that the watchmen upon the mount Ephraim shall cry, Arise ye, and let us go up to Zion unto the LORD our God.
9   They shall come with weeping, and with supplications will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters in a straight way, wherein they shall not stumble: for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.

These clear statements, made by the LORD, identify the primary audience. It was the Northern Ten Tribes who occupied Samaria/the hill country of Ephraim anciently, and who are prophesied to do so again.

These Ten Northern Tribes, who are frequently referred to in Scripture collectively as Ephraim, are called the LORD'S "first-born" (possibly an allusion to Genesis 48:14-20 and I Chronicles 5:1).

Genesis 48
14   And Israel stretched out his right hand, and laid it upon Ephraim's head, who was the younger, and his left hand upon Manasseh's head, guiding his hands wittingly; for Manasseh was the firstborn.
15   And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day,
16   The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth.
17   And when Joseph saw that his father laid his right hand upon the head of Ephraim, it displeased him: and he held up his father's hand, to remove it from Ephraim's head unto Manasseh's head.
18   And Joseph said unto his father, Not so, my father: for this is the firstborn; put thy right hand upon his head.
19   And his father refused, and said, I know it, my son, I know it: he also shall become a people, and he also shall be great: but truly his younger brother shall be greater than he, and his seed shall become a multitude of nations.
20   And he blessed them that day, saying, In thee shall Israel bless, saying, God make thee as Ephraim and as Manasseh: and he set Ephraim before Manasseh.


1 Chronicles 5
1   Now the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel, (for he was the firstborn; but forasmuch as he defiled his father's bed, his birthright was given unto the sons of Joseph the son of Israel: and the genealogy is not to be reckoned after the birthright.

The word of God to the descendants of Ephraim, the Northern Ten Tribes, is:

8   Behold, I will bring them from the north country, and gather them from the coasts of the earth, and with them the blind and the lame, the woman with child and her that travaileth with child together: a great company shall return thither.

And again, stated even more emphatically in verse 10:

10   Hear the word of the LORD, O ye nations, and declare it in the isles afar off, and say, He that scattered Israel will gather him, and keep him, as a shepherd doth his flock.


Notice the interesting wording here. These declarations are  made to the "coasts of the earth, and isles afar off," and the descendants of Israel are to be gathered from the remote parts of the earth.  These locations certainly lend evidence to current efforts to identify the descendants of the Ten Tribes with the Northwest European peoples and their colonies (America).

Proceeding to the next major section of Jeremiah 31, we encounter the passage:

15   Thus saith the LORD; A voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation, and bitter weeping; Rachel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children, because they were not.

According to the historical books of the Bible, the Jewish people are primarily composed of descendants of the Tribes of Judah and Levi, and to a lesser extent Benjamin. Judah and Levi are the children of Leah, not of Rachel (Gen. 29:32-35). And while Benjamin was Rachel's son, she never got the chance to know him, as she died during his birth (Gen. 35:16-19).

But Rachel did give Jacob a son, whom Jacob loved very dearly, Joseph (Gen. 37:3).

It is this son Joseph and his children [Joseph remember had two sons….Manessah and Ephraim] whose descendants were taken in the Assyrian captivity and never returned to their land or their faith that Rachel is weeping over in Jeremiah 31:15.
16   Thus saith the LORD; Refrain thy voice from weeping, and thine eyes from tears: for thy work shall be rewarded, saith the LORD; and they shall come again from the land of the enemy.

What children are these?

17   And there is hope in thine end, saith the LORD, that thy children shall come again to their own border.
18   I have surely heard Ephraim bemoaning himself thus; Thou hast chastised me, and I was chastised, as a bullock unaccustomed to the yoke: turn thou me, and I shall be turned; for thou art the LORD my God.
19   Surely after that I was turned, I repented; and after that I was instructed, I smote upon my thigh: I was ashamed, yea, even confounded, because I did bear the reproach of my youth.
20   Is Ephraim my dear son? is he a pleasant child? for since I spake against him, I do earnestly remember him still: therefore my bowels are troubled for him; I will surely have mercy upon him, saith the LORD.

It is clear that it is The House of Israel/Ephraim/the Northern Ten Tribes which through intermarriage is melted into the Gentile gene pool of the world which is being referred to here, not the House of Judah/the Jews. If anyone is tempted to think that the term Ephraim is being employed here in a generic way to address all Israel, just glance down to verses 23, 24, and 27, where Judah is treated as distinct from Ephraim/the House of Israel.


31   Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Is this "new covenant" made with the Christian Gentile Church or with descendants of the Tribes of Jacob of the House of Judah and Ephraim (comprising the Ten Northern Tribes of Jacob)?

Let's say that you, as the Christian, are Ephraim and this prophecy applies to the Christian Church, then according to the timing of when God will make this "new covenant", can you say that this New Covenant is already made and existing because the Christians have been restored to the land of Israel and their ancestor's faith, or do most of Christianity today lay outside the land of Israel and have a belief system quite opposite to the Jewish Church of Jerusalem?

Note that this new covenant is not made with the Gentiles; neither is it made solely with the house of Judah, the Jews. Rather, it is a future promise that is guaranteed to the Jews and to their brothers, the descendants of Joseph/Ephraim (Jesus called these the "lost sheep of the House of Israel [Ephraim])

Was God talking through Jeremiah the Prophet to Baptists, Methodists, Catholics today, or was God speaking through Jeremiah to the House of Judah (Jews of the Tribe of Judah and Benjamin) and the House of Israel (consisting of the Ten other Tribes of Jacob)?

33   But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

God doesn't lie.

Could these promises be taken away from the physical descendants of Jacob/Israel and given instead to a group of Gentiles calling themselves "Christians" who reject the Laws of God let alone His appointed times such as Biblical Festivals and Sabbaths?

Are you grafted into Israel as Paul stated in Romans, or are you grafted into a Gentile organization built upon Replacement Theology given to you by the early Gentile Catholic Church?

Matthew 10
5   These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
6   But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
7   And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.


Do you observe the Festivals and Sabbaths of the Lord and of Israel, or do you observe pagan holidays that have had Jesus' name affixed to them and have taken the place of what is commanded in Scripture?

Have you substituted the "day of the sun" (Sunday) for the Sabbath?

Are you, as Gentile Godfearers grafted into Israel, in fact part of Israel and the people of God or have you apostatized from truth, and practice a mixture of truth and error in Christianity as it stands today?

Are you the "remnant" among the Gentile nations who will be gathered as the "elect" and be presented at the Marriage Supper along with Judah-Benjamin, thus making up the Bride of Messiah, or will you be delegated to be the "servant-foolish bride" and be cast out of the Wedding Supper because Jesus, a Jew, in his own Torah, is commanded by his Father to not marry Gentiles! The only Gentile who will become a bride to Messiah is one, like Ruth, who said "your people will be my people and your God my God."

Is the "New Covenant" really NEW at all?

testament and covenant both bring up 1242 from the Greek
1242
diatheke dee-ath-ay'-kay from 1303; properly, a disposition, i.e. (specially) a contract (especially a devisory will):--covenant, testament.
1) a disposition, arrangement, of any sort, which one wishes to be valid, the last disposition which one makes of his earthly possessions after his death, a testament or will
2) a compact, a covenant, a testament
   a) God's covenant with Noah, etc.

Notice it does NOT say the church!

Do the actual words in the Greek Scriptures show us that a "testament" is made between God and the Church?   NOPE!

It does mention the covenant with Noah though.....


Hebrews 8
10   For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

Hebrews 8:10 says: "For THIS the covenant," and then quotes from Jer. 31:33.
Hebrews 8
10   For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

this from the Greek
3778
houtos hoo'-tos, including nominative masculine plural houtoi hoo'-toy, nominative feminine singular haute how'-tay, and nominative feminine plural hautai how'-tahee from the article 3588 and 846; the he (she or it), i.e. this or that (often with article repeated):--he (it was that), hereof, it, she, such as, the same, these, they, this (man, same, woman), which, who.
1) this, these, etc.

846 autos ow-tos' from the particle au (perhaps akin to the base of 109 through the idea of a baffling wind) (backward); the reflexive pronoun self, used (alone or in the comparative 1438) of the third person , and (with the proper personal pronoun) of the other persons:--her, it(-self), one, the other, (mine) own, said, (self-), the) same, ((him-, my-, thy- )self, (your-)selves, she, that, their(-s), them(-selves), there(-at, - by, -in, -into, -of, -on, -with), they, (these) things, this (man), those, together, very, which.
1)
himself, herself, themselves, itself
2)
he, she, it
3) the same

In other words, "this---same" covenant, as was spoken by Jeremiah has now been RENEWED .... NOT REPLACED!  THE SAME COVENANT, WITH ITS LAWS AND COMMANDMENTS WHICH ARE ITS COVENANT STIPULATIONS.
   How do Gentiles, who once were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, who had no hope, and were without God in the world according to Eph. 2:12 become part of this "New/Same Covenant" of Jeremiah spoken about in the New Testament?  By being grafted into Israel and the faith of Israel which practices Sabbaths and Festivals, or by becoming members of various denominations and non-denominations which reject God's Biblical Feasts, Festivals, and Sabbaths?

Are you "in the faith" or just have "a" faith about something which God never gave mankind?

Jeremiah 31 states that the day will come when this "RENEWED" covenant will be made with "whom"?  Israel and Judah?  Or with Judah and the church which rejects the faith of Judah?

The answer to that question is "Israel and Judah".   Israel being understood as Ephraim who today are dispersed Gentiles worldwide who take the form of Christians to whom can be traced Jewish Roots all the way back to the Assyrian Captivity and whom reject paganism and paganized religious practices, (the very reason Ephraim was taken captive in the first place).

This "New" testament is often used to refer to a collection of books written by the Apostles. It isn't.  The collection of books commonly known as the New Testament has unfortunately replaced the Bible Jesus used and which the early church took to the Gentiles for almost 400 years before the Catholic Church created a document to establish their validity for doctrines which they taught that were often contradicted by the Torah and Tanakh (the Bible Jesus used and which was taken to the Gentiles in the Great Commission).   As I've shown above, the "New Testament/Covenant" is not NEW at all, but is a RENEWAL of the Old Testament/Covenant.

A covenant, or testament, is a contract between two parties. Webster's unabridged dictionary defines "testament" this way: "In law, a writing, under seal, containing the terms of agreement or contract between parties..."  

Because this is a legal document and has an impact on our lives, we certainly should be intimately familiar with what the terms of this covenant are. The collections of writings that we call the New Testament have been much too vague about the terms of this agreement.  Since most of the writings of the New Testament do not contain the terms of this covenant, it would be poor scholarship to refer to this collection of Apostolic Writings as the "New Testament,"  especially since there is no 'new' testament, but a RENEWAL of the Old Testament.     

Acts 15
28   For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
29   That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

And even this reference to the agreement, is much too vague.

163 posted on 07/01/2003 10:05:50 AM PDT by ET(end tyranny) ( Luke 16:17 -- And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.)
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To: MississippiMan
I'm very thankful he prays (as I understand it from a person who ought to know--in an authentic, heart-felt way to God Almighty invoking the Blood of Jesus and His Holy Spirit toward aiding him in his job) an hour a day before leaving his private quarters to begin his day.

Billdo preferred to have people praying--at least kneelilng to him!
164 posted on 07/01/2003 10:10:16 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: OREALLY
The list of offenses to God from His perspective knows no boundaries of denomination.

It is logical that those who emphasize being led of The Spirit will be more assaulted of the enemy in their areas of weakness.

IMHO, the pride, rigidity, narrowness, blindness in the other denominations, is AT LEAST AS serious.
165 posted on 07/01/2003 10:12:06 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: ET(end tyranny)
THANKS.

Such a goodly amount of apt bother. I didn't feel it worth it.

166 posted on 07/01/2003 10:15:42 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: Quix
El Shaddai

El Shaddai

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

El-Elyon na Adonia,

Age to age You're still the same,

By the power of the name.

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

Erkamka na Adonai,

We will praise and lift You high,

El Shaddai.

Through your love and through the ram,

You saved the son of Abraham;

Through the power of your hand,

Turned the sea into dry land.

To the outcast on her knees

, You were the God who really sees,

And by Your might,

You set Your children free.

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

El-Elyon na Adonia,

Age to age You're still the same,

By the power of the name.

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

Erkamka na Adonai,

We will praise and lift You high,

El Shaddai.

Through the years You've made it clear,

That the time of Christ was near,

Though the people couldn't see

What Messiah ought to be.

Though Your Word contained the plan,

They just could not understand

Your most awesome work was done

Through the frailty of Your Son.

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

El-Elyon na Adonai,

Age to age You're still the same,

By the power of the name.

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

Erkamka na Adonai,

I will praise and lift You high,

El Shaddai.

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

El-Elyon na Adonai,

Age to age You're still the same,

By the power of the name.

El Shaddai, El Shaddai,

Erkamka na Adonai,

I will praise and lift You high,

El Shaddai.

167 posted on 07/01/2003 10:17:32 AM PDT by Neenah ("It's always something ! ")
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To: yonif
bump for later read
168 posted on 07/01/2003 10:25:10 AM PDT by RightField (the older you get ..... the older "old" is ......)
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To: Quix
very thankful he prays an hour a day

Where's that info from, Quix? Any word on his Bible-reading habits?

MM

169 posted on 07/01/2003 10:31:50 AM PDT by MississippiMan
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To: Quix
the pride,ridgity,narrowness,blindness in the other dominations, is at least as serious....

Exactly my point...if I had judged all pentecostals by a bad experience at one bad church...I would not have been blessed with some dear pentecostals friends. I am not a pentacostal but often attend one that is next door to me.
A christian, if we must judge them should be on their own individual behavior or their fruits of the spirit...not on the church they attend. Not all Methodist churched are bad, as not all other churches are bad.
Now if a church for example accepts things against God, such as homosexuality...any christian should run for their lives !
When we as christians tear each other down we are hurting God's church of which all true christians belong.
I have been a christian for 50 years...When Christ returns we will probably be surprised to see who is taken and who is left behind !
I am not a Methodist...
170 posted on 07/01/2003 10:41:38 AM PDT by OREALLY
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To: All
The prophet Zechariah said that in the last days, Jerusalem would become a "burdensome stone" and that all who try to shoulder that burden will be "cut to pieces."

The warning is given to "all the people of the earth [gathered] against it." The prophet Daniel prophesied that someone would come up with a workable peace plan.

Daniel 9:27 speaks of someone confirming a seven year covenant between Israel and her enemies. The covenant is broken mid-way through over an incursion into the same holy places currently responsible for the Peace talks.

Do you see a pattern here?

Today, the only path to peace

involved dividing the indivisible.

But a form of peace will come.

Somebody will come up with a solution

to the thorniest foreign policy problem in history.

Hailed as a great peacemaker,

he will rise to global power.

The Antichrist

171 posted on 07/01/2003 10:45:25 AM PDT by Neenah ("It's always something ! ")
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To: OREALLY
Well said.

Agree.
172 posted on 07/01/2003 11:49:35 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: ET(end tyranny)
Your post is so bad, I hardly know where to start!

You are certainly correct about his post being bad. Your real problem is that you did not know where to end. That has to be the longest post I have ever seen.

173 posted on 07/01/2003 11:51:06 AM PDT by Radix
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To: MississippiMan
From a source God touched me with a most heavy anointing through.
174 posted on 07/01/2003 11:59:29 AM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: Neenah
Absolutely.

Love that song.
Thanks.
175 posted on 07/01/2003 12:00:20 PM PDT by Quix (FAIR MINDED & INTERESTED--please watch UFO special Tues eve & share opinions)
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To: Radix
Part of the reason it is long is because I used scripture to back up what I was saying. I could have mis-stated scripture like the person I was replying to, but I chose to post scripture so that people could see it, instead of merely 'taking my word' for it.

Sorry it bothered you.

176 posted on 07/01/2003 12:07:07 PM PDT by ET(end tyranny) ( Luke 16:17 -- And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.)
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To: Cacophonous
I have made it a point to read the entire thread as of 15:00 Tuesday, 1 July.

I would advise you to do more study and research before you make such sweeping remarks.
177 posted on 07/01/2003 12:07:11 PM PDT by Radix
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To: ET(end tyranny)
It did not bother me. I was trying to be a bit funny, in the midst of all of this confusion.
178 posted on 07/01/2003 12:07:59 PM PDT by Radix
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To: MississippiMan
I'm having the same questions as you regarding GW's born-again experience. Is it really real???? Is he biblically ignorant? That may be part of it, the fact that he's somewhat of a baby Christian However, I figure the Spirit of God would strive mightily with him to lead him in the right direction. The problem may be, is the President listening to man or God??? At this point, I'm beginning to be unsure.
179 posted on 07/01/2003 12:20:32 PM PDT by Canadian Outrage (All us Western Canuks belong South)
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To: Quix
Right on you are!!
180 posted on 07/01/2003 12:35:33 PM PDT by Canadian Outrage (All us Western Canuks belong South)
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To: Neenah
Exactly!!
181 posted on 07/01/2003 12:39:01 PM PDT by Canadian Outrage (All us Western Canuks belong South)
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To: Cacophonous
Replacement theology has been totally debunked, See Arnold Fructembaums 'Israelology", Israel is not the church, her promises were to national Israel, not the church.
182 posted on 07/01/2003 12:43:22 PM PDT by Scythian
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To: gedeon3
How so?
183 posted on 07/01/2003 1:38:42 PM PDT by Cacophonous
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To: Scythian
God's promises were made to national Israel, not the Church? He does not require Jews to find their salvation through the promised Messiah in order to be saved?
184 posted on 07/01/2003 1:42:46 PM PDT by Cacophonous
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To: Cacophonous
He does not require Jews to find their salvation through the promised Messiah in order to be saved?

Of course not. The believing gentiles were to be grafted unto Israel, NOT Israel being grafted unto gentile churches. When the times comes the Jews will accept the Jewish Messiah, and not some gentile/pagan version.

185 posted on 07/01/2003 1:59:50 PM PDT by ET(end tyranny) ( Luke 16:17 -- And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.)
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To: ET(end tyranny)
Well, as a Christian, I have accepted my Savior, and can only hope that Jews will accept Christ, and not some Jewish/pagan version. If I can be of service in helping any Jew (or any one else, for that matter) accept Christ, I will be happy to do so.
186 posted on 07/01/2003 2:36:18 PM PDT by Cacophonous
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To: ET(end tyranny)
He does not require Jews to find their salvation through the promised Messiah in order to be saved?

Of course not. The believing gentiles were to be grafted unto Israel, NOT Israel being grafted unto gentile churches. When the times comes the Jews will accept the Jewish Messiah, and not some gentile/pagan version.

Actually, you answered my question in the affirmative; God does require Jews to accept a Messiah before being saved. Jews just do not believe Jesus Christ was that Messiah. Fine.

However, as a Christian, I cannot accept that anyone who has not accepted Christ can be saved.

187 posted on 07/01/2003 2:41:27 PM PDT by Cacophonous
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To: ET(end tyranny); Cacophonous
...I hate hitting "post" before I've finished my thought; I apologize for the disjointed posts...

Anyway, because I cannot believe that Jews (or Muslims, or Buddhists, or atheists...) will be saved does not make me anti-Jewish, anti-Muslim, anti-Buddhist, anti-atheist, etc. On the contrary, Christ teaches us to love all, even the sinners and the unsaved.

But I would not be a Christian if I told a Jew he did not have to believe in Christ in order to get to heaven.

188 posted on 07/01/2003 2:45:28 PM PDT by Cacophonous
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To: Cacophonous; ET(end tyranny)
Geez, I'm a lousy typist, too.

The following paragraph in Post #188:

...because I cannot believe that Jews (or Muslims, or Buddhists, or atheists...) will be saved...

should of course read:

...because I cannot believe that Jews (or Muslims, or Buddhists, or atheists...) will be not saved...

Significant difference; I apologize again.

189 posted on 07/01/2003 2:48:47 PM PDT by Cacophonous
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To: Quix
God allows people freedom to make choices. Jews are NO exception and are NOT given a free ride to eternity based on disbelief of Jesus Christ. Honestly, do read your Bible and accept His truth. The gift of eternal life is available to all, Jew or otherwise, however I repeat, Jewish or otherwise the ONLY way to eternal life is BELIEF and ACCEPTANCE of Jesus Christ as him/her personal Savior. He is the ONLY way. NO WHERE in the Bible does it state otherwise. No where.
190 posted on 07/01/2003 7:02:29 PM PDT by nmh
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To: OREALLY
grammar point
191 posted on 07/01/2003 8:02:45 PM PDT by Libertina (FR - roaches check in, but they don't check out....)
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To: MississippiMan
Klinton was a baptist. Bush is a Methodist. I don't know which church he attends though. Sorry.
192 posted on 07/02/2003 6:12:47 AM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD is still in control!)
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To: OREALLY
BUMP!
193 posted on 07/12/2003 9:57:55 PM PDT by OREALLY
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Comment #194 Removed by Moderator

To: Cacophonous
My reply to yours is not to disagree with your opinion, which you are entitled to. All of the quotes that you used were from the new testament and so do not pertain to Judaism and what we believe. when you use the term "christ" you attach it to Jesus. Jews never accepted Jesus as the Messiah, therefore anything he said or was written later has absolutely no weight on Judaism or our perceptions. On a personal note, I believe that the fast growing secular population in Israel today may have a huge effect on the state of the nation....but thats just my opinion.
195 posted on 09/15/2003 2:49:12 PM PDT by priceofreedom (On A Roadmap To Hell)
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To: priceofreedom
Thank you.

You are exactly right - the very non-acceptance of Christ by Jews as the promised Messiah - and hence of the New Testament - is what separates Jews and Christians. Obviously.

But my saying what I did, and my belief that (on a related issue) the only way to salvation is through Christ, does not make me anti-Jewish or intolerant or anything of that sort, anymore than a Jew's claim that I am following a false Messiah makes him anti-Christian or intolerant (I know you have not accused me of such, and I appreciate it, but others have).

But I will try to persuade, and barring that, at least enjoy a civil discussion. And I take no offense at Jews evangelizing their faith.

Again, thank you.

196 posted on 09/15/2003 3:02:31 PM PDT by Cacophonous
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