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Screed: With Treason, Ann Coulter once again defines a new low in America's political debate
Spinsanity ^ | july 2, 2003 | Brendan Nyhan

Posted on 07/02/2003 4:50:57 PM PDT by The Raven

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To: ChadGore
Nah... Ann is atrocious when it comes to fact checking. Before you guys get all in a tiff about this guy shredding Ann, please note that he did the same thing to Michael Moore. He was even more critical of Michael Moore's disregard of the truth to prove a point.

Ann Coulter blatantly missuses the footnote. It's a fact. Her general argument is valid, but she lets herself get carried by excess. If a person writes an op ed in the times, she says "The Times says...". It is intellectually dishonest of her, and she knows it, but she is more interested in proving her point than being scrupulous with sourcing and footnoting. She is the Michael Moore of the Right.

21 posted on 07/02/2003 5:18:19 PM PDT by dogbyte12
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To: The Raven
I'm tempted to Fisk this silly spinsanity screed, but the effort would be wasted.

He seems to be bent on proving Ann's point.

22 posted on 07/02/2003 5:19:13 PM PDT by absalom01
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To: The Raven
Throughout the book, she attributes outside book reviews, magazine profiles and op-eds to media outlets as if they were staff-written news reports, feeding the perception of bias on the part of these institutions. These include a New York Times Week in Review article by historian Richard Gid Powers cited as "According to the Times..." (p. 6);

Oh, this example just shatters Ann's credibility. We all know that the NYT Week in Review has a wide variety of opinion from right to left, and this citation just happened to be from a left wing historian.

The other examples of "factual errors" the writer cites are like this. Mainly technical errors that do not detract from the essential truth that Ann conveys.

23 posted on 07/02/2003 5:29:50 PM PDT by Plutarch
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To: The Raven
"Screed: With Treason, Ann Coulter once again defines a new low in America's political debate"

So the unvarnished TRUTH is now deemed a new low in America's political debate.

24 posted on 07/02/2003 5:46:20 PM PDT by Dacus943
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To: The Raven
For years, she has infused her syndicated columns with cheap shots and asides directed at targets like President Bill Clinton, the American Civil Liberties Union and Hustler publisher Larry Flynt

That the author sees this as a bad thing is all you need to know about him.

25 posted on 07/02/2003 5:51:51 PM PDT by JennysCool
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To: The Raven
At times, Coulter portrays liberals and the left as engaged in a grand conspiracy to destroy the United States:
While undermining victory in the Cold War, liberals dedicated themselves to mainstreaming Communist ideals at home... Betraying the manifest national defense objectives of the country is only part of the left's treasonous scheme. They aim to destroy America from the inside with their relentless attacks on morality and the truth. (p. 289)

All true, so ... his point is???

26 posted on 07/02/2003 5:53:06 PM PDT by zip
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To: NativeNewYorker
For well-informed FReepers, there's not much new material.

It is well documented (footnoted) and I use it for easy (and immediate) references. That alone makes it worthwhile.

27 posted on 07/02/2003 5:56:33 PM PDT by zip
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To: The Raven
He(Brendan Nyhan) gets, it.
The most serious challege to the democrat socialist machine since I've been an adult (that I know of).. Useing the word irrational of this book telegraphs dis-information because the book is supported in ever detail by solid data... One of the first many efforts to discredit it I believe.. The time is so right for this book... The democratic party has been totally co-opted and seemingly the co-opting of the republican party is well advanced... I think soon the biggest threat to the credibilty of this book will be from so-called conservatives.. since democrats have none.

The book is so well written it could be the most important and timely political book in the last 20 years because it goes for the bedrock issues of what is mainly wrong with America. Just saying "liberal" or "Socialist" are too weak because after all Communism "IS" Socialism and is where all Socialism is heading in the end.

I think this book is so important because of what it DON'T say but implies. No doubt in my mind that is the intent of the book, and it will work. Ann Coulter merely inseminated the reader with a seed.... and a fetus is growing.. Because if this book is true what have the american communists been doing since the House Commitee on Un-American Activitys CLOSED...

A very pregnant question, not asked directly, but implied..

28 posted on 07/02/2003 5:57:39 PM PDT by hosepipe
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To: dogbyte12
Nah... Ann is atrocious when it comes to fact checking

Excuse me? I heard her debate with numerous people on television and radio and she has substantiated her point of view very well. That is why the libs hate her so much.

Ann Coulter blatantly missuses the footnote.

Can you point to a few examples, or are you merely venting?

29 posted on 07/02/2003 5:59:08 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: The Raven
Unbelievable. I went to Waldenbooks at the mall and Ann's book was in the entryway with #2 prominately displayed in front of 2 rows and 1 row of hitlery's book with #3. B&N didn't have any Treason's displayed but said they were just sold out. They would take my name and hold a copy yada, yada, yada. They did have many Lying History's laying around.
30 posted on 07/02/2003 6:01:25 PM PDT by zip
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To: The Raven
Sounds to me like she qualifies for an Academy Award!!


31 posted on 07/02/2003 6:02:36 PM PDT by optimistically_conservative
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To: dogbyte12
She is the Michael Moore of the Right.

Totally off the mark and straight out of DU. You've been around too long to post crap like that. Since when is the use of facts/logic equated to lies/feelings of the left?

32 posted on 07/02/2003 6:06:34 PM PDT by zip
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To: JennysCool
That the author sees this as a bad thing is all you need to know about him.

Excellent point. Thank you for bringing it out.

33 posted on 07/02/2003 6:09:37 PM PDT by zip
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To: The Raven
If a writer wants to make a point he should try not to put the reader to sleep with minutiae.
34 posted on 07/02/2003 6:13:33 PM PDT by CaptainK
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To: zip
Her sourcing is atrocious. I will not repent on that fact. She misquotes, misconstrues, and misleads. She is polemicist. The fact that I agree with her points does not change that fact. I would rather her have a "more boring" yet fairer book, but I know that sells less copies.

Read the entire article, and tell me if you genuinely believe she doesn't take liscence. I also just read the author's deconstruction of Michael Moore, and I think it is a valid analogy. Liberals agree with Michael Moore, and they ignore his shoddy research. Just because Ann Coulter is correct that McCarthyism for example, was completely overblown, it still does not justify her in misquoting, misidentifying, and obfuscating the context of the comments in question. The excesses of the left are great enough without resorting to such tactics. That is my point.

If you want to read a more serious refutation of the McCarthyism charging left, read Brent Bozell's work. His father worked with Joe McCarthy, and the book is more serious and scholarly in tone. Then again, 30 times more people will read Ann Coulter. It comes down to a measure of taste though I suppose. I prefer Hugh Hewitt over Michael Savage. Polemicists aren't my bag.

35 posted on 07/02/2003 6:14:03 PM PDT by dogbyte12
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To: dogbyte12; ChadGore
Nah... Ann is atrocious when it comes to fact checking. Before you guys get all in a tiff about this guy shredding Ann, please note that he did the same thing to Michael Moore. He was even more critical of Michael Moore's disregard of the truth to prove a point.

Spinsanity does go after both the right and the left for lies and distortions, but the two guys that run it openly admit on their own "About Spinsanity" page that they're card-carrying liberals, and IMHO they do have a tendency to attack those on the right for supposed "lesser crimes" that they would let slide if it were coming from a RAT. It's not an overt bias on their part, but it does exist.

Besides, we all know Ann Coulter is a professional bombthrower given to rhetorical flourishes. So what? And it's really quite lame for liberal columnists (of whom Nyhan is but one of dozens thus far) to use the Constitutional definition of "treason" in order to attack Ann's book, when the dictionary definition of "treason" means as little as "a betrayal of trust or confidence" ... a charge that can EASILY be made against almost any prominent liberal.

Unless Ann specifically says at the beginning, "I hereby accuse all the following liberals mentioned in this book of the CRIME of Treason as defined in Article III of the US Constitution," then it's disingenuous for any reviewer, including Mr. Nyhan, to judge her book by the legal definition of the word. (I have yet to read the book; I'd appreciate someone telling me whether or not she actually does this.)

For Nyhan or any other critic to claim otherwise is the equivalent of a newspaper concert reviewer hearing the band's guitarist backstage after the show saying "Wow, we really murdered them tonight!" and then spending the entire 1000 words of his review the next day complaining about how nobody at the concert was actually killed.

36 posted on 07/02/2003 6:26:40 PM PDT by Dont Mention the War
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To: Dont Mention the War
Bottom line is: not all Democrats are traitors, but all traitors are Democrats.
37 posted on 07/02/2003 6:35:52 PM PDT by jlc
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To: The Raven
"Sweeping generalizations"? This article is one entire sweeping generalization. What a nut.
38 posted on 07/02/2003 6:35:54 PM PDT by john the bowler
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To: jlc
"Not all Democrats are traitors, but all traitors are Democrats."

The well-turned eloquence of the day!

39 posted on 07/02/2003 6:40:26 PM PDT by friendly ((Badges?, we don gots to show no stinkin' badges!))
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To: The Raven
Ann's getting to them. Life is good.
40 posted on 07/02/2003 6:41:15 PM PDT by b4its2late (FOOTBALL REFEREES - We're not in the game, we are the game.)
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