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Selling Homosexuality to America
CBN ^ | 7/11/03 | Craig von Buseck

Posted on 07/11/2003 2:12:34 PM PDT by apackof2

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To: I got the rope
He is telling us if we follow HIS way, then we will be chastised, beaten, killed, and ostracized. If you follow him then people would single you out, call you names (self-rightous), and call you a kook.

Are you doing this on purpose or what?

Ever since I made the statement about some "self righteous" freepers who rant about homosexuality...you've managed to fit comments about this into your responses.

Above you seem to be describing yourself as the follower of Christ and me as the persecuter who "called you a name... self righteous".

You can't be serious.

151 posted on 07/13/2003 8:02:09 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: tdadams
Well whether or not that particular statistic in that particular article was debunked or not, based on a google search, the story still has merit and apparently "bug chasing" is a very real phenomena. After looking at some of the references it appears that the only real point of dispute was the number.

Chasing The Bug

Bug Chasers and the Thought Police (This particular one debunks the debunkers.)

Barebacking and bug chasers: expressions of an HIV subculture

Bug Chasers

Ex-Gay Watch

152 posted on 07/13/2003 8:02:48 PM PDT by sweetliberty ("Having the right to do a thing is not at all the same thing as being right in doing it.")
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To: PurVirgo
Here is a good site to read.
http://www.broadcaster.org.uk/section2/transcript/marriage1.htm
There is nothing wrong with not being married as long as you are not letting your youthful lusts get away with you.
The bible says if you can not control yourself then you should get married. I will search for the verse for you. I am in total brain lock right now...(my wife keeps asking me to get her some ice cream.)
153 posted on 07/13/2003 8:08:58 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: I got the rope
"but do we all know right from wrong. Apparantly not. If we all did then Christ would not have had to die for our sins."

Knowing right from wrong and choosing right over wrong are two different things. Because we are all born into sin, we know good and evil. But knowing is not enough. Jesus shed His blood not only to redeem our sin nature but to give us strength in our weakness to choose good over evil.

154 posted on 07/13/2003 8:10:26 PM PDT by sweetliberty ("Having the right to do a thing is not at all the same thing as being right in doing it.")
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To: PurVirgo
>>"I have tried to read the Bible, but I have a hard time getting through it."<<

Leviticus and Deuteronomy were the most difficult things I've ever read!! The commentary helped me over the hump. On the whole, the Bible is the most exciting, most interesting, most awesome historical record ever written!

His Word is faithful and true!
155 posted on 07/13/2003 8:11:10 PM PDT by viaveritasvita
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To: DannyTN
Well tomorrow is D-Day so to speak if Massachusettes allow Homosexuals to Marry how totally discusting!

What is going on in this world!
How will the courts deal with Child Custody, Spousal Support, property rights for Gays, why don't they just wipe out marraige altogether then maybe everyone could just 'Do there own Thing" because the government will back you up! Come Soon Jesus We need you!
156 posted on 07/13/2003 8:11:31 PM PDT by missyme
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To: DannyTN
Well tomorrow is D-Day so to speak if Massachusettes allow Homosexuals to Marry how totally discusting!

What is going on in this world!
How will the courts deal with Child Custody, Spousal Support, property rights for Gays, why don't they just wipe out marraige altogether then maybe everyone could just 'Do there own Thing" because the government will back you up! Come Soon Jesus We need you!
157 posted on 07/13/2003 8:11:31 PM PDT by missyme
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To: DannyTN
Well tomorrow is D-Day so to speak if Massachusettes allow Homosexuals to Marry how totally discusting!

What is going on in this world!
How will the courts deal with Child Custody, Spousal Support, property rights for Gays, why don't they just wipe out marraige altogether then maybe everyone could just 'Do there own Thing" because the government will back you up! Come Soon Jesus We need you!
158 posted on 07/13/2003 8:13:01 PM PDT by missyme
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To: Jorge
See the scripture reference in my post #57. I think it makes it quite clear that adultery and fornication are on equal footing with the practice of homosexuality.
159 posted on 07/13/2003 8:14:40 PM PDT by sweetliberty ("Having the right to do a thing is not at all the same thing as being right in doing it.")
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To: Jorge
Jorge, Jorge, Jorge...are you going to tell me you weren't on full attack mode when you joined this thread?

I've lurked other threads long enough to know that this is your M.O.

Fine. I'll concede. I apologize.
160 posted on 07/13/2003 8:14:51 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: viaveritasvita
I'm tempted to say something like: "You're not from around here are you." LOL! Maybe you forgot the clinton years???

I wasn't on FreeRepublic during the Clinton years. Guess I missed some real good threads!

161 posted on 07/13/2003 8:16:06 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: sweetliberty
I reread my post. I guess it was a bit confusing. Thanks.
162 posted on 07/13/2003 8:21:22 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: DannyTN
And what percentage of that 1% were raped when they were young, and convinced "you're one of us now - you can't go back." Rape of the innocent is a thing of humor to some sodomites - and a way to "get dates." A lot of people would be shocked to hear what vice/sex crimes detectives know about the nastiest of the sodomites.
163 posted on 07/13/2003 8:23:09 PM PDT by 185JHP ( Penumbras. Emanations. Fatuities.)
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To: KC_for_Freedom
What you're talking about is a tactic the left uses that was started by Leon Trotsky, known as "entrism". This is where socialists hijack a social movement to further their agenda of a worldwide socialist government.

Most decent people aren't racist, and treat black and white people the same. Unfortunately the anti-racism movement has been hijacked by leftists who have seen it as a perfect opportunity to push a radical agenda. Rather than emphasizing ethnic equality, they've moved on to push 'cultural' equality - as long as the culture in question isn't Christian Conservativism. Similarly, the Feminist movement has been hijacked by socialist entrists, seeking to push their agenda.

This has led to a huge shift in domestic and foreign policy, and has allowed for situations where - for instance - Christians who treat people of all races equally can be branded "racist", or Christian African Americans are "racist" for opposing the negative, mysoginist (sp?) messages of rap music! When you think about it for a minute, it's bizzare!

In a foreign policy sense, as I've mentioned before here on FR, it's been hugely damaging to the people of Africa the leftists claim to support so ardently. Supporting multiple tribal cultures in African and other 3rd world cultures gets in the way of forming national, and christian cultures. This gets in the way of overthrowing tribalist Marxist and Islamist dictators in favor of the free market capitalist governments that 3rd world countries so despirately need. Of course, creating stable free markets across Africa - where foreign investors can build up the economies and make 3rd world countries valuable contributors in the world economy is "racist" because it would mean getting rid of a lot of tribal cultures.

The gay agenda is another front where socialists can undermine traditional Christian values. What has happend in the past decade or so is that the gay agenda has been grafted on to the feminist and anti-racism (now multiculturalist) movements by the socialist entrists who have hijacked those movements.

Look no further than how radical lesbian feminism and marxist feminism is now equated with feminism; respect for mothers, housewives, and women who chose to work based on their own talents and abilities is off the agenda. Meanwhile, "hetrosexism" ("sexism" against gays by straight people) is on the feminist agenda. Sexism against men dressed as women is on the feminist agenda.

Similarly, many of the same laws preventing anti-semitism discrimination against African Americans have also had "homophobia" added to the list you can be thrown in the slammer for.

Think something's screwed up when Christians start being treated - by the law - like Klansmen? Worried about free speech? Do you read the Bible? You're not just homophobic, but according to these hijacked movements, you're also a sexist and a racist!
164 posted on 07/13/2003 8:32:05 PM PDT by ThinkFreedom (Well, that's my 2c, take or leave.)
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To: I got the rope
Jorge, Jorge, Jorge...are you going to tell me you weren't on full attack mode when you joined this thread?

I've lurked other threads long enough to know that this is your M.O.

Me in "attack mode"? I can't believe you would say such a mean thing. I'm really hurt. (You must be thinking about somebody else )

Anyway..even if I was, you're the one who posted the verse that Jesus said we are not supposed to bring "peace" but should "divide".

So that means you are persecuting me for being a follower of Christ. Repent!

Fine. I'll concede. I apologize.

You don't sound very sorry to me. I think maybe you need to do penance. :)

165 posted on 07/13/2003 8:36:44 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: PurVirgo
Then you understand where I stand. Judgement for matters of the flesh are the court's responisbility, not mine. Judgement for matters of the spirit goes to God, not me.

Are you not a member of society? Are you not a citizen? Your vote could alter what some appointed black robe judge says about our culture. (i.e...sodomy) These "Ministers of Justice" were originally supposed to be of the greatest moral standing. The courts are now a joke, because they invent their own morality or laws out of thin air.

166 posted on 07/13/2003 8:42:28 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: CROSSHIGHWAYMAN
It is definately a learned "recruited" behavior. Read Pink Swastika about the "Youth programs" in Germany in the lst half of the 20th century. How do you explain ALL the molested boys who became homosexuals--like Roehm of Nazi fame and the Catholic Priests who have molested boys and confessed that they were molested as boys.

People are "conditioned" to think the way they do--it is not by accident that some believe there is a "gay" gene. It is from the constant indoctrination of the media and the removal of "shame" when no acts will be considered "wrong"--even man-boy sex.
167 posted on 07/13/2003 8:46:28 PM PDT by savagesusie (Ann Coulter rules!)
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To: 185JHP
A lot of people would be shocked to hear what vice/sex crimes detectives know about the nastiest of the sodomites.

I think that the problem, our people don't know the course this perversion takes and how it manifests itself.

Thus we don't view it as a perversion of natural desires combined with rebellion, we view it as "natural". And nothing could be further from the truth.

I don't really have anything to base this on other than annedotal stores, but my guess is 95% raped when young and the other 5% just wicked. Which means I'm not unsympathetic to them, the damage inflicted on them wasn't their fault. But it is a perversion that spreads like a desease and it should remain a state's right to outlaw it.

168 posted on 07/13/2003 8:48:44 PM PDT by DannyTN (Note left on my door by a pack of neighborhood dogs.)
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To: DannyTN
And it should remain a punishable offense under the UCMJ. FReegards
169 posted on 07/13/2003 8:50:57 PM PDT by 185JHP ( Penumbras. Emanations. Fatuities.)
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To: sweetliberty
See the scripture reference in my post #57. I think it makes it quite clear that adultery and fornication are on equal footing with the practice of homosexuality.

I don't need to reference your previous post. If you say so I'll take your word for it.

But without being too nit-picky...I have to say that I'm not quite sure adultery and fornication are on "equal footing" with the practice of homosexuality.

I mean they're all sin...and God prescribes the death penalty for both adultery and homosexuality in the Old Testament.

BUT...it seems to me that homosexuality goes further than simple sexual immorality and disobedience to God...but also totally distorts God's design and created intent for human sexuality.

Now that doesn't mean that I think homosexuality is the worst form of sexual immorality around...I believe heterosexual pedophilia is worse because it violates even more standards of decency. As well as God's special care for children.

170 posted on 07/13/2003 8:53:07 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: ThinkFreedom
well said.
171 posted on 07/13/2003 8:57:00 PM PDT by KC_for_Freedom
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To: Jorge
From my perspective, I agree with you, but I'm not sure that God does. He says that none of them will inherit the kingdom of God so it sounds like the same punishment awaits them all. Or maybe it's a matter of degrees or maybe heterosexual promiscuity is something one is more likely to repent of ultimately. I don't know. Purely speculation on my part.
172 posted on 07/13/2003 8:57:16 PM PDT by sweetliberty ("Having the right to do a thing is not at all the same thing as being right in doing it.")
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To: Jorge
So that means you are persecuting me for being a follower of Christ.

Jorge, why do I get the feeling that you are everthing but a follower of Christ. BTW...Catholics do Penance...and I'm not Catholic. If you are not going to accept my apology for hurting your feeling then I'll have to take it back and start flaming you. I don't want that. I don't want to have to follow you from thread to thread for weeks on end. I don't want to have to search for you at DU like some angry troll. Can't we all just get along.

173 posted on 07/13/2003 9:03:56 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: sweetliberty
From my perspective, I agree with you, but I'm not sure that God does.

I don't either.

But I do know that some sins have greater consequences than others when it comes to their destructive nature.
And God doesn't want us to destroy our lives.

174 posted on 07/13/2003 9:12:00 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge
So tell us Jorge. How do you really feel about sodomy?
All forms of it. Hetero, Homo, etc. Just for the record.
175 posted on 07/13/2003 9:15:46 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: I got the rope
Allow an aside pointed added to your cogent post.

While there is a hormonal influence traceable in a very rare percentage of homosexual behavior, the behavior is a complex mix of onset hormonal rage (prepubescent/pubescent) and choice in behavior patterns, IMHO. But how to explain the homosexuals who actually turn their lives around and away from the debasement of homosexual behaviors? You can tell a homo-activist by their insistence that this is not a genuine turnaround.

As human beings are exposed to notions of God and salvation, there is a very real tug of war between the 'adamic nature' we're all born with and the longing to commune with God, to be pleasing to Him not abhorent to Him. I think this is generated because of the human spirit within our human soul.

As the homosexual community seeks society's full affirmation for their deviant behavior, they cannot resolve the inner whispers in their human spirit ... they cannot mollify that which Holy God calls them to by forcing through their activism the acceptance and protection within this society or any society.

Much of the activist behavior of homosexuals is misdirected rage against God's still small voice calling them to reject the behavioral urges in favor of spiritual growth. Deviancy in sexual matters (whether adultery, or homosexual behavior, or addiction to pornography ...) is an immaturity in sexual development where sexual and social development run into the 'diety' needs of the adult human being with a spirit that will not be at peace until a relationship with the Creator is begun. It is the source of so many homosexuals that rage against Christianity. It is also the source of the demand to be accepted within a church community as if they are 'just like everyone else'. They are not like everyone else, unless everyone else is slave to addictive behaviors!

You wrote, "He wanted us to love him freely. Homosexual life is no life at all." As you know, when our behavior impedes our free association with Him, we are in a state of 'unrequited spiritual love', deep spiritual longing if you will, thus such a state in life is not 'aliveness', spiritually. I'm reminded of where Jesus said 'Let the dead bury the dead'.

And lastly, 'Many are called but few are chosen' and 'Faithful is He that calleth you, for He will also do it' (calls you to salvation for He will also save you). It is innate in so many to want to respond to God's still small voice by doing their own saving, being good enough to 'warrant' God's affirmation of them, not relenting to allow Him to also 'do it', to grace them with eternal life in Him. As Cain railed at God when told to bring a specific offering, 'I can bring what I have produced by my own efforts and it will be good enough.' But it never was.

176 posted on 07/13/2003 9:22:20 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: Jorge
"My summer with Jorge"
177 posted on 07/13/2003 9:26:47 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: only1percent
Being gay isn't "natrual" for human beings. Sure homosexuality has been around for ages however the root cause it typically sexual abuse or lack of a role model. For example, is it any wonder that Cher Bono's daughter, Chastity, is a lesbian? This vain woman had NO time for her daughter so when she was of age she acted out her emotional neglect through lesbianism. As for sexual molestation or abuse, surely you don't need examples of that. The other typical reason is sometimes more difficult to explain so I let Cher do it for me.
178 posted on 07/13/2003 9:33:20 PM PDT by nmh
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To: I got the rope
Jorge, why do I get the feeling that you are everthing but a follower of Christ. BTW...Catholics do Penance...and I'm not Catholic. If you are not going to accept my apology for hurting your feeling then I'll have to take it back and start flaming you. I don't want that. I don't want to have to follow you from thread to thread for weeks on end. I don't want to have to search for you at DU like some angry troll. Can't we all just get along.

Sure we can. But you need to lighten up just a tad first.

My response to you was meant to be tongue in cheek. Go back and read it again. It was a joke dude.
I'm not Catholic either.

I am rather surprised not only at your lack of sense of humor but also your hostility.

You judge me as not being a follower of Christ and then tell me that if I don't accept your apology you will "have to take it back and start flaming" me?

This is an example of what it means to be Christ-like?

I was trying to be light hearted and humerous with you... and unlike you, I've made no judgements about whether you are a follower of Christ or not.

179 posted on 07/13/2003 9:36:25 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: I got the rope
"My summer with Jorge"

Thank you for posting that link to my post. I stand by what I said....and I like the way I said it.

Of course if you disagree, by all means feel free to challenge it.

180 posted on 07/13/2003 9:47:10 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: I got the rope
yes, and yes. I do vote, and I do stand for things that I beleive are right. Equal (not special) rights are an issue for me, but I don't beleive gays should get married. Marriage is a covenant of God, and should therefore be left to the chrches anyways, not the gov't.

You can berate, scream, picket, holler all you want. I just don't agree with that approach.

Mom always said you get more flies with honey than vinegar, and I tend to agree.

181 posted on 07/13/2003 9:55:33 PM PDT by PurVirgo (Never fault a pig for having a shorter neck than a girrafe)
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To: Jorge
I was just trying to point out your M.O. Jorge. You attacked me on more than one occasion. Without knowing the facts BTW. Now you play the victim. I was trying to explain some things to PurVirgo, but you insist on corrupting this thread by calling me self-rightous and trying to find Biblical inaccuracy when there is none.

I'll play nice, but you better not whine...dude.
182 posted on 07/13/2003 10:04:29 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: I got the rope
Jorge, why do I get the feeling that you are everthing but a follower of Christ.

Probably because you are so busy condemning anybody who dares disagree with you...that you have are hard time imagining them ascending to your personal level of holiness.

If you are not going to accept my apology for hurting your feeling then I'll have to take it back and start flaming you. I don't want that. I don't want to have to follow you from thread to thread for weeks on end.

You can stalk me all over the internet if you want. Flame me for months on end.
Do you think I care?

I welcome any and all challenges to my posts.
It's what makes posting on FR fun.

183 posted on 07/13/2003 10:06:37 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: PurVirgo
Fair enough. I guess for some this approach could work. My wife uses it on me all the time. LOL. Good luck with "the Word." Don't give up. If at times you find something confusing, put the book down and pray about it.

Sometimes having more than one translation helps too.
184 posted on 07/13/2003 10:10:09 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: Jorge
In case you haven't noticed - this thread is what, a day or so old. I got a rope, sweetliberty, viaveritaswita and myself, even though there was disagreement, have been able to discuss a controversial topic without reverting to name calling and immaturity.
185 posted on 07/13/2003 10:10:51 PM PDT by PurVirgo (Never fault a pig for having a shorter neck than a girrafe)
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To: I got the rope
ok... hey, a bible study on FR would be pretty neat. But then, not such a good idea now that I think about it
186 posted on 07/13/2003 10:12:59 PM PDT by PurVirgo (Never fault a pig for having a shorter neck than a girrafe)
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To: I got the rope
I was just trying to point out your M.O. Jorge. You attacked me on more than one occasion. Without knowing the facts BTW.

Funny, I don't remember attacking you.
But then I don't take FR message board disagreements personally. You shouldn't either.

I really don't remember any past unpleasant encounters with you. Sorry.

Now you play the victim.

I TOLD YOU. I was JOKING. I think your attacks are funny. It's a form of message board entertainment for me.

I was trying to explain some things to PurVirgo, but you insist on corrupting this thread by calling me self-rightous and trying to find Biblical inaccuracy when there is none.

You poor thing. Nothing's stopping you from clarifying your personal positions or Biblical convictions to anyone.

Perhaps if you would stop condemning those whose disagree with you as not being followers of Christ, you might be more convincing.
Just a suggestion dude.

187 posted on 07/13/2003 10:24:14 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Jorge
Most of the time I am joking. Especially when I said I would hunt you down like an angry troll (I wish I could find that gif image!)

I try to stay low-key in many posts, but I certainly remember you in all the homo-apologist threads that start here on FR. Your angle is the liberaltarian one. I can't accept this. It's too illogical for me...it is also counter to my Christian beliefs.

I don't think I've ever been "hypocritical" on any subject here.

Maybe you should clarify how you feel on certain subjects so that all on this thread can see for themselves. Enlighten us Jorge. BTW is pronounced "Hor-he"
188 posted on 07/13/2003 10:42:05 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: I got the rope
BTW is IT prounounced "Hor-he"?
189 posted on 07/13/2003 10:43:42 PM PDT by I got the rope
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To: sweetliberty
I never denied that bug chasing is a real phenomenon, for God knows why. I stated that the article you cited was less than truthful in many aspects, specifically the 25% of new infections number cited.

I'll take a look at the other links you posted. Thanks.

190 posted on 07/14/2003 2:27:57 AM PDT by tdadams
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To: MHGinTN
Deviancy in sexual matters (whether adultery, or homosexual behavior, or addiction to pornography ...) is an immaturity in sexual development where sexual and social development run into the 'diety' needs of the adult human being...

The idolatry of perversion... click on my name...

191 posted on 07/14/2003 4:34:20 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: Jorge
BUT...it seems to me that homosexuality goes further than simple sexual immorality

Idolatry of perversion...

192 posted on 07/14/2003 4:37:06 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: PurVirgo
As for astrology, it's more entertainment than anything else.

It is idolatry. Click on my name...

193 posted on 07/14/2003 4:39:00 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: ThinkFreedom
What you're talking about is a tactic the left uses that was started by Leon Trotsky, known as "entrism".

The idolatry of Marxist paganism...

194 posted on 07/14/2003 4:45:15 AM PDT by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: Jorge
I'm not arguing that it's an exact science, it's just my anecdotal observation that gays appear to have a lot in common, regardless of where they're from or how old they are.

We could spot it easily as kids, and there does seem to be some kind of "gay sensibility." It's a stereotype, but gays really are florists, flight attendants, decorators, etc.

And since these stereotypes apply to gays from all over, there must be SOMETHING that gives them a common link. If not a gay gene, then I'm curious as to what it is.

195 posted on 07/14/2003 9:19:11 AM PDT by ItsJeff
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To: Jorge; I got the rope; viaveritasvita
{Now try getting a thread going about the evil adultery and heterosexual fornication is causing our society...and see how many responses you get}

FYI. Here are two recent FR threads which discussed these issues. Both threads did receive a lot of responses.

"He's celibate until marriage, and dates won't tolerate it"

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/929495/posts

"NEIL Bush Admits Asian Flings While Married"

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/945236/posts

196 posted on 07/14/2003 9:29:53 AM PDT by Kuksool
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To: MHGinTN; All
Our Last, Best Option

BreakPoint with Charles Colson

The Federal Marriage Amendment

The gay-rights movement is advancing like, as one gay activist put it, a juggernaut. First, Canada by judicial fiat legalized same-sex "marriage," and gay couples rushed to Canada to get "married." Second, in the Lawrence decision two weeks ago, the U.S. Supreme Court by judicial fiat struck down the Texas law prohibiting sodomy that makes consensual sex a protected right and sets the precedent for gay "marriage." And third, the Massachusetts Supreme Court by judicial fiat will likely legalize same-sex unions in that state—a ruling that could lead to a domino effect nationwide.

For centuries, civilizations worldwide protected heterosexual families because sex, in the natural order of things, is for procreation. But since the sexual revolution, we've treated sex as recreation, and now people are demanding it like a civil right, and they are succeeding. Gay "marriage" is on the horizon.

And some Christians believe that the battle is lost. There was hardly a protest over the Supreme Court case, one friend told me. And he said, "Face it, Chuck. You can't stop this juggernaut."

Oh, yeah? I'm reminded of the Battle of the Bulge in World War II. The Allied troops were surrounded, and their situation seemed hopeless. The Germans sent a message to the American general Anthony McAuliffe, asking him to surrender and save lives. His answer lives on in American folklore: "Us, surrender? Nuts."

Well, I say we do not rub our hands in despair. I say "nuts" to those who want to give up. Let's roll up our sleeves and get busy.

There is one thing left that could stop the gay "marriage" steamroller. It's a Constitutional amendment. And there's one prepared that says: "Marriage in the United States shall consist only of the union of a man and a woman."

I've been a little bit lukewarm to this idea because it's such a huge task to get a Constitutional amendment passed, but recent events have changed my mind. This is our last, best option.

The purpose of the Federal Marriage Amendment, according to Dr. Robert George of Princeton University, who helped draft it, is to take the decision about same-sex "marriage" out of the hands of the courts. The amendment will force the fight over marriage into legislatures and the democratic process.

And we can succeed, if Christians and others who value marriage refuse to lay down their arms and go to work.

Obviously, you need to talk to your senators and congressman about getting them to support the amendment. Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist (R-Tenn.) has already announced his support. There's no reason this can't pass in this Congress. Then it will go to the states for ratification, where our work will be cut out for us.

I don't want you just to make phone calls, however. I want you to start educating yourselves and your neighbors as to why heterosexual marriage is distinct. No society in history has ever tried this kind of radical social experiment. It's madness.

And we can make an intelligent case, but only if BreakPoint listeners are equipped with the worldview arguments to present it prudentially to their neighbors. So please call us here at BreakPoint (1-877-3-CALLBP). We'd like to send you information you can use. Then, let's go to work. I know it sounds extreme, but I believe nothing less than the survival of our culture is at stake.

197 posted on 07/14/2003 6:13:00 PM PDT by apackof2 (Listen much, talk little, learn greatly)
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To: I got the rope
Most of the time I am joking. Especially when I said I would hunt you down like an angry troll (I wish I could find that gif image!)

I'm glad to hear that. There are some kooks online who have nothing better to do than stalk and harrass people who've disagreed with them. Really weird..but they are out there.

I try to stay low-key in many posts, but I certainly remember you in all the homo-apologist threads that start here on FR. Your angle is the liberaltarian one. I can't accept this. It's too illogical for me...it is also counter to my Christian beliefs.

Actually, I only post in a fraction of all the FR threads on homosexuality. Unlike some who seem obsessed with the topic...I get bored with it.

I always find it interesting that some people claim my positions on this topic are contrary to their "Christian beliefs" when in fact all of my views come from the Bible as well as Christian ministries that deal with this topic..some of which have visited my church.

There is nothing homo-apologist about my views..and the only ones who accuse me of this either don't understand my beliefs, or are homophobic bigots who think the Bible is there to support their personal hatred of others.

So if you could tell me exactly where any of my views are counter to your Christian beliefs, I would love to hear about it. So far you haven't shown me anything unChristian about my views.

Maybe you should clarify how you feel on certain subjects so that all on this thread can see for themselves.

I don't see how I could be anymore bold in articulating a clear position when it comes to most topics. I'm not the least bit shy about voicing my views.

If you have something specific you don't get, by all means don't hesitate to ask me about it.

Enlighten us Jorge. BTW is pronounced "Hor-he"

It's pronounced "whore-hey". :)

198 posted on 07/14/2003 8:02:21 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: ItsJeff
It's a stereotype, but gays really are florists, flight attendants, decorators, etc.

LOL!
I'm almost 50 years old and I've met auto mechanics, welders and managers of businesses who turned out to be gay.

And I've met some drop-dead beautiful women who turned out to be lesbians.

Sure most of us can spot the obvious ones, but I've learned the stereotypes don't always apply.

199 posted on 07/14/2003 8:18:39 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Sir Francis Dashwood
idolatry - n. 1. the worship of idols 2. Blind adoration

I don't understand... I don't "worship" astrology.

Out of curiosity, I let a friend of mine enter my birth information to do a natal chart. To be honest, what I got back was surprising. I found a striking similarity between my profile and my own personality.

That's where I left it. But who is to say that the position of the planets don't have influence? Who is to say that it doesn't? It's not even an argument worth considering. It's a quesion that some people would equate with the existence of God.

200 posted on 07/14/2003 9:41:28 PM PDT by PurVirgo (Never fault a pig for having a shorter neck than a girrafe)
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