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Army, Marines rate weapon success
Stars and Stripes ^ | Sunday, July 13, 2003 | Mark Oliva

Posted on 07/13/2003 2:53:59 PM PDT by demlosers

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1 posted on 07/13/2003 2:53:59 PM PDT by demlosers
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To: Prodigal Son
Ping. I noticed your interested in these threads :)
2 posted on 07/13/2003 3:02:11 PM PDT by demlosers
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To: All

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3 posted on 07/13/2003 3:02:58 PM PDT by Support Free Republic (Your support keeps Free Republic going strong!)
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To: demlosers
Both soldiers and Marines also noted problems with the M-9 9 mm pistol. “There was general dissatisfaction with this weapon,” the Army report said. “First and foremost, soldiers do not feel it possesses sufficient stopping power.”

I hear some guy named Browning has designed a pistol which may be satisfactory.

4 posted on 07/13/2003 3:05:33 PM PDT by pa_dweller (This space left blank intentionally)
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To: Gabrielle Reilly
read later.
5 posted on 07/13/2003 3:06:35 PM PDT by Gabrielle Reilly
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To: *bang_list
Bang!
6 posted on 07/13/2003 3:06:56 PM PDT by wysiwyg (What parts of "right of the people" and "shall not be infringed" do you not understand?)
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To: wysiwyg
I heard the same rumor about a Browing designed auto pistol in .45 caliber. Sounds like the army should give it a tryout. Parley
7 posted on 07/13/2003 3:11:25 PM PDT by Parley Baer
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To: demlosers
Just give them a colt .45
8 posted on 07/13/2003 3:11:38 PM PDT by Sofa King (-I am Sofa King- tired of liberal BS!)
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To: demlosers
“The most significant negative comment was reference [to] the M-4’s range,” the Army report stated. “In the desert, there were times where soldiers needed to assault a building that may be 500+ meters distant across open terrain. They did not feel the M-4 provided effective fire at that range.”

No, Sh*t!

500+ meters is 7.62 country. Should have broken out the M14's in storage if there are any left.
9 posted on 07/13/2003 3:16:02 PM PDT by x1stcav ( HOOAHH!)
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To: pa_dweller
I hear some guy named Browning has designed a pistol which may be satisfactory.

The Browning High Power is an excellent weapon! :-) I also hear that a guy named Glock has made some ultra reliable pistols that are favored by police in the U.S.

Maybe a 10mm would be better than a 9mm, if there were no problem with NATO standards.

Seriously, though, I think the real solution would be to do what the British did in their empire for decades, only do it with all of our troops, not just the officers.

Allow soldiers to buy their own personal sidearms, as long as it is of an approved caliber. The soldier will then have more confidence in their arm, and will be more likely to be proficient with it.

10 posted on 07/13/2003 3:17:31 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain
Actually have used both the Hi power and the M1911A1, perfer the M1911A1, simple robust, and if you hit something with it it stays down.
11 posted on 07/13/2003 3:24:48 PM PDT by dts32041 ("The avalanche has started. It is too late for the pebbles to vote.")
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To: x1stcav
I've heard rumors that, rather than sell them thru the DCM, the plan is to scrap the M-14's, since they are too big to give to 3rd world "allies" and Americans can't be trusted with an "assault" rifle.
12 posted on 07/13/2003 3:38:00 PM PDT by jonascord (To Robert Service, with respect)
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To: dts32041
The 9mm is Euro-junk. Without making judgements, the "civilized" concept of wounding so that the Enemy ties up 4 other to take care of each casualty is a luxury the 3rd World does not indulge in. Kindness is a bullet thru the head. Hence the .45 ACP... Put 'em down, one shot, no worry about him getting up.
13 posted on 07/13/2003 3:44:54 PM PDT by jonascord (To Robert Service, with respect)
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To: demlosers
This brings to mind what General George S.Patton Jr. said about the M-1Garand Rifle!He called it:"The Finest Battle Implement Ever Devised"!!Now,I'm not saying that we should go back that far,but how about the M-14?It fires a .30cal.projectile(7.62/54).Or how about the FN/FAL which fires the same NATO cartridge as the M-14??As far as the Beretta 9mm.pistol,this is a DISGRACE!!!The 1911 Colt.45ACP pistol served this country's armed forces BRILLIANTLY for 75-years!!!!If you ask all of the pistol champions,they will almost always favor a 1911 variant.Combat-wise,it has no peer.The only improvement that could(and can)be easily undertaken is to re-engineer the grip so that it will accomodate a straddled,high-cap(15-round)magazine.You don't have to make a "killing shot"with a 1911.ANYWHERE will do just fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
14 posted on 07/13/2003 3:47:21 PM PDT by bandleader
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To: pa_dweller
You are quite RIGHT!It was adopted by the US Army Ordinance Dept. in 1911!!!!!!!!
15 posted on 07/13/2003 3:48:44 PM PDT by bandleader
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To: demlosers
FNGs! You never lube a weapon in the desert! You spend a lot of time removing the least speck of oil! If the gun doesn't work without lube, ram it up the Ordinance Dept.'s rear end and get one that does, hence the pickup AK-47s...

Why does every war have to be fought by little boys, who get killed re-learning how to slaughter?

16 posted on 07/13/2003 3:50:15 PM PDT by jonascord (To Robert Service, with respect)
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To: marktwain
NATO"Standards"SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!
17 posted on 07/13/2003 3:50:27 PM PDT by bandleader
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To: demlosers
Here's a good link on 7.62mm vs 5.56mm rounds:

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/report/1986/MVT.htm

Can female soldiers qualify shooting the 7.62 round at 1000 yds (as was the old standard)?
18 posted on 07/13/2003 3:50:34 PM PDT by Gary Boldwater
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To: demlosers
The M9 is a piece of sh!t- in my opinion. You may as well throw the f---ing thing at the enemy. You'd be better off with a reliable revolver than the M9.

The max effective range of the M16A2 is 550 meters. It's hard to distinguish a man target past this range. But getting accurate fire at the ranges between 300 and 500 meters is important. The M16A2 sight is set all the way up to 800 meters. I would've felt confident setting the iron sights on 500 meters and having a go at a target at that range. The thing is, obviously, those extra inches of barrel weigh something. You have to sort of take your pick in the end. What do you want? A weapon that is effective at long range or a weapon that is easier to carry and good for MOUT type combat? Personally, I like to be able to shoot at something from a long ways off and have a reasonable chance of hitting it.

19 posted on 07/13/2003 3:50:46 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: Sofa King
If you fire a .45ACP and then fire a 9mm,the difference is breathtaking!If you re-load both(as do I),the"recipes"are just as breatakingly different!!Standard load for the .45ACP is a 230-grain bullet and about 10grs of Unique(what I use).The 9mm Parabellum standard is a 115-grain bullet with about 6grs.of Unique.No Comparison!!!!!!
20 posted on 07/13/2003 3:55:08 PM PDT by bandleader
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