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French secret service 'kept CIA in the dark over Iraq and uranium'
The Telegraph (U.K.) ^ | 07/14/03 | Michael Smith

Posted on 07/13/2003 5:14:06 PM PDT by Pokey78

The French secret service is believed to have refused to allow MI6 to give the Americans "credible" intelligence showing that Iraq was trying to buy uranium ore from Niger, US intelligence sources said yesterday.

MI6 had more than one "different and credible" piece of intelligence to show that Iraq was attempting to buy the ore, known as yellowcake, British officials insisted. But it was given to them by at least one and possibly two intelligence services and, under the rules governing cooperation, it could not be shared with anyone else without the originator's permission.

US intelligence sources believe that the most likely source of the MI6 intelligence was the French secret service, the DGSE. Niger is a former French colony and its uranium mines are run by a French company that comes under the control of the French Atomic Energy Commission.

A further factor in the refusal to hand over the information might have been concern that the US administration's willingness to publicise intelligence might lead to sources being inadvertently disclosed.

US sources also point out that the French government was vehemently opposed to the war with Iraq and so suggest that it would have been instinctively against the idea of passing on the intelligence.

British sources yesterday dismissed suggestions of a row between MI6 and the CIA on the issue. However, they admitted being surprised that George Tenet, the CIA director, had apologised to President George W Bush for allowing him to cite the British government and its claim that Saddam had sought to acquire uranium from Africa in his State of the Union speech last October.

The apology follows the International Atomic Energy Authority's dismissal of documents given to it by the CIA, which purported to prove the link, as fakes.

Those documents have been widely identified with last September's British dossier on Iraqi weapons of mass destruction, which said Saddam Hussein was trying to buy uranium ore from an unnamed country in Africa.

British officials admitted that the country was Niger but insisted that the intelligence behind it was genuine and had nothing to do with the fake documents. It was convincing and they were sticking with it, the officials said.

They dismissed a report from a former US diplomat who was sent to Niger to investigate the claims and rejected them. "He seems to have asked a few people if it was true and when they said 'no' he accepted it all," one official said. "We see no reason at all to change our assessment."

The fake documents were not behind that assessment and were not seen by MI6 until after they were denounced by the IAEA. If MI6 had seen them earlier, it would have immediately advised the Americans that they were fakes.

There had been a number of reports in America in particular suggesting that the fake documents - which came from another intelligence source - were passed on via MI6, the officials said. But this was not true.

"What they can't accuse MI6 of doing is passing anything on this to the CIA because it didn't have the fake documents and it was not allowed to pass on the intelligence it did have to anyone else."


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: bushdoctrineunfold; bushropadope; cia; dgse; france; iaea; intelligence; mi6; niger; nigerflap; nonallyfrance; scandal; uranium; warlist; wmd
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1 posted on 07/13/2003 5:14:06 PM PDT by Pokey78
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To: Pokey78
Unnamed sources rock.
2 posted on 07/13/2003 5:16:24 PM PDT by Satadru
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3 posted on 07/13/2003 5:18:01 PM PDT by Support Free Republic (Your support keeps Free Republic going strong!)
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To: Pokey78
Now why am I not surprised the French had a role in this?
4 posted on 07/13/2003 5:19:19 PM PDT by rintense (Freedom is contagious, and everyone wants to catch it!)
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To: Peach; Howlin; Dog; Ernest_at_the_Beach; backhoe; BOBTHENAILER; Grampa Dave; FairOpinion
Weasel alert!

"The French secret service is believed to have refused to allow MI6 to give the Americans "credible" intelligence showing that Iraq was trying to buy uranium ore from Niger, US intelligence sources said yesterday."

5 posted on 07/13/2003 5:21:28 PM PDT by MizSterious (Support whirled peas!)
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To: Pokey78
How precisely does this rise above the level of sheer idle speculation? The CIA asserts the intelligence is faulty, Blair insists it's genuine but cannot be shared, so someone simply decides it cannot be shared because the French are withholding permission. Where's the substance?
6 posted on 07/13/2003 5:22:06 PM PDT by AntiGuv ()
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To: Cathryn Crawford
British officials... insisted that the intelligence behind it was genuine and had nothing to do with the fake documents. It was convincing and they were sticking with it, the officials said. They dismissed a report from a former US diplomat who was sent to Niger to investigate the claims and rejected them. "He seems to have asked a few people if it was true and when they said 'no' he accepted it all," one official said. "We see no reason at all to change our assessment."
7 posted on 07/13/2003 5:22:54 PM PDT by marron
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To: Pokey78
Click!
A big question has been 'why would the British government not share the other intelligence about Niger'? Jack Straw stood by the British intelligence, saying there was more than just the documents that Wilson claims to be fake (though Wilson never saw them).

We now know why. French secret service 'kept CIA in the dark over Iraq and uranium':

"The French secret service is believed to have refused to allow MI6 to give the Americans 'credible' intelligence showing that Iraq was trying to buy uranium ore from Niger, US intelligence sources said yesterday.

MI6 had more than one 'different and credible' piece of intelligence to show that Iraq was attempting to buy the ore, known as yellowcake, British officials insisted. But it was given to them by at least one and possibly two intelligence services and, under the rules governing cooperation, it could not be shared with anyone else without the originator's permission.

US intelligence sources believe that the most likely source of the MI6 intelligence was the French secret service, the DGSE. Niger is a former French colony and its uranium mines are run by a French company that comes under the control of the French Atomic Energy Commission."

As I said in the blog entry linked above (click Straw's name): What did the Clinton's know, and when did they know it?

Remember this:

"France's first lady expressed her support for a presidential run by Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, saying that such a candidacy would be an inspiration to women worldwide."
Folks, there really is a Watergate style scandal coming. But it is not going to be about the administration. It is going to be about the Democrats.

8 posted on 07/13/2003 5:23:23 PM PDT by William McKinley (You're so vain, you probably think this tagline's about you.)
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To: Satadru
The British blame the French and CIA, the CIA blames the British and the French, Bush blames the CIA and British and French because they didn't want the British and US to go into Iraq. Never have so many tried to pass the blame onto so many other shoulders. It is effective though, because nobody can figure out who did or did not do what.
9 posted on 07/13/2003 5:24:23 PM PDT by meenie
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To: Pokey78
Uck the rench.
10 posted on 07/13/2003 5:28:41 PM PDT by Mean Daddy
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To: Miss Marple; Dog
ping
11 posted on 07/13/2003 5:31:58 PM PDT by kayak (Support FR with a donation ... or become a monthly donor ... or at least go bump the thread, please.)
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To: William McKinley
Folks, there really is a Watergate style scandal coming. But it is not going to be about the administration. It is going to be about the Democrats.

And to think, Chirac's wife is throwing her support behind Hillary! The weasels stick together, come hell or high water, don't they?

12 posted on 07/13/2003 5:33:41 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Lurking since 2000.)
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: William McKinley
I have thought this for some time. Clinton spent a great deal of time in the run-up to the Iraqi war gadding about Europe, hobnobbing with Chirac and meeting with people in Belgium. I note also that right before Chretien of Canada let loose with his last round of insults about President Bush, he was meeting with Bill and Hillary Clinton in the Dominican Republic.

My hope is that the Secret Service reports this stuff to Secretary Snow, who briefs the appropriate people.

14 posted on 07/13/2003 5:35:53 PM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: marron
Yeah...and its pretty interesting how so much credibility is given to Wilson's claim when he only spent 8 days in Niger doing nothing more than asking questions. And, were suppose to believe that Niger is going to admit to dealing with Saddam and participating in proliferation.
15 posted on 07/13/2003 5:36:18 PM PDT by cwb
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To: rintense
Well, there is no proof here. Just some really good educated guesses that would explain an awful lot. There is obviously something the Brits know that we don't (see the Straw statement). Why would they not share with us?

Here is a very, very plausible explanation.

16 posted on 07/13/2003 5:36:41 PM PDT by William McKinley (You're so vain, you probably think this tagline's about you.)
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To: meenie
Well, meenie, I have no trouble figuring this out at all. I am sure if you ask nicely, William McKinley will give you a quick synopsis.
17 posted on 07/13/2003 5:37:10 PM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: AntiGuv
"...so someone simply decides it cannot be shared because the French are withholding permission. Where's the substance?"

Italian intelligence, the reported source of the forged documents, has asserted that they got them from the French.

Ever since the forgery has become known, the speculative source has been France. They had opportunity. And they had motive -- to cover their continued game of footsie with Saddam...and to embarrass the USA.

It's not "substance". But it seems a well-founded guess...

18 posted on 07/13/2003 5:38:20 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: IGNORANCE ON PARADE.)
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To: rintense
Now why am I not surprised the French had a role in this?

Because the French are Weasles.

19 posted on 07/13/2003 5:38:40 PM PDT by NeoCaveman ("I don't need the Bush tax cut. I never worked a f****** day in my life. Patrick Kennedy D-RI)
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To: William McKinley
This is indeed a plausible explanation. The other explanations for the Brit's withholding intelligence would be the protection of a source (which I don't think is the case) OR the knowledge that the information might reach someone who is compromised in the US...like a Senator or Representative that sits on one of the Congressional intelligence committees.
20 posted on 07/13/2003 5:39:20 PM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: Miss Marple
OR the knowledge that the information might reach someone who is compromised in the US...like a Senator or Representative that sits on one of the Congressional intelligence committees.

Not Senator Leaky Leahy? He wouldn't do that.

Oh yes he would.

21 posted on 07/13/2003 5:40:43 PM PDT by NeoCaveman ("I don't need the Bush tax cut. I never worked a f****** day in my life. Patrick Kennedy D-RI)
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To: William McKinley
Wouldn't surprise me in the least that the French knew all about this Iraq-Africa connection, mainly because they were helping the Iraqis get the needed components. Could this be just one more piece of info that will shut the Dems up?
22 posted on 07/13/2003 5:41:09 PM PDT by rintense (Freedom is contagious, and everyone wants to catch it!)
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To: okie01
Italian intelligence, the reported source of the forged documents, has asserted that they got them from the French.

If so, then why would the French permit the Italians to share the intelligence with the British, but permit neither to share the intelligence with the Americans?

23 posted on 07/13/2003 5:41:51 PM PDT by AntiGuv ()
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To: Pokey78
Why is Bush/Tenet/everyone else so defensive about this matter?

Tony Blair is right ... sticking to his guns.
24 posted on 07/13/2003 5:42:37 PM PDT by aculeus
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To: William McKinley
Folks, there really is a Watergate style scandal coming. But it is not going to be about the administration. It is going to be about the Democrats.

Could it really happen?

25 posted on 07/13/2003 5:42:43 PM PDT by Mo1 (Please help Free Republic and Donate Now !!!)
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To: Pokey78
The French secret service is believed to have refused to allow MI6 to give the Americans "credible" intelligence showing that Iraq was trying to buy uranium ore from Niger, US intelligence sources said yesterday.

Blame the French, cool.

26 posted on 07/13/2003 5:43:06 PM PDT by A. Pole
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To: AntiGuv
If so, then why would the French permit the Italians to share the intelligence with the British, but permit neither to share the intelligence with the Americans?

Given the behavior of the Chriac regime in France, over the last year or so, that should be self-evident.

27 posted on 07/13/2003 5:43:14 PM PDT by NeoCaveman ("I don't need the Bush tax cut. I never worked a f****** day in my life. Patrick Kennedy D-RI)
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To: Lauratealeaf; cyncooper; arasina
ping
28 posted on 07/13/2003 5:44:22 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Lurking since 2000.)
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To: Pokey78
I hope that Blairs visit next week will clear up some of this.
29 posted on 07/13/2003 5:44:56 PM PDT by Irish Eyes
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To: rintense; William McKinley
Wouldn't surprise me in the least that the French knew all about this Iraq-Africa connection, mainly because they were helping the Iraqis get the needed components. Could this be just one more piece of info that will shut the Dems up?

France is one of interests that oversee the 2 mines in Nigar.

Germany, Japan and Spain are the others

30 posted on 07/13/2003 5:45:30 PM PDT by Mo1 (Please help Free Republic and Donate Now !!!)
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To: dubyaismypresident

"Sacre bleu! I rezemble zat remark!"

31 posted on 07/13/2003 5:46:40 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (. . . there is nothing new under the sun.)
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To: Miss Marple
Yeah...it wouldn't be a surprise at all. Especially with the recent revelations that Carter had met with the Soviets to discuss ways of defeating Reagan in both 1980 and 1984. The democrats have a habit of not only working with this country's enemies, but treating Republicans as the enemy. I don't know what has happened to this party.
32 posted on 07/13/2003 5:47:04 PM PDT by cwb
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To: cwboelter
Yeah...it wouldn't be a surprise at all. Especially with the recent revelations that Carter had met with the Soviets to discuss ways of defeating Reagan in both 1980 and 1984

Really???

Dang, I miss all the news .. do you have a link that I can save for reference?

33 posted on 07/13/2003 5:49:15 PM PDT by Mo1 (Please help Free Republic and Donate Now !!!)
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To: William McKinley
French secret service 'kept CIA in the dark over Iraq and uranium'

Your# 8.......Folks, there really is a Watergate style scandal coming. But it is not going to be about the administration. It is going to be about the Democrats.

'WMD'......too!!

ROTFLOL

(Can't 'find' them "YET",......too many 'trails' have to be covered/sanitized first!!)

Good things take time........

:-)

34 posted on 07/13/2003 5:49:55 PM PDT by maestro
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To: William McKinley
France and Germany have allied with Iraq vs America and Britain. The Democrats have formally aligned themselves with the French/German/Iraqi axis against America. How much more anti-American can you get?
35 posted on 07/13/2003 5:50:42 PM PDT by Jim Robinson (Conservative by nature... Republican by spirit... Patriot by heart... AND... ANTI-Liberal by GOD!)
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To: Jim Robinson
You bet!

Your# 35.....says it all!!

bttt

36 posted on 07/13/2003 5:53:14 PM PDT by maestro
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To: Pokey78
The Washington Post reported several months ago that the forged Niger documents entered the intelligence communist from French intelligence.

Worthy of note that the documents were exposed as fake almost immediately after being made public.

37 posted on 07/13/2003 5:53:31 PM PDT by DPB101
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To: Mo1
The source was the former Secretary of State under President Bush, Lawrence Eagleburger, on Hannity and Colmes, I believe. I heard it myself.
38 posted on 07/13/2003 5:54:43 PM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: Mo1
Dang, I miss all the news .. do you have a link that I can save for reference?

Carter's treachery, from the National Review.

Detailed in the book Reagan's War.

Too bad Ann Coulter didn't cover this in her book "Treason"

39 posted on 07/13/2003 5:54:51 PM PDT by NeoCaveman ("I don't need the Bush tax cut. I never worked a f****** day in my life. Patrick Kennedy D-RI)
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To: Jim Robinson
And the anti-Republican/anti-Bush paleocon/paleolibertarian/buchananite/rockwellian/anarchist movement has combined with the Democrat/French/German/Iraq pro-terror axis.
40 posted on 07/13/2003 5:55:22 PM PDT by Jim Robinson (Conservative by nature... Republican by spirit... Patriot by heart... AND... ANTI-Liberal by GOD!)
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To: dubyaismypresident; Miss Marple
Thanks to both of you ..
41 posted on 07/13/2003 5:55:49 PM PDT by Mo1 (Please help Free Republic and Donate Now !!!)
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To: William McKinley
Folks, there really is a Watergate style scandal coming. But it is not going to be about the administration. It is going to be about the Democrats.

It will be interesting to see this unfold. P.S. I love the coin flipping blog.

42 posted on 07/13/2003 5:56:02 PM PDT by arasina (I'm not sure if I really care for indecisive people. Maybe I do; maybe not.)
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To: Mo1
Thanks to both of you ..

No problem. I had fun learning about this, just now, using google.

43 posted on 07/13/2003 5:56:26 PM PDT by NeoCaveman ("I don't need the Bush tax cut. I never worked a f****** day in my life. Patrick Kennedy D-RI)
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To: AntiGuv
"If so, then why would the French permit the Italians to share the intelligence with the British, but permit neither to share the intelligence with the Americans?"

There are two (or more) items of intelligence involved. Only one of them was forged. By inserting the forged documents into the pipeline, the French a.) intended that the forgery be discovered, so that b.) it would discredit the other evidence and c.) end up embarrassing the U.S.

The article (and your question) assumes that French intelligence was also the source of the legitimate evidence. That could be the case. But, then again, it may not be. In may be a Frenchman...as distinct from French intelligence.

In any event, we should recognize that, while France is not necessarily an enemy, she is no longer an ally.

44 posted on 07/13/2003 5:58:05 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: IGNORANCE ON PARADE.)
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To: Jim Robinson
Your# 40.......'Jim Robinson',....."Rocks!".....on!!

Wow!!

:-)

45 posted on 07/13/2003 5:58:28 PM PDT by maestro
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To: arasina
Thanks!

Maybe I should post that as a vanity.

More on this story:

French link to UK's Iraq intelligence From correspondents in London July 14, 2003

TWO foreign intelligence services, thought to be those of France and Italy, supplied Britain with the information for its controversial claim that Saddam Hussein's Iraq had sought uranium from Africa, the Financial Times newspaper reported Monday.

Britain made the uranium claim in a dossier last September despite being told the US Central Intelligence Agency had "reservations" about its inclusion.

The paper said its information came from senior Whitehall sources.

US administration officials have criticised the inclusion of a reference to the nuclear claim and the nation in President George W. Bush's January 28 State of the Union Address, and pointed out that it had not been corroborated by Washington's intelligence network.

CIA chief George Tenet, who took the blame for Bush's discredited prewar claim, has come under fire again with a leading Republican senator suggesting he resign.

The Financial Times said it had learnt that the original information on the nuclear claim came from two west European countries, and not from now discredited documents that proved to be forgeries.

The Italian government on Sunday denied reports that its intelligence services handed the United States and Britain documents indicating that Iraq was seeking uranium from Niger for a nuclear weapons programme.

The denial followed a report by Italy's Corriere della Sera newspaper that Rome's SISMI intelligence services had given Washington and London documents in late 2001, showing the regime of Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein had sought uranium from the African state.

There is considerable doubt in London and Washington over the strength of the US and British case for ending UN arms inspections and launching the March 20 invasion to topple the Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.

Hans Blix, the UN weapons chief inspector in Iraq in the run-up to war, added to the criticism, telling The Independent on Sunday newspaper that Britain had "over-interpreted the intelligence they had".


46 posted on 07/13/2003 5:58:36 PM PDT by William McKinley (You're so vain, you probably think this tagline's about you.)
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To: William McKinley
Mark, and read ur mail
47 posted on 07/13/2003 5:58:56 PM PDT by Neets (Sometimes you feel like a nut; sometimes you are)
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To: meenie
Simply Clintonian!!
48 posted on 07/13/2003 6:00:46 PM PDT by zarf (fuggetaboutit)
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To: arasina
And more:
'France and Italy gave information on Saddam' By Mark Huband and Christopher Adams

Two foreign governments, thought to be France and Italy, supplied Britain with the intelligence for its claim that Saddam Hussein's Iraq had sought uranium from Africa.

The Financial Times has learnt from senior Whitehall sources that the information came from two west European countries, and not from now discredited documents that proved to be forgeries.

This information, which does not appear to have been passed on to the US, would suggest why the government felt confident enough to put it in a dossier on Iraq's weapons of mass destruction last September.

US criticism of British claims about Iraq's efforts to buy uranium has exposed flaws in intelligence-sharing between London and Washington and caused deep concern in some parts of Whitehall, officials said on Sunday.

Britain made the uranium claim in last September's dossier despite being told the US Central Intelligence Agency had "reservations" about its inclusion.

Tony Blair faces difficult talks this week in Washington with George W. Bush over the US's controversial plans for a military trial of two British-born terrorist suspects held at Guantanamo Bay. Downing Street, however, denied reports of a rift with the US.

Ministers rushed to defend the inclusion of the uranium claim in the September dossier. Peter Hain, leader of the Commons, said all the intelligence he had seen proved "absolutely conclusively" that Mr Hussein had WMD and was developing more.

Condoleezza Rice, the US national security adviser, said on Sunday: "We have never said that the British report was wrong . . . the British stand by it because they have sources we did not have."

Jack Straw, foreign secretary, has written to the Commons foreign affairs committee saying British officials were confident the dossier's statement was based on reliable intelligence.

The information from foreign intelligence services was not shared with the US because it "was not ours to share", an official said.

The foreign secretary also disclosed that the US did not share with London details of a visit to Niger in 2002 by Joseph Wilson, an American envoy, who reported that no contract to buy uranium had been concluded with Iraq. Britain only learnt about this in recent press reports.

But he pointed to a part of the envoy's report that cited a visit by an Iraqi delegation in 1999 to Niger. This supported the UK claim that Iraq had sought African uranium.


49 posted on 07/13/2003 6:00:52 PM PDT by William McKinley (You're so vain, you probably think this tagline's about you.)
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To: cwboelter
"I don't know what has happened to this party."

The sixties is what happened to the Democrats.

50 posted on 07/13/2003 6:01:02 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: IGNORANCE ON PARADE.)
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