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Hendel Asks What About Pollard?
Arutz 7 ^ | July 227, 2003 | staff

Posted on 07/27/2003 10:46:18 AM PDT by Nachum

IsraelNN.com) Deputy Minister (National Union) Tzvi Hendel today asked once again that the issue of the release of PA prisoners be linked to America's release of Jonathan Pollard.

Hendel added "the impertinence cries to the heavens", explaining that while we continue to release terrorists, Jonathan Pollard remains in a US prison.

Other requests made to the prime minister to link prisoner releases to the release of Pollard and Israeli citizen Azzam Azzam [who is imprisoned in Egypt] have been rejected by Prime Minister Sharon.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: about; antiamericanscum; hendel; israelfirst; jonathan; pollard; traitor
Not a bad idea. If the US wants Israel to release a murderous hoard of Arabs, why not deal for Pollard?
1 posted on 07/27/2003 10:46:18 AM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum
Pollard was a traitor to the United States. He took an oath to the US and signed agreements not to disclose classified information. He sold America's classified information for money. There is no excuse. He is lucky not to have been executed. He should never see the outside of a prison alive.

The Israelis should stop pushing his case.

2 posted on 07/27/2003 11:03:06 AM PDT by CatoRenasci (Ceterum Censeo [Gallia][Germania][Arabia] Esse Delendam --- Select One or More as needed)
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To: CatoRenasci
OK. He was a traitor, fine. What about the many Israelis who will die as the Arab scum are released from their cage? If the US wants Jews to die, why not trade?
3 posted on 07/27/2003 11:07:46 AM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum
Pollard's name is not on the table. What he sold ended up in the hands of the Red Chinese. Spending the rest of his life in prison is the best deal he can get. He certainly deserved to be executed.
4 posted on 07/27/2003 11:10:48 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Nachum
the US wants Jews to die

What a slur. America is Israel's stalwart friend, and this is your gratitude - - a smear against the United States?

5 posted on 07/27/2003 11:11:17 AM PDT by churchillbuff
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To: Nachum
Hey, I agree that the USS Liberty has been brought up waaaay too many times, and that it is a dead issue that ought to be dropped. However, the same people that get so pissed whenever the USS Liberty is brought up can't help but constantly bring up the piece of garbage traitor Jonathan Pollard.
6 posted on 07/27/2003 11:14:01 AM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: Nachum
What about the many Israelis who will die as the Arab scum are released from their cage?

The US is not releasing them, Israel is. If Israel does not want to release them, they don't have to be released.

If the US wants Jews to die

If you think that, you have serious problems.

7 posted on 07/27/2003 11:15:19 AM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: churchillbuff
the US wants Jews to die What a slur. America is Israel's stalwart friend, and this is your gratitude - - a smear against the United States?

Some in the US want that, but the Bush Administration is a friend of both Jews and Israel.

8 posted on 07/27/2003 11:16:07 AM PDT by af_vet_1981
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To: af_vet_1981
Some in the US want that, but the Bush Administration is a friend of both Jews and Israel.

A lot of people at FR would disagree with you.

9 posted on 07/27/2003 11:19:13 AM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: Nachum
Pollard is a traitor to his country, the US, and must die in a US prison. He worked for Israel against his own country. To prevent others from doing the same thing, we must make sure that the next US citizen we catch spying for Israel KNOWS he is going to prison for the rest of his days. The Israelis want to be able to use the concept of continuing pressure to ease the burden of being caught as a recruiting tool. We can't let that happen.

I still can't believe that the Iraelis didn't buy a pardon for Pollard from Willie like Rich did. Negotiations must have been ongoing. Willie could have had several million placed in a secret account (and, it would have been US government money) almost anywhere the Israelis have secret accounts and no one would have know the truth (like all those other Willie crimes). Just don't understand why the deal didn't get done.

10 posted on 07/27/2003 11:21:47 AM PDT by Tacis
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To: af_vet_1981
the US wants Jews to die

This is the kind of despicable anti-Americanism I'd expect from Leftists ("the US wants blacks to die;" "the US wants Native Americans to die"). This kind of reckless, hateful rhetoric bespeaks a paranoid hatred of the US - even if it's coming from a freeper. By the way, where are Jews more safe - in the US or in Israel? I'd say they've never been better off, in all of history, than in the United States - - - - so this writer should show a little common sense, a little patriotism, and a lot less nutty paranoia about the US endangering Jews.

11 posted on 07/27/2003 11:24:12 AM PDT by churchillbuff
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To: Rodney King
The prisoner release is indeed on the table. It is a constant drumbeat by the PA and will be a part of any settlement deal. This is being brokered by this administration and the State Dept.. No, I don't believe that the US intentionally wants Jews to die, but on the other hand knows exactly who and what has been captured by Israelis sitting in their jails. Only a fool would believe that their release would not be followed by the renewed attacks on Jews by the same people.
12 posted on 07/27/2003 11:26:34 AM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum
Were Pollard an Israeli, then his release could be discussed. However, Pollard is an American citizen who willfully betrayed his country, not just an Israeli spy.
13 posted on 07/27/2003 11:30:05 AM PDT by squidly
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To: Nachum
OK, I am glad we are talking then. There is a question that I have asked probably 10 times in the last few months of people complaining about the road map, and not one has answered it, perhaps you will:

Israel has been caught in a bloody battle for its entire existence. For various reasons (not the least among them, IMHO, is that the Arabs are afraid of Bush) we are now at this roadmap, which is designed to finally bring peace to Israel.

It may, or it may not. Certinaly, the Arabs have a history of going back on any peace deal. However, my question to you is this:

What do you want? You obviosly don't want the roadmap to work. Do you want nothing? I.E., do you want the status quo of Israel occupying the lands where Palestinians live and Palestinians bloeing up Israeli buses forever? Do you want to kill all the palestinians? Do you want to force them into Egypt and/or Syria? I am not accusing you of such. But all I see here is people carping about Bush and the roadmap, without anyone stating what he/she wants.

To show my hand, i'll tell you what I want (despite the fact that I have yet to get an answer to my above question).

I want Israel to pull out of the Palestinian occupied territories. What those territories are is debateable, but I would have the Isrealis making small concessions on the more recent settlements. Then, I would recognize a palestinian state, putting up a large fence on the border. Then, I would announce to the world that Isreal no longer holds any palestinian territory. I would announce that any attack upon Israelis by Palestinians is thus an act of war by Palestine upon Israel, and after a few happend I would bomb the shit out of the mofo's. That's what I want, and what I would do. Please tell me, since you hate the roadmap, what it is that you want, and what you would do.

14 posted on 07/27/2003 11:36:41 AM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: CatoRenasci
The problem for the Israelis is that they have nothing to really offer the US in exchange for Pollard's release. We are their patron and the ultimate bastion of their ultimate safety and survival. What can they offer or threaten, refusal of US Aid?

Pollard as a US Citizen betrayed US secrets to his paymasters in Israel! Similar to a previous blackmark, USS Liberty, this incident in US-Israeli relations, reflects very different perspectives and desires. Israel, besieged and surrounded by enemies, will sacrifice everything for survival, a concept elucidated by the motto, "No more Masadas!" The United States, superpower for half-century, winner of the Cold War, explicit defender of Israel, sees equally explicit flouting of friendship and trust.

2 countries with different perspectives, different needs. Israel wants Pollard freed, the offense forgiven, saying it was just "one of those things" and the necessities of survival. The US says that honor was violated, that promises were broken and that the rewards of treason should not be a cheering parade in Israel.

15 posted on 07/27/2003 11:39:17 AM PDT by SES1066
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To: squidly
Correct. I think the reason Pollard wasn't released by the Clintons was it would have led to mass resignations in our spook agencies. The Clintons skated pretty close to traitorous conduct with the Red Chinese. Maybe they got enough from them to just get by ?
16 posted on 07/27/2003 11:41:59 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Rodney King
The real issue in my mind is not whether the roadmap and a fence would work, but rather is there ever any peace possible with these Arabs. Like you said, the Arabs have a long record on going back on any peace deal. I can understand your desire for building a wall. Many many Jews both in America and Israel believe that your idea is a valid one. The Israelis are pragmatic and would accept a brokered truce if it was possible.

The real problem with this is that the Arabs have openly stated and as evidenced by all their action for as long as we can we care to recall, that they will never accept the Jews as an organized presence in their midst. The primary reason for secular Israelis putting settlements on the Judean hills were not ideological, but defensive in nature. Religious Jews were only too happy to mover there, but the secular leadership of Israel did so for a purely practical reason, the Arabs in successive wars used them as points of attack and to lob missiles.

I believe that whatever peace is brokered, it will only be used as a new launch pad for the next war. There will be a rearming of the PA, using what ever weapons Iran, Syria, and Saudi Arabia can buy. You are dealing with people who are very nearly brainwashed in the true sense of the word. From the time they were old enough to hold a bottle, they were inculcated with the words "Itbar Al Yahid" (death to the Jews). In the same way that America is in Iraq, taking control, this is the only way that the threat of war with these people will be averted.

There are only two choices in my opinion, total annexation of all of the territories along with a total dismantling of the Arab school system and outlawing of state sponsored hate or- more death. If this road map is pushed through, the next phase of this conflict will be far more bloody IMHO. The Arabs will only plan on the destruction of the fence in the next open military conflict against Israel. This deal is in my view a form of capitulation for which Isreal and other western democracies will pay dearly.

17 posted on 07/27/2003 12:09:12 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum
Thanks for your answer. I basically agree with you. The reason why I personally would go ahead with the roadmap is the wide popularity it has worldwide. I would use it as, essentially, a base camp for launching a final striking blow against the Palestinians if they treat this treaty like they have the last few.
18 posted on 07/27/2003 12:12:49 PM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: Nachum
Are you an American citizen with the Israel first, American second mentality?
19 posted on 07/27/2003 12:26:09 PM PDT by doc
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To: churchillbuff; Nachum
I am a Catholic and an American. I cannot see why what Nachum suggests is unreasonable. We would be trading Pollard to a nation which is ordinarily among our strongest allies. The United States proposal to release these Palestinian criminal savages from Israeli jails is bad enough. The released criminals will directly contribute to further homicide bombings of innocent Israeli civilians and, often, American civilians as well.

Personally, I very much question the wisdom of releasing these terrorists at all. Why should they be released? Maybe the Palestinians should grow up and realize that when "Palestine" was partitioned after the Israelis won their revolution against the Brits, Israel was set aside for the Jewish homeland and Jordan (the remainder) was set aside as the "Palestinian" homeland. Maybe, if the Marxist-Leninist and anti-Semitic and anti-American trash that are the "Palestinian" leadership would have refrained from printing maps for their schoolchildren which show Israel on the maps, maybe if they did not keep their own people in concentration camps under the lie that the Jews have dispossessed them, maybe if they did not turn up the steam of anti-Semitism among the concentration camp residents to excuse every miserable failing of their own t care for their own people, there would be no homicide bombing campaigns. But NOOOOOOOO!

Then, the "Palestinians'" allies attack Israel on two occasions, get their backsides handed to them militarily by the Israeli military, and cause Israel to take the Golan Heights, the Gaza Strip and the West Bank. This too is regarded as an outrage by the Leninist looney tunes in "Palestine" who dare imagine that the only justice is driving the Jews into the sea en masse so their failed attempts to do so cannot count and they simply must get "their" land back. All of this is not news. This is history. The last "moderate" Palestinian leader was the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem in 1929 who issued a statement welcoming Jews back into the Holy Land BEFORE the Holocaust. Of course, he was promptly assassinated by the lunatics for his moderation.

As to Nachum, he and I are acquainted only over the internet. He is a fine fellow and a good American who is apparently a bit angry that American policy (which seems to have no connection to American interests in this case) is trying to force the release from Israeli prisons those in the neighborhood who are the equivalent against Israelis of the 9/11 club, with the sole difference that they are trying to slaughter Israel on the sneaky installment plan.

To tell the truth is not to smear America or to slur her. If those prisoners are released, then Israelis will die as a result. Israel ought to say an unconditional no to the release. If Israel is willing to say yes, then releasing Pollard to them is no big deal. Whatever Pollard did, he is not likely to be in a position to do again. These criminals in the Israeli jails are VERY likely to kill again.

Finally, if Israel had a death penalty, we would not be discussing many of the prisoners in question.

20 posted on 07/27/2003 12:42:30 PM PDT by BlackElk ( Anti-Semitism has no home among American conservatives.!)
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To: Nachum
Israel is being asked to release terrorists who are a major threat to their security. Pollard is no threat to anyone at this point. If the idea is to let bygones be bygones then Bush should be willing to release Pollard. The guy has suffered in prison for 18 years now. Whatever deterrence was desired in his case has certainly been achieved.
21 posted on 07/27/2003 1:12:39 PM PDT by Honestfreedom
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To: BlackElk
I very much question the wisdom of releasing these terrorists at all

I'm not debating the policy choices; they're open to debate and you may be right. What I can't let go unanswered is the writer's claim that "the US wants Jews killed." The administration's policy may be misguided -- I'm not taking a position here -- but to attribute it to a desire of the US that "Jews should be killed" is crap -- and, as I wrote earlier, reminds me of nothing so much as hate-America Leftists who say similar things about Newt Gingrich wanting poor people to die, or Lott wanting blacks to be lynched -- just because they disagree with certain policies. This kind of rhetoric is more than over the top, it's hateful, and shows a basic hatred of America.

22 posted on 07/27/2003 1:13:51 PM PDT by churchillbuff
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To: doc
I am an American, period.
23 posted on 07/27/2003 1:19:40 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: BlackElk
Well stated.
24 posted on 07/27/2003 1:29:11 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum; churchillbuff
Indeed you are, my friend. May I suggest a private exchange of e-mails between you and churchillbuff which will probably lead to a better understanding?
25 posted on 07/27/2003 1:40:02 PM PDT by BlackElk ( So long Uday and Qucay! Dad should be right along any day now!)
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To: Nachum
Thank you from you L'er Catholic friend and admirer.
26 posted on 07/27/2003 1:41:48 PM PDT by BlackElk ( So long Uday and Qucay! Dad should be right along any day now!)
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To: Nachum
Your reply is a non sequitor, and Israel's releasing Arab prisoners is completely unrelated to the Pollard affair. It's truly silly and, even harmful, to say the US wants Jews to die. C'mon, without the US, Israel would be in a much worse position than it is now. The fact that the US supports Israel, though not always in the way some Israelis would like, doesn't mean we condone everything Israel does. And, spying on the US is a real no no. Pollard rotting in jail is a fine example to remind everyone that the US does not tolerate breach of trust in friends any more than in enemies. Further, Pollard was an American citizen, holding an office of profit and trust under the United States, who betrayed his oath and signed agreement not to disclose classified information. If he were sincere that Israel need the information, he would not ask to be released, rather he would say "I violated my oath to the US to help Israel because I thought it was right. But, I did breach the trust the United States placed in me. Therefore, I am guilty and deserve whatever penalty US law provides."
27 posted on 07/27/2003 6:24:29 PM PDT by CatoRenasci (Ceterum Censeo [Gallia][Germania][Arabia] Esse Delendam --- Select One or More as needed)
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To: CatoRenasci
My reply about the Pollard case is in direct response to the lack of fairness in it. We have no idea how long Pollard should be in jail for becuase no one, except for Cap Weinberger and the judge know what exactly the evidence was. The court violated its own plea bargain agreement with Pollard to lock him up for so long. Therefore, in the eyes of many his sentence was itself a non sequitor. If the fairness of US law is off the table, than everything is therefore negotiable.
28 posted on 07/27/2003 7:04:24 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: churchillbuff
This kind of reckless, hateful rhetoric bespeaks a paranoid hatred of the US - even if it's coming from a freeper.

I don't think so. I think it indicates a level of frustration with terrorist attacks. I was shopping today and imagined what would happen to American culture and attitudes if homocide bombers started targeting food stores. Consider what Israel has endured and be sensitive to the loss of life. Would Americans show the same restraint in similar circumstances ? We are seeing some of this now in Iraq and my sense of frustration grows with each casualty. Don't think for a minute President Bush doesn't care about the loss of innocent life. He cares.

29 posted on 07/27/2003 7:24:23 PM PDT by af_vet_1981
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To: Rodney King
A lot of people at FR would disagree with you.

I know. They are frustrated and want to influence the Bush Administration to keep it honest. Rep. Delay and former Speaker Gingrich do to. It is a complex problem.

30 posted on 07/27/2003 7:25:51 PM PDT by af_vet_1981
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To: Nachum
If the US wants Jews to die

You are not helping your cause

31 posted on 07/27/2003 7:32:23 PM PDT by ladyjane
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To: Nachum
This has nothing to do with Pollard. May he rot in jail like all traitors.
32 posted on 07/27/2003 7:39:23 PM PDT by The_Media_never_lie
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To: Nachum
Get over it. Pollard will die in jail. I support Israel, and have no use for the Palestinians who want to kill Jews. But, I think Pollard was a dispicable traitor who should have been executed.
33 posted on 07/27/2003 7:56:43 PM PDT by CatoRenasci (Ceterum Censeo [Gallia][Germania][Arabia] Esse Delendam --- Select One or More as needed)
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