Foreign Born President? Congress Eyes Amendment

Mobile Register from the San Francisco Chronicle | August 13, 2003

[ClearBlueSky]

Austrian born Arnold Schwarzenegger is still a long way from being elected California's Governor, but proposed Constitutional amendments that would allow foreign born citizens such as the action movie star to become President will be debated in Congress this autumm.

One of the proposals, by Schwarzenegger political friend, Senator Orin Hatch, Republican Utah, would allow anyone who has been a US citizen for 20 years, and has resided in the country for 14 years, to be elected President. Schwarzenegger was naturalized in 1983.

The other proposal, by a bi-partisan group in the house, whose ranks include conservative Representative Darrell Issa, Republican California- who spent more than 1.5 million to put the recall election on the October 7th ballot- would allow anyone who has been a naturalized citizen for 35 years to be eligible to become President. The House legislation, whose co-sponsors include liberal Representative Barney Frank, Democrat Mass., was proposed long before the recall movement in California.

Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitution, drafted in 1787, says that only natural-born Americans at least 35 years old who have lived in the country for 14 years can serve as President.

Proponents of a change say the rule long ago outlived its usefulness. Hatch said figures such as former Secretaries of State Henry Kissinger and Madeleine Albright or Michigan Governor Jennifer Granholm, the Canada native whom Democrats consider a rising star, couldn't be President. Nor could the 700 foreign born recipients of the Medal of Honor.

[ClearBlueSky]

Of all the changes in the Constitution that should not be proposed- now, of all times- is one that would make it easier for a foreign born national Muslim extremist to end up in the White House. I"m disgusted with Hatch. This should scare the hell out of everyone.

[lonestar]

This should scare the hell out of everyone.

It does! I can't believe some of these idiots!

[Commander8]

We need to start educating the public about this.

[gcruse]

Barbra Streisand. We should be able to elect anyone we wish to be president. This country is run by and for the people. If that's what the people want, they deserve it. The same goes for limiting presidents to two terms.

[WorkingClassFilth]

We're up to our necks in domestic traitors as it is. Why on earth would anyone want to add the nightmare with a flood of foreign-born people, I can't imagine.

Unless they WANT more traitors...

[Pukin Dog]

I have a theory about Orrin Hatch.

I think he has a fetish for television, and anytime he has been off the networks for as long as he can stand it, he will do something or say something stupid enough to get him back on television for a few interviews; after which his ideas will go nowhere and soon be forgotten.

[Ichneumon]

Hatch said figures such as former Secretaries of State Henry Kissinger and Madeleine Albright or Michigan Governor Jennifer Granholm, the Canada native whom Democrats consider a rising star, couldn't be President.

Um, and what's the downside?

[Paleo Conservative]

That sounds like Barbara Streisand.

[PAR35]

So, you would only support a native born muslim extremist for President?

[Paleo Conservative]

One of the proposals, by Schwarzenegger political friend, Senator Orin Hatch, Republican Utah, would allow anyone who has been a US citizen for 20 years, and has resided in the country for 14 years, to be elected President. Schwarzenegger was naturalized in 1983.

That explains why Orrin Hatch has been advocating this drivel. The history of expatriot Austrians running other countries is not pretty.

[Noachian]

The unintended consequences of such an amendment, down the road, are too scary to think aboubt.

Often times things that look good on on paper at one moment in time can wind up to be a disaster later on.

The Founding Fathers had a good reason to limit the highest office to natural born Americans, and unless Hatch can come up with better reasoning than the Founders had his amendment is going no where.

[Uncle Hal]

I do not want anything changed. I am satisfied the way it is,

[Bogey78O]

It's too late for Bob Hope.

[Barry Goldwater]

The first few presidents, George Washington, etc, were not born in the United States.

[Bogey78O]

There was a caveat in the Constitution allowing for territory incorporated into the US.

[ChinaGotTheGoodsOnClinton]

Here's my theroy.

Arnold is a Kennedy plot to regain the White House.

[lilylangtree]

Somebody's been watching too many reruns of the "Demolition Man".

[sheik yerbouty]

Senator "Booby" Hatch.

[San Jacinto]

Hatch must be off his medication.

[Ronaldus Magnus]

We should be able to elect anyone we wish to be president. This country is run by and for the people. If that's what the people want, they deserve it. The same goes for limiting presidents to two terms

So much for the constitution. Your attitude is the exact reason we should NOT change it.

[San Jacinto]

Barbra Streisand. We should be able to elect anyone we wish to be president. This country is run by and for the people. If that's what the people want, they deserve it. The same goes for limiting presidents to two terms.

You forgot the quotation marks--here

Barbra Streisand says "We should be able to elect anyone we wish to be president. This country is run by and for the people. If that's what the people want, they deserve it. The same goes for limiting presidents to two terms."

[ClearBlueSky]

I don't want the Constitution changed, and I don't want ANY Muslim Presidents. Islamification of all Western- and ESPECIALLY this- country is the ultimate goal of Islam, make no mistake about that. This is one woman who will never wear a burkha, or bow to Mecca.

[goldstategop]

It would open the door for Arnold but also open it up to Jennifer Granholm.

[Ronaldus Magnus]

The first few presidents, George Washington, etc, were not born in the United States.

Um, no. George Washington was born in 1741 in Westmoreland County, Virginia. No U.S. president has ever been foreign born, and God willing, never will be.

[Congressman Billybob]

This is a tempest in a teapot. Let's put some facts on the table.

In all the years that the Constitution has been in effect, more than 10,000 proposed amendments have been dropped in the hopper in Congress. Only 52 of those ever passed by the required 2/3rds of just one House of Congress. Only 27, of course, have passed both Houses of Congress and been ratified by 3/4ths of the states.

The plain fact is, the Framers made it very difficult (though not effectively impossible as it was under the unanimous state vote under the Articles of Confederation) to amend the Constitution.

Over 1,000 proposed amendments have been submitted concerning the election and term of the President. Only one has passed (the two-term only amendment).

Wake me up when the "Schwarzenegger amendment" even gets a committee hearing in either House of Congress. (Most of this mass of proposals never rose even to that level.) Until then, as they say in New Jersey, fuggetaboutit.

Congressman Billybob

Latest column, "Nuts and Bolts in California" posted on FR, also published in San Francisco and on the UPI wire Wednesday.

[ClearBlueSky]

The first few Presidents? The first ' AMERICANS' weren't born here! If you want to be technical, we should have had an American Indian President long ago.
YES,the current restriction has probably prevented good people from trying for the Presidency, that has always been unfortunate; but changing it now WILL allow for a scenario wherin a radical with loyalties to a dangerous cult, and existing terrorists, to run this country.
That it is even being discussed by any governmental official now strikes me as monumentally stupid and short-sighted at the least, and 'fifth-columnist-like' at the worst.

[Congressman Billybob]

Given your screen name, you ought to know the last major party nominee for President who was NOT born in the United States. No, it wasn't in the 19th century. It was Barry Goldwater. He was born in the Arizona Territory, before that was admitted to the Union as a state.

Congressman Billybob

[goldstategop]

Exactly. It would be the ultimate "special interest" amendment. The Constitution is fine as it is. There's no crying need to amend it all out of recognition.

[San Jacinto]

There was a caveat in the Constitution allowing for territory incorporated into the US.

You should know. Barry Goldwater, Presidential candidate in 1964, was not born in the United States.

[DouglasKC]

Of all the changes in the Constitution that should not be proposed- now, of all times- is one that would make it easier for a foreign born national Muslim extremist to end up in the White House. I"m disgusted with Hatch. This should scare the hell out of everyone.

Yup...this is a bad idea. On the other hand, it's not just foriegners who want to bring the US down. Hillary comes to mind.

[Quix]

No thanks.

I realize natural born did not protect us from the treasonous duo.

Nevertheless, it's a worthy criteria.

We should keep it.

[Princeliberty]

I wonder if somehow the Drug companies want this
since everything the corrupt Hatch does now is controlled by them.

[RWR8189]

Washington was not foreign born, no president has even been. Thats why Hamilton was never able to seek the office.

[Maccabee]

None of us wants a muslim president, but there are many (long since naturalized) foreigners who could contribute greatly to our cause. Who would mind seeing, for example, an idealistic Cuban exile with the guts to sweep out terriorists and communists alike? I fear that too many Americans have turned lukewarm and liberal. Perhaps the future is at our shores.

[Paleo Conservative]

The first few presidents, George Washington, etc, were not born in the United States

You lose. None of the first seven presidents was born outside United States territory. The Constitution prohibited anyone who was not a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of the Constitution and a resident for at least 14 years from becoming President of the United States. Furthermore, anyone born after the adoption of the Constitution is required to be a natural born citizen of the United States in order to become President. The one person born outside the United States who had a shot at becoming President was Alexander Hamilton. If he had not been killed by Aarron Burr, he might have been elected President.

George Washington Birthplace National Monument

http://www.nps.gov/gewa

People have made the pilgrimage to the birthplace of George Washington since 1815. Visitors from all over the world have come to see where the first President of the United States was born. Today this 550-acre park memorializes George Washington and the place of his birth. The park includes: Visitor Center; the brick foundation of the house where he was born; the Washington family cemetery where George’s father, grandfather, and great-grandfather are buried; the historical area with the Memorial House, kitchen, and typical plantation surroundings; the picnic grounds with a nature trail; and the Potomac River beach area. Here, in these sublime surroundings, one can sense the character and spirit of the great whole man.

Adams National Historical Park

http://www.nps.gov/adam

Adams National Historical Park is located in the City of Quincy, Norfolk County, Massachusetts, approximately ten miles south of Boston. The Park comprises 11 historic structures and a cultural landscape totaling almost 14 acres.

The story encompasses five generations of the Adams family (from 1720 to 1927) including two Presidents and First Ladies, three U.S.Ministers, historians, writers and family members who supported and contributed to the success of these public figures. The site's main historic features include: John Adams Birthplace, where 2nd U.S. President John Adams was born on October 30, 1735, and less than 75 yards away the John Quincy Adams Birthplace, where his son, John Quincy Adams, 6th U.S. President was born on July 11, 1767; the "Old House," home to four generations of the Adams family; the Stone Library contains more than 14,000 historic volumes and includes the book collection of John Quincy Adams; no tour is complete without a visit to the United First Parish Church, where both Presidents and the First Ladies are entombed in the Adams family crypt. There is an off-site visitor center located within one mile of the historic structures.

Thomas Jefferson

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0760627.html

Born: 4/13/1743
Birthplace: Albemarle County, Va.

Thomas Jefferson was born on April 13 (April 2, old style), 1743, at Shadwell in Goochland (now Albemarle) County, Va. A William and Mary graduate, he studied law, but from the start showed an interest in science and philosophy. His literary skill and political clarity brought him to the forefront of the revolutionary movement in Virginia. As delegate to the Continental Congress, he drafted the Declaration of Independence. In 1776, he entered the Virginia House of Delegates and initiated a comprehensive reform program for the abolition of feudal survivals in land tenure and the separation of church and state.

In 1779, he became governor, but constitutional limitations on his power, combined with his own lack of executive energy, caused an unsatisfactory administration, culminating in Jefferson's virtual abdication when the British invaded Virginia in 1781. He retired to his beautiful home at Monticello, Va., to his family. His wife, Martha Wayles Skelton, whom he married in 1772, died in 1782.

James Madison

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0760589.html

Born: 3/16/1751
Birthplace: Port Conway, Va.

James Madison was born in Port Conway, Va., on March 16, 1751 (March 5, 1750/1, old style). A Princeton graduate, he joined the struggle for independence on his return to Virginia in 1771. In the 1770s and 1780s he was active in state politics, where he championed the Jefferson reform program, and in the Continental Congress. Madison was influential in the Constitutional Convention as leader of the group favoring a strong central government and as recorder of the debates; and he subsequently wrote, in collaboration with Alexander Hamilton and John Jay, the Federalist papers to aid the campaign for the adoption of the Constitution.

Serving in the new Congress, Madison soon emerged as the leader in the House of the men who opposed Hamilton's financial program and his pro-British leanings in foreign policy. Retiring from Congress in 1797, he continued to be active in Virginia and drafted the Virginia Resolution protesting the Alien and Sedition Acts. His intimacy with Jefferson made him the natural choice for secretary of state in 1801.

James Monroe

http://www.familyfirst.com/archives/004762.html

James Monroe, a third-generation American, was born April 28th, 1758 in Westmoreland County, Virginia. He served in the Revelutionary War under George Washington, studied law under Thomas Jefferson, US Senator and Governor of Virginia, and President of the United States. His term in office was characterized as the Era of Good Feelings, and was noted for being honest, hardworking, self-sacrificing, judicious, and trusting in democracy. Here you can learn about his life and his term in office. He died on July 4th, 1831.

As a side note, James Monroe was the third President to die on the 4th of July. Two other presidents also have passed away on the anniversary of our nations independence. Can you name them? If you would like to know who they were, email me at rlc7254@attbi.com and I will give you the answer.

John Quincy Adams

http://www.nps.gov/adam

See John Adams birthplace information.

Andrew Jackson

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0760592.html

Born: 3/15/1767
Birthplace: Waxhaw, S.C.

Andrew Jackson was born on March 15, 1767, in what is now generally agreed to be Waxhaw, S.C. After a turbulent boyhood as an orphan and a British prisoner, he moved west to Tennessee, where he soon qualified for law practice but found time for such frontier pleasures as horse racing, cockfighting, and dueling. His marriage to Rachel Donelson Robards in 1791 was complicated by subsequent legal uncertainties about the status of her divorce. During the 1790s, Jackson served in the Tennessee Constitutional Convention, the United States House of Representatives and Senate, and on the Tennessee Supreme Court.

After some years as a country gentleman, living at the Hermitage near Nashville, Jackson in 1812 was given command of Tennessee troops sent against the Creeks. He defeated the Indians at Horseshoe Bend in 1814; subsequently he became a major general and won the Battle of New Orleans over veteran British troops, though after the treaty of peace had been signed at Ghent. In 1818, Jackson invaded Florida, captured Pensacola, and hanged two Englishmen named Arbuthnot and Ambrister, creating an international incident. A presidential boom began for him in 1821, and to foster it, he returned to the Senate (1823–25). Though he won a plurality of electoral votes in 1824, he lost in the House when Clay threw his strength to Adams. Four years later, he easily defeated Adams.

[Princeliberty]

Yes they were born in the 13 colonies,
and your point?

You surely don't think Washington was in England.

[ClearBlueSky]

God Willing, you're right. Past attempts have failed. This would be a disastrous time to be wrong and we should not forget that 'great storms announce themselves with a gentle breeze'. We should all pray that this nation never falls to Islam.

[dorben]

Hmm .

[ladyinred]

It does scare the hell out of me! Hatch is the worst of all of the Rinos.

[abishai]

Simple solution. Annex Austria as the 51st state. Elect Schwarzenegger for two terms. Sell Austria to Mexico as a home for its illegal immigrants.

[ClearBlueSky]

Diabolically creative! And I like your screen name!

[Ronaldus Magnus]

None of us wants a muslim president

Lots of Muslims do.

[Ronaldus Magnus]

We should all pray that this nation never falls to Islam.

And not just Muslims. I for one would not want a foreign born General Secretary of the United Nations to simultaniously be our President either. It would set a bad precedent!

[Quix]

Interesting possibility.

Could make a lot of corrupt, treasonous things easier.

Sigh.

God help us!

[Paleo Conservative]

Simple solution. Annex Austria as the 51st state. Elect Schwarzenegger for two terms. Sell Austria to Mexico as a home for its illegal immigrants.

"Diabolically creative! And I like your screen name!"

We could call that "Anschluss".

[Bogey78O]

Ahhh...didn't realize that.

Just looked it up. Goldater was born in the territory of Arizona in 1909 and Arizona was added in 1912 as a state.

[Elliott Jackalope]

"Simple solution. Annex Austria as the 51st state. Elect Schwarzenegger for two terms. Sell Austria to Mexico as a home for its illegal immigrants.

Holy Ned! Just what the hell did Austria ever do to you?

[Bogey78O]

There was no United States to be born into in the mid 1700s.

[Princeliberty]

What is revealing are these guys on this webpage
who support Arnold only because he (r) label
and will even insult real conservatives like
McClintock and someone like McClintock
who has real Character.

Putting Arnold in would like putting Clinton
in but at the same time giving him control
of the party.

These guys better have never attacked
Blacks for voting Democrat without question,
because they are being even worse!

[Classicaliberalconservative]

Alright, I have heard a lot on this forum that just made me want to throttle some people. Not every person of foreign birth is disloyal to the country or beholden to a foreign power. We have plenty of traitors born in the US and plenty of terrible politicans who are native born. This admendment does not force anyone to vote for someone of foreign birth. If someone's loyalties are that suspicious than I would hope that they never win the nomination, at least the GOP would never nominate them, and there is always the option of not voting for them. I came to this country as an immigrant with my parents at the age of 4. I grew up in the US and consider myself a full American. Yet I and many others do not have a privelege granted to all other Americans of native birth and this makes us offically second class citizens. And many of our founding fathers were suspicious of this clause. Thomas Jefferson wanted it struck down so that his Treasury Secretary Albert Gallatin could run. One of the schools in my college is named Gallatin fyi. I support a version of this admendment because it is fair and arguments that it endangers the national security of the nation are incredibly xenophobic. In my opinion a person who is naturalized should be able to qualify for the presidency 35 years AFTER they are naturalized since 35 is the minimum age of someone who wants to run and is native born. The 15 year residency should obviously be kept. That being said those of you who disagree with me need not worry. This admendment will probably not pass. Oh and if what is this about the Constitution should not be changed. Did we not change it 27 times at last count?