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Microsoft makes Outlook Express U-turn
Silicon.com ^ | August 15, 2003

Posted on 08/15/2003 10:30:34 AM PDT by HAL9000

Just days after announcing that it planned to halt development on Outlook Express, Microsoft has been forced to change its position following internal confusion and an outcry from customers.

As reported earlier this week on silicon.com Microsoft had planned to stop product development on Outlook Express, which forms part of the Internet Explorer code bundled with consumer versions of Windows.

At the time Dan Leach, Office product manager, said: "The technology doesn't go away, but no new work is being done."

Under that vision, consumers would have been directed towards the company's MSN software, while businesses would be encouraged to purchase Office, which includes the full Outlook client.

However, Leach has now distanced himself from his original comments, claiming that while Microsoft had originally planned to halt new work on Outlook Express, the situation has since changed.

"I sat down with the Windows team today, and they tell me my comments were inaccurate," Leach said Friday. "Outlook Express was in sustain engineering, but customers asked for continued improvement, and we are doing that. Microsoft will continue its innovation around the email experience in Windows."

Leach blamed communication problems for the confusion.

"The Outlook Express team has been in the process of making this change known inside Microsoft," he said. "They just hadn't reached me before I left for Asia."

The lack of internal communication underlines the growing challenge faced by Microsoft as it attempts to co-ordinate software development activities over an increasingly diverse range of markets.



TOPICS: News/Current Events; Technical
KEYWORDS: email; exploit; internet; lookoutexpress; lowqualitycrap; malware; microsoft; outlook; outlookemail; outlookexpress; securityflaw; techindex; windows
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Outlook Express is like the Idi Amin of email software. It just won't die.
1 posted on 08/15/2003 10:30:34 AM PDT by HAL9000
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To: HAL9000; RJayneJ
Outlook Express is like the Idi Amin of email software. It just won't die.

Quote of the day nominee!

2 posted on 08/15/2003 10:32:08 AM PDT by B Knotts
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To: HAL9000
When I read these original remarks by this guy I thought something did not make sense.
3 posted on 08/15/2003 10:33:06 AM PDT by Uncle Hal
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To: HAL9000
Microsoft Outlook: Popular e-mail software and even more popular virus propagator.
4 posted on 08/15/2003 10:33:26 AM PDT by July 4th
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To: July 4th
Oh, you mean Outbreak?
5 posted on 08/15/2003 10:36:05 AM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: July 4th
Are there any other email programs besides the welcome mat for script-kiddies more commonly known as MS Outlook? I'd like to get that crap off of my hard drive.
6 posted on 08/15/2003 10:36:36 AM PDT by Orangedog (Soccer-Moms are the biggest threat to your freedoms and the republic !)
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To: HAL9000
Leach blamed communication problems for the confusion.

Okay, somebody help me with an ironic comment here.

7 posted on 08/15/2003 10:37:07 AM PDT by Richard Kimball
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To: July 4th
We'll see how the next release of Linux fares, since persons unknown had their way with the source for several months. (Undetected tampering with the Linux development servers.)
8 posted on 08/15/2003 10:39:08 AM PDT by js1138
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To: HAL9000
"I sat down with the Windows team today, and they tell me my comments were inaccurate,"

Translation: "I got my chain yanked, but good."

9 posted on 08/15/2003 10:40:34 AM PDT by DeFault User
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To: js1138
We'll see how the next release of Linux fares, since persons unknown had their way with the source for several months. (Undetected tampering with the Linux development servers.)

You know, if you're going to troll, you could at least get your facts straight.

The hacked site wasn't "the Linux development servers," it was the Free Software Foundation FTP site. It houses no Linux core source code, only code for GNU userland tools.

Additionally, the problem has already been addressed by checking MD5 sums. There have been no reports of trojaned files on the FSF FTP site.

10 posted on 08/15/2003 10:44:17 AM PDT by Knitebane
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To: HAL9000
what improvements does this app need? it does what it is designed to do right?
11 posted on 08/15/2003 10:48:48 AM PDT by isom35
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To: Orangedog
Are there any other email programs besides the welcome mat for script-kiddies more commonly known as MS Outlook? I'd like to get that crap off of my hard drive.

The Bat.

Pine for Windows.

Eudora

Thunderbird - The Mozilla Mail project

Any of these are a replacement for the email component of Outlook Express, most of them are superior to OE.

To replace the newsreader portion, try Forte Agent or Forte FreeAgent

12 posted on 08/15/2003 10:52:40 AM PDT by Knitebane
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To: Knitebane
Actually I was searching for a troll being hammered, but this was the best I could do:

Nevertheless, I suspect the site that was hacked was not running IIS.

13 posted on 08/15/2003 10:52:58 AM PDT by js1138
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To: HAL9000
We see this kind of faux pas from Microsoft all the time (excuse my French). The company is large and the various parts are rather disconnected from one another. For those of us who deal with Microsoft on a daily basis, we see contradictory messages all the time.

The funny part is that the anti-Microsoft folks somehow simultaneously hold these two ideas in their head:

1) Microsoft marketing people are idiots who often can't get their story straight and send out contradictory messages.

2) Microsoft has lousy products and only succeeds because it has great marketing.

Take your choice, but I don't see how you can believe both of these.
14 posted on 08/15/2003 10:54:56 AM PDT by Joe Bonforte
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To: HAL9000
Outlook Express is like the Idi Amin of email software. It just won't die.

Then why use it?

15 posted on 08/15/2003 10:55:08 AM PDT by TomServo ("Cinematography by Zapruder.")
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Comment #16 Removed by Moderator

To: isom35
what improvements does this app need? it does what it is designed to do right?

Well, if it was designed to let script kiddies trash your machine, then it does it well.

As a mail client, it's strictly average.

It needs to be much more secure than it is. Microsoft seems to have other security concerns than it's give-away email client at the moment, though.

17 posted on 08/15/2003 10:55:26 AM PDT by Knitebane
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To: Richard Kimball
Leach blamed communication problems for the confusion.

> Okay, somebody help me with an ironic comment here.

Someone sent Mr. Leach a message, using Outlook Express, but for some reason he never got it.

18 posted on 08/15/2003 10:55:57 AM PDT by Califelephant
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To: js1138
You are mistaken. That was the GNU FTP site, not the Linux kernel site. Don't spread FUD.
19 posted on 08/15/2003 10:56:18 AM PDT by B Knotts
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To: js1138
You might try reading this, which is a detailed description of what happened and how it was/is being corrected. I seriously doubt anything widely used that was compromised will stay that way for long.

I suppose we can expect FUD about this for years though.

20 posted on 08/15/2003 10:57:01 AM PDT by zeugma (Hate pop-up ads? Here's the fix: http://www.mozilla.org/ Now Version 1.4!)
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To: Orangedog
I love Eudora. Never given me a single problem. Even more importantly, it has never sent thousands of unwanted messages to people in its address book.

Plus, I use PGP occasionally, and it has a good plug-in for that.
21 posted on 08/15/2003 10:57:13 AM PDT by July 4th
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To: Knitebane
I love Mozilla for e-mail. Add SpamPal (spampal.org) to that and I am killing 98% + of my spam.

This a technological solution that works...and its free!

22 posted on 08/15/2003 11:00:29 AM PDT by Voltage
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To: B Knotts
OK, I won't spread any false gossip about the kernel. I wonder, however, how the font of all that is holy got hacked. Check out the posts on this thread. It's obvious that only Microsoft servers are vulnerable and only Microsoft email clients are vulnerable. I may have trolled a bit, but every thread about Microsoft is a troll booth.
23 posted on 08/15/2003 11:01:49 AM PDT by js1138
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To: HAL9000
I just downloaded a bunch of patches, one major for OE, and as a result I can no longer open most attachments sent to me via email. I'm not even given a choice - I am simply told that "OE will not allow the opening of suspect attachment" or some such nonsense. Anyone have any idea how to get around this or do I just go download Eudora?
24 posted on 08/15/2003 11:02:38 AM PDT by agrace
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To: Knitebane
I've been using Eudora for years ... I love it!

Be Well ~ Be Armed ~ Be Safe ~ Molon Labe!
25 posted on 08/15/2003 11:02:51 AM PDT by blackie
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To: js1138
It was due to an exploit that got released one week before the patch for the ptrace vulnerability in the kernel.

The GNU FTP server was hacked by a user that apparently had an account on the machine, during that week. He was collecting passwords.

26 posted on 08/15/2003 11:05:32 AM PDT by B Knotts
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To: Orangedog
Eudora, Eudora, Eudora. Need I say more? :)
27 posted on 08/15/2003 11:05:50 AM PDT by JustAnAmerican
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To: Joe Bonforte; HAL9000
People can moan and complain all day long...but Microsoft remains #1....

Reason?.... Because they have excellent technology and fine marketing....People buy their products as the best available.

The myriad problems that arise as the technology moves forward is easily handled by those who understand how computers work and understand that there are hackers and idiots out there who take joy in screwing up the interent and the rest of the world.

For the rest, those who don't understand,?....I suppose they will just have to keep complaining.


28 posted on 08/15/2003 11:12:26 AM PDT by rmvh
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To: Knitebane; Orangedog
I installed Thunderbird 0.1 a few days ago. It's still in alpha and has a few annoying, but not serious bugs. But, it's already superior to Outlook Express.

29 posted on 08/15/2003 11:12:28 AM PDT by justlurking
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To: agrace
Outlook is blocking executable attachments. Ask the sender to ZIP the attachment first (it will reduce the bandwidth requirements, too).
30 posted on 08/15/2003 11:14:17 AM PDT by justlurking
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To: isom35
what improvements does this app need? it does what it is designed to do right?

Yes, Outlook Express is designed to function like a gay bathhouse.

31 posted on 08/15/2003 11:18:13 AM PDT by HAL9000
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To: agrace
check in Tools Option, there should be something in there on security turn it down a notch or two.
32 posted on 08/15/2003 11:20:10 AM PDT by discostu (just a tuna sandwich from another catering service)
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To: rmvh
Reason?.... Because they have excellent technology and fine marketing....

You're right about the marketing, but not the technology. Microsoft's technology is low quality crap.

The security problems in Microsoft products have cost their customers several hundred million dollars to clean up. I would not be surprised if the damage during the last couple of years has surpassed $1 billion.

33 posted on 08/15/2003 11:23:53 AM PDT by HAL9000
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Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

To: Orangedog
If you were on linux, check out Ximian.com. Their email program, Evolution is just as good as Outlook. I'm amazed it is a free product.
35 posted on 08/15/2003 11:28:11 AM PDT by lelio
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To: agrace
In OE, Tools >> Options >> Security, remove the checkmark that says saving of file attachments is not permitted.
36 posted on 08/15/2003 11:28:26 AM PDT by tictoc
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To: js1138
Nevertheless, I suspect the site that was hacked was not running IIS.

It was (and is) Linux/Apache, but the exploit was executed by someone with physical access to the machine, not from a network attack.

No computer is safe from people with physical access.

37 posted on 08/15/2003 11:31:46 AM PDT by kevkrom (This tag line for rent)
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To: kevkrom
Someone who had access at the time of the hack, or someone who had left the project?
38 posted on 08/15/2003 11:39:14 AM PDT by js1138
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To: HAL9000; *tech_index; Salo; MizSterious; shadowman99; Sparta; freedom9; martin_fierro; ...
Thanks!

OFFICIAL BUMP(TOPIC)LIST

39 posted on 08/15/2003 11:59:01 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach (All we need from a Governor is a VETO PEN!!!)
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To: isom35
"what improvements does this app need?"

They need to fix what their latest patch broke for no damn reason.
40 posted on 08/15/2003 11:59:04 AM PDT by PLMerite ("Unarmed, one can only flee from Evil. But Evil isn't overcome by fleeing from it." Jeff Cooper)
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To: rmvh
People can moan and complain all day long...but Microsoft remains #1....

And if Linux and other OSes aren't a threat, then why worry about them, right?

Reason?.... Because they have excellent technology and fine marketing....People buy their products as the best available.

"Best" is a very subjective and flexible term. A lot of people select software packages and operating systems because they are what they are used to or simply because they are #1, not because they have excellent technology. For the longest time, people wanted PCs so they could steal borrow software from work so they didn't have to pay for it. We'll see if Microsoft's activation makes a strong dent in this incentive. And once you've hired and trained staff to work on a certain operating system, there is certainly momentum to stick with what they know.

What I find particularly interesting is that Microsoft became dominant largely because the hardware it runs on was open. IBM built hardware that it was unable to maintain a proprietary hold on (it tried) but people cloned the BIOS and created their own non-IBM hardware that could run DOS. Because the hardware was open and any vendor could manufacture PCs, the prices dropped and the PC became the most affordable hardware platform available and competition in the OS sphere via work-alike DOS programs and other OSes kept the OS costs from skyrocketing.

In other words, the PC became the number one hardware platform because it was open and no one vendor controlled it. Being open kept it cheap. Keeping it cheap made it successful. There is a lesson somewhere in there for Microsoft advocates...

41 posted on 08/15/2003 12:01:46 PM PDT by Question_Assumptions
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To: tictoc; justlurking; discostu; Joe Bonforte; RicocheT
Thanks much to all, that did the trick, guess I should have looked around a little huh. :) Didn't even occur to me that the patch would have changed my settings.
42 posted on 08/15/2003 12:03:36 PM PDT by agrace
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To: EternalVigilance
"Oh, you mean Outbreak?"

I thought it was called MS Lookout! Excess.
43 posted on 08/15/2003 12:04:11 PM PDT by No Truce With Kings (The opinions expressed are mine! Mine! MINE! All Mine!)
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To: HAL9000; All
Never having used either, what's the difference between Outlook and Outlook Express?

Is the latter a "lite" version of the former?
44 posted on 08/15/2003 12:04:55 PM PDT by martin_fierro (A v v n c v l v s M a x i m v s)
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To: B Knotts
Don't spread FUD.

Hey, when it's all you've got to work with...

45 posted on 08/15/2003 12:05:09 PM PDT by Question_Assumptions
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To: HAL9000

'Nuff said.

46 posted on 08/15/2003 12:09:28 PM PDT by mhking
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To: agrace
That kind of security got added with one of the patches, they defaulted it to on. Count yourself lucky they've got it on at the server level where I work, it's really dumb though, it's just tagged on the file extension so I just add a .scan to the end of everything and it flies through fine.
47 posted on 08/15/2003 12:14:37 PM PDT by discostu (just a tuna sandwich from another catering service)
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To: zeugma
I seriously doubt anything widely used that was compromised will stay that way for long.

You also "seriously doubted" that this kind of thing could happen in the first place. But it did. That's not overly reassuring.
48 posted on 08/15/2003 12:48:13 PM PDT by Bush2000
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To: HAL9000
Seeking employment: Mr. Dan Leach, formerly of Microsft.
49 posted on 08/15/2003 12:50:50 PM PDT by beckett
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To: HAL9000
Yes, Outlook Express is designed to function like a gay bathhouse.

BAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW!!!

Best post I've seen allday!

50 posted on 08/15/2003 12:59:47 PM PDT by FierceDraka ("I am not a number - I am a FREE MAN!")
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