Warning – Serious Item! U10 Commandmensts judge Moore is an egomaniacal huckster)

ESPN Page 2 ^ | August 26, 2003 | Gregg Easterbrook

[quidnunc]

-snip-

Judge Roy Moore, the publicity-seeker who put the 2.5-ton Ten Commandments in the Alabama state courthouse, declared Monday that he could disobey the direct order of a federal judge because "judges do not make laws, they interpret them." Since, Moore continued, an interpretation can be wrong, therefore he may defy a judicial order. So presumably Judge Moore also thinks that if he sentences a man to prison, the man can declare that the interpretation might be wrong and walk free? It's exactly the same logic.

Moore further said that the First Amendment precept, "Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion," does not apply to him because "I am not Congress." Drag this incompetent lunatic out of the court quickly, please. Anyone with entry-level knowledge of Constitutional law knows that the 14th Amendment, ratified in 1868, was intended to extend the Bill of Rights to state governments; that a 1937 Supreme Court decision specifically declared that the First Amendment binds state officials like Judge Moore.

As a church-going Christian — TMQ was in this church on Sunday — I find it deeply embarrassing when Christianity is associated, in the public eye, with hucksters like Moore. I find it embarrassing, too, when Christians supporting Moore's hunk of stone suggest that a big object in a public square is what matters, rather than the power of God's message itself. Anyone who needs to look at a big object in order to believe, doesn't really believe.

And consider that in the same state, Alabama, where the Judge Moore sideshow is getting nonstop media attention, Republican Gov. Bob Riley is risking his political neck to campaign for tax-law changes that would increase taxes on the well-off while exempting everyone who makes less than $17,000 annually. Gov. Riley phrases the campaign in religious terms, saying, "According to our Christian ethics, we're supposed to love God, love each other and help take care of the poor." How come this pure and admirable Christian sentiment gets no media attention while the egomaniac with the hunk of stone in the same state's courthouse enjoys round-the-clock coverage?

-snip-

[quidnunc]

Knowledgable people strongly suspect the Judge Moore is using this incident as a steppingstone to higher office — most likely the Alabama governorship.

[Paleo Conservative]

ESPN columnists ought to stick to sports. If I wanted to read leftist social commentary, I would read Salon.com or DU.

[RAY]

The writer is simply another egghead AH.

[RAY]

The writer is simply another egghead AH.

[Catspaw]

I'll take this guy with a grain of salt. He said Favre played for Green Bay for his entire career. I guess he forgot we (meaning me & my beloved Green Bay Packers) got Favre in a trade from Atlanta.

[mrsmith]

"Knowledgeable people" are avoiding the issues and attacking personalities?

Christians can "do" public relations.

[FReepaholic]

>>...So presumably Judge Moore also thinks that if he sentences a man to prison, the man can declare that the interpretation might be wrong and walk free?...<<

Wrong. A jury convicts and a judge applies the sentence according to statutory guidelines.

Of course, the convicted can always appeal but not just "walk free".

As mentioned in a previous post, ESPN should stick to sports.

[Tribune7]

Republican Gov. Bob Riley is risking his political neck to campaign for tax-law changes that would increase taxes . . .

I think this writer has a perspective that pre-supposes a dislike for conservatism.

[Sloth]

Since, Moore continued, an interpretation can be wrong, therefore he may defy a judicial order. So presumably Judge Moore also thinks that if he sentences a man to prison, the man can declare that the interpretation might be wrong and walk free? It's exactly the same logic.

What is Mr. Easterbrook's position on the Dred Scott case?

[TommyDale]

"...Judge Moore is using this incident as a steppingstone to higher office — most likely the Alabama governorship."

And the problem with this would be.....?

[Phantom Lord]

Why is ESPN writing on such matters?

[50sDad]

Martin Luther King, the publicity-seeker who led the "March on Washington"...

[Stone Mountain]

And the problem with this would be.....?

That he is resisting a court order in order to gain himself publicity he otherwise wouldn't be able to receive and flaunting the law he has sworn to uphold in the process. And not because of the greater public good, but for personal political gain. At least, that's MY problem with it...

[ladtx]

Knowledgable people strongly suspect the Judge Moore is using this incident as a steppingstone to higher office ...

My problem with that assertion is that why would he choose such a divisive steppingstone? Seems to me he would choose some other vehicle that is not of such "hot-button" proportions unless he made a grave tactical error in not thinking it would create such a furor.

[sasafras]

Agree - leave the bias reporting and lieing to the professionals at the NY Times. ESPN should focus on sports.

[Jim Robinson]

"Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion," does not apply to him because "I am not Congress." Drag this incompetent lunatic out of the court quickly, please. Anyone with entry-level knowledge of Constitutional law knows that the 14th Amendment, ratified in 1868, was intended to extend the Bill of Rights to state governments; that a 1937 Supreme Court decision specifically declared that the First Amendment binds state officials like Judge Moore.

Judge Moore made no law and he violated no law.

[quidnunc]

ladtx wrote: My problem with that assertion is that why would he choose such a divisive steppingstone? …

Because he did it before.

Judge Moore was a local judge who a few years ago defied a federal court order to remove the 10 Commandments from the wall of his courtroom.

The case received much attention in the news media.

He parlayed the notoriety he got from this incident into a successful election campaign for chief justice of the Alabama supreme court.

[ohioman]

ESPN columnists are all liberal scum. It is that simple.

[quidnunc]

Jim Robinson wrote: Judge Moore made no law and he violated no law.

Judge Moore took an oath to uphold the Constitution.

It is settled law (See Marbury vs Madison) that the federal courts in general and SCOTUS in particular are the final arbiters on the US Constitution.

[Jim Robinson]

He did not violate his oath and he did not violate the Constitution.

[AppyPappy]

Judge Moore took an oath to uphold the Constitution.

He did not violate the Constitution. He simply stood up for free speech.

[Jim Robinson]

The Congress made no law respecting the establishment of a state religion and neither did Judge Moore.

[LiteKeeper]

SPOTREP

[Jim Robinson]

Nor did he make or enforce any law which abridges the privileges or immunities of any citizen of the United States; nor did he deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor did he deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

[quidnunc]

Jim Robinson wrote: The Congress made no law respecting the establishment of a state religion and neither did Judge Moore.

No, but a federal judge ruled that under the circumstances the public display of this monument violated the US Constitution.

A federal appeals court upheld this decision and SCOTUS declined to review.

Judge Moore is legally- and honor-bound by his oath of office to obey this decision.

Citizen Roy Moore is morally entitled to engage in public disobedience, Chief Justice Roy Moore is not.

[TheCrusader]

Mission accomplished, Judge Moore. People are talking about serious domestic issues because of you. And people are becoming aware just how repressive our government has become against the institution of religion, and in particular, Christianity.

An honest person recognizes that an inanimate marble stone with the Ten Commandments chisled onto it, while sitting silently inside a glass partition, does not constitute the government pushing religion on the citizenry. This act of religious intolerance doesn't represent 'separation of Church and State', it represents the outlawing of Christianity inside any and all government jurisdiction. They drove the sweet little manger scene of the baby Jesus off thier property, I guess it just follows that they'd hate the Ten Commandments too. Maybe they'll start pulling down telephone poles because they are shaped like crosses.

[headsonpikes]

What's with this quoting the text of the First Amendment?!?

You're just another 'oldthinker', hung up on black and white literalness and logical distinctions.

These days, life is so complicated and we have progressed so far that we need lawyers and judges to tell us what words really mean, and how we should live.

They're experts; they're from the government; they're only here to help us.

Chin up, Citizen Jim, everything's taken care of!

(/sarc)

[texgal]

That he is resisting a court order in order to gain himself publicity he otherwise wouldn't be able to receive and flaunting the law he has sworn to uphold in the process. And not because of the greater public good, but for personal political gain. At least, that's MY problem with it...

He is resisting an order that was made based upon no law whatsoever. The plaintiffs sued based on "feelings" the courts ruled based upon "separation of church and state" - a lie if there ever was one.

The fourteenth amendment was to extend basic civil rights to those who had never been granted them before - former slaves. The fourteenth amendment was not created to undo the 10th amendment (state's rights).

[Jim Robinson]

As you admit, Judge Moore violated no law. He's standing up for his (and our) rights against federal judicial tyranny and he should be commended for that, not condemned.

[onedoug]

We, the people of the State of Alabama, in order to establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God, do ordain and establish the following Constitution and form of government for the State of Alabama....

[TommyDale]

He is taking a stand against a court order that is very unpopular and most likely incorrect, given the history of the United States. He is a folk hero to his fellow Alabama citizens, not to mention millions of other Americans. Taking advantage of his popularity over this issue for his political gain is no different than any other politician, except that this man is standing on high moral ground.

[an amused spectator]

Knowledgeable people also know that Gregg's brother is a holy federal Druid:

Easterbrook, Frank Hoover

Born 1948 in Buffalo, NY

Federal Judicial Service:
U. S. Court of Appeals for the Seventh Circuit
Nominated by Ronald Reagan on February 25, 1985, to a new seat created by 98 Stat. 333, 346; Confirmed by the Senate on April 3, 1985, and received commission on April 4, 1985.

Education:
Swarthmore College, B.A., 1970

University of Chicago Law School, J.D., 1973

Professional Career:
Law clerk, Hon. Levin H. Campbell, U.S. Court of Appeals, First Circuit, 1973-1974
Assistant to the U.S. solicitor general, U.S. Dept. of Justice, 1974-1977
Deputy U.S. solicitor general, U.S. Department of Justice, 1978-1979
Principal employee, Lexecon, Inc., Chicago, Illinois, 1980-1985
Assistant professor of law, University of Chicago, 1978-1981
Professor of law, University of Chicago, 1981-1985


Race or Ethnicity: White

Gender: Male

=============================

Gregg has a dog in the fight. ;-)

[quidnunc]

Jim Robinson wrote: As you admit, Judge Moore violated no law. He's standing up for his (and our) rights against federal judicial tyranny and he should be commended for that, not condemned.

Chief Justice Roy Moore is entitled to contest a federal court decision only within the framework of the federal courts or Congress.

Chief Justice Roy Moore is not allowed to let the dictates of his personal conscience override statuatary law or court decisions.

[stars & stripes forever]

Knowledgable people strongly suspect the Judge Moore is using this incident as a steppingstone to higher office — most likely the Alabama governorship

If a person is faithful in the small things, God will reward him with larger things.

[dirtboy]

It is settled law (See Marbury vs Madison) that the federal courts in general and SCOTUS in particular are the final arbiters on the US Constitution.

So tell me, then, when SCOTUS is going to have that 10 Commandments statuary removed from their building.

[Publius6961]

Egomaniacal huckster...
Egomaniacal pervert...

Let me think.

I'll get back to you.

[dirtboy]

Judge Moore is legally- and honor-bound by his oath of office to obey this decision.

So apparently the federal courts can disregard the Constitution but state courts are not allowed to stand up to them for doing such?

[Jim Robinson]

Judge Moore is "entitled" to argue his case against judicial tyranny as vigorously as he desires.

[semaj]

Please excuse my ignorance, but what does the 1st Amendment have to do with preventing the States from allowing the free exercise of religion within their respective jurisdiction?

[quidnunc]

Jim Robinson wrote: Judge Moore is "entitled" to argue his case against judicial tyranny as vigorously as he desires.

But once a decision has been rendered he's not entitled to defy the federal courts outside of the judicial or legislative systems.

[Jim Robinson]

Says who? If the order is unconstitutional, and many people believe it is, he has the moral right to continue fighting as forcefully as he possibly can. The federal government may step in and end it forcefully, but that does not make it right. And they may find they have the people to answer for it if they do.

[dirtboy]

But once a decision has been rendered he's not entitled to defy the federal courts outside of the judicial or legislative systems.

I think it's time for that to be challenged, as the feds have gotten way too big for their britches. And the states are the best place to challenge that.

[dirtboy]

If the order is unconstitutional, and many people believe it is, he has the moral right to continue fighting as forcefully as he possibly can. The federal government may step in and end it forcefully, but that does not make it right. And they may find they have the people to answer for it if they do.

That's the only peaceful way the fedgov will be pared back, if the states and the people stand up to its usurpations.

[quidnunc]

dirtboy wrote: I think it's time for that to be challenged, as the feds have gotten way too big for their britches. And the states are the best place to challenge that.

Just so those doing the challenging understand that there may be a hefty price to pay.

Defiance of a federal court order is contempt of court and can place the non-complier in jeopardy of a substantial fine or a stretch in the stony lonesome.

[dirtboy]

Just so those doing the challenging understand that there may be a hefty price to pay.

As if we're not paying a hefty price already, bowing down to federal usurpation? How much worse will the price get if some people don't start standing up before it is too late?

Defiance of a federal court order is contempt of court and can place the non-complier in jeopardy of a substantial fine or a stretch in the stony lonesome.

Well, Andrew Jackson once said "John Marshall has made his decision; let him enforce it now if he can." - the point is, the checks and balances at the federal level have completely broken down, and the feds have decided they can do just about anything they damn well please - so who is best suited to take them on? The states. It has to happen sooner or later, or else the federal government will become completely supreme and the republic as we know it will be dead.

[Mr. Silverback]

If every person who as called Moore a huckster/demagogue/self-promoter in the last 2 weeks applied the same standard to people who agree with them (or that they like) they would have to call virtually everyone in the public square a huckster/demagogue/self-promoter. Want some examples?

What did Al Gore run on in 200? The economy. Why? Because he could claim he had a good "record" on the issue and the voters like a good economy.

Why will Dubya run on homeland security and foreign policy next year? Because he can claim a good record on both issues and the voters like safe streets and frequent womping of jihadis.

So, why did Moore run as "The Ten Commandments Judge?" Because he had a record of posting and protecting the big 10, and a lot of Alabamans liked it. That doesn't make him a huckster.

[Jim Robinson]

Lots of people fighting for liberty have been wrongfully jailed or even killed by their oppressors. This is not new.

[Mr. Silverback]

LOL!!

[quidnunc]

Jim Robinson wrote: Says who? If the order is unconstitutional, and many people believe it is, he has the moral right to continue fighting as forcefully as he possibly can. The federal government may step in and end it forcefully, but that does not make it right. And they may find they have the people to answer for it if they do.

The SCOTUS is the final arbiter of what is constitutional.

Furthermore, the US Constitutuin trumps state constitutions and state law.

Are you really advocating tinkering with Marbury vs Madison (which has been settled law since 1803) and the Establishment Clause of the Bill of Rights?

[shaggy eel]

Knowledgable people strongly suspect that Judge Moore is using this incident as a steppingstone to higher office

,,, looking at the decisions coming out of the Supreme Court lately, do you really think he has a chance - or would want to go any higher? I think he's taken a stand on the BIG10 issue and proved his worth.