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The Selling of Sally Hemings
Oregon Magazine ^ | September 14, 2003 | Thomas Lipscomb

Posted on 09/14/2003 1:36:48 PM PDT by WaterDragon

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To: I_Love_My_Husband
Jefferson did NOT have a male heir! They had to use Field Jefferson's DNA! So, that DOES skew the DNA results a bit anyways.

No, it doesn't. The chromosome that was examined, the Y chromosome (the one that separates the boys from the girls!) is passed down unchanged from father to son. Therefore Thomas and Field, natural brothers, should have identical Y chromosomes.

The only way that the results would be "skewed" is if one of the other was a product of an extramarital affair (which probably explains the Woodson line that doesn't match... poor Tom Woodson thought he was that guy's father... only the mother knows for sure! ,P. D.O.L.

Criminal Number 18F

51 posted on 09/14/2003 4:53:19 PM PDT by Criminal Number 18F (Support Billybob! >>>>========>>> http://www. ArmorForCongress.com/)
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To: WaterDragon
Thomas Jerrerson had 10 children, mostly girls, who all died except one who survived him. She and her husband set about to pay all of Jeffersons overwhelming debts due to the inability of the Fed. Govt. to reimburse him for his exspenditures while holding the office President, and overseas ambassadorial forays into France.He contnued to entertain foreign ambassadors and politicos at his own expense once retired. They sold most of the furniture in Monticello and finally the property itself.

During the 20's a Jewish family named Levy bought it, collected what they could of the original furnishings, restored the house and grounds to their original grandeur and gave it to the State of Virginia as a memorial to Thomas Jefferson. All at their own expense.

If Sally Hemming was already partly white(half sister to Mrs. Jefferson) maybe it is that drollop of white DNA that has the smear Jefferson and Sally gang going nuts. Who really knows who the father of Sally's children were.

Thomas Jefferson and William Jefferson Clinton have nothing in common. I still think the child attributed to Bill with the black hooker is his child. He is a truly disgusting man.

Thomas Jefferson is an American Patriot and the President to whom we owe thanks for the American Continent. He was the father of the Louisianna Purchase from Napoleon, a huge tract of land, without which, we would never have achieved the greatness we have. We never would have settled the west into the Continental USA. We'd be stuck with the eastern colonies, with the elite NE states calling the shots. Sort of like they think they do now.
52 posted on 09/14/2003 5:11:33 PM PDT by wingnuts'nbolts (I agree with Dick Morris. Off with their heads! Let's start with the Clintons, all three of them.)
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To: wingnuts'nbolts
Thomas Jefferson and William Jefferson Clinton have nothing in common. I still think the child attributed to Bill with the black hooker is his child. He is a truly disgusting man.

** Am I alone in believing that Roger Clinton may be the father? Hmmm... I too did not believe that DNA outcome either. THE KID LOOKS JUST LIKE HIM. Maybe my tinfoil hat is getting too tight. Klintoon is a scumbucket either way.
53 posted on 09/14/2003 5:16:39 PM PDT by cyborg (`)
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To: exit82
The Democrats used the Sally Hemings lie to bash a truly great American just so they could somehow redeem their rapist President,Bildo. This psuedo-history broke at the time of the FreeRepublic "March for Justice" 10/31/98.

DANGIT, ya beat me to it!

(clinton voice-over) Whatch'all gettin' worked up about over me for? Hell, if ol' TJ could do it, that's a precendent, kinda. Ho'bout it, Hillary, think it'll fly? (heh heh, that was a good one!)

54 posted on 09/14/2003 5:27:29 PM PDT by Old Sarge (Serving You... on Operation Noble Eagle!)
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To: I_Love_My_Husband
Nice concise post.
55 posted on 09/14/2003 5:40:15 PM PDT by wardaddy (Roland will be missed by me.)
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To: cyborg
We don't know that Thomas Jefferson ever had sexual relations with that woman, Sally Hemings. A political enemy, James Callender, claimed in 1802 that Jefferson had children by Sally; Callender died less than a year later (drowned while intoxicated). Jefferson denied the truth of the allegation in a letter in 1805.

The DNA evidence is ambiguous, since Thomas Jefferson was not the only Jefferson male in the vicinity.

The main argument in favor is the oral tradition among Sally's descendants, that Sally had children by Thomas Jefferson.

Madison Hemings, one of her children, told the census taker in 1870 that he was the son of Thomas Jefferson; the census taker was sufficiently impressed that he made a note of that on the census form (clearly legible on the microfilm of the census record). Later, in 1873, a newspaper in Pike County, Ohio, carried an article about Madison Hemings being the son of Thomas Jefferson, evidently based on what Madison had told the author.

There is a good short treatment of this in Willard Sterne Randall's Thomas Jefferson: A Life (1993). The late Fawn Brodie, who did more than anyone else to revive interest in the Sally Hemings story, located several of her descendants who claimed to have heard of their descent from Thomas Jefferson from family tradition.

Sally's mother was a mulatto, so she was no more than one-quarter African by ancestry.

56 posted on 09/14/2003 5:46:32 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: Verginius Rufus
Sally's mother was a mulatto, so she was no more than one-quarter African by ancestry.

** Well she was white practically, much closer to my ancestry which in those days were called quadroon. I wonder why when I read about these speculations they always make her out to be some black field hand. Seems to be they're trying to serve some agenda. Either way, I do not get the fascination. Why aren't they as equally fascinated with Benjamin Franklin? He had a child out of wedlock.
57 posted on 09/14/2003 5:54:55 PM PDT by cyborg (`)
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To: Verginius Rufus
Personally, I don't care one way or the other, and I would doubt that many other people do, either. (BTW, I think oral family histories, based on my experience, are pretty unreliable because people tend to embroider the heck out of their past.)

But the whole Sally Hemmings uproar was clearly an attempt by the Clinton crowd to say, "See? Jefferson was as bad as Billy (Jefferson) Clinton." It was clearly a political thing that had nothing to do with a desire for historical accuracy.
58 posted on 09/14/2003 6:04:51 PM PDT by livius
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To: mrustow
bump
59 posted on 09/14/2003 7:34:55 PM PDT by foreverfree
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To: WaterDragon
Recently a friend who is originally from Scotland told me she at least knows her
race is 'pure.' LOL. How sad. She's not yet Americanized enough to
understand the sterility of that view.


Your friend might want to look at a glossary in a good human genetics book for
"inbreeding" and "hybrid vigor".
(although the later term may usually be applied in plant breeding).

But your friend doesn't scare me as much as the sperm banks do...those are the cats
we really make sure we can't know if we're going to try to marry and produce
off-spring with a half-sibling.
60 posted on 09/14/2003 7:41:24 PM PDT by VOA
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To: cyborg
Callender wrote about Sally and her children as if they were very dark complexioned, but he had never been to Monticello. I think the main agenda nowadays is to put down Jefferson. Obviously there were many slaveholders who had children by their slave women; whether Jefferson was one of them, who knows? It does serve to divert attention to the things he should be honored for, like the Declaration of Independence or instigating the Lewis and Clark expedition.

Madison Hemings couldn't know for sure if TJ was his father; in the newspaper story he reported that TJ never treated him as a son. He may have told the truth that his mother said TJ was his father, or perhaps he or she wanted to latch on to the famous name rather than one of his obscure relatives.

61 posted on 09/14/2003 7:53:30 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: Verginius Rufus
It does serve to divert attention to the things he should be honored for, like the Declaration of Independence or instigating the Lewis and Clark expedition.


*** Didn't the media just report that schools do not teach anything positive about American history? Yeah all this is in the end is an attempt to distract people from things more important.
62 posted on 09/14/2003 7:55:59 PM PDT by cyborg (member of the tinfoil hat society)
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To: livius
Agreed that some people try to embroider their family history. W. J. Cash in his classic The Mind of the South cites a family history which claimed that their German immigrant ancestor, a dirt farmer in the backwoods of South Carolina, was the grandson of the German emperor.

I don't think the Sally Hemings issue is entirely because of the Clinton/Lewinsky scandal--some people would be pushing it for other reasons. But it certainly did appear in the fall of 1998 that the publicity being given to the DNA evidence about Sally's descendants was partly designed to help Bill Clinton.

One important difference is that Jefferson was a widower when the alleged liaison took place...he wasn't guilty of adultery.

63 posted on 09/14/2003 8:04:09 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: cyborg
In my opinion, calling Clinton a 'black' president is an insult to black Americans.
64 posted on 09/14/2003 8:31:22 PM PDT by WaterDragon (America the beautiful, I love this nation of (legal) immigrants.)
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To: WaterDragon
:sigh: Klintoon is called a black president by Toni Morrison (?) I believe it was her. I was going to say something really nasty but I won't. Not going to go there. Why does Klintoon have such appeal to the ladies? He makes me ill with that face.
65 posted on 09/14/2003 8:40:24 PM PDT by cyborg (member of the tinfoil hat society)
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To: LWalk18
I haven't confused Washington with Jefferson at all. Everything I said is documented and true.

I also used a phrase"in the context of the times". Slaves were considered property at the time. I don't know that he mortgaged them, but if you say he did, that's plausible to me. But that was a common occurence then in an agricultural economy, where the cash flow for the plantation was tied into the harvest and selling of the crops.

There's no question that he treated his slaves decently. The record of the slaves themselves is such. When he died in 1826, he left a tremendous debt. About two years later, everything had to be sold, including Monticello, to pay his creditors. His heirs sold the slaves as well--that was the way it was then.

The point is, he wasn't abusive to the slaves.I think on that we can both agree.
66 posted on 09/14/2003 8:47:21 PM PDT by exit82 (Constitution?--I got your Constitution right here!--T. Daschle)
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To: WaterDragon
"Recently a friend who is originally from Scotland told me she at least knows her race is 'pure.' LOL. How sad. She's not yet Americanized enough to understand the sterility of that view.


Pure Pict? Pure Celt? Pure Norse? How about some Anglo-Saxon-Jute-Frisian? A little Belgian? Oh, how about some Norman? I doubt the Roman's left without donating a seed, or three?

Not to mention some various strains thrown in, from the Scot's fine service around the Empire?
67 posted on 09/15/2003 1:23:16 AM PDT by truth_seeker
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To: alethia
Recently a friend who is originally from Scotland told me she at least knows her race is 'pure.'

I'm surprised that everybody is too sheepish to post the obvious joke. Have the mods make ewe all as gentle as lambs, or has the wool been pulled over your eyes?

68 posted on 09/15/2003 7:46:17 AM PDT by steve-b
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To: steve-b
LOL!
69 posted on 09/15/2003 11:02:26 AM PDT by WaterDragon (America the beautiful, I love this nation of (legal) immigrants.)
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To: Old Sarge
Hey, Sarge, sorry I beat you to it. You get the next one,OK?
70 posted on 09/15/2003 9:19:19 PM PDT by exit82 (Constitution?--I got your Constitution right here!--T. Daschle)
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To: wardaddy

Actually you guys should know that sally was not 50 black and 50 white. She was actually only 1/4 black and 3/4 white. Her Grandmother was an african slave who had a child with her master old captain hemmings, her name was Elizabeth. When she and her mother where sold to Master Whalyes (T. Jefferson’s wife’s father) Elizabeth aka Betty has Sally with Master Whayles (making there children T.J’S Wife’s haif-siblings)Sally’s Grandmother 100% african
Sally’s Mother 1/2 black and 1/2 white
Sally 3/4 White 1/4 black
Her Children 7/8 white and 1/8 black


71 posted on 05/18/2007 4:54:04 AM PDT by uniquesongstress
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